Selection Committee's Top 10 - 11-3-16

[Katfan]

Your strength of schedule was 27th in '11. This year it's 85th. That's the difference.
And improving but no one will admit, the other part of the formula, mov is much better than in 2011.

[clenz]

And improving but no one will admit, the other part of the formula, mov is much better than in 2011.
I would hope MOV is better if you're playing the 85th ( of 110ish) rated schedule vs the 27th (of 120ish) rated schedules...

[FargoBison]

Real in depth analysis there. Nice job.

What do you expect? It was a crappy game to watch and you beat them like I would expect. It isn't like I am taking detailed notes.

JSU took shots from LSU and responded. They had a rough few minutes where LSU out athlete'd them but they are LSU, I expect that. JSU really impressed me for parts of that game. If you go on the road and give LSU a tough game, you have my respect.

Wofford and The Citadel are both option teams, both want to run the football and stop the run. It was always going to be a grind it out game, The Citadel forced the turnover in OT and found a way to survive.

I haven't seen SHSU take a punch but that is what happens when you play a bunch of teams that don't know how to throw one.

[BisonTru]

And improving but no one will admit, the other part of the formula, mov is much better than in 2011.

It's projected to move to 70th once you get past Central Arkansas. I for one, will watch that game closely as that will tell us a lot about both those squads, but to place them ahead of a team with a top 25 FBS victory with it's only knock an OT loss on the road to the allegedly 4th best team in the nation. That's nuts.

As far as MOV. Yes, you are beating a much weaker slate of teams by more than you beat better teams in '11. I can't take much away from that.

Let me ask you this, do you think Sam Houston would fair any better than EWU with their schedule?

[YoUDeeMan]

I watched SHSU play Nichols, they played well against a mediocre team. But it wasn't really a game that told me much about how good they were because Nichols isn't that great. I can't really make a proper evaluation of SHSU, they've provided me with nothing. The last time they played a relevant opponent they lost by 52 points.

JSU hasn't exactly played an amazing schedule but I watched their game with LSU, they hung tough with an SEC team.

I watched The Citadel play Wofford, tough game against a rival and potential playoff team on the road. The Citadel found a way to win, good teams find a way to win and that is what happened against Wofford. I like to see how teams deal with a little adversity.




Hey, a football answer!

MUCH respect. xthumbsupx

I appreciate your willingness to watch some other games.

JSU is a good team, but they seem to sputter too often and are inconsistent. It has little to do with their opponent and more with themselves. If they get going, I'd say they are one of the top 3 teams.

I've seen two Citadel games and plan to watch more. I just don't see a lot of individual talent on that team. I do see a decent game plan and some solid execution, but they don't have the talent, speed, pass rush, or the coverage to run the table in the playoffs. Watch another of their games other than Wofford...Wofford is always an anomaly because of the way the play football.

As far as SHSU goes, it is hard to judge them due to their opponents, but watch the individual match ups. Nicholls has played two FBS teams tough, but they weren't in the same ball park as SHSU. PJ and Adebo are ridiculous match ups for any team.

I won't bother you with many more details, but one other thing is a bonus for SHSU that NDSU might relate to...their players are getting a TON of snaps. NDSU's SRs and JRs have played, and practiced, about a whole extra season due to their playoff games. That experience surely helps the Bison develop depth and cohesiveness. SHSU has been getting that kind of extra experience due to the way they play the game. Briscoe was a newbie last year, and he wasn't THE MAN. He had the off season to get his timing down with the receivers...and the team is getting 80-90 snaps per game on O, and a lot of snaps for the D. That is helping the players and the coaches fine tune everything. SHSU should be a well oiled machine come playoff time.

In the end, this is all fun. No one will know who is number 1 until January. And the team that wins it all might not be the best team playing right now (forget the polls in the next couple weeks, I'm just saying the future #1 team, possibly JSU, or NDSU, might not have peaked peaked yet).


One other thing...I hope everyone stays healthy. Yes, it is football, but it would be nice if teams could bring their best in the playoffs. xnodx

[clawman]

Yep, pretty sad. The committee should be encouraging those type of matchups. Good for FCS football, and seemingly, makes playoff selection more cut and dry. My top 4 would be.

1) NDSU (I cannot justify putting EWU ahead of a team that beat them). Also, P5 win and plays in a tough conference.
2) EWU (P5 win over a team that's now in the AP Top 25)
3) JSU
4) SHSU

1) What is home field advantage worth?
1a) would you consider Iowa as strong as WSU?
WSU # 20 82.58 Iowa #33 79.14

[YoUDeeMan]

7-1 doesn't seem to be that poor to me.

Do you think NDSU has played well?

Not won games, but played well.

