Patriot League 2019 Off Season Thread

[DFW HOYA]

It's never too early to start the talk to 2019. As we learned in the post that opened the 2018 thread, things don't always go as planned.



I'm curious what peoples thoughts on next years conference will look like and how they think it will shake out. I know personally the Raiders are excited for what's possibly to come in the sunny tundra ... Curious how everyone else thinks the league will shake out next year.

Colgate - Returns a vast majority on both sides of the ball. Love the quarterback, offensive line, and backfield situation.

Lehigh - Loses two key weapons at wide receiver. Return the best running back in PL though which should take pressure off of a QB who makes questionable decisions as is. If defense tightens up they should at least be in the talk around the top of the league.

Lafayette - That defense loses a bunch of contributors on the d-line but should still be a relatively stingy group. Can the offense figure it out? Should be able to feast on lower end of PL if they can figure out how to put a couple points on the board.

Fordham - Losing the experience they will at QB and RB hurts a ton. Their defense was suspect this year and I'm not sure what they lose to graduation. Supposedly they had a very tough year injury wise. I also think rest of league is catching up with the scholarship situation. Not sure Fordham will be able to "feast" as it used to in coming years.

Bucknell - A team that didn't show much fight towards the end of the year. Could be the biggest ? next year as to what type of team comes out of Lewisburg on Saturdays.

Holy Cross - New coach, no PP. A team that had lofty expectations at beginning of year after a couple games that quickly were extinguished. A bottom half of the league type team that might surprise one of two teams if they don't come ready to play, but doubt they will be contenders.

Georgetown - I don't think much needs to be said here.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Bucknell - Will Susan be back? They had a lot of young players getting reps but they were still terrible this year. It's hard to see them being much better next year regardless who's running the show
Colgate - will be hit very hard by graduation and Hunt is obviously going receive some phone calls. If he returns they head into next year as the favorite basically by default. The tradition of success if obviously on place.
Fordham - really disappointed this year year in Conlin's 1st season. The offense was especially bad and that's Conlin's expertise. I think they'll be vastly improved in 2019.
Georgetown - If Srgarlata returns and Johnson gets some weapons to work with they could be a 6 or 7 win team.
Holy Cross - Could be seen as the favorite imo but the schedule is ridiculously hard. A winning record will be a tall task. The program needs one.
Lafayette - Garrett needs to extinguish a lot of fires. The display today was an embarrassment for all those involved with Leopard football. The QB situation needs serious attention. They'll likely close out the decade without posting a winning record.
Lehigh - I comes down to the staff imo. With the right staff and given the current state of the PL they could turn the corner quick. If it's the same staff then it'll be another year of bad defense and fighting for a winning a record.

[van]

aside from the staff issues, Lehigh has some big shoes to fill from graduations, although I think that several seniors will be eligible for medical 5th years, and then there is the issue of the OL which was hit hard by injury this year but we really don't know if it would have performed better without the injuries

for example the starting 3 DL graduating, 4 year K/P graduating, QB and RB graduating, of these 6 the RB situation should reload fine but really no solid data on the other 5 positions

[RichH2]

Geez DFW this is a summer topic :)
Colgate will be preseason favorite. Raiders lose a lot but also get enough back. Expect continuity to keep them in the race.
The question for Lehigh is who will be coaching?. TBD.
We lose Brad and Dom but our biggest issue will be DTs.All of the position groups have starters or lettermen returning. OL s/b better with Curlin and Motley healthy. Fi gers crossed.
Holy Cross.Chesney has put together a solid team. Certainly a contender for PL title.
Fordham.I give Conlin a pass for 1st year but they were a bad team. A few years away.
Hoyas. If HC stays and he can get some better talent on the OL, they could have at least as good a year.
Bucknell has some talent but Susan has never gotten them beyind mediocre. Does he remain? TBD
Lafayette is ,if anything, more of a mess after 2 years of Garrett. Ms.Freeman has some decisions to make during the off season.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Pretty "interesting" headline in the local Lehigh Valley newspaper regarding Coen...

"Lehigh Gets A Happy Ending To The Season And Maybe A Coach's Career"


If Saturday’s game was the end of his 13-season tenure, it was a fitting final chapter for one of the area’s most classy coaches, regardless of sport or level.
It had been one of the most frustrating seasons of the Coen era as Lehigh followed up back-to-back Patriot League (https://www.mcall.com/topic/sports/college-sports/patriot-league-ORSPT000871-topic.html) championships and Football Championship Subdivision playoff appearances with two wins in their first 10 games and most of the eight losses were not competitive.

https://www.mcall.com/sports/college/mc-spt-lehigh-lafayette-football-20181117-story.html

[RichH2]

Pretty "interesting" headline in the local Lehigh Valley newspaper regarding Coen...

"Lehigh Gets A Happy Ending To The Season And Maybe A Coach's Career"



https://www.mcall.com/sports/college/mc-spt-lehigh-lafayette-football-20181117-story.html
That was the major topic at the game. Word was during August camp that Andy was retiring this year. The overwhelming feeling I got yesterday was the srnse that the day was a testimonial for Andy. If so, it was a fit one for his years at LU. We'll see.

[carney2]

I've given this no thought, and don't plan to begin thinking about it for months and months. The only thing that seems certain at this point is that Garrett was a bad hire at Lafayette and he is not the man to right the ship. Lots of talk about a second consecutive year of mass defections by the coaching staff, and bets are being taken as to how many of the freshmen and sophomores transfer out. (Any freshman or sophomore QB, other than O'Malley, who stays apparently doesn't care much about playing football.) At this point it appears that Garrett has lost all of his apologist supporters, and there is a loud cry for his firing. That absolutely won't happen, but he appears to have lost the respect of everyone in the locker room.

As for the Lehigh coaching situation, there was rumbling (not quite a full blown rumor) during the season that Andy Coen has some health issues. If so, it could play into what happens in Turdville over the next few days and weeks.

[ngineer]

Pretty "interesting" headline in the local Lehigh Valley newspaper regarding Coen...

"Lehigh Gets A Happy Ending To The Season And Maybe A Coach's Career"



https://www.mcall.com/sports/college/mc-spt-lehigh-lafayette-football-20181117-story.html

Very appropriate headline for a season that sucked... up until...

[ColgateTD]

Predicted order of finish 2019 season:
1. Georgetown
2. Colgate
3. Bucknell
4. Lehigh
5. Lafayette
6. Holy Cross
7. Fordham

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Predicted order of finish 2019 season:
1. Georgetown
2. Colgate
3. Bucknell
4. Lehigh
5. Lafayette
6. Holy Cross
7. Fordham

That's bold! Bucknell was horrific and generally have been for a while now. Lafayette and Bucknell appear to be among the very worst FCS programs right now. I could honestly see Georgetown being a legit factor again. HC has to survive their OOC to be a player in the league race.

[Sader87]

HC 6th in '19....as the inestimable Daffy Duck once opined: "Ha, ha and ho, ho! It is to laugh!" xdrunkyx

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

HC 6th in '19....as the inestimable Daffy Duck once opined: "Ha, ha and ho, ho! It is to laugh!" xdrunkyx

I agree. I think HC enters next year either 1 or 2 depending on Hunt. After that, Georgetown, Lehigh and Fordham seem to fit in some order with Lafayette and Bucknell resigned to the basement.

[RichH2]

Gate is the lock for #1 preseason. Agree Cross likely #2. After that its a crap shoot.

[DFW HOYA]

Meanwhile, a new "American Patriot League" has been formed. I guess the name "American Ivy League" wasn't available.

https://www.fox10tv.com/news/mobile-based-football-team-will-play-in-american-patriot-league/article_ece52126-ec41-11e8-a98e-97e2f46a555e.html

[LUHawker]

Meanwhile, a new "American Patriot League" has been formed. I guess the name "American Ivy League" wasn't available.

https://www.fox10tv.com/news/mobile-based-football-team-will-play-in-american-patriot-league/article_ece52126-ec41-11e8-a98e-97e2f46a555e.html

Seems like a trademark infringement.

[Pards Rule]

Sounds like another failure for spring pro football...Two teams only so far: Mobile and Daytona Beach!

[PAllen]

Sounds like another failure for spring pro football...Two teams only so far: Mobile and Daytona Beach!

Probably true, but I'll take more football over less. Plus, if it's successful, we could get all of our playoff guarantees paid for by the settlement.

[RichH2]

Interesting factoid as FCS enters the playoffs. Only 2 conferences have winning records vs the MVFC in the playoffs. The SoCon at 14-10. The PL at 3-2.xcoffeex

Just a reminder of who we were and must be again.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Interesting factoid as FCS enters the playoffs. Only 2 conferences have winning records vs the MVFC in the playoffs. The SoCon at 14-10. The PL at 3-2.xcoffeex

Just a reminder of who we were and must be again.

Absoutely! We know what the ceiling is. That's never been the question. The league desperately needs 2-3 relevant teams on a yearly basis.

[Gate83]

I agree. I think HC enters next year either 1 or 2 depending on Hunt. After that, Georgetown, Lehigh and Fordham seem to fit in some order with Lafayette and Bucknell resigned to the basement.

He just signed a 5 year extension...

https://gocolgateraiders.com/news/2018/11/29/football-raiders-announce-contract-extension-for-hunt.aspx

[Go...gate]

He just signed a 5 year extension...

https://gocolgateraiders.com/news/2018/11/29/football-raiders-announce-contract-extension-for-hunt.aspx

I don't believe Hunt is going anywhere.

[Gate83]

I don't believe Hunt is going anywhere.

Agree. I didn't think he was leaving before, and certainly it's even more unlikely with the extension done. Never say never, but he's happy in Hamilton & very much embedded in the community.

[ColgateTD]

Great news!!

[Fordham]

Predicted order of finish 2019 season:
1. Georgetown
2. Colgate
3. Bucknell
4. Lehigh
5. Lafayette
6. Holy Cross
7. Fordham

Oof. Gate fans mailing it in for ‘19. Maybe once you know your team is locked in pole position you get magnanimous and just start filling in the blanks randomly? But then you took the time to put the color scheme in so I’m back to being confused again

[carney2]

Someone obviously spiked the Thanksgiving punch to yield these predictions for next year. Here's a much more rational attempt:

1. COLGATE - Some graduation losses, but this League is so bad that they are still probably the best.

2. (Tie)
LEHIGH - New coach, new attitude.
HOLY CROSS - A serious knock on the door is Chesney's next step.

4. (Who cares, and in alphabetical order)
BUCKNELL - They never seem to improve.
FORDHAM - It's a mystery how they got this bad.
GEORGETOWN - Just because the blind squirrel found one acorn doesn't mean he'll eat forever.
LAFAYETTE - The same coach will play the same quarterback and achieve the same results.

[Go...gate]

Any rumors or thoughts on who the new Engineer coach will be?

[Lehigh'98]

Any rumors or thoughts on who the new Engineer coach will be?

From what I understand, the situation is a mess right now. Unsure if change will be made at this point. To say it has been handled poorly would be a gross understatement.

[ngineer]

Interesting info heard today at a social function attended by a former Lafayette player who has contact with some former Lehigh coaches. Sterrett is on top of this and 'something is in the works'. I think certain people have to be talked with and clearances received, plus typical HR protocols. Best not to get into some speculated specifics, but I get the sense we should be in decent shape going into next year.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Interesting info heard today at a social function attended by a former Lafayette player who has contact with some former Lehigh coaches. Sterrett is on top of this and 'something is in the works'. I think certain people have to be talked with and clearances received, plus typical HR protocols. Best not to get into some speculated specifics, but I get the sense we should be in decent shape going into next year.

Hopefully that proves to be true! Colgate once again showed FCS today that quality Patriot League teams can roll with the CAA. That's 3-0 for 'Gate against the CAA this year! That's EXTREMELY impressive on its own given the history between the two leagues.

A home playoff game would be a wonderful thing! I enjoyed my trip to Colgate today but I'd still much rather head south to Bethlehem in December.....

[van]

former Lehigh coaches.

hmmm, wonder who they might be?

[Pards Rule]

hmmm, wonder who they might be?
I know...any wash between Easton and Bethlehem lol that could be traced? Still, I assume a gameplan had to be formulated based on this season as to what would happen by Dec. 1 if Coen beats Lafayette (not to mention loses). Maybe they are negotiating a buyout is all I can come up with? And Coen is playing hardball.

[Neighbor2]

Posters here and elsewhere are showing an expectation of a coaching change at Lehigh. I certainly expect that to happen! Lehigh football will continue to be stuck on lousy if Coen and his staff remain in place. Seriously, can anyone convince otherwise?

Get it done. Or, have the courage to admit no change is planned.

[ngineer]

The sense I get is that a 'lateral' move of some kind is being worked on, but there are a number of internal HR protocols that must be followed in the scenario.Additionally, there may be time being spent on negotiations with a successor and no announcements are going to be made until the matter is solidified. some things take time.

[Neighbor2]

A lateral move for Coen would be fine with me. I just believe the best rebuild will come with someone else, and that person’s selections as assistants. The current “Lehigh football” has fallen down almost to a Lafayette level. Yikes!

[LUHawker]

hmmm, wonder who they might be?

I know we at Lehigh (and the PL in general), like to keep it in the family, but I was really hoping for an "outsider" with a strong history of scholarship recruiting and coaching. I don't think it would be the worst thing if Lehigh was a stop for an ambitious coach for 4-5 years.

[Go...gate]

AFAIAC, if Lehigh can bring in the right coach and staff, they can get turned around quickly. I will never forget that Princeton game. Those youngsters had no spark at all. They did not believe in Coen.

[Sader87]

It really doesn't take too much imo to "turn around" a PL program vis a vis within the league anyway...Chesney inherited a relatively young team with no real #1 QB coming into this season and went 4-2 in the league this year....probably should have been 5-1 too as we threw up all ourselves at home against Bucknell.

