Patriot League Pick 'Em - Week 12

[DFW HOYA]

The last game of the 2021 season for five, perhaps six schools.

Georgetown (2-7) at Morgan St. (1-9), (1st Meeting), 12:00pm
Lafayette (3-7) at Lehigh (2-8), (157th Meeting), 12:30 pm
Fordham (6-4) at Colgate (4-6), (33rd Meeting), 1:00 pm
Holy Cross (8-2) at Bucknell (1-9), (38th Meeting), 1:00 pm

Meanwhile, the second longest PL rivalry game was already played: Colgate-Holy Cross (83)

[Ivytalk]

Morgan State
Lehigh
Fordham
Holy Cross

[bonarae]

Georgetown - is the season over since several weeks ago? Akin to the Houston Texans of '14?
Lehigh
Fordham
Holy Cross

[LehighU11]

Meanwhile, the second longest PL rivalry game was already played: Colgate-Holy Cross (83)
Bucknell and Lehigh played their 85th last week, with the Bison and Lafayette playing their 99th earlier this season.

[DFW HOYA]

Bucknell and Lehigh played their 85th last week, with the Bison and Lafayette playing their 99th earlier this season.

Thanks for the correction--I as referring to series outside those involving Lehigh and Lafayette, who are already occupied for week 12.

Week 12 should be:

Lehigh-Lafayette
Colgate-HC
Fordham-Bucknell
Georgetown vs TBD, though Morgan St. is not exactly a tradition.

[Sader87]

We have a much longah continous history with the Red Raidahhs but our rival game should be Fordham....

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Fordham at Colgate will be interesting. I'll keep an eye on the forecast for that game. 35 and snow flurries and what will the Rams motivation be? 5-6 and a 4-2 conference mark would be a very reasonable year for the Raiders to build off of given what the program went through the last 6 months...

[ngineer]

Couple toughies and a blowout

Don't know much about Morgan State this year, other than seeing their record. How psyched will Gtown be. A lot of seniors bowing out. One would think they will be motivated to go out on a high note. Going with the Hoyas, 24-21.

Fordham SHOULD beat Colgate. I don't know if they will. Will they rebound after getting spanked by Holy Cross? Colgate may have a bigger motivation after beating Lafayette to end strong. Also on the 'tundra'.. Raiders, 33-31

A Bison win would be seismic. I don't see anything 'shakin' but Cecchini's head. Crusaders will take foot off the gas in the second half winning easily, 44-12

The Rivalry #157 should be entertaining even if the quality is not there. Both teams seem to have had a lot of self destructive tendencies this year, so one question is who will make the less the mistakes? While Lehigh appears 'younger', at this point in the season there are no rookies. Lehigh has seemed to grow in the second half of the season, while the Leotards have seemed to struggle. Always an emotional game, a key for both is who can keep their emotions under control and not make stupid mistakes, like personal fouls or unsportsmanlike penalties on third and long that can change possession.
Lehigh's offense has become more balanced over the past few weeks and, hopefully, TE Snyder gets to return from injury that really adds an additonal weapon to their maturing WRs. Laf has a strong RB and a strong OL, if healthy. Lehigh's LBs are quite good and they will be heavily needed to be on their 'A' game. Laf's QB is a freshman, but has shown a lot of poise throughout the season. There have been 'freshman mistakes', but he has a lot of ability so Lehigh's young secondary will be tested, necessitating good pressure by Lehigh's DL. Lehigh has become a PL leader in sacks, and pressure will be needed. Special teams may be a slight edge to LC with an experienced PK with a strong leg. Lehigh's PK has been fairly steady--the Fordham two 'doinks' being the only FG misses this year. However, he doesn't have a cannon for a leg. Finally, we have Garrett v. Gilmore...and two new college presidents facing off for the first time. Lehigh's is a Lehigh grad, so might he "pull a Nixon" and send Gilmore a special play? Trick plays have always been a feature of a Rivalry game. Forgot the weather...right now, should not be a factor. Long range forecast says partly sunny with temps in the low to mid 40's. "So what's it all mean Mr. Natural?" "Don't mean sheeet!"

Lehigh 30 Laughyette 24

[Digby]

Georgetown
Holy Cross
Fordham
Lehigh
ugh
well at least we Lafayette fans have the greatest basketball coach in history to wipe out the memory of this season.

The Pards didn’t beat anybody they weren’t supposed to.

[DFW HOYA]

Bucknell trying to avoid its first winless season in the PL since 2006. Not happening versus Holy Cross.