Not well enough to squeak by games where you hope the opponents screw up so you can win...but do you honestly think NDSU has played like the #1 team in the country? xeyebrowx

[Bisonoline]

Well NDSU has one close loss to a Top 25 SDSU team. Has wins over Iowa, #3 EWU, and #9 CSU. Yet they are 4th. Behind a team they beat. It is an odd poll to say the least.

Yeah. I dont get it. Its like they are making stuff up as they go along. There is no valid reason for these rankings.

[YoUDeeMan]

However, they've crushed everyone they've played which is exactly what a national title contender should do. When it comes to rankings though, I'll take the teams that have proven they can beat top competition.

xlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolx

THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT STUPID SOUNDS LIKE.

NDSU has also PROVEN they can lose to an SDSU team that shouldn't be in the top 15. They have proven they can lose, AT HOME, to a one dimensional passing team and a one dimensional running team. NDSU has also proven that they could be 3-5 or 8-0.

And yet that is a top 1 or 2 team? xeyebrowx

[Bisonoline]

Do you think NDSU has played well?

Not won games, but played well.

Not well enough to squeak by games where you hope the opponents screw up so you can win...but do you honestly think NDSU has played like the #1 team in the country? xeyebrowx

So is this a measurable metric? Good wins vs bad wins? What are they going to come up with next?

Weve played what 4-5 ranked teams. Beat 4 of them. One was an FBS win. Our OOC was against ranked opponents. SHSU has played nobody. none. Nada. Unbelievable.

[The Pud]

Not too surprised about the committee's ranking, but I would have thought Sammy would have been ranked No. 1 instead of JSU, who in my opinion has the weakest SOS next to Chattanoga. I cannot think of one single OVC member outside of JSU without having to check ESPN or yahoo.

I was surprised that EWU wasn't ranked higher. I believe EWU should have been ranked No. 2, with NDSU ranked No. 3

[YoUDeeMan]

So is this a measurable metric? Good wins vs bad wins? What are they going to come up with next?

Weve played what 4-5 ranked teams. Beat 4 of them. One was an FBS win. Our OOC was against ranked opponents. SHSU has played nobody. none. Nada. Unbelievable.

It is OK if you have to have someone read you the questions...the oil money probably wasn't there when you were in school.

So, get back to me when you have the answer as to whether you think your team is playing well.

[semobison]

Do you think NDSU has played well?

Not won games, but played well.

Not well enough to squeak by games where you hope the opponents screw up so you can win...but do you honestly think NDSU has played like the #1 team in the country? xeyebrowx

I think that if Sammy had played NDSU's schedule they would be at best 6-2. Could they have beaten EWU or Iowa? How would they do in the Valley week in and week out? The Valley wears on you. 2013 was the only season the Bison didn't lose a conference game.
NDSU isn't dominant this year but 7-1 against that schedule is impressive.

[Professor Chaos]

xlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolx

THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT STUPID SOUNDS LIKE.

NDSU has also PROVEN they can lose to an SDSU team that shouldn't be in the top 15. They have proven they can lose, AT HOME, to a one dimensional passing team and a one dimensional running team. NDSU has also proven that they could be 3-5 or 8-0.

And yet that is a top 1 or 2 team? xeyebrowx
NDSU has proven they're deserving of being one of the top two seeds by going 7-1 against the toughest schedule in the FCS. Could they have played better? Absolutely, but its not dumb luck that they keep winning close games. Being pushed to the brink by a good team and still coming out on top tells me more than smacking around an overmatched opponent for 2-3 quarters before switching on the cruise control.

[Big_Fan]

Not too surprised about the committee's ranking, but I would have thought Sammy would have been ranked No. 1 instead of JSU, who in my opinion has the weakest SOS next to Chattanoga. I cannot think of one single OVC member outside of JSU without having to check ESPN or yahoo.

I was surprised that EWU wasn't ranked higher. I believe EWU should have been ranked No. 2, with NDSU ranked No. 3
If you think Sammy has a tougher schedule than either JSU or Chatty, you are the Jon Snow of AGS.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using Tapatalk

[FargoBison]

Do you think NDSU has played well?

Not won games, but played well.

Not well enough to squeak by games where you hope the opponents screw up so you can win...but do you honestly think NDSU has played like the #1 team in the country? xeyebrowx


Sure, we are finding ways to beat tough teams. That is what a #1 team does in my opinion. Teams have thrown the kitchen sink at us and so has this schedule, we've beaten a very diverse group of teams.

That said I've struggled with NDSU and EWU and in some weeks I've ranked EWU #1.

[BisonTru]

Do you think NDSU has played well?

Not won games, but played well.

