STATS Poll, sept. 27th, 2021

[kdinva]

https://theanalyst.com/na/2021/09/its-a-september-to-remember-in-fcs-top-25-rankings/

Stats Perform FCS Top 25 (Sept. 27)

1. Sam Houston (3-0, 1-0 AQ7), 1,208 points (32 first-place votes)
Previous Ranking: 1; Week 4 Result: 45-35 win at then-No. 25 Central Arkansas
2. South Dakota State (3-0, 1-0 Missouri Valley), 1,195 (10)
Previous Ranking: 2; Week 4 Result: 44-0 win at Indiana State
3. James Madison (3-0, 1-0 CAA), 1,162 (5)
Previous Ranking: 3; Week 4 Result: Open week
4. Montana (3-0, 1-0 Big Sky), 1,089 (3)
Previous Ranking: 4; Week 4 Result: 39-7 win over Cal Poly
5. North Dakota State (3-0, 0-0 Missouri Valley), 1,070
Previous Ranking: 5; Week 4 Result: Open week
6. Eastern Washington (4-0, 1-0 Big Sky), 964
Previous Ranking: 6; Week 4 Result: 50-21 win at Southern Utah
7. Southern Illinois (3-1, 1-0 Missouri Valley), 909
Previous Ranking: 7; Week 4 Result: 35-17 win over Illinois State
8. UC Davis (4-0, 1-0 Big Sky), 859
Previous Ranking: 12; Week 4 Result: 17-14 win at then-No. 14 Weber State
9. Delaware (2-1, 1-0 CAA), 842
Previous Ranking: 8; Week 4 Result: Open week
10. North Dakota (2-1, 0-0 Missouri Valley), 785
Previous Ranking: 10; Week 4 Result: Open week
11. Montana State (3-1, 1-0 Big Sky), 757
Previous Ranking: 13; Week 4 Result: 30-17 win at Portland State
12. Villanova (3-1, 1-0 CAA), 692
Previous Ranking: 11; Week 4 Result: 38-17 at Penn State
13. ETSU (4-0, 1-0 Southern), 637
Previous Ranking: 15; Week 4 Result: 55-48 OT win at Samford
14. Southeastern Louisiana (2-1, 0-0 Southland), 574
Previous Ranking: 16; Week 4 Result: Open week
15. Northern Iowa (2-1, 0-0 Missouri Valley), 528
Previous Ranking: 17; Week 4 Result: Open week
16. Missouri State (2-1, 1-0 Missouri Valley), 527
Previous Ranking: 18; Week 4 Result: 31-23 win over South Dakota
17. Jacksonville State (2-2, 0-0 AQ7), 352
Previous Ranking: 9; Week 4 Result: 34-31 loss to UT Martin
18. VMI (3-1, 1-0 Southern), 338
Previous Ranking: 22; Week 4 Result: 31-23 win over Wofford
19. Weber State (1-3, 0-1 Big Sky), 319
Previous Ranking: 14; Week 4 Result: 17-14 loss to then-No. 12 UC Davis
20. Kennesaw State (2-1, 0-0 Big South), 225
Previous Ranking: 23; Week 4 Result: Open week
21. Rhode Island (3-0, 1-0 CAA): 184
Previous Ranking: Not Ranked; Week 4 Result: Open week
22. Richmond (2-2, 0-1 CAA), 130
Previous Ranking: 24; Week 4 Result: 21-10 loss at Virginia Tech
23. UT Martin (3-1, 0-0 Ohio Valley), 124
Previous Ranking: Not Ranked; Week 4 Result: 34-31 win at Jacksonville State
24. UIW (3-1, 1-0 Southland), 120
Previous Ranking: Not Ranked; Week 4 Result: 31-0 win over McNeese
25. New Hampshire (3-1, 2-0 CAA), 116
Previous Ranking: 21; Week 4 Result: 77-7 loss at Pittsburgh

Dropped Out: Austin Peay (19), Monmouth (20), Central Arkansas (25)

Others Receiving Votes (schools listed on two or more ballots): Austin Peay 86, Alabama A&M 85, Holy Cross 74, Stephen F. Austin 71, Monmouth 35, Central Arkansas 33, Nicholls 33, Murray State 26, Jackson State 22, Chattanooga 20, Duquesne 13, Mercer 11, Princeton 11, Samford 7, South Dakota 6, Eastern Kentucky 4

[crusader11]

Merrimack isn't even receiving votes?