[Digby]

Sagarin for entertainment purposes

1-Georgia
61-NDSU (highest FCS)
126-Dartmouth (highest Ivy)
222-Brown (lowest Ivy)

151-Holy Cross
188-Fordham
223-Lafayette
230-Colgate
239-Lehigh
244-Georgetown
254-Bucknell

Wagner, Stetson, Butler and Presbyterian (last) are below Bucknell.

[NY Crusader 2010]

Bucknell trying to avoid its first winless season in the PL since 2006. Not happening versus Holy Cross.

There IS precedent for Bucknell beating us after having clinched the Patriot League AQ. They did this to us in 2009. They also beat Fordham in 2007 the last week in the same sort of lame duck "we already clinched" game. And Bucknell did play us fairly competitively last year in the Patriot League Championship Game. So maybe they'll have some confidence in addition to the motivation to lay out a Herculean effort on Senior Day.

I would rest Sluka next week unless he's adamant he needs the game reps and go Siderman the whole way.

I'll take any win next week. Don't care if we win by a point. Don't care if we get out-gained by 200 yards. Don't care if we turn the ball over 5 times. Just get the win and clinch HC first undefeated PL season since 1991. And make it that much harder for the committee to not give us a home game.

[NY Crusader 2010]

We have a much longah continous history with the Red Raidahhs but our rival game should be Fordham....

100%. And now that Bucknell and Colgate are the top two basketball programs in the Patriot League of late, maybe they can declare each other rivals.

If we added Duquesne, there's your rival for Georgetown.

[NY Crusader 2010]

Georgetown
Lehigh
Fordham
Holy Cross

[crusader11]

After what Bucknell did to HC in the spring (not allowing parents of players to attend the game), I hope we run up the score and win by 50.

NY, disagree with resting Sluka. Don’t want the offense, which was really clicking against Fordham, to get out of sorts going into Nov 27.

Also, conference road games are weird. Let’s not dick around and get cute.

[DFW HOYA]

If we added Duquesne, there's your rival for Georgetown.

So if the PL added RPI instead, is that Georgetown's rival too? You can't assign rivalries without fan interest, and that was a point from before.

[ngineer]

So if the PL added RPI instead, is that Georgetown's rival too? You can't assign rivalries without fan interest, and that was a point from before.


What about geographical. Duquesne would be a lot closer than RPI for travel purposes, which allows fans of the traveling team to make the game. Having fans connecting before the game and cheering their teams in the same stadium helps build the rivalry, assuming the teams are competitive. JHU would be a natural, but I don't see them moving up. Howard is in your backyard, but I don't see them leaving the MEAC, unless it falls apart.

[DFW HOYA]

What about geographical. Duquesne would be a lot closer than RPI for travel purposes, which allows fans of the traveling team to make the game. Having fans connecting before the game and cheering their teams in the same stadium helps build the rivalry, assuming the teams are competitive. JHU would be a natural, but I don't see them moving up. Howard is in your backyard, but I don't see them leaving the MEAC, unless it falls apart.

Georgetown to Duquesne is 249 miles. Bucknell, Lehigh, Lafayette and even Fordham are all closer to Washington than this, and none of these four have built up any connections among fans by distance. This is why rivalries are organic and not simply geographic.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

PL Coaching Records as we enter the final week. Just for a good laugh...

Bob Chesney 90-40
Joe Conlin 14-22
Tom Gilmore 78-99
John Garrett 14-32
Dave Cecchini 22-50
Rob Sgarlate 22-48
Rob Dakosty 4-6

xlolxxlolxxnodxxcoffeex

There is no surprise Chesney is running laps around these clowns. It's so sad it's comical....

[TheValleyRaider]

4-0 last week, looking for a strong finish to 2021. It's been a long time since we got a full slate of fall football, so great to see it almost complete. Quite a finishing kick as well, given how much uncertainty I feel. About the picks, I mean, as congrats to Holy Cross on taking their third consecutive League crown. Represent us well in the playoffs. 36-15 for the season, I need 3 wins to finish over 70 percent for the year.

Georgetown at Morgan State Georgetown Not really sure what to do with this game, as both teams are sputtering to a close. One common data point, as both have wins over Delaware State. Other than that win, the Bears have lost every game by double-digits. A bit of a homer pick, I guess, but the Hoyas do have two more wins, plus a few closer losses.

Lehigh at Lafayette Lehigh When in doubt, go with the better team. But is Lafayette really the better team right now? Losses in three of their last four, while the Hawks come in with a two-game winning streak. The level of competition certainly matters, but the Leopards only edged Georgetown while Lehigh won by two touchdowns. While this feels like a perfect opportunity for the re-emergence of Lafayette: Agent of Chaos, I can't pick it.