Not well enough to squeak by games where you hope the opponents screw up so you can win...but do you honestly think NDSU has played like the #1 team in the country? xeyebrowx

Yes we are, and I know that because we face competition that has a pulse. I'm not just watching my team blow up the little sisters of the poor, and getting a chubby because my eye ball test says they're the best team in the country.

FTR, the chubby might be from staring at Keeler on the sidelines.

[No_Skill]

I don't think NDSU has played up to their potential. That said, they're still beating some pretty talented teams who want nothing more than to hang an L on the 5 time champs.

[The Pud]

If you think Sammy has a tougher schedule than either JSU or Chatty, you are the Jon Snow of AGS.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using Tapatalk


Let's see......JSU played power house North Alabama and powerhouse OVC teams..........

Chattanooga played power house Shorter University and Presbyterian.


Please, give me a break dude.

:D

[BisonTru]

Also, to get off the current discussion. What has James Madison did to deserve to be 5, and especially be above The Citadel?

[BisonTru]

Let's see......JSU played power house North Alabama and powerhouse OVC teams..........

Chattanooga played power house Shorter University and Presbyterian.


Please, give me a break dude.

:D

JSU beat Coastal and destroyed Liberty. What's Sammy's win that tops either of those two?

[dewey]

Let's see......JSU played power house North Alabama and powerhouse OVC teams..........

Chattanooga played power house Shorter University and Presbyterian.


Please, give me a break dude.

:D

Take a look at the strength of schedule numbers.

North Alabama is #3 in Division 2 right now.
http://www.d2football.com/top25poll/11/

I would take them over Oklahoma Panhandle State or Houston Baptist from SHSU's schedule.

If you think a good D2 team can't beat a top FCS team ask SHSU about that.

Chattanooga actually played The Citadel.

Dewey

[The Pud]

Also, to get off the current discussion. What has James Madison did to deserve to be 5, and especially be above The Citadel?

Great question!

[Professor Chaos]

Also, to get off the current discussion. What has James Madison did to deserve to be 5, and especially be above The Citadel?
Uuuuum... being ranked #5 in the Coach's poll and #7 in the STATS poll. Having comparable rankings in those polls appears to be requisite for the committee rankings.

[PantherRob82]

I'm not whining or complaining or "slanging" anything around... just making a comment based on posts I have read.

Like I said. You clearly haven't been reading if that is your conclusion.xrolleyesx

[The Pud]

Take a look at the strength of schedule numbers.

North Alabama is #3 in Division 2 right now.
http://www.d2football.com/top25poll/11/

I would take them over Oklahoma Panhandle State or Houston Baptist from SHSU's schedule.

If you think a good D2 team can't beat a top FIVE STAR team ask SHSU about that.

Chattanooga actually played The Citadel.

Dewey


and Chattanooga got their butts handed to them by weak Citadel team. I am not asking Sammy nothing abut their schedule, my post was about JSU and Chat.

[JaxSinfonian]

Let's see......JSU played power house North Alabama and powerhouse OVC teams..........

Chattanooga played power house Shorter University and Presbyterian.


Please, give me a break dude.

:D

I notice you didn't mention any of the Bearkats' oh-so-tough opponents there. Go ahead and look them up. We'll wait.

(Going by Massey's ratings, by the way, North Alabama would be the third-highest-rated team in the Southland. That's right behind Sam Houston State, which isn't the top-rated team in the conference.)

[PantherRob82]

Let's see......JSU played power house North Alabama and powerhouse OVC teams..........

Chattanooga played power house Shorter University and Presbyterian.


Please, give me a break dude.

:D

xrolleyesx

[dewey]

Also, to get off the current discussion. What has James Madison did to deserve to be 5, and especially be above The Citadel?

With this committee train of thought they should be higher since they haven't lost to an FCS team. That would put them higher over NDSU and EWU since those teams have lost to FCS teams.

The mantra for schedule now is take an easy OOC schedule. Why bother playing at Montana, Eastern Washington, NDSU or UNI in the OOC? Call every D2, STACY, MEACHAM, Patriot and Pioneer team and get them to come for a game.

Also if you don't like those bloodbath games and are congratulating teams for challenging OOC games admit this is F'd up.

Dewey

[The Pud]

With this committee train of thought they should be higher since they haven't lost to an FCS team. That would put them higher over NDSU and EWU since those teams have lost to FCS teams.

The mantra for schedule now is take an easy OOC schedule. Why bother playing at Montana, Eastern Washington, NDSU or UNI?

Dewey

Funny how Sammy figured this out and you guys are showing up late to the party. LOL!!!

[Serpentor]

Meh, I see the Bearkats at.... maybe #4. Still, thanks committee!

[dewey]

Meh, I see the Bearkats at.... maybe #4. Still, thanks committee!

Agreed. If you are an SHSU fan be happy as hell.

