Lafayette-Princeton thread

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Lafayette scores a TD on the first play from scrimmage but the play is called back for holding. This should be a good game.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

That wouldn't be a "phantom" holding call, would it? :D

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Princeton moves the ball a little bit then they stall at the 'Pards 40.

Maurice White who broke that first 59 yard run is done for the game. Big news for the 'Pards.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Princeton intercepts Lafayette at the Pards 25 but the Tigers offense goes backwards out of field goal range. Still 0-0 midway through the 1st.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Princeton puts a nice drive together and ends up with a FG. 3-0 Tigers late in the 1st.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Lafayette scores a TD. Not sure how since my plug in for the Lafayette video stream keeps messing up. 7-3 Pards early in the 2nd.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Princeton putting together a nice drive to close out the first half. They're inside the Lafayette redzone with 3 or so minutes left.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

TD Princeton!! Tigers look pretty good night. Their QB is playing a lot better than he did against Lehigh last weekend.

Princeton 10 Lafayette 7, 16 second left in 1st half.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Second half starting. Princeton took it to Lafayette physically in the first half which usually doesn't happen to the 'Pards.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Princeton got the ball to start the second half and drove to the Lafayette 17 before they stalled and settled for a FG.

Princeton 13 Lafayette 7 11:00 3rd.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Lafayette responds with a 60 yard TD drive to retake the lead.

Lafayette 14 Princeton 13

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Princeton reponds with a great drive of their own to take the lead back.
Lafayette's defense is getting pushed around which is suprising.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Lafayette goes 3 and out on their possesion. Princeton is once again driving. Lafayette's D is getting beaten up.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Lafayette driving the ball. They're down to Princeton's 25 with about 4 minutes left.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Princeton stops Lafayette on 4th and 13 from the Tiger 30. Lafayette got the first down on 4 and 5 but was called for a block in the back. Lafayette deffinately has issues on offense.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Princeton 20 Lafayette 13 Final

Lafayette was physically whipped up front which you don't usually see. Princeton played better than they did last year. The Tigers QB forced somethings but Lafayette wasn't able to make anything of the opportunities. Lafayette deffinately has a lot to work on. They suffered numerous injuries too so it'll be interesting to see how that plays out. On a side note Villanova is beating up on Penn pretty good.

[ngineer]

This was an exciting game..see/saw with momentum shifts..Again, whoever makes the least mistakes usually wins and Princeton made less mistakes. Lafayette committed some critical penalties-one negating a touchdown and another negating a first down they would have had late in their last drive. Their 'bye' week comes at an opportune time with the various injuries incurred and getting their heads refocused..

[Pards Rule]

Indeed. Not only was the defense pushed, also at times Lafayette QB was running for his life. And the O-Line averages 300? WTF?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I thought we'd see the "real" Princeton team this week and we did. They didn't make plays to kill themselves, they came up with a fascinating gameplan (running many, many option and QB running plays) and executed it just well enough to win. I was very surprised that Lafayette tried to beat up Princeton on the line of scrimmage, which never worked last year even though Princeton is consistently outwieghed there - the Tigers use that small, athletic "O" line to perfection, generally.

That Lafayette "D" is a monster.

[Pards Rule]

Mo White (star RB) was out of the game on the fourth offensive play. Have not heard what is up with him. Any word, LFN??

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The word I have is that he has a sprained ankle, no word on severity. I'd imagine he'll be back after the bye week, assuming that the sprain isn't that severe.

[Franks Tanks]

Indeed. Not only was the defense pushed, also at times Lafayette QB was running for his life. And the O-Line averages 300? WTF?

Lots of blitzing, I suspect they were bring the heat trying to test our inexperienced QB. He has to find the open man in that situation as there are more blitzers than blockers. Also can I get some other serious opinion on some calls that were highly questionable.

1.) The 60 yard TD run. Look ok to me from the replay, if there was a hold it was minor, instead the refs whistle took points off the board and possible the game. That is unacceptable.

2.) In the 4th we had a reciever streaking toward the endzone on a long pass. The Prineton defender was all over the Laffy reciever-- face guarding, bumping, all that and no call.