[NY Crusader 2010]

How much does Colgate lose next year as far as starters go? If they don't reload next year, it could be a REALLY BAD year for the PL. Holy Cross clearly on upswing but we still have a ways to go before we're conference championship good at least relative to top Patriot League teams of the past, to include Colgate's team this year, Colgate '15, Lehigh 2010-11, HC 2009 etc. I don't see Lehigh all of a sudden learning how to field a defense by 2019 and sorry no matter how much they improve Georgetown will not ready to be a major player at the FCS level. Fordham is in rebuild. Lafayette and Bucknell STINK.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

How much does Colgate lose next year as far as starters go? If they don't reload next year, it could be a REALLY BAD year for the PL. Holy Cross clearly on upswing but we still have a ways to go before we're conference championship good at least relative to top Patriot League teams of the past, to include Colgate's team this year, Colgate '15, Lehigh 2010-11, HC 2009 etc. I don't see Lehigh all of a sudden learning how to field a defense by 2019 and sorry no matter how much they improve Georgetown will not ready to be a major player at the FCS level. Fordham is in rebuild. Lafayette and Bucknell STINK.

As a whole I think the league will be better. But I don't see anyone being near a Top 25 level heading into the year. Colgate is going to get crushed by graduation. Their senior class was loaded. Plus Holland is a 5th year guy. They'll still be solid but they're not carrying the torch for the league on a national level unless Hunt has some 4 stars rolling in. I don't think Fordham and Lehigh will be as bad they were this year. Just a modest improvement (like HC this year) would help the league. The Hawks and Rams followed a similar path from the penthouse to the toilet in recent years. But the desire is strong to win at both places which is everything. Both teams must get better on defense and along the line of scrimmage. The OL play in the Bronx and Bethlehem was terrible for much of the year. Holy Cross is definitely the #1 contender heading into the year solely based on Chesney's track record. Had they not come back from being down 31-5 to the Hoyas the offseason narrative would be different. But they did! So it comes down to surviving a brutal OOC schedule and posting a winning record in 2019.

Bucknell and Lafayette are terrible. They're FCS "Bottom 10" worthy and have been for several years. Lafayette seems like a pretty safe bet to finish out the 2010's without a winning record.xembarrassedx

I'm close to climbing on the Hoya bandwagon. Sgarlata must get Johnson some help. They're OOC should be manageable so I could see them making a run at a winning record with improvement on "O".

[Sader87]

Holy Cross is really the only program structurally in place i.e. coaching stability, recruiting, facilities etc. to threaten Colgate next year.

Just about every PL football program not named Colgate or Holy Cross is a dumpstah fire in one way or another right now.

[Gate83]

I think we'll be a little better than Owl lays out. Lose a lot on D, but have a few key pieces back in Wheeler, Rohr, Ioanelli & Daramy-Swaray. Breneman will be a junior & we've got a lot of lineman back with experience. Matthews & Twyman both back at RB with considerable experience. Agree the gap with the rest of the league won't be as wide as this year (not possible), but i'm not ruling out next year's squad growing into a top 25 type team by the end of the year.

[Sader87]

Colgate wan't that much bettah than HC this year...just sayin'....took a couple of big 3rd down conversions to win that game 24-17 at Hamilton this year....

[NY Crusader 2010]

HC OOC brutal. 2-4 might be considered a good start. Whats Colgates schedule like?

[crusader11]

Anyone think that Sgarlata will receive job offers this offseason? Can he really do much better at Georgetown than the record he compiled this past season? Is an FBS DC > Georgetown HC?

[PAllen]

Anyone think that Sgarlata will receive job offers this offseason? Can he really do much better at Georgetown than the record he compiled this past season? Is an FBS DC > Georgetown HC?

Unless it is lower half G6 then yes.

[NY Crusader 2010]

Colgate wan't that much bettah than HC this year...just sayin'....took a couple of big 3rd down conversions to win that game 24-17 at Hamilton this year....

As much as we improved this season, I don't think the score would have been nearly as close had we played in November. Remember Colgate was up 24-0 at half against us. My opinion is that second half was a wake up call for them and led to them keeping their foot on the gas for a full four quarters the rest of the way.

[DFW HOYA]

Anyone think that Sgarlata will receive job offers this offseason? Can he really do much better at Georgetown than the record he compiled this past season? Is an FBS DC > Georgetown HC?

Never say never, but not a lot of coaches have been at one school for 24 years. What would being the linebackers coach at Georgia Southern or UTEP offer him outside salary?

Sgarlata's predecessor, Kevin Kelly, is on his 15th different school in 37 years; the eight years at GU being his longest stay anywhere. And with a vacancy at Bryant, it could be a 16th school around the corner. Some coaches like moving around, but most do not, including families. Current Georgetown coordinator Rob Spence has moved seven times in ten years since he was OC at Clemson, where he would have been a legitimate head coaching candidate at some point.

How many times do coaches want to move for the brass ring? I liken it to the 6:00 news anchor in Lafayette, IN. He's got a good job, steady pay, and good ratings. He could retire there, but if he wants to be on the network, he trades that in for a general assignment reporter at a Top-100 market, say, Rochester, hope he gets promoted back to an anchor, and if the ratings are good maybe he gets on in Hartford, and them up to Nashville and maybe, maybe someone calls in Raleigh-Durham, and maybe, just maybe, he finds a role at one of the network feeder markets like Chicago, Dallas, or Miami where a lot of network talent is groomed and he's just another name, probably an older one at that. All that for a network job that may or may not come, any one step of which might have had a boss that doesn't like him and gives him assignments to cover the zoo or the elementary school beat for his highlight reel. Suddenly, the 6:00 and 11:00 pm news in Lafayette wasn't that bad at all.

[Gate83]

HC OOC brutal. 2-4 might be considered a good start. Whats Colgates schedule like?

Hard. Air Force, Maine, Dartmouth, W&M, Cornell. Don't have a 12th game on the schedule, at least as yet. Not as bad as yours as that BC/Cuse double is rough... but Maine/Dartmouth could be tougher than any of your FCS contests. I think we could win or lose any of our OOC games (including AF).

[ngineer]

As a whole I think the league will be better. But I don't see anyone being near a Top 25 level heading into the year. Colgate is going to get crushed by graduation. Their senior class was loaded. Plus Holland is a 5th year guy. They'll still be solid but they're not carrying the torch for the league on a national level unless Hunt has some 4 stars rolling in. I don't think Fordham and Lehigh will be as bad they were this year. Just a modest improvement (like HC this year) would help the league. The Hawks and Rams followed a similar path from the penthouse to the toilet in recent years. But the desire is strong to win at both places which is everything. Both teams must get better on defense and along the line of scrimmage. The OL play in the Bronx and Bethlehem was terrible for much of the year. Holy Cross is definitely the #1 contender heading into the year solely based on Chesney's track record. Had they not come back from being down 31-5 to the Hoyas the offseason narrative would be different. But they did! So it comes down to surviving a brutal OOC schedule and posting a winning record in 2019.

Bucknell and Lafayette are terrible. They're FCS "Bottom 10" worthy and have been for several years. Lafayette seems like a pretty safe bet to finish out the 2010's without a winning record.xembarrassedx

I'm close to climbing on the Hoya bandwagon. Sgarlata must get Johnson some help. They're OOC should be manageable so I could see them making a run at a winning record with improvement on "O".

Lehigh's OL should be much improved next year as we get the two OL starters, who were lost for the season, back. Some decent frosh and sophs got some good experience. WRs should be improved and the frosh RB has a lot of talent. Biggest Q will be at QB. Monaco with some experience, but doesn't set the world on fire. Two others with unknown talent. However, we have a new QB coming in that a number of people are high on based upon film and high level of competition.
Defense, as always, must improve. So many times this year, the D would have nice stretches, then collapse either mentally with blown assignments, or lousy tackling. Colgate shows that one can do it with defense.
Special teams will be unknown as four year starter, Mish, graduates. Devine is a backup, and I note we have a P/K coming in, but unknown talent.

[The Boogie Down]

Colgate wan't that much bettah than HC this year...just sayin'....

Late nominee for funniest post of the year! Juss sayin... :D xsmiley_wixxsmileyclapxxhurrayxxthumbsupx

[PAllen]

Lehigh's OL should be much improved next year as we get the two OL starters, who were lost for the season, back. Some decent frosh and sophs got some good experience. WRs should be improved and the frosh RB has a lot of talent. Biggest Q will be at QB. Monaco with some experience, but doesn't set the world on fire. Two others with unknown talent. However, we have a new QB coming in that a number of people are high on based upon film and high level of competition.
Defense, as always, must improve. So many times this year, the D would have nice stretches, then collapse either mentally with blown assignments, or lousy tackling. Colgate shows that one can do it with defense.
Special teams will be unknown as four year starter, Mish, graduates. Devine is a backup, and I note we have a P/K coming in, but unknown talent.

For Lehigh, it's all about who will be coaching on the sidelines. I don't see us as world beaters with the talent in view, but we could easily compete for a league title next year if the league is still down and we have a staff that knows how to execute at this level.

[carney2]

Lots of talk about contenders and pretenders on this thread (as it should be), but little about the great unwashed. Anyway, some points to be made about Lafayette, in some ways the dirtiest of them all:

The OOC schedule is not as difficult as some, but for a downtrodden program Like this it's difficult to see any wins coming from W&M, Monmouth, Penn, Sacred Heart and Princeton, even though four of the five games are at home.

For the first time in many years the schedule is loaded with home games (7). For a program that has pi$$ed away its fan base this won't be much of an advantage.

The biggest problem going into 2019 is coaching. John Garrett has, so far, shown absolutely nothing as a head coach and "offensive genius." He continues to serve as his own OC. The early signs are that, for the second consecutive year, the staff is looking for greener pastures.

The number one sign of progress - or not - will be who Garrett sends out under center at the opener in Williamsburg. The incumbent, Sean O'Malley, has had an incomprehensible 2 year, 22 game audition and has, so far, demonstrated that he is not a D-1 QB. If he is sent out there again, all is probably lost.

Defense has been the strength of this woebegone bunch. The credit goes to DC Luke Thompson who supposedly circulated his resume last year and is no guarantee to be around for 2019. Graduation, of course, is a factor, but the defense could again be above average in 2019.

Wins - any wins - will be surprises for the Leopards in 2019.

[ngineer]

Lots of talk about contenders and pretenders on this thread (as it should be), but little about the great unwashed. Anyway, some points to be made about Lafayette, in some ways the dirtiest of them all:

The OOC schedule is not as difficult as some, but for a downtrodden program Like this it's difficult to see any wins coming from W&M, Monmouth, Penn, Sacred Heart and Princeton, even though four of the five games are at home.

For the first time in many years the schedule is loaded with home games (7). For a program that has pi$$ed away its fan base this won't be much of an advantage.

The biggest problem going into 2019 is coaching. John Garrett has, so far, shown absolutely nothing as a head coach and "offensive genius." He continues to serve as his own OC. The early signs are that, for the second consecutive year, the staff is looking for greener pastures.

The number one sign of progress - or not - will be who Garrett sends out under center at the opener in Williamsburg. The incumbent, Sean O'Malley, has had an incomprehensible 2 year, 22 game audition and has, so far, demonstrated that he is not a D-1 QB. If he is sent out there again, all is probably lost.

Defense has been the strength of this woebegone bunch. The credit goes to DC Luke Thompson who supposedly circulated his resume last year and is no guarantee to be around for 2019. Graduation, of course, is a factor, but the defense could again be above average in 2019.

Wins - any wins - will be surprises for the Leopards in 2019.

I am hearing that Garrett is not an easy guy to work with or work for. When you look at his resume and see all the "stops" he's made along the way (couple years here, few years there, etc.) at his age, it might say something about his style that wears out early. Agreed about LC's defense. Has to be the building block for sustained success.

[Franks Tanks]

I am hearing that Garrett is not an easy guy to work with or work for. When you look at his resume and see all the "stops" he's made along the way (couple years here, few years there, etc.) at his age, it might say something about his style that wears out early. Agreed about LC's defense. Has to be the building block for sustained success.

Do Lehigh guys still think Andy won’t be the coach next year? The season ended nearly 3 weeks ago and signing day is right around the corner. This is a ridiculously long time if something has been in the works for months as many have said.

Garrett does appear to be a bit difficult to work with. I will say however that any coach with any sort of ambition, who is working in the PL, has his resume out every year. Very few of these guys want to be PL lifers and make what is essentially a teacher salary, unless they have a clearly defined career path at their current job (such as Hunt being groomed to take over for Biddle). I understand not taking a lateral move, but not testing the waters every year is career malpractice for these guys.

[RichH2]

Do Lehigh guys still think Andy won’t be the coach next year? The season ended nearly 3 weeks ago and signing day is right around the corner. This is a ridiculously long time if something has been in the works for months as many have said.

Garrett does appear to be a bit difficult to work with. I will say however that any coach with any sort of ambition, who is working in the PL, has his resume out every year. Very few of these guys want to be PL lifers and make what is essentially a teacher salary, unless they have a clearly defined career path at their current job (such as Hunt being groomed to take over for Biddle). I understand not taking a lateral move, but not testing the waters every year is career malpractice for these guys.

The rumor mill fairly consistent saying Andy will be promoted to an AD spot and a prior LU coach is coming in.
Sources are pretty good but there is zero actual info one way or the other. Explanations for the delay abound . How much it may hamper recruiting is likewise not clear. The assts are on the road and offers are still being made. 12/19 will certainly answer that question ate least for this early period.

[Franks Tanks]

The rumor mill fairly consistent saying Andy will be promoted to an AD spot and a prior LU coach is coming in.
Sources are pretty good but there is zero actual info one way or the other. Explanations for the delay abound . How much it may hamper recruiting is likewise not clear. The assts are on the road and offers are still being made. 12/19 will certainly answer that question ate least for this early period.

I hope it’s Trey Brown, but I’m sure it’s Chechenni.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Do Lehigh guys still think Andy won’t be the coach next year? The season ended nearly 3 weeks ago and signing day is right around the corner. This is a ridiculously long time if something has been in the works for months as many have said.

Garrett does appear to be a bit difficult to work with. I will say however that any coach with any sort of ambition, who is working in the PL, has his resume out every year. Very few of these guys want to be PL lifers and make what is essentially a teacher salary, unless they have a clearly defined career path at their current job (such as Hunt being groomed to take over for Biddle). I understand not taking a lateral move, but not testing the waters every year is career malpractice for these guys.

If there is a health element to it then the extended period of time makes sense. Many thought Meyer was going to step down after the season yet they still had to wait until the very end to announce it. They easily could have made something public after the Michigan win. His wife was balling her eyes out. It's brutally tough with the early signing period. Ohio State and Day have already lost two major commits since Monday.