It will be interesting to hear how they ranked team and based on what criteria.

Dewey

[dewey]

Funny how Sammy figured this out and you guys are showing up late to the party. LOL!!!

Yeah because the SHSU athletic director knew that strength of schedule wouldn't matter to the committee. With his crystal ball...right?

Dewey

[Big_Fan]

Let's see......JSU played power house North Alabama and powerhouse OVC teams..........

Chattanooga played power house Shorter University and Presbyterian.


Please, give me a break dude.

:D
...let's just leave off LSU, Liberty, and Coastal Carolina...nice... and EIU beat ISUr at their house... not to mention that D2 UNA would be undefeated against SHSU's schedule. Most of our opponents would be. Chatty doesn't need me to defend them playing in the Socon.

Obvious troll is obvious. I shouldn't have replied.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using Tapatalk

[ElCid]

Thought I would have some fun looking at the SOS, at least according to Massey. It is obvious that the committee did not use SOS as a major criteria. What their magic formula consists of is actually anyone's guess. Some combination of record, SOS, home versus road, and margin of victory obviously, but I can't seem to crack the code. Sagarin is not bad as well, but since they do not even account for Div II games, their overall ratings are a bit off. I put them below as well so you can see.

In any event here are the SOS numbers and some notes for these 10. In regard to the Current SOS, I wanted to give a team that represents the value that Massey gave to a team's current SOS. I also wanted it to be from another conference instead of their own. So the teams that represent the SOS rating are the closest non-conference team that represents the current SOS for each team. The Final SOS is the final projected after all games are played. Anyway, just a little perspective. For those who have never gone to the Massey site, you should. Lots of good info there even if you don't necessarily agree with the data always. http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016&sub=11605




Rank
Team
record
Notes
Current SOS
Projected Final SOS
Team representing current SOS


1
JSU
7-1
Lost to FBS, Div II win
36.21
34.29
N Arizona - 35.84


2
SHSU
8-0
Div II win
19.94
25.00
Holy Cross - 19.60


3
EWU
7-1
Lost to NDSU, Beat FBS
43.83
41.15
The Citadel - 43.83


4
NDSU
7-1
Lost to SDSU, Beat FBS
47.06
45.35
C Ark - 47.64


5
JMU
7-1
Lost to FBS
27.38
29.36
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


6
The Cid
8-0
Div II win
30.50
34.24
Tenn-Martin - 30.54


7
Rich
7-1
Beat FBS, Lost to Stony Brook
30.13
29.91
Nicholls St - 30.14


8
UTC
8-1
Lost to The Cid, Div II win
27.50
33.45
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


9
CSU
5-2
Lost to FBS, NDSU, Div II win
34.80
34.07
S Utah - 34.83


10
C Ark
7-1
Lost to Samford, Beat FBS
32.54
33.25
Albany - 32.54




In case you wanted to see it just by current SOS here it is in SOS order.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
47.06


3
EWU
43.83


1
JSU
36.21


9
CSU
34.80


10
C Ark
32.54


6
The Cid
30.50


7
Richmond
30.13


8
UTC
27.50


5
JMU
27.38


2
SHSU
19.94




In case you wanted to see it in order for the projected final SOS.



Rank
Team
Final SOS


4
NDSU
45.35


3
EWU
41.15


1
JSU
34.29


6
The Cid
34.24


9
CSU
34.07


8
UTC
33.45


10
C Ark
33.25


7
Richmond
29.91


5
JMU
29.36


2
SHSU
25.00





Here are the current Sagarin SOS ratings. You can see by looking at The Citadel it jumped one spot and CSU jumped two spots because Sagarin does not account for Div II games in the ratings. The gap for how far SHSU is behind got smaller as well since it did not account for their Div II game.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
59.36


9
CSU
57.61


3
EWU
56.86


1
JSU
49.77


6
The Cid
48.25


7
Richmond
46.94


5
JMU
42.92


10
C Ark
42.04


8
UTC
41.99


2
SHSU
34.25

[dewey]

For the record I have no ill will towards SHSU or any other school. I would just like to hear what the criteria for selecting the top 10 teams are and then ensure that criteria is followed. If it is wins only then so be it (bye-bye big OOC match ups that almost everyone agrees is good for the FCS), if it is strength of schedule or if wins over FBS teams are a big deal or if it is a combination of the all of them. Or if they just grab the STATS poll and The Coaches poll and make their own based on that (seems that way to me).

I know if NDSU goes 10-1 they will have an impressive resume and if they need to go on the road then so be it.