3.) The clip call on Dipaolo scramble for the first down in the waning minutes. The 1st here would have gave us a great opp to bunch it in for the score and win, again a penalty- was this vaild. Let the kids play, I hate refs they are always way too involed in the game.

Does anyone agree? Please tell me, if I'm being a homer i can certainly understand, really looking for an impartial opinion or two.

Also Princeton has to be the most classless bunch of a**es I have ever seen. All other Ivy school we play against are great, and even Lehigh fans and players show tons more class in a very intense rivalry game. Princeton band once again play during the alma mater, and even in the campus library before the game- that is BS. Also Princetin players were screaming at the home stands after the game. Not to celebrate but antoginize. Do any of the other Patriot/Ivy people out there feel Princeton exibits similar poor behavior? Is this a reflection of there coach who also seems to carry on like a child on the sideline?

[Pards Rule]

Franks, I missed the replay of the hold on Whites opening play non-TD. I did see a flag on a simple pattern near our side that I thought should have been a non-call. I agree with the pass-interference that you saw. I think that was much more callable than the one near our stands. And, last but not least, the 50/50 at best clip call. It was a 50/50 shot. I don't understand -folks get this - where they measured the ball (a half foot over) after the play and the one ref signaled a first with the flag on the ground?!?! And then its like - oh yeah, a clip.

[Franks Tanks]

Franks, I missed the replay of the hold on Whites opening play non-TD. I did see a flag on a simple pattern near our side that I thought should have been a non-call. I agree with the pass-interference that you saw. I think that was much more callable than the one near our stands. And, last but not least, the 50/50 at best clip call. It was a 50/50 shot. I don't understand -folks get this - where they measured the ball (a half foot over) after the play and the one ref signaled a first with the flag on the ground?!?! And then its like - oh yeah, a clip.

I agree that the one pass-inf call was very questionable, and I guess you can sell that the other pass inf non-call was a make up or sort, and I can somewhat buy. Runs get called back at times, and it really sucked but I can accept that. But if that clip was questionable than that is a totally terrible call. We got a first down on a late 4th quarter drive as we were going for the potential winning score..Oh wait no we threw a flag on a very questionable call. It was a very close game and could have went either way, but that clip call pretty much ended it, and I hate when erfs decide any game.

[R.A.]

I saw the replay... I think Princeton is underrated.

[bulldog10jw]

Lots of blitzing, I suspect they were bring the heat trying to test our inexperienced QB. He has to find the open man in that situation as there are more blitzers than blockers. Also can I get some other serious opinion on some calls that were highly questionable.

1.) The 60 yard TD run. Look ok to me from the replay, if there was a hold it was minor, instead the refs whistle took points off the board and possible the game. That is unacceptable.

2.) In the 4th we had a reciever streaking toward the endzone on a long pass. The Prineton defender was all over the Laffy reciever-- face guarding, bumping, all that and no call.

3.) The clip call on Dipaolo scramble for the first down in the waning minutes. The 1st here would have gave us a great opp to bunch it in for the score and win, again a penalty- was this vaild. Let the kids play, I hate refs they are always way too involed in the game.

Does anyone agree? Please tell me, if I'm being a homer i can certainly understand, really looking for an impartial opinion or two.

Also Princeton has to be the most classless bunch of a**es I have ever seen. All other Ivy school we play against are great, and even Lehigh fans and players show tons more class in a very intense rivalry game. Princeton band once again play during the alma mater, and even in the campus library before the game- that is BS. Also Princetin players were screaming at the home stands after the game. Not to celebrate but antoginize. Do any of the other Patriot/Ivy people out there feel Princeton exibits similar poor behavior? Is this a reflection of there coach who also seems to carry on like a child on the sideline?

Princeton was always historically known as the most obnoxious team and fans in the Ivy League. It was most prevalent in the '50's and '60's when they won a lot. Penn took that title away from them through the 80's and '90's, although it was mostly Penn FANS that were obnoxious. The Penn players, who couldn't get into any other Ivy school, even Cornell (Hotel Management) couldn't SPELL obnoxious. I guess Princeton after last years title is making a comeback.