Sterrett definitely needs to get a move on it. One would hope that something is said, either way, by early next week. If it's a former coach, aka Cech, then the transition will be extremely smooth.

What I don't get is why there aren't more alums coaching in the PL. Outside of Moorhead has there been another one? I can't think of anyone. The schools seem tailor made for them to assume these positions. Alums have taken over the IL with mostly positive results.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

I hope it’s Trey Brown, but I’m sure it’s Chechenni.

Likely would be Cech but still a chance at Folmar if Cignetti leaves Elon?

I think both would be very good but Cech would get the ship turned around a little quicker. He's not afraid to ruffle some feathers in order to win. Plus, Dave knows every part of the Lehigh program at this point. He, Sterrett and Coen would be a great leadership trio imo.

[RichH2]

Likely would be Cech but still a chance at Folmar if Cignetti leaves Elon?

I think both would be very good but Cech would get the ship turned around a little quicker. He's not afraid to ruffle some feathers in order to win. Plus, Dave knows every part of the Lehigh program at this point. He, Sterrett and Coen would be a great leadership trio imo.

Agreed.

[Franks Tanks]

If there is a health element to it then the extended period of time makes sense. Many thought Meyer was going to step down after the season yet they still had to wait until the very end to announce it. They easily could have made something public after the Michigan win. His wife was balling her eyes out. It's brutally tough with the early signing period. Ohio State and Day have already lost two major commits since Monday.

Sterrett definitely needs to get a move on it. One would hope that something is said, either way, by early next week. If it's a former coach, aka Cech, then the transition will be extremely smooth.

What I don't get is why there aren't more alums coaching in the PL. Outside of Moorhead has there been another one? I can't think of anyone. The schools seem tailor made for them to assume these positions. Alums have taken over the IL with mostly positive results.

The Georgetown guy in an alum, but he’s the only other one I can think of.

Bucknell interviewed Justin Lustig before settling on Susan, and I think they made the wrong choice there.

[RichH2]

There are some PL alums in coaching at various levels. Why not more in the PL? Quick simple answer is that the vast majority of students, including football players, come to PL schools for the academics and career opportunities first and athletics second.

[Colgate Raider Redux]

There are some PL alums in coaching at various levels. Why not more in the PL? Quick simple answer is that the vast majority of students, including football players, come to PL schools for the academics and career opportunities first and athletics second.
Three current assistants at Colgate are alumni. One is the Associate Head Coach who is in charge of recruiting. Another is the Offensive Coordinator.

[DFW HOYA]

There are some PL alums in coaching at various levels. Why not more in the PL? Quick simple answer is that the vast majority of students, including football players, come to PL schools for the academics and career opportunities first and athletics second.

That's a overstatement. How many football coaches come from the University of Alabama vs. its undergraduate population as a whole? Next to none. You can also state that the vast majority of students, come to SEC schools for the academics and career opportunities first and athletics second. A close second, perhaps, but second.

[Gate83]

Three current assistants at Colgate are alumni. One is the Associate Head Coach who is in charge of recruiting. Another is the Offensive Coordinator.

Fred Dunlap of course was an alum/coach at Gate. After 19 years as an assistant & raising his kids in town, Hunt is even better than an alum... he's a local.

[RichH2]

That's a overstatement. How many coaches come from Alabama vs. the undergraduate population as a whole? Next to none. You can also state that the vast majority of students, including football players, come to SEC schools for the academics and career opportunities first and athletics second. A close second, perhaps, but second.

I am not comparing football players "to" the general student body. I am merely pointing out that they are a part of the student body. Obviously, alum football coaches would come from players not generally from non football students. My point is that the vast majority of football players, like most other students come to a PL schools for academics first. I note for recruits I'm familiar with the fact that we are a D1 league is a real ego boost. Is it a determining factor? No idea.

[carney2]

I'm not sure that I see the advantages of hiring an alum as the head coach. In fact, I could probably tick off a few disadvantages if I thought about it for a while. Frankly, I like what Lafayette did with its last two hires - the process, that is. Of course, they whiffed on the final decision for a football coach, but that doesn't mean that the process wasn't correct. They followed up with a similar approach to hiring a women's basketball coach where they may have hit a home run. Anyway, I see a lot of advantages to running a legitimate search that covers all the bases.

[RichH2]

Talking about coaches, a full team meeting has been called for Friday. May be an end to the suspense at Lehigh. Fingers crossed.xdrunkyxxnod

Just heard staff meeting tomorrow.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Talking about coaches, a full team meeting has been called for Friday. May be an end to the suspense at Lehigh. Fingers crossed.xdrunkyxxnod

Just heard staff meeting tomorrow.

Wow! Well, there's some legit head turning news we've been waiting for....

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

The rumors of Cecchini replacing Coen have hit the Valpo board.

[RichH2]

The rumors of Cecchini replacing Coen have hit the Valpo board.


What do we think we know. LU is hiring a prior LU coach. Dave certainly fits the bill as does Higgins, Lembo, Clawson, Wilcher, Gilmore, Trey Brown and Stambaugh. :)
Some time ago I wondered who might be a possible choice for Sterrett. I found a surprising number of LU alums and prior LU coaches. There are quite a few more than I've mentioned here. MY guess is that Dave will be the pick. Lets remember that when Pete left the HC spot came down to a choice of Andy and Dave.

[ngineer]

xshhhxxprayxxhypedxxpopcornxxdizzyx

[ngineer]

xshhhxxprayxxhypedxxpopcornxxdizzyx


Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick....xshakingmadxxxmasx..hopefully, comes early...

[RichH2]

Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick....xshakingmadxxxmasx..hopefully, comes early...

Gee, and I thought I was impatient for announcement.
Tomorrow is Friday. We can make it one more day.xeyebrowx. Sure we can.xbeerchugx

[Bill]

Gee, and I thought I was impatient for announcement.
Tomorrow is Friday. We can make it one more day.xeyebrowx. Sure we can.xbeerchugx

I will add this though - Lehigh still out there recruiting. My brother, who is a coach at a NH high school, had a Lehigh assistant in today to look at one of their players....

[RichH2]

They've been all over since Thanksgiving. Offers still going out. So far about one a day over the last week or so.

[Tribe4SF]

I've given this no thought, and don't plan to begin thinking about it for months and months. The only thing that seems certain at this point is that Garrett was a bad hire at Lafayette and he is not the man to right the ship. Lots of talk about a second consecutive year of mass defections by the coaching staff, and bets are being taken as to how many of the freshmen and sophomores transfer out. (Any freshman or sophomore QB, other than O'Malley, who stays apparently doesn't care much about playing football.) At this point it appears that Garrett has lost all of his apologist supporters, and there is a loud cry for his firing. That absolutely won't happen, but he appears to have lost the respect of everyone in the locker room.



Gordie Sammis is now at W&M coaching the OL. Hope you can make the game on Aug. 31 and come to our tailgate again.

[Stripes]

Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick....xshakingmadxxxmasx..hopefully, comes early...

When is this meeting to take place? What time today?

[RichH2]

When is this meeting to take place? What time today?

We dont know. My guess would be lunchtime or 4pm or so after classes. Dont forget,while well sourced this info is a product of the rumor mill. Lots of tea leaves but no confirmation at all.

[Gater]

I think Colgate will be OK next year. Wofford--who was preseason all-league and hurt on first play of the season comes back from injury--so you have four starters coming back on the O-line. Coaches are very high on a bunch of the young OL guys so it seems like there is depth there. All-league QB comes back. A bunch of solid rb's come back (Holland is a great player and will be missed). Pre-season All American TJ Holl got a medical red shirt and is back. Wheeler is back (which means Colgate brings back two defensive players of the year). 315 pound NT comes back after dealing with injuries and some other hard stuff this year. The other all-league LB is back. LB Trevor Thompson comes back from injury (he was in the mix to start this past year). Castillo is gone but there is (by all accounts) a very good cover corner waiting. All-league corner Daramy is back (he along with Wheeler and Holl should get pre-season all-American votes) The safeties will be missed. Wisniewski (the best hitter I've ever seen) is very hard to replace. That being said, every position on the outgoing D was incredibly solid. Guys who don't get a lot of accolades (#8, 53, 95 and 41) would be 'gate's best player a number of years. In good shape at TE. WR will lose some really good players but gain some speed with Caine and Sizer.

Think the culture is the thing that is the most important to Colgate at this point. I have no idea what other PL teams do over the summer, but Colgate has 60 plus guys on campus every year. Feel like this is a big reason why Colgate is so solid at this point. If the team puts in the work they did last year (I think Holl and others will make sure this happens) 2019 edition of Colgate football has the potential to be very good.

[cx500d]

I think Colgate will be OK next year. Wofford--who was preseason all-league and hurt on first play of the season comes back from injury--so you have four starters coming back on the O-line. Coaches are very high on a bunch of the young OL guys so it seems like there is depth there. All-league QB comes back. A bunch of solid rb's come back (Holland is a great player and will be missed). Pre-season All American TJ Holl got a medical red shirt and is back. Wheeler is back (which means Colgate brings back two defensive players of the year). 315 pound NT comes back after dealing with injuries and some other hard stuff this year. The other all-league LB is back. LB Trevor Thompson comes back from injury (he was in the mix to start this past year). Castillo is gone but there is (by all accounts) a very good cover corner waiting. All-league corner Daramy is back (he along with Wheeler and Holl should get pre-season all-American votes) The safeties will be missed. Wisniewski (the best hitter I've ever seen) is very hard to replace. That being said, every position on the outgoing D was incredibly solid. Guys who don't get a lot of accolades (#8, 53, 95 and 41) would be 'gate's best player a number of years. In good shape at TE. WR will lose some really good players but gain some speed with Caine and Sizer.

Think the culture is the thing that is the most important to Colgate at this point. I have no idea what other PL teams do over the summer, but Colgate has 60 plus guys on campus every year. Feel like this is a big reason why Colgate is so solid at this point. If the team puts in the work they did last year (I think Holl and others will make sure this happens) 2019 edition of Colgate football has the potential to be very good.

I feel sorry for the rest of the Patriot League

[Gate83]

I think Colgate will be OK next year. Wofford--who was preseason all-league and hurt on first play of the season comes back from injury--so you have four starters coming back on the O-line. Coaches are very high on a bunch of the young OL guys so it seems like there is depth there. All-league QB comes back. A bunch of solid rb's come back (Holland is a great player and will be missed). Pre-season All American TJ Holl got a medical red shirt and is back. Wheeler is back (which means Colgate brings back two defensive players of the year). 315 pound NT comes back after dealing with injuries and some other hard stuff this year. The other all-league LB is back. LB Trevor Thompson comes back from injury (he was in the mix to start this past year). Castillo is gone but there is (by all accounts) a very good cover corner waiting. All-league corner Daramy is back (he along with Wheeler and Holl should get pre-season all-American votes) The safeties will be missed. Wisniewski (the best hitter I've ever seen) is very hard to replace. That being said, every position on the outgoing D was incredibly solid. Guys who don't get a lot of accolades (#8, 53, 95 and 41) would be 'gate's best player a number of years. In good shape at TE. WR will lose some really good players but gain some speed with Caine and Sizer.

Think the culture is the thing that is the most important to Colgate at this point. I have no idea what other PL teams do over the summer, but Colgate has 60 plus guys on campus every year. Feel like this is a big reason why Colgate is so solid at this point. If the team puts in the work they did last year (I think Holl and others will make sure this happens) 2019 edition of Colgate football has the potential to be very good.

Gater, I had not heard definitively that Woolford and Holl are coming back. Have you? I heard Holl was discussed on the broadcast yesterday & is hoping to gain another year, have heard nothing about Woolford's plans. Would be a big boost if they both play another year.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

I feel sorry for the rest of the Patriot League

Colgate will be good but they still need to find an offense. Matthews is solid but Holland was a helluva back and had 5th year experience. Getting Holl back would be a huge get. Still, that secondary is going to take a hit.

Holy Cross will be formidable and there's not a doubt in my mind that Lehigh will be heard from rather quickly. The unfortunate Coen situation made things really tough. A 3-peat will not be easy for the Raiders. But they definitely are the favorites to start.

[Gater]

'83, heard definitively that Holl was back--think it was Hunt in an interview. Heard early in the season that Woolford had been getting looked at by the pros and would be back--it was more of a given than anything official but could for sure be wrong on that.

Agreed with Owl on Holland. Holland only had 20 negative yards on 207 carries taking the ball four yards behind the line of scrimmage. Incredibly good at twisting forward and very good vision. A great back. Matthews is a very good back as is Twyman. Can see Twyman getting a lot of carries for his ability to keep moving forward after initial contact.

As for Colgate's O, I was sitting with some former players at the JMU game and the word was that Breneman's AC joint injury was pretty bad and that he had gotten a cortisone shot before the game and couldn't feel his passing hand. Kind of makes sense when you think about the game he had. His long throws were on the mark but his touch passes (which he had been completing all year) were off. Have no idea what condition his arm was in for the NDSU game, but it's hard to imagine it was 100%. As for the rest of the offense, it's a little hard to say how good it was last year. It wasn't great at UNH, but Colgate lost its left tackle and #1 receiver for that game--and UNH could certainly play well at times. As for the rest of the stats, Colgate was so far ahead in the majority of its games that its hard to say what the O was capable of. I mean the #4 rusher on the team was the #4 QB (Ferrari--who might have been one of the best running QB's in memory--kid ran tough and could fly). Sizer is supposed to be the best athlete on the team. Caine is great after the catch. But losing a bunch of guys who blocked well and caught most everything thrown their way.

[Pard4Life]

More evidence of the fall of the PL: 3 NEC guys on first and second team All-America FCS, one for PL and I'm not counting the punter.

[Go...gate]

More evidence of the fall of the PL: 3 NEC guys on first and second team All-America FCS, one for PL and I'm not counting the punter.

The league has work to do. But the potential is there.

[UAalum72]

Lots of talk about contenders and pretenders on this thread (as it should be), but little about the great unwashed. Anyway, some points to be made about Lafayette, in some ways the dirtiest of them all:

The OOC schedule is not as difficult as some, but for a downtrodden program Like this it's difficult to see any wins coming from W&M, Monmouth, Penn, Sacred Heart and Princeton, even though four of the five games are at home.The schedule released by the CAA on 10/31 says that Lafayette is playing at Albany on 9/21.
https://caasports.com/news/2018/10/31/caa-football-announces-schedule-for-2019.aspx

[Sader87]

Doubtful it affects football in the PL in any significant way, but AD Pine took the AD job at Air Force yesterday.