Dewey

[Bearkats94]

So what will all of you say when Sam and UCA kicks everyone but and met in Frisco? Better watch what you say if this does happen. You could be calling your team trash team. Let's let it play out on the field.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dewey]

So what will all of you say when Sam and UCA kicks everyone but and met in Frisco? Better watch what you say if this does happen. You could be calling your team trash team. Let's let it play out on the field.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Very well could happen. As has been pointed out a thousand times most people think SHSU is a very good team and could be the best team but against inferior opponents how can you tell?

Like you said it will all be settled in the playoffs.

Dewey

[centennial]

So what will all of you say when Sam and UCA kicks everyone but and met in Frisco? Better watch what you say if this does happen. You could be calling your team trash team. Let's let it play out on the field.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You want to put a $100 on that happening?

[Bearkats94]

You want to put a $100 on that happening?

Just let it play out on the field. I don't bet on anything, but crazy things have happen. Then you all will have a full plate of crow to eat.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ElCid]

Very well could happen. As has been pointed out a thousand times most people think SHSU is a very good team and could be the best team but against inferior opponents how can you tell?

Like you said it will all be settled in the playoffs.

Dewey

Exactly. I think most people think that for sure, but like you said, how can you really be certain. Even before the playoffs, the game between C Ark and SHSU on 19 Nov will reveal quite a bit, one way or another, for a lot of people.

[Bisonoline]

So what will all of you say when Sam and UCA kicks everyone but and met in Frisco? Better watch what you say if this does happen. You could be calling your team trash team. Let's let it play out on the field.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Whats there to say? You make it to the Natty you deserve to be there.

[Bisonoline]

Thought I would have some fun looking at the SOS, at least according to Massey. It is obvious that the committee did not use SOS as a major criteria. What their magic formula consists of is actually anyone's guess. Some combination of record, SOS, home versus road, and margin of victory obviously, but I can't seem to crack the code. Sagarin is not bad as well, but since they do not even account for Div II games, their overall ratings are a bit off. I put them below as well so you can see.

In any event here are the SOS numbers and some notes for these 10. In regard to the Current SOS, I wanted to give a team that represents the value that Massey gave to a team's current SOS. I also wanted it to be from another conference instead of their own. So the teams that represent the SOS rating are the closest non-conference team that represents the current SOS for each team. The Final SOS is the final projected after all games are played. Anyway, just a little perspective. For those who have never gone to the Massey site, you should. Lots of good info there even if you don't necessarily agree with the data always. http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016&sub=11605




Rank
Team
record
Notes
Current SOS
Projected Final SOS
Team representing current SOS


1
JSU
7-1
Lost to FBS, Div II win
36.21
34.29
N Arizona - 35.84


2
SHSU
8-0
Div II win
19.94
25.00
Holy Cross - 19.60


3
EWU
7-1
Lost to NDSU, Beat FBS
43.83
41.15
The Citadel - 43.83


4
NDSU
7-1
Lost to SDSU, Beat FBS
47.06
45.35
C Ark - 47.64


5
JMU
7-1
Lost to FBS
27.38
29.36
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


6
The Cid
8-0
Div II win
30.50
34.24
Tenn-Martin - 30.54


7
Rich
7-1
Beat FBS, Lost to Stony Brook
30.13
29.91
Nicholls St - 30.14


8
UTC
8-1
Lost to The Cid, Div II win
27.50
33.45
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


9
CSU
5-2
Lost to FBS, NDSU, Div II win
34.80
34.07
S Utah - 34.83


10
C Ark
7-1
Lost to Samford, Beat FBS
32.54
33.25
Albany - 32.54




In case you wanted to see it just by current SOS here it is in SOS order.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
47.06


3
EWU
43.83


1
JSU
36.21


9
CSU
34.80


10
C Ark
32.54


6
The Cid
30.50


7
Richmond
30.13


8
UTC
27.50


5
JMU
27.38


2
SHSU
19.94




In case you wanted to see it in order for the projected final SOS.



Rank
Team
Final SOS


4
NDSU
45.35


3
EWU
41.15


1
JSU
34.29


6
The Cid
34.24


9
CSU
34.07


8
UTC
33.45


10
C Ark
33.25


7
Richmond
29.91


5
JMU
29.36


2
SHSU
25.00





Here are the current Sagarin SOS ratings. You can see by looking at The Citadel it jumped one spot and CSU jumped two spots because Sagarin does not account for Div II games in the ratings. The gap for how far SHSU is behind got smaller as well since it did not account for their Div II game.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
59.36


9
CSU
57.61


3
EWU
56.86


1
JSU
49.77


6
The Cid
48.25


7
Richmond
46.94


5
JMU
42.92


10
C Ark
42.04


8
UTC
41.99


2
SHSU
34.25





Im not a stat whore but I find this compelling.

[Bearkats94]

Whats there to say? You make it to the Natty you deserve to be there.