Fordham at Colgate Colgate The Raiders have a 2-game winning streak for the second time this year. While it is hard to be too pleased with the season, it is nice to finish strong, and comforting to see improvement from the Spring's showing at Lafayette. A matchup with the other Spring opponent beckons, perhaps continued improvement? Fordham's win streak came to a sudden stop last week, and now the Rams look to bounce back. They are probably the second best team in the League, but not if they don't win this one. This is, to me, an underrated contest that has produced some real tight games over the years (since we're talking about potential season-ending rivalries). Upstate versus the City, looking to finish on a high note.

Holy Cross at Bucknell Holy Cross The Crusaders have cut a swath through the League this season, winning every League contest by multiple scores. Bucknell has...not done that, staying within one possession in only one of their League games this fall. As it turns out, these two teams have only played two one-possession games all season (Bucknell over the Hoyas, Holy Cross over Yale). Does that mean we get a close one here? Maybe, if the Crusaders are still nursing a celebratory hangover. Hard to see it, though, not enough against this year's Bison.

[NY Crusader 2010]

So if the PL added RPI instead, is that Georgetown's rival too? You can't assign rivalries without fan interest, and that was a point from before.

RPI-Colgate
Bucknell-Georgetown
HC-Fordham
Lehigh-Lafayette

Will you be happy if I declare that Villanova would be Georgetown's season-end rival if they join as the 8th team? Sometimes you need to calm down with the constant little brother syndrome when it comes to the Patriot League.

[Pards Rule]

So no one picks Lafayette so far????

[Lehigh'98]

So no one picks Lafayette so far????

Pards 27-6. Lehigh has still not moved the ball against any defense with a pulse (sorry Fordham). Lafayette is significantly better than Georgetown & Bucknell.

[Pards Rule]

Pards 27-6. Lehigh has still not moved the ball against any defense with a pulse (sorry Fordham). Lafayette is significantly better than Georgetown & Bucknell.

Thanks Im Pards 24-20

[DFW HOYA]

Sometimes you need to calm down with the constant little brother syndrome when it comes to the Patriot League.

That wasn't the issue. Whether it's the PL or the Big 10, rivalries are organic and not just assignable. Rutgers-Maryland is not a rivalry.

[ngineer]

That wasn't the issue. Whether it's the PL or the Big 10, rivalries are organic and not just assignable.
Rutgers-Maryland is not a rivalry.

I think it's a syndrome...

[NY Crusader 2010]

That wasn't the issue. Whether it's the PL or the Big 10, rivalries are organic and not just assignable. Rutgers-Maryland is not a rivalry.

Maryland decided to leave behind all their longstanding rivalries in the ACC in favor of the Big Ten TV $$$. Their natural rival should be West Virginia.

Rhode Island's end-of-season-rival in the CAA: **drumroll** => ELON

[Sader87]

Did John Thompson Sr's Hoya teams avoid Maryland or was it the other way around? I forget. That would have been a great hoop rivalry.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Did John Thompson Sr's Hoya teams avoid Maryland or was it the other way around? I forget. That would have been a great hoop rivalry.

Sadly those days of strong, unique college hoops passion here in the Northeast are long gone; just glad I'm old enough to remember the heyday. I'm a lifelong 'Cuse fan (Big East in general) and a Temple grad. It's in my blood. Give me a cold January night at the Garden in 1989 or 1990 with the 'Cuse and St. John's on tap...

This is one of my favorite moments.....
https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2021/09/george-kalinsky-9.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&w=1024

[ngineer]

Maryland decided to leave behind all their longstanding rivalries in the ACC in favor of the Big Ten TV $$$. Their natural rival should be West Virginia.

Rhode Island's end-of-season-rival in the CAA: **drumroll** => ELON

I would think Virginia would be their biggest rival since they share a lot of border..Plus, a lot of Virginia's population is closer to MD. I think Maryland and Virginia have long been national powerhouses in lacrosse, which is pretty big and growing in that neck of the woods. Poor Rhody...maybe UConn will get smart and decide to return. And, how much money do you thing Elon could get for changing their mascot to the "Musk Ox"...xsmiley_wix

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

I would think Virginia would be their biggest rival since they share a lot of border..Plus, a lot of Virginia's population is closer to MD. I think Maryland and Virginia have long been national powerhouses in lacrosse, which is pretty big and growing in that neck of the woods. Poor Rhody...maybe UConn will get smart and decide to return. And, how much money do you thing Elon could get for changing their mascot to the "Musk Ox"...xsmiley_wix

College Park to State College is 198 miles. Maryland's and Penn State's alumni bases actually cross over a decent amount given where they tend to settle (DC, Baltimore, Philly, smaller cities in the Mid-Atlantic).