[DFW HOYA]

Some candidates for the Lehigh search:

https://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2018/12/fifteen-guys-who-might-be-lehighs-next.html?fbclid=IwAR2ESCHl6Rj6GsamIxDW2UBXz4AVQxi jQMugiatHSerqzROXAeMwgzyas54

[Sader87]

It's interesting how LFN thinks a "local connection" is somewhat important in the hiring process.

Lehigh (and maybe Lafayette) seems to be the most parochial of all the PL football schools.

[ngineer]

It's interesting how LFN thinks a "local connection" is somewhat important in the hiring process.

Lehigh (and maybe Lafayette) seems to be the most parochial of all the PL football schools.

I agree that such a connection is overplayed. I doubt it makes much an impact for those hiring. The only caveat is that it MAY be a nice lure to someone who might want to come 'home' at a certain time in their life. I do not think it should have any impact on Lehigh. Both LU and LC have experience tough times recruiting in the Lehigh Valley in recent times because of the elevated admissions standards. Time and again, we alums submit names of kids we see play at our local HS with the response that admissions won't sign off. Ironically, some end up playing for Penn! So being able to more effectively 'mine' the LV is a pipe dream. I hope we get someone who has the ability to have a national viewpoint in terms of recruiting AND experience as to what we need to get to the 'proverbial next level'.

[van]

I agree that such a connection is overplayed. I doubt it makes much an impact for those hiring. The only caveat is that it MAY be a nice lure to someone who might want to come 'home' at a certain time in their life. I do not think it should have any impact on Lehigh. Both LU and LC have experience tough times recruiting in the Lehigh Valley in recent times because of the elevated admissions standards. Time and again, we alums submit names of kids we see play at our local HS with the response that admissions won't sign off. Ironically, some end up playing for Penn! So being able to more effectively 'mine' the LV is a pipe dream. I hope we get someone who has the ability to have a national viewpoint in terms of recruiting AND experience as to what we need to get to the 'proverbial next level'.

way to throw the Quackers under the bus xsmiley_wix

[RichH2]

I agree that such a connection is overplayed. I doubt it makes much an impact for those hiring. The only caveat is that it MAY be a nice lure to someone who might want to come 'home' at a certain time in their life. I do not think it should have any impact on Lehigh. Both LU and LC have experience tough times recruiting in the Lehigh Valley in recent times because of the elevated admissions standards. Time and again, we alums submit names of kids we see play at our local HS with the response that admissions won't sign off. Ironically, some end up playing for Penn! So being able to more effectively 'mine' the LV is a pipe dream. I hope we get someone who has the ability to have a national viewpoint in terms of recruiting AND experience as to what we need to get to the 'proverbial next level'.

+1
Agreed. Lehigh connection is nice and shouldnt be a bar or a necessity. A HC capable of running a winning program.A key part of that is familiarity and success with schollie recruiting. We have seen the havoc the lack of familiarity can wreak.

[Go...gate]

Nathan Pine's departure from HC for Air Force.

My question: Will HC continue his aggressive initiatives?

https://gazette.com/military/nathan-pine-named-athletic-director-at-air-force-academy/article_6828b5e8-ff19-11e8-a51b-a304b8718402.html

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Nathan Pine's departure from HC for Air Force.

My question: Will HC continue his aggressive initiatives?

https://gazette.com/military/nathan-pine-named-athletic-director-at-air-force-academy/article_6828b5e8-ff19-11e8-a51b-a304b8718402.html

This could be a blessing. He talked a good game and was rather energetic but Crusader athletics continue to struggle for the most part. I do think the Chesney hire was good. Carmody just seems happy to ride along into retirement.

[Go...gate]

This could be a blessing. He talked a good game and was rather energetic but Crusader athletics continue to struggle for the most part. I do think the Chesney hire was good. Carmody just seems happy to ride along into retirement.

Biggest mistake Carmody ever made was leaving Princeton. Carril's hand-picked replacement and he walked away.

[DFW HOYA]

When you send a coach's letter, make sure the largest donor in the history of the program gets a copy.

http://ramblingsfromthebench.blogspot.com/2018/12/on-early-signing-day-look-back-at-2018.html#more

[RichH2]

When you send a coach's letter, make sure the largest donor in the history of the program gets a copy.

http://ramblingsfromthebench.blogspot.com/2018/12/on-early-signing-day-look-back-at-2018.html#more

Wow. That is a brutal takedown of Garrett and the Lafayette football program. Reinhard has been on the Pard beat for decades. His article is honest and heart felt with almost absolute contenpt for Garrett.

[ngineer]

Agreed. That article is a real eye opener as Reinhard has been Lafayette's cheerleader for years. I know Groller is "Lehigh's boy" with The Morning Call, but Keith has never been an ass-kisser imo. Paul, it seems he picks the Leopards to win in almost every game. For him to give such an "unvarnished" picture is surprising and says a lot that some of the alums have been chirping in his ear and he is giving them voice.

[Franks Tanks]

Wow. That is a brutal takedown of Garrett and the Lafayette football program. Reinhard has been on the Pard beat for decades. His article is honest and heart felt with almost absolute contenpt for Garrett.

Paul has a gigantic axe to grind with Garrett, and has done so since the beginning really. He is still pissed his buddy Frank got fired, and never really gave John a chance.

I strongly disagree with a few points he brings up incessantly. I’m sure we will have a few transfers, but we have not had excessive player transfers. Our offensive line coach went to William & Mary. He went to UVA and in close with London. This is not an indictment of the head coach as this was a no brainer move for him. I don’t expect any other significant assistants to leave.

However, he is dead on about the performance of our offense and QB. These last two years have been among the most futile displays of offensive football I’ve seen. Our QB can barely complete a pass on air, and often badly misses open receivers. Garrett’s inability to be even field a mediocre offense is troubling. His handling of the QB situation had been dreadful. I have no idea what the hell he did to piss off Jack Bourger, but he really effed that one up.

[Franks Tanks]

Agreed. That article is a real eye opener as Reinhard has been Lafayette's cheerleader for years. I know Groller is "Lehigh's boy" with The Morning Call, but Keith has never been an ass-kisser imo. Paul, it seems he picks the Leopards to win in almost every game. For him to give such an "unvarnished" picture is surprising and says a lot that some of the alums have been chirping in his ear and he is giving them voice.

Paul has been extremely critical of Garrett going back to early last season, but he doesn’t air his opinions in the paper. He posts his criticisms on our board and in his blog.

[ngineer]

Paul has been extremely critical of Garrett going back to early last season, but he doesn’t air his opinions in the paper. He posts his criticisms on our board and in his blog.

So noted. I do agree with his QB analysis. I have not idea what Garrett sees in O'Malley, or if he is the best they got, then they in deep doo-doo.

[Franks Tanks]

So noted. I do agree with his QB analysis. I have not idea what Garrett sees in O'Malley, or if he is the best they got, then they in deep doo-doo.

Agree, it’s baffling. Brycen Mussina did transfer from here last year, and he threw for like 4,000 yards at Ship this past season. He is much better than our current QB.

[DFW HOYA]

Lafayette fans have cause for concern. Garrett is 6-16 (2-8 at home and 0-2 vs. LU) heading into a schedule that will be a uphill climb to avoid a 10th consecutive losing season at College Hill.

The only PL teams to have suffered such a fate were the Fordham program that joined the PL in the 1990's (1990-01), and the Georgetown program that joined the PL in the 2000's (2001-10).

[Fordham]

https://twitter.com/FORDHAMFOOTBALL/status/1075478520619515905

Fordham signed (I believe the final # is) 15 yesterday. On paper our highest rated recruited class ever and we still have scholarships left for the late signing period. Big help on both lines, a stud Rutgers transfer at RB, hard hitting LB and speed and talent at WR and at DB. Really need a QB but otherwise a great day yesterday for us although I never put much stock in the 'on paper we're really good' as we'll see how everyone does when they show up for camp.

How'd the rest of the PL do? Early on I got the sense that HC is knocking it out of the park but didn't hear much lately to know how they did yesterday.

[ngineer]

You can't go on current numbers. Once the final signing period occurs we will be able to get a sense of how good or bad the classes are..."on paper".

[Fordham]

You can't go on current numbers. Once the final signing period occurs we will be able to get a sense of how good or bad the classes are..."on paper".
You get a really good sense for a class when they have more than 11 - 12 signees imo. It's not like we're going to add THAT many more so this is the class we're going to bring in with the exception of a handful of others. I think HC and Gate have quite a few as well. Lafayette and, understandably, you guys have the fewest at this point so the final signing period will be critical. Haven't heard anything about Bucknell and obviously Gtown doesn't announce anything even following the final signing period. So I guess I'm asking how HC and Gate feel their classes are at this point?

[RichH2]

Looking forward to our new head coach. Pretty perfect timing. Leaves ample time for fans to dissect him, prejudge him and to bitch about Joe not picking ( insert name here ). All before Spring practice. Oh, its just gonna be so much fun.xeyebrowx xslapfightxx406x

Perhaps I may be just a tad overly dramatic.xdrunkyxxlolx

[crusader11]

So I guess I'm asking how HC and Gate feel their classes are at this point?

I think we have the best class in the league. In fact, this is probably the most talented class on paper HC has had in decades.

[DFW HOYA]

Signings by school:

Fordham 15
Colgate 13
HC 12
Lehigh 12
Bucknell 11
Lafayette 6
Georgetown 4

That Sgarlata even got four is a plus for Georgetown. A prospect navigating early admissions without any hope of scholarships is a gauntlet other PL teams don't have to face. Last year's early admit rate was 12 percent.

The downside is they lose a ton of good prospects in the process.

[Fordham]

I think we have the best class in the league. In fact, this is probably the most talented class on paper HC has had in decades.

that was the sense I got early on when your first verbals started pouring in. We were not that far behind you in terms of star rating, etc, but we did lose two guys in the run up to signing day including a highly rated QB which took a small amount of luster off of the group. That said, this is clearly the highest rated class we've had in as long as I can remember. Have to see how they do once you put on the pads but better to out recruit FBS schools than hoping a kid with much lower level offers is a diamond in the rough.

[DFW HOYA]

I don't understand why nearly every team claims its recruiting class is the best ever. It'll be the "best ever" at Rutgers or Rice and they'll still finish at the bottom.

Is it remotely possible a team's "best ever" was in 1975 or 1986 or 2007?

[Fordham]

I don't understand why nearly every team claims its recruiting class is the best ever. It'll be the "best ever" at Rutgers or Rice and they'll still finish at the bottom.

Is it remotely possible a team's "best ever" was in 1975 or 1986 or 2007?

best ever = highest rated and rating incoming classes is a relatively recent phenomenon ... particularly for FCS. That's why I put an emphasis on 'on paper' in each one of my posts. Comparing this year's class to last year's is ok. Comparing this year's to 1975, not so much.

Sorry for assuming all knew that xconfusedx

[DFW HOYA]

Got it.

This is not going to be a best ever or "highest rated" class for Georgetown because, well, you know...

(For the record, Georgetown had two "four-star" recruits in the 2000's. Neither got off the bench.)

[Gate83]

So I guess I'm asking how HC and Gate feel their classes are at this point?

Our class is up to 14 at this point, 1 signing came in Thursday AM. Looks to me like they prioritized line & wr/db types, which fits with what we're graduating. Hope they turn out to be good! Hunt does a good job with his announcements & this year's featured theme was "The Office," which was pretty entertaining.

[ngineer]

Got it.

This is not going to be a best ever or "highest rated" class for Georgetown because, well, you know...

(For the record, Georgetown had two "four-star" recruits in the 2000's. Neither got off the bench.)

Exactly the reason I do not get very excited about ratings. Our QB was considered the best QB ever recruited at Lehigh. He might have had the best arm ever recruited at Lehigh, but was far from the best QB who ever played. So much goes into becoming a great or even a very good player, and it is not all physical.

[RichH2]

[/B]Exactly the reason I do not get very excited about ratings. Our QB was considered the best QB ever recruited at Lehigh. He might have had the best arm ever recruited at Lehigh, but was far from the best QB who ever played. So much goes into becoming a great or even a very good player, and it is not all physical.

Stars are fun but not not always reliable as a prediction of success. LU has 3*s on roster who have yet to see the field. We also have some who have done very well . Only time will tell how good any class is. Our current seniors came in with a lot of hype. We did have a few excellent players and some solid PL players. Overall however class underperformed. The rule of thumb, according to one of our prior HCs, is a good recruit class should have at least a thurd of them being good to excellent starters..

[citdog]

So how will the racist attempted murder at le high affect the coaching search???

[van]

ignore the troll

[LU808]

So how will the racist attempted murder at le high affect the coaching search???


W T F??? OVER!xpissedx

[citdog]

Of course le high feels it is immune to anyone pointing that subject out... But if some Cadets sing xmas carols in pillowcases boy that's a subject to talk about....

[RichH2]

Of course le high feels it is immune to anyone pointing that subject out... But if some Cadets sing xmas carols in pillowcases boy that's a subject to talk about....

Neither are appropriate here ,unless they involve football players. There is not a college in America that does not have idiotic even criminal conduct at some point in time by students.. Unless it is connected to football, it has no place here.

Lehigh has had its share of moronic behavior by football players. We have been called out on those events on AGS. Absolutely fair comment.

[PAllen]

Our class is up to 14 at this point, 1 signing came in Thursday AM. Looks to me like they prioritized line & wr/db types, which fits with what we're graduating. Hope they turn out to be good! Hunt does a good job with his announcements & this year's featured theme was "The Office," which was pretty entertaining.

Honest question: Shouldn't teams be recruiting to replace folks who they will be losing to graduation after next season (one more year of eligibility)? I hear things like the above all of the time, but I don't understand why you wouldn't plan recruiting around players getting real reps as sophomores.

[DFW HOYA]

Honest question: Shouldn't teams be recruiting to replace folks who they will be losing to graduation after next season (one more year of eligibility)? I hear things like the above all of the time, but I don't understand why you wouldn't plan recruiting around players getting real reps as sophomores.