P.S. For all I know, maybe the rest of the league thinks Yale is obnoxious.xlolx

[Franks Tanks]

Princeton was always historically known as the most obnoxious team and fans in the Ivy League. It was most prevalent in the '50's and '60's when they won a lot. Penn took that title away from them through the 80's and '90's, although it was mostly Penn FANS that were obnoxious. The Penn players, who couldn't get into any other Ivy school, even Cornell (Hotel Management) couldn't SPELL obnoxious. I guess Princeton after last years title is making a comeback.

P.S. For all I know, maybe the rest of the league thinks Yale is obnoxious.xlolx

Penn has a twinge of obnoxious behavior, but Princeton makes them look like amatures.

[Andy]

I agree that the one pass-inf call was very questionable, and I guess you can sell that the other pass inf non-call was a make up or sort, and I can somewhat buy. Runs get called back at times, and it really sucked but I can accept that. But if that clip was questionable than that is a totally terrible call. We got a first down on a late 4th quarter drive as we were going for the potential winning score..Oh wait no we threw a flag on a very questionable call. It was a very close game and could have went either way, but that clip call pretty much ended it, and I hate when erfs decide any game.

The "block in the back" was questionable at best. Knowing that a flag there basically guarantees PU the win, it ought to be a beyond a doubt call, otherwise keep the flag in your pocket. Just watched the replay several times (available archived via all-access). Second replay shows blockers helmet making contact with defenders upper arm, shoulder. Ref was way too eager to throw that baby. Hughes' bitching must have worked. Would like to hear Tavani's take on it after he saw the replay. Thought LC battled well through all the adversity against a quality opponent, but with a mediocre, at best, passing game, things won't be easy.

[Go...gate]

Lots of blitzing, I suspect they were bring the heat trying to test our inexperienced QB. He has to find the open man in that situation as there are more blitzers than blockers. Also can I get some other serious opinion on some calls that were highly questionable.

1.) The 60 yard TD run. Look ok to me from the replay, if there was a hold it was minor, instead the refs whistle took points off the board and possible the game. That is unacceptable.

2.) In the 4th we had a reciever streaking toward the endzone on a long pass. The Prineton defender was all over the Laffy reciever-- face guarding, bumping, all that and no call.

3.) The clip call on Dipaolo scramble for the first down in the waning minutes. The 1st here would have gave us a great opp to bunch it in for the score and win, again a penalty- was this vaild. Let the kids play, I hate refs they are always way too involed in the game.

Does anyone agree? Please tell me, if I'm being a homer i can certainly understand, really looking for an impartial opinion or two.

Also Princeton has to be the most classless bunch of a**es I have ever seen. All other Ivy school we play against are great, and even Lehigh fans and players show tons more class in a very intense rivalry game. Princeton band once again play during the alma mater, and even in the campus library before the game- that is BS. Also Princetin players were screaming at the home stands after the game. Not to celebrate but antoginize. Do any of the other Patriot/Ivy people out there feel Princeton exibits similar poor behavior? Is this a reflection of there coach who also seems to carry on like a child on the sideline?

I saw the PU band (which is traditionally comprised of a$$holes) play over your alma mater and that was truly classless. I have season tix near the bench on the PU side and did not players yelling into the stands, except if they were trying to get the attention of parents or friends.

I don't agree that PU fans are always bad. I do think Penn fans leave much to be desired.

[Franks Tanks]

I saw the PU band (which is traditionally comprised of a$$holes) play over your alma mater and that was truly classless. I have season tix near the bench on the PU side and did not players yelling into the stands, except if they were trying to get the attention of parents or friends. I don't agree that PU fans are always bad. I do think Penn fans leave much to be desired.


Well its not so much the fans, but more so the Princeton players. I guess this still harkens back to my when I played, I always though they were a bit too cocky and lacking class a tad. There was a little jumpinh around flexing, and gloating type behavior by a few players. Maybe not a big deal I guess, just a bit of my prior experience and pre-concieved biased notions coming through I guess xthumbsupx

[letsgopards04]

I had friends in the Lafayette Pep Band '00-'04 and the Penn band would always play during Lafayette's playing of the alma mater. There was no love lost between the bands.