[atthewbon]

How is Jacksonville St still 17

[aceinthehole]

Merrimack isn't even receiving votes?

NEC bias.

[acbearkat]

How is Jacksonville St still 17

Probably because people believe in their talent. I could easily see them dropping at least two or three more games. They're talented, but don't always play up to their talent level. Jacksonville State is reminding of Texas under Tom Herman. The team had talent, but didn't always play like it. The Gamecocks shouldn't be anywhere close to the top 25.

[atthewbon]

NEC bias.
Winner of Duquesne v Merrimack should definitely be ranked. On the AGS Poll for this week I have the Duquesne 24 and Merrimack just out.

[atthewbon]

Probably because people believe in their talent. I could easily see them dropping at least two or three more games. They're talented, but don't always play up to their talent level. Jacksonville State is reminding of Texas under Tom Herman. The team had talent, but didn't always play like it. The Gamecocks shouldn't be anywhere close to the top 25.
Yea they are consistently inconsistent. I could still see them being ranked just not that much ahead of a team with a better record who just beat them in Jacksonville.

[JSUSoutherner]

How is Jacksonville St still 17

Because people are stupid.

[JSUSoutherner]

Probably because people believe in their talent. I could easily see them dropping at least two or three more games. They're talented, but don't always play up to their talent level. Jacksonville State is reminding of Texas under Tom Herman. The team had talent, but didn't always play like it. The Gamecocks shouldn't be anywhere close to the top 25.

Really? I think we'll be lucky to WIN two or three more games.

[JSUSoutherner]

Yea they are consistently inconsistent. I could still see them being ranked just not that much ahead of a team with a better record who just beat them in Jacksonville.

Horse****. We are consistently awful and we have been all season.

This whole inconsistency narrative is hilariously dumb.

[MUHAWKS]

HOLY CROSS not ranked is a slap in face not only to them but The Big South- I know how this board feels about the Big South but Kennesaw is ranked based on beating Wofford? It is def not based on last year- I get Monmouth may be down this year from expectations but they thrashed us, beat an FBS albeit a bad one, beat Yale on the road- Ok there is the Merrimack loss but shocked that a team with a top 20 FCS win, an FBS win, a road win against good Ivy and loss to a team that may be a playoff team is left out. Merrimack not getting votes is absurd too. I get that not every team can be ranked in week 4 but Kennesaw being 20 while HC is unranked makes no sense b/c they are saying the MOnmouth win was not that huge yet Kennesaw until proven otherwise is NOT teh Big South's best team

[crusader11]

HOLY CROSS not ranked is a slap in face not only to them but The Big South- I know how this board feels about the Big South but Kennesaw is ranked based on beating Wofford? It is def not based on last year- I get Monmouth may be down this year from expectations but they thrashed us, beat an FBS albeit a bad one, beat Yale on the road- Ok there is the Merrimack loss but shocked that a team with a top 20 FCS win, an FBS win, a road win against good Ivy and loss to a team that may be a playoff team is left out. Merrimack not getting votes is absurd too. I get that not every team can be ranked in week 4 but Kennesaw being 20 while HC is unranked makes no sense b/c they are saying the MOnmouth win was not that huge yet Kennesaw until proven otherwise is NOT teh Big South's best team

It's a tricky one. Often times, teams from leagues such as the NEC, Ivy, Big South, PL, etc. don't get the benefit of the doubt. There's a perception -- and it's probably the right one -- that because these teams come from outside of the CAA, Valley, Big Sky, and Southern, until they beat a legitimate team from that conference, it's hard to really make a move up the rankings.

I think HC is legit (obviously, I am biased). We have three nice looking wins, as you mentioned. But, it's going to be hard to get respect nationally when our wins are against a dog ***** FBS team, an Ivy, and a Big South. I think that even if we beat Harvard next week, it's not going to be hugely reflected in the polls because "how good do we know Harvard is" when they've played a weak schedule to date (Georgetown and Brown).

Rankings are only rankings. Winning will take care of everything.

But...it does seem a little out of whack that 1-3 Weber St is ranked about 3-1 Holy Cross.