In theory, yes, but the concept of "next man up" doesn't presuppose that the juniors are always the ones to replace in 2020.

Add in the PL's arcane admissions rules and at least a couple of schools are recruiting just to get kids in the door, not for one to one replacements.

[RichH2]

In theory, yes, but the concept of "next man up" doesn't presuppose that the juniors are always the ones to replace in 2020.

Add in the PL's arcane admissions rules and at least a couple of schools are recruiting just to get kids in the door, not for one to one replacements.

One to one replacement recruiting is only a dream in the PL and likely to at least some degree in all FCS leagues. There are just to many competing factors to predict future rosters. Lehigh has less than 60 players returning including a number of WOs. Can we get 30+ recruits for next year? Perhaps if use only partials and get some PWOs and WO. Of course you sacrifice talent for quantity. Sure you can get a gem WO as we did with Nana at RB but most WOs never see the field. Recruiting can be hit or miss despite perfect talent evaluation and good luck. Injuries and other nonpredictable events can wreak havoc with a roster. Coen's approach was to try as best as possible to recruit every position every year. In a perfect world, we could all award 40 full rides and 20 partials with WOs to fill out the roster. But, real life can step in and wipe out most of a position group. And the juggling starts.
Schollie recruiting. Well, hope we all get good classes this year. Guessvwe're trying to catch up to Chesney :)

[van]

this is where the difference between 60 and 63 equivalencies makes a big difference, of all the PL barriers that have been kicked around, that IMHO is the biggest difference maker, +3 could be 6 recruited guys adding meaningful depth

[RichH2]

this is where the difference between 60 and 63 equivalencies makes a big difference, of all the PL barriers that have been kicked around, that IMHO is the biggest difference maker, +3 could be 6 recruited guys adding meaningful depth

+1

[ngineer]

this is where the difference between 60 and 63 equivalencies makes a big difference, of all the PL barriers that have been kicked around, that IMHO is the biggest difference maker, +3 could be 6 recruited guys adding meaningful depth

Good point. When you run as "thin a margin" as we do, 3 more schollies/year can have a big impact.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

this is where the difference between 60 and 63 equivalencies makes a big difference, of all the PL barriers that have been kicked around, that IMHO is the biggest difference maker, +3 could be 6 recruited guys adding meaningful depth

The league office has to lift at least one of these ridiculous restrictions. Adding a 3 extra scholarships would certainly help. If someone doesn't want to go along, then don't go along...

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Lehigh seemed to fair quite well in the early signing period. The current staff has done a great job keeping the program heading in the right direction. The new coach will have an opportunity to bring in a few of his own guys in February which is a nice bonus.

Could the league be headed towards some legit Top 25 depth with Colgate, Holy Cross and Lehigh?!

[LehighU11]

Army is beating 8-4 Houston 42-7 just after halftime...now 49-7. Based on that score and Colgate and LC's performances at Michie, maybe the PL isn't as bad as we thought...

[citdog]

Army is beating 8-4 Houston 42-7 just after halftime...now 49-7. Based on that score and Colgate and LC's performances at Michie, maybe the PL isn't as bad as we thought...

The patsy league is worse than you thought. The Pioneer league is superior to your league. Far fewer racist attempted murders in that league as well.

[cx500d]

Army is beating 8-4 Houston 42-7 just after halftime...now 56-7. Based on that score and Colgate and LC's performances at Michie, maybe the PL isn't as bad as we thought...
FYP

[ngineer]

Army is beating 8-4 Houston 42-7 just after halftime...now 49-7. Based on that score and Colgate and LC's performances at Michie, maybe the PL isn't as bad as we thought...

Army was very impressive...however, Houston was running with several of their defensive regulars out. Regardless, it was impressive and Michigan should be taking notes. Black Knights go to the Big House in September!

[citdog]

le high leads the patsy league in racist attempted murders.

[ngineer]

Army was very impressive...however, Houston was running with several of their defensive regulars out. Regardless, it was impressive and Michigan should be taking notes. Black Knights go to the Big House in September!

I also seem to recall that we should be making a call at Michie in a couple years. Hopefully, the LUAA puts together a sail up the Hudson for that.

[LehighU11]

Agree, it’s baffling. Brycen Mussina did transfer from here last year, and he threw for like 4,000 yards at Ship this past season. He is much better than our current QB.
And Mussina was just named the D2 Freshman of the Year by Hero Sports. Shippensburg is not exactly a PSAC powerhouse with a ton of talent, so those numbers are even more impressive. The fact that Garrett has stuck with a D3 version of Nathan Peterman for 2 years rather than give Mussina or others a chance is an indictment of Garrett's ability to recognize potential on his roster.

[RichH2]

And Mussina was just named the D2 Freshman of the Year by Hero Sports. Shippensburg is not exactly a PSAC powerhouse with a ton of talent, so those numbers are even more impressive. The fact that Garrett has stuck with a D3 version of Nathan Peterman for 2 years rather than give Mussina or others a chance is an indictment of Garrett's ability to recognize potential on his roster.

Garrett rather stubborn with his QB. Odd as he landed one of the best QBs in Penn last class and Fisher just sits.

[citdog]

I also seem to recall that we should be making a call at Michie in a couple years. Hopefully, the LUAA puts together a sail up the Hudson for that.

Nope. Busy explaining away racist attempted murders on the racist le high campus...

[Bill]

It's tough to blame everyone for the actions of a few...
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=29762&stc=1

[citdog]

It's tough to blame everyone for the actions of a few...
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=29762&stc=1

Yet none of them were arrested for a racist attempted murder. We'll leave the racist attempted murders to le high...

[Go...gate]

The league office has to lift at least one of these ridiculous restrictions. Adding a 3 extra scholarships would certainly help. If someone doesn't want to go along, then don't go along...

Go to a 63-scholarship limit and raise minimum roster sizes.

[citdog]

Go to a 63-scholarship limit and raise minimum roster sizes.
I'd be pleased if le high rejected racist attempted murders...

[Lehigh74]

Enough already, Citdog. The kid was an international student from China who lost his mind. He was suspended and indicted. How do the actions of one crazy student from another country have anything to do with the university?

[citdog]

Enough already, Citdog. The kid was an international student from China who lost his mind. He was suspended and indicted. How do the actions of one crazy student from another country have anything to do with the university?

His actions are indicative of the average le high students white privilege. How can this horrible racist attempted murder occur on a campus that recognizes the crime against humanity that the average le high student commits by existing????

[Fordham]

Could the league be headed towards some legit Top 25 depth with Colgate, Holy Cross and Lehigh?!
Don’t count us out of the top tier just yet. Our initial signing period was as or more impressive than anyone in the PL imo, save HC (but not by much). We bottomed out last year but think this staff knows what it’s doing. In retrospect we were extremely fortunate that Breiner went to Ms St. Obviously so was he

[RichH2]

Don’t count us out of the top tier just yet. Our initial signing period was as or more impressive than anyone in the PL imo, save HC (but not by much). We bottomed out last year but think this staff knows what it’s doing. In retrospect we were extremely fortunate that Breiner went to Ms St. Obviously so was he

Too soon to make a call either way particularly with most of your talent are underclassmen.

[cx500d]

His actions are indicative of the average le high students white privilege. How can this horrible racist attempted murder occur on a campus that recognizes the crime against humanity that the average le high student commits by existing????

Isn’t it brown or yellow or even Maoist privilege if he’s a chicom?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Don’t count us out of the top tier just yet. Our initial signing period was as or more impressive than anyone in the PL imo, save HC (but not by much). We bottomed out last year but think this staff knows what it’s doing. In retrospect we were extremely fortunate that Breiner went to Ms St. Obviously so was he

Fordham should return if they can get some stability within their staff. The potential is definitely there but it's been a real bumpy ride since Moorhead left.

I could get some of the skepticism on Lehigh but they did win the league in '16 and '17 and the coaching situation was obviously a tough deal. They're not going anywhere once the program gets some stability again. By all accounts the AD and current staff have handled the transition in a top-notch manner. The cupboard is not bare. A Biddle/Moorhead type turnaround is within reason imo.

[RichH2]

Fordham should return if they can get some stability within their staff. The potential is definitely there but it's been a real bumpy ride since Moorhead left.

I could get some of the skepticism on Lehigh but they did win the league in '16 and '17 and the coaching situation was obviously a tough deal. They're not going anywhere once the program gets some stability again. By all accounts the AD and current staff have handled the transition in a top-notch manner. The cupboard is not bare. A Biddle/Moorhead type turnaround is within reason imo.

Certainly possible. A lot of talent returns on O. D better but exceptionally inconsistent. D must be righted for even modest improvement.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Certainly possible. A lot of talent returns on O. D better but exceptionally inconsistent. D must be righted for even modest improvement.

The skill positions are loaded with talent. Not at all concerned there. I tend to think some fresh blood at QB might get the mojo going. The OL must get better! The loss of the OL coach combined with Coen's health did the unit no favors imo. One of Coen's absolute strengths as a coach was his ability to mold/ensure top tier FCS OL's. There will be plenty of experience back in '19 "thanks" to the injury bug in 2018. Getting every one on the same page must be a focus in the spring.

The defense is obviously the glaring issue. It's been a talking point, and I'm not talking about on message boards, for years. There's definitely been a personnel deficiency in recent classes. What's made it worse is the coaching has done nothing to help. Not being ranked in the 100's in virtually every statistical would be a start.

Really looking forward to next year. There's legit reason for optimism at Colgate, Lehigh and Holy Cross imo. Fordham is right there too. The league might not produce a Top 10 team like Colgate was this season but there's the possibility of 3-4 Top 40 teams which would be a huge step in the right direction.

How about Lafayette? There seems to be some serious viral issues throughout that program?!? I'm not hating just the noise out of Easton is not good. At least Bucknell's indifference is loud enough to make sure everyone knows they'll continue to stink.

[DFW HOYA]

Really looking forward to next year. There's legit reason for optimism at Colgate, Lehigh and Holy Cross imo. Fordham is right there too. The league might not produce a Top 10 team like Colgate was this season but there's the possibility of 3-4 Top 40 teams which would be a huge step in the right direction.

How about Lafayette? There seems to be some serious viral issues throughout that program?!? I'm not hating just the noise out of Easton is not good. At least Bucknell's indifference is loud enough to make sure everyone knows they'll continue to stink.

Any thoughts about team #7?

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Any thoughts about team #7?

I said earlier in the thread that I believe Georgetown will be in the mix next year. Despite some naysaying Sgarlata has brought in some "good enough" talent to compete in the PL. Can some one figure out the offense? Johnson's good enough to win with imo. The OL needs to improve; still not physical enough.

I think the question moving forward will be how much of a boost the program gets from the facility improvements. As of right now Georgetown is in better shape than Lafayette and Bucknell.

[DFW HOYA]

I said earlier in the thread that I believe Georgetown will be in the mix next year. Despite some naysaying Sgarlata has brought in some "good enough" talent to compete in the PL. Can some one figure out the offense? Johnson's good enough to win with imo. The OL needs to improve; still not physical enough.

The problem with offense is bigger than Sgarlata. In 20 years of PL recruiting classes, not a single Georgetown player has ever made the All-PL first team. None. The law of averages would have suggested a guard, a tackle, or a receiver...someone would have qualified at least for one year. That may be a function of scholarships or admissions or just bad luck, but Georgetown hasn't attracted impact offensive players.

Two numbers to ponder:

2018 National Rankings, Total Defense:
11. Georgetown

2018 National Rankings, Total Offense:
121. Georgetown

[LU808]

le high leads the patsy league in racist attempted murders.


Interesting tat someone with an inglorious moniker and list of catchphrases/mottos in his signature block would repeat the racist insults commonly attributed to the Southern Democrats pre and post Civil War. I wonder if he employs the same racially charged taunting against the 63 Citadel African American players on his roster and the 3 African American coaches on his team?

[RichH2]

I said earlier in the thread that I believe Georgetown will be in the mix next year. Despite some naysaying Sgarlata has brought in some "good enough" talent to compete in the PL. Can some one figure out the offense? Johnson's good enough to win with imo. The OL needs to improve; still not physical enough.

I think the question moving forward will be how much of a boost the program gets from the facility improvements. As of right now Georgetown is in better shape than Lafayette and Bucknell.

Hoyas greatest need is a more effective OL. Facilities would be real nice for fans. Not much help up front on O. :)
A list of stable programs would have Hoyas and Gate at the top. Just saying.

[Go...gate]

Enough already, Citdog. The kid was an international student from China who lost his mind. He was suspended and indicted. How do the actions of one crazy student from another country have anything to do with the university?

Agree with Lehigh74. It is a non-story.

[ngineer]

The problem with offense is bigger than Sgarlata. In 20 years of PL recruiting classes, not a single Georgetown player has ever made the All-PL first team. None. The law of averages would have suggested a guard, a tackle, or a receiver...someone would have qualified at least for one year. That may be a function of scholarships or admissions or just bad luck, but Georgetown hasn't attracted impact offensive players.

Two numbers to ponder:

2018 National Rankings, Total Defense:
11. Georgetown

2018 National Rankings, Total Offense:
121. Georgetown

But that is why Hoyas should be in 'the mix'. With a good defense, you are always 'in the mix'. Close games, even with a mediocre offense become winnable.That's the starting point. If, and granted it has been a big if, G'town gets some offensive playmakers, they can be trouble.

[DFW HOYA]

But that is why Hoyas should be in 'the mix'. With a good defense, you are always 'in the mix'. Close games, even with a mediocre offense become winnable.That's the starting point. If, and granted it has been a big if, G'town gets some offensive playmakers, they can be trouble.

One season without any All-PL offensive talent is an accident. Two is a coincidence, three is a trend, and twenty is, well...

There was a quote attributed to CBS' Billy Packer, when, discussing basketball at Georgetown, once said "I think they need a superstar to be successful. Why would a superstar want to go there?" Well, we can agree to disagree what a "superstar" in football looks like at the I-AA level, but why would the next (take your pick: Carson Wentz, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Joe Flacco, Tony Romo, Randy Moss, Jerry Rice, et al.) want to play at Georgetown, and why wouldn't he go to a hundred other places instead?