[colorless raider]

Lots of blitzing, I suspect they were bring the heat trying to test our inexperienced QB. He has to find the open man in that situation as there are more blitzers than blockers. Also can I get some other serious opinion on some calls that were highly questionable.

1.) The 60 yard TD run. Look ok to me from the replay, if there was a hold it was minor, instead the refs whistle took points off the board and possible the game. That is unacceptable.

2.) In the 4th we had a reciever streaking toward the endzone on a long pass. The Prineton defender was all over the Laffy reciever-- face guarding, bumping, all that and no call.

3.) The clip call on Dipaolo scramble for the first down in the waning minutes. The 1st here would have gave us a great opp to bunch it in for the score and win, again a penalty- was this vaild. Let the kids play, I hate refs they are always way too involed in the game.

Does anyone agree? Please tell me, if I'm being a homer i can certainly understand, really looking for an impartial opinion or two.

Also Princeton has to be the most classless bunch of a**es I have ever seen. All other Ivy school we play against are great, and even Lehigh fans and players show tons more class in a very intense rivalry game. Princeton band once again play during the alma mater, and even in the campus library before the game- that is BS. Also Princetin players were screaming at the home stands after the game. Not to celebrate but antoginize. Do any of the other Patriot/Ivy people out there feel Princeton exibits similar poor behavior? Is this a reflection of there coach who also seems to carry on like a child on the sideline?

The Red Raiders have always felt that Princeton coaches and players do not conduct themselves in a classy manner.

[carney2]

Frankly, I was surprised that Princeton didn't bring more people. It looked like the right number for mom, pop, and girl friend. It was a Columbia-esque turnout.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Frankly, I was surprised that Princeton didn't bring more people. It looked like the right number for mom, pop, and girl friend. It was a Columbia-esque turnout.

For some weird reason, Princeton *never* seems to travel well, although the home crowd comes out in force for Tiger home games. The games at Lehigh are the same way. In contrast, Harvard and Yale really do bring much better road crowds.

[65 Pard]

I dont get it.....Lafayette is driving for the winning TD and has a 3rd and 5 with 4 minutes left and are moving the ball on the ground....In 4 down territory on Princeton 25, they call a pass play rather than continue to grind it out on the ground and run down the clock....probably cost us the game....

OH, and by the way.....that very loud obnoxious music on the PA has me rethinking going to another game...but what a great facility....

[Go...gate]

Well its not so much the fans, but more so the Princeton players. I guess this still harkens back to my when I played, I always though they were a bit too cocky and lacking class a tad. There was a little jumpinh around flexing, and gloating type behavior by a few players. Maybe not a big deal I guess, just a bit of my prior experience and pre-concieved biased notions coming through I guess xthumbsupx

Also, I was referring to PU-Lehigh @Princeton, so it may have been worse at Fisher.

[Go...gate]

For some weird reason, Princeton *never* seems to travel well, although the home crowd comes out in force for Tiger home games. The games at Lehigh are the same way. In contrast, Harvard and Yale really do bring much better road crowds.

Right. Unfortunately, the most loyal part of their fan base is the "old guard" who do not travel often. I do travel to see PU (when I'm not seeing Colgate) road games when I can, but I am not making any road trips at all this year.

[ngineer]

We had no problems with PU fans at PU this year,,,in fact I thought Lehigh had as many in the stadium as they did.
As for the calls complained about, I did not see the beginning of the game and the run called back. But I did see the block in the back on TV and even the Lafayette announcers on RCN 4 acknowledged it was a fair call. Problem is, the kid probably didn't have to hit the player as DiPaolo appeared to have made the corner regardless. Overall, I was surprised at how the Princeton line seemed to blow Lafayette's bigger guys off the ball. That, to me, was where the game was lost.
I think there may be more of an 'animus' between Lafayette and Princeton than between Lehigh and Princeton--maybe it's because you're closer (by a whole 15 miles) or maybe because we have beaten Princeton pretty regularly over the last ten years..Whereas we have 'issues' with Penn..Their coaches have always had a 'holier than thou' attitude.