[ngineer]

No question. I was focused on Maryland and UVA having been in the same conference for a long time. Attempts were made over the decades to 'goose' a rivalry between MD and PA. When I was in high school, the Big 33 Game played in Hershey pitted the top high school players between MD and PA. PA usually won, and PSU has traditionally beaten up the Terps. So despite the proximity and 'cross pollination' of the populace, I never got a feeling there was much a 'rivalry animus' created.

[The Cats]

Georgetown (2-7) at Morgan St. (1-9), (1st Meeting), 12:00pm
Lafayette (3-7) at Lehigh (2-8), (157th Meeting), 12:30 pm
Fordham (6-4) at Colgate (4-6), (33rd Meeting), 1:00 pm
Holy Cross (8-2) at Bucknell (1-9), (38th Meeting), 1:00 pm

[NY Crusader 2010]

I would think Virginia would be their biggest rival since they share a lot of border..Plus, a lot of Virginia's population is closer to MD. I think Maryland and Virginia have long been national powerhouses in lacrosse, which is pretty big and growing in that neck of the woods. Poor Rhody...maybe UConn will get smart and decide to return. And, how much money do you thing Elon could get for changing their mascot to the "Musk Ox"...xsmiley_wix

Back in the old days of the ACC, Virginia-Maryland was the season-ending rivalry game. Virginia Tech's biggest rivals were actually West Virginia and VMI. Up until the mid-1970's West Virginia and Virginia Tech were in the Southern Conference along with W&M, Richmond, VMI, East Carolina, The Citadel and Furman. It was Division I "major college football" but effectively today's equivalent of G5 level. UVA-Virginia Tech developed into a true end-of-season rivalry in the 1980's at some point.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Back in the old days of the ACC, Virginia-Maryland was the season-ending rivalry game. Virginia Tech's biggest rivals were actually West Virginia and VMI. Up until the mid-1970's West Virginia and Virginia Tech were in the Southern Conference along with W&M, Richmond, VMI, East Carolina, The Citadel and Furman. It was Division I "major college football" but effectively today's equivalent of G5 level. UVA-Virginia Tech developed into a true end-of-season rivalry in the 1980's at some point.

George Welsh and Frank Beamer really turned both programs around. UVA reached #1 in the country for a few weeks in 1990 before losing to Georgia Tech (eventual champ) in an epic game in Charlottesville. Both of them knew the importance of growing their respective programs for the betterment of each institution and the Commonwealth. Beamer played for Virginia Tech and was a beloved figure in the area due to his family tree.

I was at Virginia Tech two weeks ago and did some research on the institution; fascinating place. It was very much rooted in a male only, military core ideology until the 1970s. It evolved rapidly in the 1980s from a regional institution to one that surpassed the James Madison's and ODU's of the world in terms of capacity/breadth. Football played a big role in growing the school. The Blacksburg/Christiansburg/Radford small metro area is beautiful. I'd have a hard time turning down an opportunity to spend 4 years there. Seriously, what state with two major research research institutions have better locations than Charlottesville and Blacksburg? Colorado (Boulder) and Colorado State (Fort Collins)? Granted, Boulder can be tough even if you're "a bit liberal". The Montana schools? Bozeman is trending towards a more insufferable, expensive Boulder.

Also, if you have time, read up Frank Beamers family; especially Floyd Allen. He was one crazy SOB in SW Virginia.

I'm not a big fan of the south (nothing personal, don't like the heat or things "overly" conservative) but I absolutely love that part of the country. Winchester, Virginia through Johnson City/Bristol/Knoxville into Boone and Asheville is spectacular! Seems like a great retirement spot....

[Sader87]

Holy Cross coulda been in the Big East ya' know.....xdrunkyx

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Since Virginia Tech will be celebrating their 150th anniversary the school has a special website dedicated to the occasion. I really enjoyed reading through this...
Virginia Tech History | history.unirel | Virginia Tech (vt.edu) (https://history.unirel.vt.edu/)

Do any PL institutions have a similar website (subsection) dedicated to their history? At this point, for most of us it might be better to look to the past anyway...lol

[Pards Rule]

Say NO to any additions AT ALL to Patriot

[DFW HOYA]

Say NO to any additions AT ALL to Patriot
Why?

[Pards Rule]

Why?
I guess same question as mine - why? Or better yet..For who? For what? (hello Ricky Watters!). Why expand it? What are we trying to accomplish? I actually like the 5 OOC games we schedule every year.