Yes, you can argue that PL teams don't need superstars, but when you're 121st in offense, you better get someone who can make a difference. No one is making that difference. Averaging 15 points a game doesn't win a lot of games--that they won five games this year at 15 ppg is a feat in itself. Some years, Georgetown struggled to average 10 a game.

The Hoyas haven't signed an impact rusher in 22 years, its last great receiver graduated in 2000. You're not going to win, even in the Patriot League, with all-county or second team all-district offensive players. While scholarships would help on offense, that's not likely to bring in the next Easton Stick driving across Key Bridge.

[Go...gate]

One season without any All-PL offensive talent is an accident. Two is a coincidence, three is a trend, and twenty is, well...

There was a quote attributed to CBS' Billy Packer, when, discussing basketball at Georgetown, once said "I think they need a superstar to be successful. Why would a superstar want to go there?" Well, we can agree to disagree what a "superstar" in football looks like at the I-AA level, but why would the next (take your pick: Carson Wentz, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Joe Flacco, Tony Romo, Randy Moss, Jerry Rice, et al.) want to play at Georgetown, and why wouldn't he go to a hundred other places instead?

Yes, you can argue that PL teams don't need superstars, but when you're 121st in offense, you better get someone who can make a difference. No one is making that difference. Averaging 15 points a game doesn't win a lot of games--that they won five games this year at 15 ppg is a feat in itself. Some years, Georgetown struggled to average 10 a game.

The Hoyas haven't signed an impact rusher in 22 years, its last great receiver graduated in 2000. You're not going to win, even in the Patriot League, with all-county or second team all-district offensive players. While scholarships would help on offense, that's not likely to bring in the next Easton Stick driving across Key Bridge.

Never could stand Billy Packer.

[Sader87]

Never could stand Billy PACCker.

With a nod to Al McGuire, FIFY xdrunkyx

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Never could stand Billy Packer.

My grandmother was in the same graduating class as Billy Packer at Liberty High School in Bethlehem.

[ngineer]

My grandmother was in the same graduating class as Billy Packer at Liberty High School in Bethlehem.

And what did she think of him....A quick first step? Good hands? Easy lay up? Money from downtown? Tough on the boards? Too many passes? I could think of a few others, but we're not in the Lounge! xsmiley_wixxsmiley_wixxsmiley_wix

[DFW HOYA]

Billy Packer is a great story waiting to be written, except he probably has no interest in participating.

From growing up as the son of Lehigh's basketball coach to a Final Four point guard at Wake Forest, as Bones McKinney's right hand man in the 1970's to a run where he broadcast 33 consecutive Final Four's he's seen it all. But in a 2015 article he said he finds the modern game a shadow of itself and isn't interested, coming from someone who owns no computer, no e-mail account, and doesn't even use a cell phone.

While it's before my time, take a chance to read about how Billy Packer changed TV broadcasting. Prior to the late 1970's, college basketball wasn't regularly broadcast on network TV, only at local stations. The ACC had its own network of local affiliates in the Carolinas that showed games twice a week, preempting network shows to do it. Fans loved it. The team of Jim Thacker and Billy Packer were local stars back then, which is why NBC called him up to do its games, most notably with Al McGuire. Packer's approach was the anti-Dick Vitale because he wasn't about the showtime, and never let people forget, as they said, that "I may be wrong but I am never in doubt."

Or maybe he soured because of how CBS treated him when they showed him the door in 2008. That network has a legacy of treating talent poorly. Back in 1981, at the height of his popularity, Walter Cronkite was told he had to retire at 65 per CBS policy (never mind that Mike Wallace and Andy Rooney stayed on to their 90's). Instead, Cronkite spent his 38 years of retirement with almost no interaction from the network. Others from Dan Rather to Brent Musburger have received similar persona non grata status.

[Doc QB]

My grandmother was in the same graduating class as Billy Packer at Liberty High School in Bethlehem.
My dad, Packer, Pete Carril of Princeton hoops fame, and Chuck Badnarik grew up in same neighborhood. Went to LU, Wake, Laff, Upenn respectively.

[Bill]

My dad, Packer, Pete Carril of Princeton hoops fame, and Chuck Badnarik grew up in same neighborhood. Went to LU, Wake, Laff, Upenn respectively.

That's cool! I'm going to assume at different times though :) You're younger than me...and there's no way I'm as old as Packer xlolx

[ngineer]

That's cool! I'm going to assume at different times though :) You're younger than me...and there's no way I'm as old as Packer xlolx

Well, Asa turned 213 the other day...(;-)

[Go...gate]

Billy Packer is a great story waiting to be written, except he probably has no interest in participating.

From growing up as the son of Lehigh's basketball coach to a Final Four point guard at Wake Forest, as Bones McKinney's right hand man in the 1970's to a run where he broadcast 33 consecutive Final Four's he's seen it all. But in a 2015 article he said he finds the modern game a shadow of itself and isn't interested, coming from someone who owns no computer, no e-mail account, and doesn't even use a cell phone.

While it's before my time, take a chance to read about how Billy Packer changed TV broadcasting. Prior to the late 1970's, college basketball wasn't regularly broadcast on network TV, only at local stations. The ACC had its own network of local affiliates in the Carolinas that showed games twice a week, preempting network shows to do it. Fans loved it. The team of Jim Thacker and Billy Packer were local stars back then, which is why NBC called him up to do its games, most notably with Al McGuire. Packer's approach was the anti-Dick Vitale because he wasn't about the showtime, and never let people forget, as they said, that "I may be wrong but I am never in doubt."

Or maybe he soured because of how CBS treated him when they showed him the door in 2008. That network has a legacy of treating talent poorly. Back in 1981, at the height of his popularity, Walter Cronkite was told he had to retire at 65 per CBS policy (never mind that Mike Wallace and Andy Rooney stayed on to their 90's). Instead, Cronkite spent his 38 years of retirement with almost no interaction from the network. Others from Dan Rather to Brent Musburger have received similar persona non grata status.

I watched and listened to Packer going back to about 1973-74. He was very knowledgeable and balanced when it came to the ACC, Kentucky, and certain Big Ten schools when they played each other, but he seemed to have limited respect or tolerance for the schools in other conferences. He could also be insufferable at times, which could be entertaining when he had Al McGuire as a co-analyst but not when he went to CBS. In some of his WFAN radio interviews with Mike Francesa and Chris Russo back in the day, he admitted that he kept information on only a small group of teams and had no interest in the others. His firing at CBS was not in the category of Cronkite leaving (which admittedly was inexplicable) but based on his performance. No one would touch him thereafter, which I found a confirmation of his fall from grace.

[Go...gate]

My dad, Packer, Pete Carril of Princeton hoops fame, and Chuck Badnarik grew up in same neighborhood. Went to LU, Wake, Laff, Upenn respectively.

Pete truly loves that area and the values which he learned there. He is a Princeton treasure, but his heart is in the Easton/Bethlehem area.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

And what did she think of him....A quick first step? Good hands? Easy lay up? Money from downtown? Tough on the boards? Too many passes? I could think of a few others, but we're not in the Lounge! xsmiley_wixxsmiley_wixxsmiley_wix

LOL...the 1950's were a wild time in the Lehigh Valley!

[ngineer]

LOL...the 1950's were a wild time in the Lehigh Valley!

I know the early '70's were!

[RichH2]

I know the early '70's were!

For me the early 60s were the best. Animal House on South Mountain.

[Bill]

For me the early 60s were the best. Animal House on South Mountain.

You 60's and 70's guys are the stuff of legend! I straddled the end of the 80's into the 1990's. It was great right up until the end - about 1992, when the social policies began to change dramatically. We heard tales and myths of days gone past - but it was still better than anything else out there.

[van]

afraid they probably were not all myths, xembarrassedx

[RichH2]

afraid they probably were not all myths, xembarrassedx

Nope, they weren't. I look back at time and I wonder how any of us survived, much less graduated.An all male campus with too much testosterone and just enough beer makes for great stories of epic stupidity. The standard Wed nite keg party in the dead of winter. Road trips to Goucher,Beaver, Vassar et al , just to actually see girls if only for a few hours. A different world fondly recalled by us old farts. It is hard to believe that those rather warped times on an all male campus were considered normal back then. They were not. Memory slides over blithely the times in between that were stressful and boring simultaneously.

[Gater]

Colgate's TJ Holl announced he was going to graduate with his class and play his grad/medical redshirt year somewhere else last night on Twitter. He immediately picked up an offer from Louisville. Guy is a great player and a great leader. Big loss for Colgate on the field and off but wish him nothing but the best.

[PAllen]

Colgate's TJ Holl announced he was going to graduate with his class and play his grad/medical redshirt year somewhere else last night on Twitter. He immediately picked up an offer from Louisville. Guy is a great player and a great leader. Big loss for Colgate on the field and off but wish him nothing but the best.

Bad for Colgate, but good for him.

[Fordham]

Colgate's TJ Holl announced he was going to graduate with his class and play his grad/medical redshirt year somewhere else last night on Twitter. He immediately picked up an offer from Louisville. Guy is a great player and a great leader. Big loss for Colgate on the field and off but wish him nothing but the best.
Under PL rules was it even an option for him to come back? A few years back Mason Halter had a post grad year which I think was based on an earlier medical redshirt (but could be wrong). He was not allowed to come back to Fordham due to PL rules I was told at the time and he transferred to Florida and ended up starting at tackle for them. Pretty cool experience. Good luck to TJ

https://floridagators.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2134

[Gater]

Think he would have to not go to school in spring and then come back for fall and graduate. If that's the case, see why he'd want to get another degree for free.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Colgate's TJ Holl announced he was going to graduate with his class and play his grad/medical redshirt year somewhere else last night on Twitter. He immediately picked up an offer from Louisville. Guy is a great player and a great leader. Big loss for Colgate on the field and off but wish him nothing but the best.

Tough loss for Colgate. I'd like to think he could and will do better than Louisville given their coaching transition. He would be a great get for a high-end P5 program. Penn State would be a good landing spot and I can't stand them...lol..

[ngineer]

Under PL rules was it even an option for him to come back? A few years back Mason Halter had a post grad year which I think was based on an earlier medical redshirt (but could be wrong). He was not allowed to come back to Fordham due to PL rules I was told at the time and he transferred to Florida and ended up starting at tackle for them. Pretty cool experience. Good luck to TJ

https://floridagators.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2134

Yes, that's how Lehigh's Gatlin Casey (WR) ended up at Middle Tennessee State this year. We could have really used him. Too bad for 'gate, but good for us. Holl is a top notch player.

[ngineer]

afraid they probably were not all myths, xembarrassedx

True dat. I was there when coeducation started, but there were so few LU coeds it was still very male-dominant atmosphere and all the boorish behavior that one can imagine. "The Hill" will never see the likes..Debauchery U.

[RichH2]

For DFW
I see GU picked up a stud OL in Stanford Maison 6'4 300 yesterday. Congrats.

[The Boogie Down]

Under PL rules was it even an option for him to come back? A few years back Mason Halter had a post grad year which I think was based on an earlier medical redshirt (but could be wrong). He was not allowed to come back to Fordham due to PL rules I was told at the time and he transferred to Florida and ended up starting at tackle for them. Pretty cool experience. Good luck to TJ

https://floridagators.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2134

Fordham has seen its share of 5th year seniors due to medical redshirts over the years and this has always (as Blaze showed in the early '90s) been the case. So, I think the Gators media guide is wrong and that Halter didn't play as a freshman simply b/c he wasn't ready.

As for his time in Gainesville, Halter had an up and then a very-very down spell down there. Not only did he make the team as a starter but he was an offensive team captain too. After a few games he was rumored to be a serious draft prospect but he later wilted against tougher competition from schools like FSU and Alabama. He missed his team's bowl game (academically ineligible) and followed that up w/a poor combine so he never got drafted. I forget which team signed him for training camp but I don't think he even made it to the preseason. So disappointing conclusion to what started out as a great post-Fordham career. Then again, simply going from JCF to The Swamp musta been pretty cool.

[DFW HOYA]

For DFW
I see GU picked up a stud OL in Stanford Maison 6'4 300 yesterday. Congrats.

Good to get some OL help but it would be preemptive to call him a stud. First team in the Mid Penn Conference isn't at the competitive level of many programs elsewhere but given how few recruits Gerogetown is picking up in the PA/NJ/NY area these days, It's a step forward.

In an earlier thread, I noted that 20 years ago, Georgetown had something like 42 kids on its roster from NY and NJ alone. In 2018? Eight. And only four from PA.

As we speak, the 2018 early action figures were announced today. Don't know how it affects the PL's Ivy Index, but I don't see a lot of recruits in those bands.

http://www.thehoya.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/[email protected]

http://www.thehoya.com/class-2023-early-action-admissions-rate-reaches-record-low/

[DFW HOYA]

Also of interest: a feature on former Holy Cross announcer Bob Fouracre:

https://www.telegram.com/news/20190109/holy-cross-sports-scene-isnt-same-since-bob-fouracre-stepped-aside

[Sader87]

Saw that today....I literally had Mr E as an announcer for HC sports from age 7 into my 50s...a long, enjoyable retirement for Bob.

[Sader87]

Posted in the LU/Gilmore thread, it works bettah ovah here: HC and Colgate both have pretty brutal OOC skeds next year....wondah how that might impact them in league play??? Be interesting...

ETA: Fordham's is pretty tough too. I like seeing the upgrades in the scheduling mostly league wide. Now we have to translate solid play on the field to match the scheduling xdrunkyx

On a non-PL note (sorta), a shame that Princeton is not playing Rutgers next year for the 150th. They play Butler, Bucknell and Lafayette. Harvard continues to underwhelm, playing San Diego, Howard and lol, Holy Cross.

[ngineer]

Posted in the LU/Gilmore thread, it works bettah ovah here: HC and Colgate both have pretty brutal OOC skeds next year....wondah how that might impact them in league play??? Be interesting...

ETA: Fordham's is pretty tough too. I like seeing the upgrades in the scheduling mostly league wide. Now we have to translate solid play on the field to match the scheduling xdrunkyx

On a non-PL note (sorta), a shame that Princeton is not playing Rutgers next year for the 150th. They play Butler, Bucknell and Lafayette. Harvard continues to underwhelm, playing San Diego, Howard and lol, Holy Cross.