[dewey]

HOLY CROSS not ranked is a slap in face not only to them but The Big South- I know how this board feels about the Big South but Kennesaw is ranked based on beating Wofford? It is def not based on last year- I get Monmouth may be down this year from expectations but they thrashed us, beat an FBS albeit a bad one, beat Yale on the road- Ok there is the Merrimack loss but shocked that a team with a top 20 FCS win, an FBS win, a road win against good Ivy and loss to a team that may be a playoff team is left out. Merrimack not getting votes is absurd too. I get that not every team can be ranked in week 4 but Kennesaw being 20 while HC is unranked makes no sense b/c they are saying the MOnmouth win was not that huge yet Kennesaw until proven otherwise is NOT teh Big South's best team

Imagine how Merrimack feels. Merrimack beat HC 35-21 on 11 September.

Merrimack's only loss is to Main 31-26. Luke others have said they have a big game against Duquesne coming up.

Dewey

[dewey]

It's a tricky one. Often times, teams from leagues such as the NEC, Ivy, Big South, PL, etc. don't get the benefit of the doubt. There's a perception -- and it's probably the right one -- that because these teams come from outside of the CAA, Valley, Big Sky, and Southern, until they beat a legitimate team from that conference, it's hard to really make a move up the rankings.

I think HC is legit (obviously, I am biased). We have three nice looking wins, as you mentioned. But, it's going to be hard to get respect nationally when our wins are against a dog ***** FBS team, an Ivy, and a Big South. I think that even if we beat Harvard next week, it's not going to be hugely reflected in the polls because "how good do we know Harvard is" when they've played a weak schedule to date (Georgetown and Brown).

Rankings are only rankings. Winning will take care of everything.

But...it does seem a little out of whack that 1-3 Weber St is ranked about 3-1 Holy Cross.

Weber State has had a consistent track record in the playoffs over the last QUOTE a few years. Their losses are to James Madison, UC Davis and Utah. I think HC would have the same results in those games.

HC has 2 good wins over Monmouth and Connecticut (FBS). I think Merrimack should be higher than HC but HC has 1 better win.

Dewey

[crusader11]

Weber State has had a consistent track record in the playoffs over the last QUOTE a few years.

Dewey

Should past results impact current rankings?

[DFW HOYA]

Merrimack isn't even receiving votes?

To get poll attention in FCS, they could refer to themselves as "Merrimack State". Private schools fare poorly in these surveys.

[clenz]

Should past results impact current rankings?
No.....but.....you can't really not look at it

If one team has a deacde or two of proven success and year after year after year they are good/top 20 quality then more benefit of the doubt will be given to them over a team that has 2 seasons of success and in those 2 seasons saw an first round exit in games that weren't that close.

Also, you ****ing lost to Merrimack where 99% of FCS fans didn't know/forgot they moved from D2 to D1 because they did it in 2019 and didn't play in 2020. It's not like Merrimack is some sort of powerhouse. Even in D2 they had 1 total playoff appearance - 2006


If anything Merrimack has a bigger gripe than Holy Cross does.

[crusader11]

No.....but.....you can't really not look at it

If one team has a deacde or two of proven success and year after year after year they are good/top 20 quality then more benefit of the doubt will be given to them over a team that has 2 seasons of success and in those 2 seasons saw an first round exit in games that weren't that close.



So the answer is yes.

We are four weeks into the season and Weber State doesn't have a Division I win, yet is ranked inside the Top 20. Past success or not, that doesn't make sense.

[atthewbon]

It's a tricky one. Often times, teams from leagues such as the NEC, Ivy, Big South, PL, etc. don't get the benefit of the doubt. There's a perception -- and it's probably the right one -- that because these teams come from outside of the CAA, Valley, Big Sky, and Southern, until they beat a legitimate team from that conference, it's hard to really make a move up the rankings.

I think HC is legit (obviously, I am biased). We have three nice looking wins, as you mentioned. But, it's going to be hard to get respect nationally when our wins are against a dog ***** FBS team, an Ivy, and a Big South. I think that even if we beat Harvard next week, it's not going to be hugely reflected in the polls because "how good do we know Harvard is" when they've played a weak schedule to date (Georgetown and Brown).

Rankings are only rankings. Winning will take care of everything.

But...it does seem a little out of whack that 1-3 Weber St is ranked about 3-1 Holy Cross.