That's what I think to. Our program has had 5 year history of making deep runs in the playoffs just like y'all's. Good teams win on the road or at home it doesn't matter where they play. One thing I can say about Sam is they do play down to the level of the team they are playing. So I think when we will play top notch teams who know what our team will be like.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[UpstateBison]

[QUOTE=Bearkats94;2405618]So what will all of you say when Sam and UCA kicks everyone but and met in Frisco? Better watch what you say if this does happen. You could be calling your team trash team. Let's let it play out on the field.

Won't happen due to regionalization. If SOS is not a consideration, regionalization is a given. FCS is the best because you have to beat the best teams on the field. My opinon:

1. EWU
2. NDSU
3. JSU
4. Citadel
5. SHSU

If NDSU does not have at least a 2 seed, I hope they play at JSU. Closest road trip to a game that I could have unless El Cid moves up.

SHSU is a good team just don't know. Their toughest game will be against a team that lost to the #3 team in the SoCon.

#AnyGivenSaturday

[Thumper 76]

xlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolx

THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT STUPID SOUNDS LIKE.

NDSU has also PROVEN they can lose to an SDSU team that shouldn't be in the top 15. They have proven they can lose, AT HOME, to a one dimensional passing team and a one dimensional running team. NDSU has also proven that they could be 3-5 or 8-0.

And yet that is a top 1 or 2 team? xeyebrowx

Where do you think WIU and YSU should be? Legitimately asking.

[UpstateBison]

I think this is a conspiracy theory by Ursus to control the FCS committee and increase membership and posts on the site. This will increase ad revenue and keep the site rolling when he thinks this is the best option. :D

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

I love this time of year on AGS, everyone sucks. I'm just thrilled "We are extremeLehigh" is part of insanity against after 3 year hiatus. It really is like the final 2-3 weeks leading up to Selection Sunday for hoops.

xpopcornx

[The Pud]

[QUOTE=Bearkats94;2405618]So what will all of you say when Sam and UCA kicks everyone but and met in Frisco? Better watch what you say if this does happen. You could be calling your team trash team. Let's let it play out on the field.

Won't happen due to regionalization. If SOS is not a consideration, regionalization is a given. FCS is the best because you have to beat the best teams on the field. My opinon:

1. EWU
2. NDSU
3. JSU
4. Citadel
5. SHSU

If NDSU does not have at least a 2 seed, I hope they play at JSU. Closest road trip to a game that I could have unless El Cid moves up.

SHSU is a good team just don't know. Their toughest game will be against a team that lost to the #3 team in the SoCon.

#AnyGivenSaturday

Too bad the committee disagrees with your ranking sir. Sammy should/will be the No 1 or 2 seed come playoff time.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Thought I would have some fun looking at the SOS, at least according to Massey. It is obvious that the committee did not use SOS as a major criteria. What their magic formula consists of is actually anyone's guess. Some combination of record, SOS, home versus road, and margin of victory obviously, but I can't seem to crack the code. Sagarin is not bad as well, but since they do not even account for Div II games, their overall ratings are a bit off. I put them below as well so you can see.

In any event here are the SOS numbers and some notes for these 10. In regard to the Current SOS, I wanted to give a team that represents the value that Massey gave to a team's current SOS. I also wanted it to be from another conference instead of their own. So the teams that represent the SOS rating are the closest non-conference team that represents the current SOS for each team. The Final SOS is the final projected after all games are played. Anyway, just a little perspective. For those who have never gone to the Massey site, you should. Lots of good info there even if you don't necessarily agree with the data always. http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016&sub=11605




Rank
Team
record
Notes
Current SOS
Projected Final SOS
Team representing current SOS


1
JSU
7-1
Lost to FBS, Div II win
36.21
34.29
N Arizona - 35.84


2
SHSU
8-0
Div II win
19.94
25.00
Holy Cross - 19.60


3
EWU
7-1
Lost to NDSU, Beat FBS
43.83
41.15
The Citadel - 43.83


4
NDSU
7-1
Lost to SDSU, Beat FBS
47.06
45.35
C Ark - 47.64


5
JMU
7-1
Lost to FBS
27.38
29.36
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


6
The Cid
8-0
Div II win
30.50
34.24
Tenn-Martin - 30.54


7
Rich
7-1
Beat FBS, Lost to Stony Brook
30.13
29.91
Nicholls St - 30.14


8
UTC
8-1
Lost to The Cid, Div II win
27.50
33.45
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


9
CSU
5-2
Lost to FBS, NDSU, Div II win
34.80
34.07
S Utah - 34.83


10
C Ark
7-1
Lost to Samford, Beat FBS
32.54
33.25
Albany - 32.54




In case you wanted to see it just by current SOS here it is in SOS order.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
47.06


3
EWU
43.83


1
JSU
36.21


9
CSU
34.80


10
C Ark
32.54


6
The Cid
30.50


7
Richmond
30.13


8
UTC
27.50


5
JMU
27.38


2
SHSU
19.94




In case you wanted to see it in order for the projected final SOS.