I agree that it is fine to schedule FBS schools, the question is how much is too much? It's exciting for the kids and helps recruiting, but can also result in a lot of injuries which can impact the League results. I hope Gilmore follows up with his statement about "renewing" some old regional rivalries. To me, that means Delaware, Rutgers and maybe Temple and UConn. One of those each year, along with a couple Ivies, and another CAA and/or SoCon would be great. Of course, I know we'll be throwing in an NEC as well. Would love to play Duquesne.

[DFW HOYA]

Posted in the LU/Gilmore thread, it works bettah ovah here: HC and Colgate both have pretty brutal OOC skeds next year....wondah how that might impact them in league play??? Be interesting...

ETA: Fordham's is pretty tough too. I like seeing the upgrades in the scheduling mostly league wide.

Key phrase: Mostly league wide. The only games Georgetown gets these days are from Marist and Davidson.

A number of future Ivy schedules show no games with the Hoyas into the mid-2020's.

[The Boogie Down]

On a non-PL note (sorta), a shame that Princeton is not playing Rutgers next year for the 150th. They play Butler, Bucknell and Lafayette.

So was it Princeton that balked at 150? Damn shame if true. Myopic too considering the type of talent Princeton had last season.

[ngineer]

So was it Princeton that balked at 150? Damn shame if true. Myopic too considering the type of talent Princeton had last season.

No question. Tigers would have turned the Knight's butts Scarlet. Not sure how much Princeton loses this year, but they seem to have significant depth. Well over 100 dressed on the sideline last year.

[DFW HOYA]

So was it Princeton that balked at 150? Damn shame if true. Myopic too considering the type of talent Princeton had last season.

Probably not. The Big Ten had a rule against scheduling I-AA opponents that only was rescinded in 2017. It's likely Rutgers already signed the game by that date.

The Scarlet's 2019 non-conference opponents are:

8/30: UMass (not in the Ivy football calendar)
9/21: Boston College (Princeton hosts Butler that day)
10/26: Liberty (Princeton hosts Harvard that day)

Given the timing of the Ivy schedule and barring a waiver to play earlier, the only date that would have worked was 9/21.

[DFW HOYA]

And on some better news, Colgate University has won the Lambert Cup.

https://gocolgateraiders.com/news/2019/1/15/football-colgate-claims-first-lambert-cup.aspx

[BucBisonAtLarge]

Congrats, Raiders, on the Lambert Cup. Nice recognition of a great season.

[Pards Rule]

Congrats, Raiders, on the Lambert Cup. Nice recognition of a great season.

BBAL, who do you think is in early running for next Bison HC now that Susan "resigned"

[BucBisonAtLarge]

BBAL, who do you think is in early running for next Bison HC now that Susan "resigned"

I live in New Mexico and watch my Bucknell football online, often thru fingers clenched across my face. I have no clue.

I do believe there are several questions about institutional commitment to address. This would be the time, or we'll hire some retread, too (kidding-just).

I defer to the shadow AD, Bison137.

Bring on Greg Schiano.

[Sader87]

Curious as to how close the Lambert Cup trophy voting was this year. Had to have been a very close vote between Colgate, Princeton and Maine. Was also surprised that this was Colgate's first Lambert Cup...would have sworn that they had won one sometime before.

Also amazing to think Army would win the Lambert Trophy again after their travails ovah the last 20 or so years.

Congrats to both Patriot League schools!!!

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

I like Lehigh's 2019 schedule overall given the coaching transition. Getting St. Francis at home to start the year is a nice bonus before two tough road trips. I also don't mind the Sacred Heart game before Lafayette. Not a bad little roadie against what might be a decent NEC team late in the season. I don't think anyone in the PL has a tougher FCS game than @ UC Davis. That will be a MONSTER test for Gilmore and staff. The Aggies are at NDSU the following week so maybe a trap game?...lol I'm sick of losing to Villanova. The early bye should help after the long trip to Cali. Then another bye after Colgate! Is the 'Gate game is going early like that it might as well be on my Bday! I'm feeling 18 at Seven Oaks then a Lehigh win? xlolx

8/31 Saint Francis
9/7 @ Villanova
9/14 @ UC Davis
9/21 BYE
9/28 Wagner
10/5 @ Colgate
10/12 BYE
10/19 @ Fordham
10/26 Georgetown
11/2 Holy Cross (Gilmore Bowl I)
11/9 @ Bucknell
11/16 @ Sacred Heart
11/23 Lafayette

[RichH2]

I like Lehigh's 2009 schedule overall given the coaching transition. Getting St. Francis at home to start the year is a nice bonus before two tough road trips. I also don't mind the Sacred Heart game before Lafayette. Not a bad little roadie against what might be a decent NEC team late in the season. I don't think anyone in the PL has a tougher FCS game than @ UC Davis. That will be a MONSTER test for Gilmore and staff. The Aggies are at NDSU the following week so maybe a trap game?...lol I'm sick of losing to Villanova. The early bye should help after the long trip to Cali. Then another bye after Colgate! Is the 'Gate game is going early like that it might as well be on my Bday! I'm feeling 18 at Seven Oaks then a Lehigh win? xlolx

8/31 Saint Francis
9/7 @ Villanova
9/14 @ UC Davis
9/21 BYE
9/28 Wagner
10/5 @ Colgate
10/12 BYE
10/19 @ Fordham
10/26 Georgetown
11/2 Holy Cross (Gilmore Bowl I)
11/9 @ Bucknell
11/16 @ Sacred Heart
11/23 Lafayette

Interesting timing next season with 2 early Byes. Dont mind SHU on the 16th. I would complain about early date for Gate but its not a year where Gate and LU are top 2 dogs.

[The Boogie Down]

Curious as to how close the Lambert Cup trophy voting was this year. Had to have been a very close vote between Colgate, Princeton and Maine. Was also surprised that this was Colgate's first Lambert Cup...would have sworn that they had won one sometime before.

Also amazing to think Army would win the Lambert Trophy again after their travails ovah the last 20 or so years.

Congrats to both Patriot League schools!!!


I could see cases being made for Princeton, Maine and Colgate. I think Princeton (undefeated) and Maine (national semifinals) may have had flashier looking laurels than Colgate, especially when taking into consideration how incredibly down the PL was but, no matter what, close call.

OTOH, Army West Point (#44 Saragin) over Penn State or Syracuse is a comedically poor choice. Poor enough to make me wonder what the point of Lambert is anymore.

[TheValleyRaider]

I could see cases being made for Princeton, Maine and Colgate. I think Princeton (undefeated) and Maine (national semifinals) may have had flashier looking laurels than Colgate, especially when taking into consideration how incredibly down the PL was but, no matter what, close call.

I think Colgate's advantage came from not losing a regular season FCS game (better than Maine) and a playoff game (better than Princeton). Their only losses were to FBS Army and FBS-lite NDSU.

All three would have been worthy choices, though, but you could argue Colgate combined their successes better.

[cx500d]

I think Colgate's advantage came from not losing a regular season FCS game (better than Maine) and a playoff game (better than Princeton). Their only losses were to FBS Army and FBS-lite NDSU.

All three would have been worthy choices, though, but you could argue Colgate combined their successes better.

Yeah, Maine had some head scratcher losses. Colgate beat everyone they were supposed to beat. They even had a team chicken out and not reschedule.

[Go...gate]

I like Lehigh's 2019 schedule overall given the coaching transition. Getting St. Francis at home to start the year is a nice bonus before two tough road trips. I also don't mind the Sacred Heart game before Lafayette. Not a bad little roadie against what might be a decent NEC team late in the season. I don't think anyone in the PL has a tougher FCS game than @ UC Davis. That will be a MONSTER test for Gilmore and staff. The Aggies are at NDSU the following week so maybe a trap game?...lol I'm sick of losing to Villanova. The early bye should help after the long trip to Cali. Then another bye after Colgate! Is the 'Gate game is going early like that it might as well be on my Bday! I'm feeling 18 at Seven Oaks then a Lehigh win? xlolx

8/31 Saint Francis
9/7 @ Villanova
9/14 @ UC Davis
9/21 BYE
9/28 Wagner
10/5 @ Colgate
10/12 BYE
10/19 @ Fordham
10/26 Georgetown
11/2 Holy Cross (Gilmore Bowl I)
11/9 @ Bucknell
11/16 @ Sacred Heart
11/23 Lafayette

Agreed. Very good schedule with a new Head Coach coming in.

[Pards Rule]

Any update on Bucknell search??

[Bill]

Any update on Bucknell search??

Nothing yet
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=29950&stc=1

[RichH2]

Interesting note I just noticed on the Cross Board.
Recruit class ranking by 247 has Cross #1 followed by Hoyasvthen Fordham. GU is indeed doing very well this year DFW. No moaning allowed. :)

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Interesting note I just noticed on the Cross Board.
Recruit class ranking by 247 has Cross #1 followed by Hoyasvthen Fordham. GU is indeed doing very well this year DFW. No moaning allowed. :)

You could see Georgetown's talent level increasing the last 2 years. I think they've stepped up their game in order to be a quality "need base" program (novel thought). They've only recently figured out how to do it. The facility improvement has to help too.

[RichH2]

One takeaway from PL recruiting up to date. Chesney shows what is possible for PL teams. He has brought in one of the best recruit classes in FCS. He may be raising the bar for all of us. May be painful for Lehigh playing over the next few years but a kick in the pants is likely good for us. We got too comfortable at competing just for PL title. That may be off the table for us unless we up our game to keep up with Cross ,Gate and Fordham.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

One takeaway from PL recruiting up to date. Chesney shows what is possible for PL teams. He has brought in one of the best recruit classes in FCS. He may be raising the bar for all of us. May be painful for Lehigh playing over the next few years but a kick in the pants is likely good for us. We got too comfortable at competing just for PL title. That may be off the table for us unless we up our game to keep up with Cross ,Gate and Fordham.

Like Fordham with Moorhead, Holy Cross needs to make the most of this run with Chesney. I'm not sure if he's going to build up the HC program for long term success but he'll have at least 1 or 2 teams capable of making a run before he moves on imo.

Lehigh had every chance to go after a young gun but opted for the old guard and faith in the program. Gilmore can't afford to stumble out of the gate. He needs to get the positive momentum going against Saint Francis. I stand by that last year's 3-8 record holds little value given the circumstances. If Gilmore and his staff are the real deal they'll get quality FCS kids to come play for them.

I would love to know what type of "negative" recruiting exists within the league. Given the boatloads of offseason drama throughout the league one could have a field day....

[RichH2]

Like Fordham with Moorhead, Holy Cross needs to make the most of this run with Chesney. I'm not sure if he's going to build up the HC program for long term success but he'll have at least 1 or 2 teams capable of making a run before he moves on imo.

Lehigh had every chance to go after a young gone but opted for the old guard and faith in the program. Gilmore can't afford to stumble out of the gate. He needs to get the positive momentum going against Saint Francis. I stand by that last year's 3-8 record holds little value given the circumstances. If Gilmore and his staff are the real deal they'll get quality FCS kids to come play for them.

I would love to know what type of "negative" recruiting exists within the league. Given the boatloads of offseason drama throughout the league one could have a field day....
Not all that much from what little I hear from coaches. Tavani early in his HC stint was infamous for it.

[Go...gate]

You could see Georgetown's talent level increasing the last 2 years. I think they've stepped up their game in order to be a quality "need base" program (novel thought). They've only recently figured out how to do it. The facility improvement has to help too.

Good for the conference.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Colgate lost their OC, Chris Young, to Elon. He's going to be the WR coach for the Phoenix. They also hired Temple's RB coach for the same position.

Elon has legitimately put together an all-star FCS coaching staff. They must be paying G5 assistant money down there. Their staff now is better than the one Cignetti had at Elon or currently has in Harrisonburg.

[RichH2]

Hero conference rankings.

PL at #11. NEC at 9. Ivies at 5. CAA at 3. Guess we should be thankful for SWAC and PFL. An 8-28 OOC record sums it up. Chesney may serve to motivate the rest to up their game recruiting. May help presidents'decide that nothing needs to be done to alleviate our restrictions though. They can point to him saying if Chesney can do it,we all can.

[ngineer]

Colgate lost their OC, Chris Young, to Elon. He's going to be the WR coach for the Phoenix. They also hired Temple's RB coach for the same position.

Elon has legitimately put together an all-star FCS coaching staff. They must be paying G5 assistant money down there. Their staff now is better than the one Cignetti had at Elon or currently has in Harrisonburg.

Perhaps 'gate feels they don't need on since they have a stellar D!

[TheValleyRaider]

Colgate lost their OC, Chris Young, to Elon. He's going to be the WR coach for the Phoenix. They also hired Temple's RB coach for the same position.

Elon has legitimately put together an all-star FCS coaching staff. They must be paying G5 assistant money down there. Their staff now is better than the one Cignetti had at Elon or currently has in Harrisonburg.

Intriguing side note, his wife was the women's lacrosse coach, and so now she's gone too: https://gocolgateraiders.com/news/2019/1/25/young-steps-down-as-womens-lacrosse-coach-beville-named-interim.aspx

[PAllen]

Intriguing side note, his wife was the women's lacrosse coach, and so now she's gone too: https://gocolgateraiders.com/news/2019/1/25/young-steps-down-as-womens-lacrosse-coach-beville-named-interim.aspx

That's just weird. Had enough of the cold winters? If not, WTH is Elon offering?

[Gangtackle11]

I’m hearing there is a 2019 “Countdown” Clock in Villanova football locker room that says “Beat Colgate”.

Can any of you Colgate fans validate a 8/24th game vs. Nova? If so, where?

[TheValleyRaider]

I’m hearing there is a 2019 “Countdown” Clock in Villanova football locker room that says “Beat Colgate”.

Can any of you Colgate fans validate a 8/24th game vs. Nova? If so, where?

First I've heard of it.

Week 0 kind of makes sense for a 12th game. Per the posted "Future Schedules" (https://gocolgateraiders.com/documents/2018/3/16/Colgate_Future_Football_Schedules_2018_19.pdf?path =football) we have open dates on 9/7 and 11/23. I suppose I'd probably prefer a slightly weaker opponent between trips to Air Force on 8/31 and W&M on 9/14, but don't mind getting on the field with Nova. Heck of an opening slate though, if true:
8/24 at Villanova
8/31 at Air Force
9/7 Bye
9/14 at William & Mary
9/21 Maine

Dartmouth and Cornell at the other OOC

[Sader87]

August 24th seems awfully early for a game....HC plays 12 games next year and opens on 8/31.