[Digby]

Hah… I was at the “For who, for what” game. I’ve never heard such booing. The nuns sitting near me were booing although they didn't throw anything. I think Gruden was the opposing coach.
I’ve seen the likes of Joe Lis and Roger Freed and Bobby Hoying and others play in Philadelphia, and this booing was the worst.

The last expansion was a bad move but the league office thought it was spectacular.

[Pards Rule]

Hah… I was at the “For who, for what” game. I’ve never heard such booing. The nuns sitting near me were booing although they didn't throw anything. I think Gruden was the opposing coach.
I’ve seen the likes of Joe Lis and Roger Freed and Bobby Hoying and others play in Philadelphia, and this booing was the worst.

The last expansion was a bad move but the league office thought it was spectacular.

I gotta look that up if JG was opposing coach. He watched the 2015 Lehigh game from right behind me. I have a picture of him with my leopard. We (my former roommate), John and his wife were chatting on and off during the game.

- - - Updated - - -

Franks Tanks u have mail :)

[Sader87]

I guess same question as mine - why? Or better yet..For who? For what? (hello Ricky Watters!). Why expand it? What are we trying to accomplish? I actually like the 5 OOC games we schedule every year.

It's funny, I've often stated that this is one of the few things I've liked with HC being in the PL overall.

Nothing against the 3 fine PL insitutions, but it's always seemed like a "forced" relationship between them and Holy Cross. Than again, there's an entire generation, going on 2, where this is seen as the norm. I'm an old bahhstid xdrunkyx

[DFW HOYA]

Nothing against the 3 fine PL insitutions, but it's always seemed like a "forced" relationship between them and Holy Cross. Than again, there's an entire generation, going on 2, where this is seen as the norm. I'm an old bahhstid xdrunkyx

Who are the three?

[Digby]

Losing the OOC agreement with the Ivies cost the PL a lot; traditional and regional opponents were replaced by lesser names.
It’s a whole lot easier for me to get friends and neighbors to attend a game against Princeton or whatever than versus (fill in the blank). That, and we just can’t compete.
The league has some quirks, such as how much Bucknell needs to be tied to Lafayette and Lehigh, and how Lafayette accepts mediocrity in FB and MBB, and how Fordham doesn’t belong in basketball.

[Digby]

Sader, before you were an old bahhstid, were you just a regular bahhstid?
Good luck in the playoffs. Success awaits!

[TheValleyRaider]

Since Virginia Tech will be celebrating their 150th anniversary the school has a special website dedicated to the occasion. I really enjoyed reading through this...
Virginia Tech History | history.unirel | Virginia Tech (vt.edu) (https://history.unirel.vt.edu/)

Do any PL institutions have a similar website (subsection) dedicated to their history? At this point, for most of us it might be better to look to the past anyway...lol

Colgate put together a site for our bicentennial in 2019: https://200.colgate.edu/

[Franks Tanks]

George Welsh and Frank Beamer really turned both programs around. UVA reached #1 in the country for a few weeks in 1990 before losing to Georgia Tech (eventual champ) in an epic game in Charlottesville. Both of them knew the importance of growing their respective programs for the betterment of each institution and the Commonwealth. Beamer played for Virginia Tech and was a beloved figure in the area due to his family tree.

I was at Virginia Tech two weeks ago and did some research on the institution; fascinating place. It was very much rooted in a male only, military core ideology until the 1970s. It evolved rapidly in the 1980s from a regional institution to one that surpassed the James Madison's and ODU's of the world in terms of capacity/breadth. Football played a big role in growing the school. The Blacksburg/Christiansburg/Radford small metro area is beautiful. I'd have a hard time turning down an opportunity to spend 4 years there. Seriously, what state with two major research research institutions have better locations than Charlottesville and Blacksburg? Colorado (Boulder) and Colorado State (Fort Collins)? Granted, Boulder can be tough even if you're "a bit liberal". The Montana schools? Bozeman is trending towards a more insufferable, expensive Boulder.

Also, if you have time, read up Frank Beamers family; especially Floyd Allen. He was one crazy SOB in SW Virginia.

I'm not a big fan of the south (nothing personal, don't like the heat or things "overly" conservative) but I absolutely love that part of the country. Winchester, Virginia through Johnson City/Bristol/Knoxville into Boone and Asheville is spectacular! Seems like a great retirement spot....

Agree, Welch and Beamer really led the VA schools out of football wasteland.

George Welsh, by the way, is a native of Coaldale, PA. He attended Coaldale High, now part of Panther Valley and Wyoming Seminary. He recruited NEPA hard back in his heyday at UVA.

I also find VA Tech fascinating. It wasn’t all that long ago that VMI was their big rival and they played an annual end of season game against the Keydets in Roanoke.