I think Weber st beats holy cross on a neutral field. That’s the main reason I have them ahead of holy cross in this weeks poll. For reference I had Weber at 17 and Holy cross at 25 in this weeks AGS Poll.

But you’re right rankings are just rankings and the great thing about the auto bid is holy cross has the opportunity to prove the voters wrong and win in the playoffs.

[dewey]

No.....but.....you can't really not look at it

If one team has a deacde or two of proven success and year after year after year they are good/top 20 quality then more benefit of the doubt will be given to them over a team that has 2 seasons of success and in those 2 seasons saw an first round exit in games that weren't that close.

Also, you ****ing lost to Merrimack where 99% of FCS fans didn't know/forgot they moved from D2 to D1 because they did it in 2019 and didn't play in 2020. It's not like Merrimack is some sort of powerhouse. Even in D2 they had 1 total playoff appearance - 2006


If anything Merrimack has a bigger gripe than Holy Cross does.

100% agree. Also why wouldn't you look at past success? Weber State made the playoffs in the spring and probably has most of the team coming back so why wouldn't we expect Weber State to right the ship.

Not to pick on Clenz but this happens to Northern Iowa a LOT. They play a tough OOC schedule every year and people bag on them about being 2-2 or so and then they finish 7-4 or so. Then they get into the playoffs and curbstomp some NEC team.

Jacksonville State is also similar because they have had long term success and get the benefit of the doubt.

Dewey

[POD Knows]

Weber State would beat HC head to head and neither one of them deserves to be in the top 25

[MSUBobcat]

So the answer is yes.

We are four weeks into the season and Weber State doesn't have a Division I win, yet is ranked inside the Top 20. Past success or not, that doesn't make sense.

BBQ actually does have a D-I win, albeit over a transitioning Dixie State. They also have no losses outside of teams currently ranked in the top 7 of the AGS poll. Holy Cross has a loss to a transitioning Merrimack, who is a respectable #37 in this week's AGS poll, and a win over #32. UCONN is FBS in name only and wouldn't be anywhere near ORV in the AGS poll, IMO. Even with their record, my money would be on BBQ to beat Holy Cross 11 times out of 10.

[clenz]

100% agree. Also why wouldn't you look at past success? Weber State made the playoffs in the spring and probably has most of the team coming back so why wouldn't we expect Weber State to right the ship.

Not to pick on Clenz but this happens to Northern Iowa a LOT. They play a tough OOC schedule every year and people bag on them about being 2-2 or so and then they finish 7-4 or so. Then they get into the playoffs and curbstomp some NEC team.

Jacksonville State is also similar because they have had long term success and get the benefit of the doubt.

Dewey
You aren't picking on me. It happens. I have railed against out athletic director for how he schedules for years. Why he feels the need to lock the program into an FBS and then a H/H set up with 2 top 25 Big Sky teams year after year after year is mind numbingly dumb. We also seem to hit NDSU/SDSU fairly early in conference play quite often. So even if we split those two we are at 2-3 after 5 games. The two wins we have are decent, but we also have losses to an FBS, a top 10 FCS and a top 20ish FCS and those loses are almost always within 10 points

The difference is, and we see it with Weber right now, is voters tend to ding UNI quite hard when it happens. Hell, look at every preseason poll thread, or early season poll thread, on AGS over the last decade. Go look at Reddit comments on preseason poll threads (national and conference), hell it happens on random team boards across the country. UNI sits at 15ish preseason and the talk on all of those places is "Typical UNI over ranked. Always happens" and the voters look for the first reason to drop the **** out of them. This year UNI finally didn't have that dumbass OOC schedule and shockingly came out of OOC play completely healthy with a winning record but you see a number of voters just waiting for the first sign of a reason to drop UNI, which is why there's such a range for the program. Some as high as 7ish and others will still have them sitting about 20

This spring set the two apart a fair amount, but I've run the numbers multiple times over the last few years.