Rank
Team
Final SOS


4
NDSU
45.35


3
EWU
41.15


1
JSU
34.29


6
The Cid
34.24


9
CSU
34.07


8
UTC
33.45


10
C Ark
33.25


7
Richmond
29.91


5
JMU
29.36


2
SHSU
25.00





Here are the current Sagarin SOS ratings. You can see by looking at The Citadel it jumped one spot and CSU jumped two spots because Sagarin does not account for Div II games in the ratings. The gap for how far SHSU is behind got smaller as well since it did not account for their Div II game.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
59.36


9
CSU
57.61


3
EWU
56.86


1
JSU
49.77


6
The Cid
48.25


7
Richmond
46.94


5
JMU
42.92


10
C Ark
42.04


8
UTC
41.99


2
SHSU
34.25




Of course, this also demonstrates how SOS is completely broken in every system, since it somehow is trying to say that Jacksonville State's SOS is harder than Richmond's when any sane look at their schedules shows that's clearly not the case. Yes, LSU is better than Virginia. That does not make the FCS teams they played anywhere close to the four ranked or once-ranked FCS teams Richmond played. It also shouldn't cheapen Richmond's win over an P5 school.

[Thumper 76]

Of course, this also demonstrates how SOS is completely broken in every system, since it somehow is trying to say that Jacksonville State's SOS is harder than Richmond's when any sane look at their schedules shows that's clearly not the case. Yes, LSU is better than Virginia. That does not make the FCS teams they played anywhere close to the four ranked or once-ranked FCS teams Richmond played. It also shouldn't cheapen Richmond's win over an P5 school.

Welp cue up the SoCon fans xlolx


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[The Pud]

Seems the committee thinks Southland is a pretty good conference with 2 teams ranked in the top 10. xthumbsupx

[thebootfitter]

Just let it play out on the field. I don't bet on anything, but crazy things have happen. Then you all will have a full plate of crow to eat.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No. No crow to eat. They are both good teams that could end up in the chipper. If they do... good for them. They will have earned it. But there's no justification to place either of those teams in the top two seeds and expect them to make it to the chipper.

[milleniumkat]

Well something called Incarnate Word didn't roll up a 50 spot on their defense last time I checked.

I watched Furman play Michigan State tough, they are capable of sneaking up on a team.

Clearly you don't understand the dynamics of TOP on a football game. SHSU score 63 points on drives that were so fast, the defense was on the field for 41 minutes, our offense only had the all for 19. 600 yards and 63 points in 19 minutes. Our offense puts a strain on our defense by having them in the field too much. It's an issue even the coach has stated.

Hell, its a characteristic of most of these uptempo, Air raid offenses. They are built for high scoring shoot outs. Personally i don't particularly care for that style. But in the games where defenses have actually made our offense work a little longer, the defense has been better. It's not a great defense, but the offensive flow skews a lot of the performance. Not to mention entire halfs of garbage time.

And UIW has a good, senior QB with some talent around him. they aren't the push over they used to be. They gave Texas State a game for a half too....hell they actually led in that game for a quarter....not so much vs us.

Our defense has done its job when it has needed to. But we do have to do a better job of playing four quarters.

[Big_Fan]

Of course, this also demonstrates how SOS is completely broken in every system, since it somehow is trying to say that Jacksonville State's SOS is harder than Richmond's when any sane look at their schedules shows that's clearly not the case. Yes, LSU is better than Virginia. That does not make the FCS teams they played anywhere close to the four ranked or once-ranked FCS teams Richmond played. It also shouldn't cheapen Richmond's win over an P5 school.

I think there are a lot of assumptions that go into your assertion that looking at Richmond's schedule shows it to clearly be better than JSU's.

Lets look at Richmond's schedule objectively.

Virginia is a solid win against a (now 2-5) P5 program. Props for that one.

Norfolk State is a MEAC team, and a bad one at that. They are arguably worse than anyone JSU has played. Norfolk has 2 wins, including a 20-12 win over a Elizabeth City team that Fordham beat 83-21. Norfolk is bad.

Stony Brook Blowout loss... Ok, so SB beat ND 13-9 to open the season. That was a solid win, albeit unspectacular. Still, their blowout losses to Sacred Heart and UNH make me question whether or not that was a fluke. Beating Rhode Island 14-3? That is like losing to Austin Peay...maybe worse. RI can't spell defense. Still, I will give them credit for a decent win.