[carney2]

As for the calls complained about, I did not see the beginning of the game and the run called back. But I did see the block in the back on TV and even the Lafayette announcers on RCN 4 acknowledged it was a fair call. Problem is, the kid probably didn't have to hit the player as DiPaolo appeared to have made the corner regardless.

Here's part of a post I made on the Lafayette board about the "questionable" calls:

I saw the replays last night of the two penalties that stick in our craw the most: the holding call on the 59 yard run by Maurice White, and the block in the back on the Mike DiPaola run for an apparent 1st down with a little over 4 minutes to go.

Up front, let us admit that they were both legitimate calls. The infractions occurred and were plainly visible. The zebras are not at fault here.

On the Mo White run, both John Leone and Gary Laubach [the annoncers] felt that the hold did not affect the play. Their view was that White had squeaked past the point of the foul before it became flagrant. From my recliner, it looked like it could have gone either way in that regard. In other words, there is some doubt in my mind that the run would have gone as it did without the hold even though White was indeed beyond the play before the most flagrant and obvious portion (the takedown) occurred.

In the case of the DiPaola run, Mike was definitely past the point of the infraction when it occurred. Dorsey nailed a trailing defender behind the play. If not impeded by Dorsey, that defender would have been no better than 2nd or 3rd man on the pile, and even could have added to the yardage since he would have been the only "tackler" whose momentum was moving him toward the goal line.

Ah, the coulda, woulda, shouldas. You hate stupid penalties, but you forgive aggressive ones. In my view, both of these were more of the aggressive nature and should not be condemned.

[LehighFan11]

Here's part of a post I made on the Lafayette board about the "questionable" calls:

I saw the replays last night of the two penalties that stick in our craw the most: the holding call on the 59 yard run by Maurice White, and the block in the back on the Mike DiPaola run for an apparent 1st down with a little over 4 minutes to go.

Up front, let us admit that they were both legitimate calls. The infractions occurred and were plainly visible. The zebras are not at fault here.

On the Mo White run, both John Leone and Gary Laubach [the annoncers] felt that the hold did not affect the play. Their view was that White had squeaked past the point of the foul before it became flagrant. From my recliner, it looked like it could have gone either way in that regard. In other words, there is some doubt in my mind that the run would have gone as it did without the hold even though White was indeed beyond the play before the most flagrant and obvious portion (the takedown) occurred.

In the case of the DiPaola run, Mike was definitely past the point of the infraction when it occurred. Dorsey nailed a trailing defender behind the play. If not impeded by Dorsey, that defender would have been no better than 2nd or 3rd man on the pile, and even could have added to the yardage since he would have been the only "tackler" whose momentum was moving him toward the goal line.

Ah, the coulda, woulda, shouldas. You hate stupid penalties, but you forgive aggressive ones. In my view, both of these were more of the aggressive nature and should not be condemned.

It doesn't matter where a holding penalty takes place. If a player is visibly being held they are going to call it whether the runner has passed the hold or not.

[Ivytalk]

For some weird reason, Princeton *never* seems to travel well, although the home crowd comes out in force for Tiger home games. The games at Lehigh are the same way. In contrast, Harvard and Yale really do bring much better road crowds.

Princeton doesn't travel well because most of its fans are on respirators and/or walkers.xwhistlex

[YaleFootballFan]

Princeton doesn't travel well because most of its fans are on respirators and/or walkers.xwhistlex

And when they do travel, they wear their ugly orange shirts....

http://research.yale.edu/yaleband/ypmb/gallery/06-07/Princeton/slides/DSCN6096.JPG
Happy Halloween!

[carney2]

It doesn't matter where a holding penalty takes place. If a player is visibly being held they are going to call it whether the runner has passed the hold or not.

You missed the point. The announcers felt that the hold had no impact on the run. In other words, they felt that the 59 yard run would have occurred with or without it. No one with even a rudimentary knowledge of football would take the position that the penalty should not be called because it was "away from the ball," so to speak. I, on the other hand, felt that the hold may have been in its early stages when White passed the two scrumming linemen, and therefore may have affected the outcome of the play. None of us - not the announcers, not me - felt that the penalty should not have been called.