If you were to ask a group of random FCS fans and go 'How much better as a program is SDSU than UNI" the answer would be everyone going "miles different" yet their records in conference play over the last decade, again prior to the spring, UNI actually had a better win % by like 2 games but no one would know. The biggest reason for that? OOC schedules and the impact they have on rankings. SDSU's OOC slate has been programs like UW-Stevens Point (or whatver one they played), APBSU, Drake 4 times, Dixie State, Long Island, Duquesne, Southern Utah multiple times, Cal Poly multipel times, Robert Morris, Butler, SLU multiple times while UNI has gone H/H with Montana, EWU, Weber State (and has a game left against them), Idaho State while they were getting votes and expected to be good, Cal Poly twice during decent seasons for them, SUU during their best years of the last decade, etc. There's some overlap but the difference has been the overlap is the weakest side of UNI's OOC has been the toughest side of SDSU's. That is a win, if not two, swing in total record and thus rankings and playoff seeding positions.

When you're an established program playing a weak OOC and putting up wins is good. When you are a program that doesn't have that reputation going 2-1 or 3-0 against bad teams isn't going to get you a lot of respect in polls.

[CenMEBlackBearFan]

Imagine how Merrimack feels. Merrimack beat HC 35-21 on 11 September.

Merrimack's only loss is to Main 31-26. Luke others have said they have a big game against Duquesne coming up.

Dewey

So should Maine be ranked at 1-3 losing to JMU #3, Delaware #9 and FBS NIU? Of course not, Merrimack was good but not a top #25 team. There QB a transfer from Louisana Tech was very good with a couple of good receivors. We lost our starting QB before the Merrimack game and hope when he comes back we can battle the middle tier CAA teams. It is still way early to get your panties bunched up, we go thru this every year and it always shakes itself out the end of the year. Just like there are alot of CAA teams that are 3-1 and have not beaten anyone of any value.

[lionsrking2]

So the answer is yes.

We are four weeks into the season and Weber State doesn't have a Division I win, yet is ranked inside the Top 20. Past success or not, that doesn't make sense.
Nor do they pass the eyeball test when I watch them play -- at least to me.

[MSUBobcat]

So should Maine be ranked at 1-3 losing to JMU #3, Delaware #9 and FBS NIU? Of course not, Merrimack was good but not a top #25 team. There QB a transfer from Louisana Tech was very good with a couple of good receivors. We lost our starting QB before the Merrimack game and hope when he comes back we can battle the middle tier CAA teams. It is still way early to get your panties bunched up, we go thru this every year and it always shakes itself out the end of the year. Just like there are alot of CAA teams that are 3-1 and have not beaten anyone of any value.

But.... if we don't have people getting their panties bunched up.... what are we supposed to talk about til Saturday?? xdontknowx

[ElCid]

Should past results impact current rankings?

Not at all.

[ElCid]

So should Maine be ranked at 1-3 losing to JMU #3, Delaware #9 and FBS NIU? Of course not, Merrimack was good but not a top #25 team. There QB a transfer from Louisana Tech was very good with a couple of good receivors. We lost our starting QB before the Merrimack game and hope when he comes back we can battle the middle tier CAA teams. It is still way early to get your panties bunched up, we go thru this every year and it always shakes itself out the end of the year. Just like there are alot of CAA teams that are 3-1 and have not beaten anyone of any value.

This is a good issue for discussion. At what point do you stop voting for someone with a losing record? If a team plays a pretty good schedule and is 1-3, 2-3, or 2-4, but lost each game to good or really good teams by less than a score, do you still vote for them? If so, why? That they "may" end up at 7-4 really not a factor. If they do they will get votes again once, if, they start winning. Personally, I don't get antsy about voting for a team with a losing record until week 5 results (or 5 games). That gets their "possible" FBS loss out of the way and leaves them at 2-2 otherwise. Before that I am not too upset voting for a team with a losing record, but I don't believe that anyone should be voting for a 1-4 team because they think they might beat someone else. At that point, it becomes serious conjecture without that hard data of Ws.

[Cocky]

Why not go ahead and vote JSU #1?

[ElCid]

Why not go ahead and vote JSU #1?

Because JSUsoutherner would become apoplectic.

[dewey]

Because JSUsoutherner would become apoplectic.

I am fearful he would find all of us and express his displeasure with us.

Dewey

[JSUSoutherner]

I am fearful he would find all of us and express his displeasure with us.

Dewey

It's simple really. Just use your brain and you'll have nothing to worry about.

[KPSUL]

I am fearful he would find all of us and express his displeasure with us.

Dewey

You wouldn't want him to smack you with his Tuba.