[Sader87]

Who are the three?

The three Pennsylvania schools....my bad

[caribbeanhen]

Since Virginia Tech will be celebrating their 150th anniversary the school has a special website dedicated to the occasion. I really enjoyed reading through this...
Virginia Tech History | history.unirel | Virginia Tech (vt.edu) (https://history.unirel.vt.edu/)

Do any PL institutions have a similar website (subsection) dedicated to their history? At this point, for most of us it might be better to look to the past anyway...lol

Thanks for posting that

My grandfather, who died 10 years before I was born, landed at Virginia Polytechnic in about 1928. I never made the connection to Virginia Tech until about 15 years ago.

[Leopard Loyalist]

Getting back to the subject of rivalries...DFW is right. Otherwise, Michigan-Michigan State would be a bigger game than Michigan-Ohio State.

[ngineer]

Getting back to the subject of rivalries...DFW is right. Otherwise, Michigan-Michigan State would be a bigger game than Michigan-Ohio State.

I lived in Michigan for three years and can say that the UM/MSU game, while not to the level of the OSU game, is still a pretty intense rivalry. I attended all three while there, and they were all SRO and loud. Still, I think there is a 'highbrow' sense by the Wolverines still viewing MSU as the 'old cow school' from 80 years ago, when it has become much more than that. Back then, you also had the 'personalities' of the Head Coaches involved, especially Bo versus Woody which added juice to the game.

[ngineer]

It's funny, I've often stated that this is one of the few things I've liked with HC being in the PL overall.

Nothing against the 3 fine PL insitutions, but it's always seemed like a "forced" relationship between them and Holy Cross. Than again, there's an entire generation, going on 2, where this is seen as the norm. I'm an old bahhstid xdrunkyx

Actually, the relationship with Fordham is more "forced" than with Holy Cross. At least you guys are 'in' for all sports. I fail to see how Fordham enjoys being a doormat in basketball.

[Leopard Loyalist]

Georgetown (2-7) at Morgan St. (1-9), (1st Meeting), 12:00pm
The Hoyas should be able to pull this one out.
Lafayette (3-7) at Lehigh (2-8), (157th Meeting), 12:00 pm
What else can I do? Records are not supposed to matter for this game, so why wouldn’t I go with “my team” even though it’s been mostly sleepwalking through the last several games?
Fordham (6-4) at Colgate (4-6), (33rd Meeting), 1:00 pm
A risky pick, to be sure, if Brescia runs as he did last week
Holy Cross (8-2) at Bucknell (1-9), (38th Meeting), 1:00 pm
Thanks to the Crusaders for trying to set a high bar for the PL heading into the playoffs

[Colgate TD]

G'town
Lehigh
Colgate
Bucknell

[Pard4Life]

. Lafayette is significantly better than Georgetown & Bucknell.

Fact check: FALSE

[DFW HOYA]

Fact check: FALSE

Not significantly better, but better.

Makes you wonder where Fordham would be sitting if they had traded paychecks at Nebraska and FAU for games with New Hampshire and Furman. And even without a late stop vs. Monmouth, they could be a legit 9-2 and sitting well for at-large consideration.

[Pard4Life]

Not significantly better, but better.

Makes you wonder where Fordham would be sitting if they had traded paychecks at Nebraska and FAU for games with New Hampshire and Furman. And even without a late stop vs. Monmouth, they could be a legit 9-2 and sitting well for at-large consideration.

True but as AD, would you really trade that? Participating in the playoffs is actually a money loser I think... has been discussed around here.

[Sitting Bull]

George Welsh and Frank Beamer really turned both programs around. UVA reached #1 in the country for a few weeks in 1990 before losing to Georgia Tech (eventual champ) in an epic game in Charlottesville. Both of them knew the importance of growing their respective programs for the betterment of each institution and the Commonwealth. Beamer played for Virginia Tech and was a beloved figure in the area due to his family tree.

I was at Virginia Tech two weeks ago and did some research on the institution; fascinating place. It was very much rooted in a male only, military core ideology until the 1970s. It evolved rapidly in the 1980s from a regional institution to one that surpassed the James Madison's and ODU's of the world in terms of capacity/breadth. Football played a big role in growing the school. The Blacksburg/Christiansburg/Radford small metro area is beautiful. I'd have a hard time turning down an opportunity to spend 4 years there. Seriously, what state with two major research research institutions have better locations than Charlottesville and Blacksburg? Colorado (Boulder) and Colorado State (Fort Collins)? Granted, Boulder can be tough even if you're "a bit liberal". The Montana schools? Bozeman is trending towards a more insufferable, expensive Boulder.