[Go...gate]

If Colgate - Villanova is in the works, happy to hear it.

[Gangtackle11]

August 24th seems awfully early for a game....HC plays 12 games next year and opens on 8/31.

College football season officially opens 8/24 with Week 0. Early yes, but allowed. xpeacex

[TheValleyRaider]

College football season officially opens 8/24 with Week 0. Early yes, but allowed. xpeacex

We did it in 2017 out at Cal Poly. ESPN was also involved getting in on TV, maybe again?

[ngineer]

First I've heard of it.

Week 0 kind of makes sense for a 12th game. Per the posted "Future Schedules" (https://gocolgateraiders.com/documents/2018/3/16/Colgate_Future_Football_Schedules_2018_19.pdf?path =football) we have open dates on 9/7 and 11/23. I suppose I'd probably prefer a slightly weaker opponent between trips to Air Force on 8/31 and W&M on 9/14, but don't mind getting on the field with Nova. Heck of an opening slate though, if true:
8/24 at Villanova
8/31 at Air Force
9/7 Bye
9/14 at William & Mary
9/21 Maine

Dartmouth and Cornell at the other OOC
Very challenging opening stretch. Do you have a new OC yet?

[crusader11]

I'm not sure if any FCS team has a more challenging first four games than Holy Cross next season --

at Navy
vs UNH
at Yale
at Syracuse

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

I'm not sure if any FCS team has a more challenging first four games than Holy Cross next season --

at Navy
vs UNH
at Yale
at Syracuse

Be interested to see how they measure up! I think the FBS games artificially inflates the schedule. I know there's history with these teams but they're scheduled losses for the purpose of making $$. The Navy game will likely cause some attrition imo. Army's OL took out Colgate's Rohr and dinged up Wheeler. Navy has a history of doing the same. After a rough 2018 the Middies will be looking to make an early statement.

'Cuse should be loaded as long as DeVito lives up to the hype. Several pieces are in place to challenge Clemson in the ACC.

UNH and Yale are two wildcards. Yale was a bit of an enigma last year while UNH's ups and downs are well documented. I think 2-2 is realistic. 0-4 would be a major disappointment for a program looking to make a big jump in year two under their current regime.

[RichH2]

Be interested to see how they measure up! I think the FBS games artificially inflates the schedule. I know there's history with these teams but they're scheduled losses for the purpose of making $$. The Navy game will likely cause some attrition imo. Army's OL took out Colgate's Rohr and dinged up Wheeler. Navy has a history of doing the same. After a rough 2018 the Middies will be looking to make an early statement.

'Cuse should be loaded as long as DeVito lives up to the hype. Several pieces are in place to challenge Clemson in the ACC.

UNH and Yale are two wildcards. Yale was a bit of an enigma last year while UNH's ups and downs are well documented. I think 2-2 is realistic. 0-4 would be a major disappointment for a program looking to make a big jump in year two under their current regime.

Perhaps so owl. A daunting start even if profitable. If they get through the OOC healthy that team will have the game speed to possibly roll through the rest of their schedule.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Perhaps so owl. A daunting start even if profitable. If they get through the OOC healthy that team will have the game speed to possibly roll through the rest of their schedule.

Not sure it's tougher than Colgate's. Both are no jokes in February but you never know how things turn out. Everyone thought Colgate's schedule last year was murders row yet it ended up being pretty weak outside of Army.

With that said, I tend to think UNH will show significant improvement while Maine likely takes a step, or 3, back. Dartmouth should once again be very good. Likely the Ivy favorite imo. W&M and Villanova will likely be mid pack at best CAA teams. But that still makes for a tough out.

[Sader87]

Holy Cross, somewhat surprisingly, has nevah played Navy in football. Partictularly surprising as HC has a long and storied tradition of being a Navy-affiliated school with NROTC and Naval officer training programs during WW2.

Hopefully making the trip to Annapolis ovah Labor Day.

[RichH2]

Per Herosports top recruit groups for PL
20. Holy Cross
29. Fordham
45. Colgate

Admittedly their metrics are skewed by total reliance on offers but still an interesting bit for PL.
According to Hero, each PL team has at least 1 top 300 recruit.

[TheValleyRaider]

Requisite grains of salt taken, but that would bode well for Fordham climbing back up in the PL standings

Regular competition at the top from Colgate/Lehigh/HC/Fordham is good for the League overall xnodx

[DFW HOYA]

Regular competition at the top from Colgate/Lehigh/HC/Fordham is good for the League overall xnodx

Regular competition at the top from Georgetown and Bucknell is good for the League overall, too.

[van]

Regular competition at the top from Georgetown and Bucknell is good for the League overall, too.

theoretically speaking that is

[RichH2]

Interesting tidbit from twitter. Cecchini meeting with players and showing them all the rings he won at Lehigh.xeyebrowx xchinscratchx
I do get that he is showing them what he can lead them to but perhaps a bit too counterintuitive.

[DFW HOYA]

theoretically speaking that is

I think it's important that every school have a realistic (if not practical) aspiration to the league championship.

If not, programs atrophy and wither. See Cornell football as an example.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Interesting tidbit from twitter. Cecchini meeting with players and showing them all the rings he won at Lehigh.xeyebrowx xchinscratchx
I do get that he is showing them what he can lead them to but perhaps a bit too counterintuitive.

That was Charlie Weis's tactic at Notre Dame. Worked for about a week....

[crusader11]

Interesting tidbit from twitter. Cecchini meeting with players and showing them all the rings he won at Lehigh.xeyebrowx xchinscratchx
I do get that he is showing them what he can lead them to but perhaps a bit too counterintuitive.

This is akin to my high school baseball coach posting his senior year statistics in the locker room as an example of "why we should be able to hit the ball."

[PAllen]

Interesting tidbit from twitter. Cecchini meeting with players and showing them all the rings he won at Lehigh.xeyebrowx xchinscratchx
I do get that he is showing them what he can lead them to but perhaps a bit too counterintuitive.

Would have certainly played better if he was the LU coach.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Would have certainly played better if he was the LU coach.

I'm trying to figure what rings he won outside of the 1993 PL Title? Ironically, Lehigh lost to Bucknell that year 32-27. Lehigh also lost to Bucknell his senior year, 1994, 31-27. His 1993 PL title team was far from a Top 25 juggernaut. They lost to Delaware 62-21, Princeton 31-23, Bucknell 32-27, Idaho 77-14. Granted, that was during the dark days of PL irrelevancy.

[TheValleyRaider]

Regular competition at the top from Georgetown and Bucknell is good for the League overall, too.

Regular competition of any sort at the top of the League is good. Highlighted those due to recent success or signs of life.

Georgetown and Bucknell's issues have been trod over here. Wish them well, but do they really belong in this conversation (I did notice one school studiously avoided in these lists :p)?

- - - Updated - - -


I'm trying to figure what rings he won outside of the 1993 PL Title? Ironically, Lehigh lost to Bucknell that year 32-27. Lehigh also lost to Bucknell his senior year, 1994, 31-27. His 1993 PL title team was far from a Top 25 juggernaut. They lost to Delaware 62-21, Princeton 31-23, Bucknell 32-27, Idaho 77-14. Granted, that was during the dark days of PL irrelevancy.

Presumably this includes titles won as an assistant?

[Franks Tanks]

I think it's important that every school have a realistic (if not practical) aspiration to the league championship.

If not, programs atrophy and wither. See Cornell football as an example.

I still believe that every school in the league is capable of a championship. Yes, it is unlikely for some as the stars must align, but the PL does not have disparities like major FBS conferences. In the Big 10 OSO, PSU and Michigan spends tens of millions more on football than some of their league mates. Their worst recruit in a given year is often rated much higher than other programs best. Indiana, Rutgers, Minnesota etc have a much lesser chance of winning the BIG than Bucknell and Georgetown do the PL.

[PAllen]

I'm trying to figure what rings he won outside of the 1993 PL Title? Ironically, Lehigh lost to Bucknell that year 32-27. Lehigh also lost to Bucknell his senior year, 1994, 31-27. His 1993 PL title team was far from a Top 25 juggernaut. They lost to Delaware 62-21, Princeton 31-23, Bucknell 32-27, Idaho 77-14. Granted, that was during the dark days of PL irrelevancy.

I'm guessing he got rings as a coach.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Regular competition of any sort at the top of the League is good. Highlighted those due to recent success or signs of life.

Georgetown and Bucknell's issues have been trod over here. Wish them well, but do they really belong in this conversation (I did notice one school studiously avoided in these lists :p)?

- - - Updated - - -



Presumably this includes titles won as an assistant?

So he really did go Charlie Weis....xoopsx

[RichH2]

So he really did go Charlie Weis....xoopsx

Yeah,well he is just going with what he's got. Its not as if there is anything at Bucknell he could use.

[Go...gate]

Regular competition at the top from Georgetown and Bucknell is good for the League overall, too.

Yes.

[RichH2]

Yes.

+1

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Can someone please explain why Fordham remains in the A10 for basketball? I noticed this year their men's team is 1-10 in the increasingly woeful A10. I'm not sure if there's been another bball program in any conference that simply hasn't been able to compete over the last 25 years. I have no idea why the school, fans, alums allow this to continue.

Point being, Fordham should be an all sports member of the PL....

[PAllen]

Can someone please explain why Fordham remains in the A10 for basketball? I noticed this year their men's team is 1-10 in the increasingly woeful A10. I'm not sure if there's been another bball program in any conference that simply hasn't been able to compete over the last 25 years. I have no idea why the school, fans, alums allow this to continue.

Point being, Fordham should be an all sports member of the PL....

They should be, but they chose not to be. Georgetown thinks the Ivy League should be begging them to join, and Fordham thinks they are a BBall powerhouse in the making. At least Holy Cross' delusions of Big East/ACC grandeur haven't lured them away.

[DFW HOYA]

They should be, but they chose not to be. Georgetown thinks the Ivy League should be begging them to join, and Fordham thinks they are a BBall powerhouse in the making. At least Holy Cross' delusions of Big East/ACC grandeur haven't lured them away.

Disagree. Some (but not all) of Georgetown's sports are good fits for the Ivy, but given its endowment, the Ivy views them the same way Lehigh would view allying with Duquesne--unworthy of the offer.

After one NCAA bid in the last 48 years, few would consider Fordham as "Gonzaga on the Grand Concourse". Notwithstanding, the inability of Fordham to have even representative success over the intervening nine U.S. presidential administrations is baffling.

Holy Cross hasn't been lured away because no one has asked, and the HC athletic brand has been so diminished over the years as to have more in common with MAAC schools than the legitimate Eastern power they were. If asked by the A-10, I think they would leave. And in some way, Rev. Brooks knew that if HC athletics were downgraded, the Big East would not come calling again. Which they haven't.

[The Boogie Down]

Point being, Fordham should be an all sports member of the PL....

I'd bet Fordham joins the CAA in football before going back to the PL for other sports. And I'd happily double down on that once JMU announces their jump into the FBS.

Yes, Fordham has been dreadful in the A-10 in terms of men's hoops. Not just the single worst A-10 team over the past 24 years, but probably the single worst team in any conference over the same period of time. In that time the Rams have a 98-289 conference record. Let's take that in for a second. Or maybe several seconds...

...But, unlike say Creighton in the Big East, Fordham is a natural fit to the A-10. Long before joining, the Rams already had a history w/other A-10 schools like St. Joe's and URI. Lesser so but they had a history with schools like UMass and (former member) Temple as well. Plus they came in with LaSalle whom they had been conference members with back in the MAAC.

Compare that to the PL. Other than Holy Cross, Fordham never had a history with ANY PL school. Looking back it should be asked how did putting a medium-sized Jesuit school from The Bronx in a league with a bunch of small, rural, Waspy, Ivy-Lights (that they had no history with whatsoever!) make any sense to begin with?

No doubt that Fordham needed the PL to help elevate the football program. No doubt that replacing Worcester Tech and Franklin & Marshall with Holy Cross and Lehigh helped change Fordham into more of a football school. That's not to say that it is a "football school" now but home attendance has doubled/tripled since the days of wooden stands overlooking a mud field while taking on the likes of Upsala (rip) and Ithaca. Aside from football though, what benefit did the PL bring to Fordham athletics? And, with Patsy football so woeful now, the current question should be, is the PL (and all their restrictions) helping keep Fordham football down? Is it time for Rams football to move on to a conference that isn't a wannabe Ivy?

As for the other sports, Fordham has fit nicely into the A-10. The women's basketball team was once as bad as the men's, but they've become one of the A-10's best over the past 7-8 years. The baseball and men's soccer teams have both been erratic since joining the A-10 but lately both have seen more ups than downs. This is especially true of men's soccer which advanced to the NCAA's Elite 8 in 2017. Women's soccer is only mediocre at best but softball has absolutely dominated for about a decade now. 8 NCAA trips over the last 9 years is not only tops in the A-10 but probably the best run of any team in the Northeast.

So yeah, men's hoops is a horror show. The administration apparently does not care. The young alumni apparently do not care either. Older alumni, especially those who were around during the special 1971 season, are livid and have been livid for years. But they're a fading group and most of them don't want to leave the A-10 anyway. Instead, they simply want the men's hoops team to be as competitive in the A-10 as Fordham has been in other sports.

[DFW HOYA]

Compare that to the PL. Other than Holy Cross, Fordham never had a history with ANY PL school. Looking back it should be asked how did putting a medium-sized Jesuit school from The Bronx in a league with a bunch of small, rural, Waspy, Ivy-Lights (that they had no history with whatsoever!) make any sense to begin with?

Patriot League expansion has always been reactive. Fordham was approached when Davidson was overwhelmed in just two seasons and made a hasty retreat back to D-III, only to be reclassified four years later. Fordham wasn't ready for the move. So, too, Georgetown, who got the call after word that Towson was ready to leave and thought it could compete with a $250K budget.

If Fordham did leave (and I don't think the Rams' administration has the fortitude to do so), what would the PL do? Send up an all-points bulletin for Monmouth? Would they consider Hampton? Or would they walk along the edge at six and hope Holy Cross doesn't follow in the Rams' footsteps?