Also, if you have time, read up Frank Beamers family; especially Floyd Allen. He was one crazy SOB in SW Virginia.

I'm not a big fan of the south (nothing personal, don't like the heat or things "overly" conservative) but I absolutely love that part of the country. Winchester, Virginia through Johnson City/Bristol/Knoxville into Boone and Asheville is spectacular! Seems like a great retirement spot....

Your initial description on the roots of Virginia Tech - male dominated, a military segment similar to Texas A&M - spot on. From there, will provide a little clearer background on the University and their eventual role as the premier college football program in the State.

It actually started in the 60s. At that time, Virginia featured a mythical “Big 5” - made up of Tech, UVA, VMI, W&M and Richmond. UVA was in the ACC, the others all in the So Con. Tech became an independent in the early 60s. The five teams played each other most every year in football through about 1980, it ended when the NCAA created the 1A/1AA split.

JMU and ODU were largely irrelevant up to that point. JMU was a woman’s teachers school until about 1972 and along with ODU, was competing at the Division 2 level.

Back to Tech, they were the one University that took football big starting in the early 1960s. They went to the Liberty Bowl in 1966 - this was a big deal in Virginia, there were only about 8-10 bowl games at that time. They lost to Miami FL. They returned to the Liberty Bowl in 1968 losing to Ole Miss. They had built Lane Stadium in the early 60s seating 35,000. That was big time capacity then, at or higher than many of the ACC teams. They had a large devoted fan base.

Tech struggled during the 70s. They played a big time schedule, drew huge crowds. Yet they still managed to lose at least one their annual games to W&M, Richmond or VMI. When Bill Dooley was hired in the late 70s, they built toward a return to the national stage which reached a peak with Michael Vick and playing Florida State in the national championship.

UVA was never a football factor even within the “Big 5” until Welsh showed up in the 80s. They were the worst team among the Five during the 70s.

On the basketball side, Tech also led the way going to the tourney in the 60s and winning a dramatic run to the NIT championship at MSG in 1973, beating Notre Dame on a buzzer shot. This was when the NIT was a major tourney, the NCAA only took conference champions, no at large. The win wasn’t the only splash for the Hokies in NYC or during the 70s. While all the other schools cheerleaders were wearing skirts and saddle shoes, the Tech cheerleaders wore skin tight orange shirts, hot pants and white go/go boots. They got more press in NYC during the NIT than the bbl team.

As far as your views of the South, having grown up in Virginia, we have endured plenty of people from north of DC who made their views and opinions known while visiting, often condescending. That also shaded my early opinions of people living northward, especially having visited there, later living there, and not quite seeing the reasons behind the condescending attitudes. To each his own I guess.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Your initial description on the roots of Virginia Tech - male dominated, a military segment similar to Texas A&M - spot on. From there, will provide a little clearer background on the University and their eventual role as the premier college football program in the State.

It actually started in the 60s. At that time, Virginia featured a mythical “Big 5” - made up of Tech, UVA, VMI, W&M and Richmond. UVA was in the ACC, the others all in the So Con. Tech became an independent in the early 60s. The five teams played each other most every year in football through about 1980, it ended when the NCAA created the 1A/1AA split.

JMU and ODU were largely irrelevant up to that point. JMU was a woman’s teachers school until about 1972 and along with ODU, was competing at the Division 2 level.

Back to Tech, they were the one University that took football big starting in the early 1960s. They went to the Liberty Bowl in 1966 - this was a big deal in Virginia, there were only about 8-10 bowl games at that time. They lost to Miami FL. They returned to the Liberty Bowl in 1968 losing to Ole Miss. They had built Lane Stadium in the early 60s seating 35,000. That was big time capacity then, at or higher than many of the ACC teams. They had a large devoted fan base.

Tech struggled during the 70s. They played a big time schedule, drew huge crowds. Yet they still managed to lose at least one their annual games to W&M, Richmond or VMI. When Bill Dooley was hired in the late 70s, they built toward a return to the national stage which reached a peak with Michael Vick and playing Florida State in the national championship.

UVA was never a football factor even within the “Big 5” until Welsh showed up in the 80s. They were the worst team among the Five during the 70s.

On the basketball side, Tech also led the way going to the tourney in the 60s and winning a dramatic run to the NIT championship at MSG in 1973, beating Notre Dame on a buzzer shot. This was when the NIT was a major tourney, the NCAA only took conference champions, no at large. The win wasn’t the only splash for the Hokies in NYC or during the 70s. While all the other schools cheerleaders were wearing skirts and saddle shoes, the Tech cheerleaders wore skin tight orange shirts, hot pants and white go/go boots. They got more press in NYC during the NIT than the bbl team.

As far as your views of the South, having grown up in Virginia, we have endured plenty of people from north of DC who made their views and opinions known while visiting, often condescending. That also shaded my early opinions of people living northward, especially having visited there, later living there, and not quite seeing the reasons behind the condescending attitudes. To each his own I guess.

Great, informative post!

I remember seeing Jim Druckenmiller play in high school then following him during his time at Virginia Tech. He was part of the team (beat Texas in the Sugar Bowl) that really put the Hokies on the map nationally.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Holy Cross 45 Bucknell 6
Colgate 27 Fordham 24
Lehigh 21 Lafayette 17 - Both coaches are awful. Law of averages suggests Gilmore should beat Garrett 1/3 times....

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Fordham 21 Colgate 14 4:12 2Q....back and forth, exciting game so far....

[crusader11]

HC 14 - Bucknell 0.

Wouldn't be surprised if Chesney wants to hang a 50 burger on Bucknell turned away HC fans from attending the spring game.

[crusader11]

HC 31 - Bucknell 0 at the half.

Bucknell has 26 yards of total offense.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Colgate 31 Fordham 24 Late 3Q

The Raiders look good. A 5-1 PL record (i know the league stinks) would be a great springboard towards 2022. Colgate could be back in a hurry....

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Colgate won 45-31...

Raiders finish alone in second place. I'd argue Dakosty should be PL coach of the year.....

[crusader11]

Colgate won 45-31...

Raiders finish alone in second place. I'd argue Dakosty should be PL coach of the year.....

Ehhhh, I get where you're going with this and why you'd suggest it, but when HC wins its PL games by an average of like 30 points, I'm not sure how it's not Chesney.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Holy Cross 45 Bucknell 6
Colgate 27 Fordham 24
Lehigh 21 Lafayette 17 - Both coaches are awful. Law of averages suggests Gilmore should beat Garrett 1/3 times....

Boom! 3-0 to close out the season and nailed the HC-Bucknell score!

[DFW HOYA]

The Conference Of Champions, by coaching records:

Bob Chesney: 24-15 (.615)
Stan Dakosty: 5-6 (.454)
Joe Conlin: 14-23 (.378)
John Garrett: 15-33 (.312)
Rob Sgarlata: 23-53 (.302)
Tom Gilmore: 7-18 (.280)
Dave Cecchini: 5-20 (.200)

[Sader87]

Holy Cross, at the moment anyway, seems to be the only Patriot League school that actually cares about football....

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Colgate 100 Syracuse 85 Final

Damn, what a win for the Raiders! I hate to see the Orange lose but this is a historic win for Colgate basketball. I watched them against Cornell the other night and they looked awful....

[TheValleyRaider]

Colgate is a basketball school now

[crusader11]

Chesney in the PL: 18-3

Doesn’t look like the wagon is slowing down, either.

Owl, are you hearing murmurings off Chesney is a candidate at Temple?

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Chesney in the PL: 18-3

Doesn’t look like the wagon is slowing down, either.

Owl, are you hearing murmurings off Chesney is a candidate at Temple?

The question at this point is not IF Chesney will leave but when. I think this playoff appearance will paint a much better picture of what he believes the ceiling is at HC. Has he reached it? Or is it worth investing another year or two in order to push the envelope further?

Chesney's name has been mentioned informally on the Temple Football FB community I'm a part of on a few occasions. Personally, myself and others are still "less than thrilled" that Temple did not pursue K.C. Keeler with more vigor when Diaz/Carey was hired. At this point (K.C.'s over 60) it's likely that ship has sailed. Even so, he would be one of the very first people i'd call. Temple desperately needs a guy who knows the Northeast and how to handle certain institutional "obstacles" (nothing egregious) in order to succeed at a level that satisfies the masses. At Temple, its' simply having a product that alums, students and the casual SEPA sports fan can take pride in....

[ngineer]

Gtown the only one I got wrong and had the point spread pretty close in both the Holy Cross and Lehigh games and picked the Raiders to win a tight one. Surprised by the 2 TD final spread (unless there was something weird happening).

I hope the Crusaders get a decent draw tomorrow. I think they can give most top 20 schools a competitive game.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Colgate is a basketball school now

This is the backdrop for my Zoom meetings/classes. Thought you might appreciate it...

https://scontent.fagc1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/259695867_4948583655174026_3798751466934766631_n.j pg?_nc_cat=103&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=vAsCG-XkxB4AX8o9AT3&_nc_ht=scontent.fagc1-1.fna&oh=83fd62c778bf0d07052be7b9406ca72e&oe=619DE680