Beating Colgate by a TD. Only your dentist thinks Colgate (3-4) is good.

Townson... how the mighty have fallen. They are a bad team... 1-7 bad. How does one lose to Dartmouth? I mean, UNH did as well... Dartmouth lost to Columbia, the answer to the question "what team holds the second longest losing streak in D1 history?"

Albany OT win... Albany isn't much. They beat G5 bottomfeeder Buffalo. The only team with a winning record they have beaten is Saint Francis (who lost to Townson).

'Nova 23-0... FINALLY a marquis FCS name... but how good are they this season, really? Nova beat Lehigh, who has a lot of wins... by about the same margin as Monmouth. The same Monmouth team that lost to Liberty 52-28. The same Liberty team that JSU beat (in Lynchburg) 48-19. Transitive property doesn't always work in Football, but I think it is fair to say that Liberty is on a different level from Monmouth, and JSU is on a different level than Liberty. Monmouth vs 'Nova would likely be competitive.

Elon is just bad...blown out by everyone but a D2 team... and what happened to Bill & Mary? They lost to Elon?!?

JSU played LSU tough for most of the game... if not for a 3 minute stretch just before halftime, the game may have ended differently. That is a tougher game than UVA.

Coastal and Liberty are on par with anyone else on Richmond's schedule. Coastal ranks higher than anyone, and Liberty is one spot below Nova.

EIU has wins over ISUr and Miami (OH) - a marginally better MAC team than Buffalo. I would rank EIU above Albany and probably on-par with SB. According to Massey, they rank 180, 167, and 178 respectively... close enough to argue who is better, but not clear-cut.

Our D2 opponent is ranked #3, and Steven Pugh's simulator has them 8 points better than SB on a neutral field (3 points inferior to Nova). I would love to run sims of all of our opponents, but you only get one or two shots per day on that site. According to Massey, UNA ranks 155 - higher than anyone Richmond has played aside from Nova (138)...and higher than anyone SHSU will have played until they meet UCA.

...what I am saying is, Richmond's schedule isn't massively better than JSU's. If all we had played were OVC teams, that might be true... but we haven't. NEC and Patriot teams are not great opponents, and Richmond hasn't played the best in the CAA. That happens this week. JMU should be a good barometer of where you are. Honestly, I don't think the CAA is that good. It definitely isn't what it once was. Bill & Mary and Delaware are dumpster fires. Albany and SB are OVC level. Nova is pretty good. UNH looks fairly solid, but that loss to Dartmouth stings. Given that UNH is the #2 team in CAA, that would be like Youngstown losing to Duquesne...and they won that game 45-3.

LSU at 10 jacks our SOS way up... but if you removed LSU from ours, and UVA from Richmond's, you would find the two schedules are not much different in terms of how they compare. The average ranking of Richmond's opponents in that instance is 242. The average ranking of JSU's is 208.14. Truthfully, Norfolk State kills your SOS. They are so bad that they drag it down... if you remove them, it is closer...but if we remove APSU, it doesn't really change anything.

So, your assertion that "just look at Richmond's schedule and you will see it is tougher!" doesn't hold up. I looked. It isn't.

[milleniumkat]

Censorship? Nah we just expect somebody to have a backbone and be able to back up their bull**** accusations. Not many people here have any reason to "hate" SHSU but they do have pretty solid reason to loudly question their ranking. They have the #2 spot right now so it will be much discussed. Add to it all the SHSU guys who came over here in a coordinated effort to troll the board what do you expect. Put up or shut up.

Only trolling i've done is of those that were going out of their way to make shsu out to be joke of a program and team. You are one of those. So take your medicine and quit crying. And we have "put up" thus far....See Committee and Major poll rankings.

[milleniumkat]

Exactly. The eye test goes a long way but most here haven't watched a single game out of the MVFC or BSC yet they anoint themselves FCS experts.

Thumper doesn't even know who his own team had played half of the time. Take what he says with a grain of meth.


"I may already be inside you"

[milleniumkat]

The chair will also be on 1660 tomorrow with Cullhane and Jorgenson. I will definitely be tuning into that interview.

"Cullhane and Jorgenson"


lololllllllllolololololololll

Damn man, if that's not a Nordic Tag Team i don't know what is.


"I may already be inside you"

[milleniumkat]

What do you expect? It was a crappy game to watch and you beat them like I would expect. It isn't like I am taking detailed notes.

JSU took shots from LSU and responded. They had a rough few minutes where LSU out athlete'd them but they are LSU, I expect that. JSU really impressed me for parts of that game. If you go on the road and give LSU a tough game, you have my respect.

Wofford and The Citadel are both option teams, both want to run the football and stop the run. It was always going to be a grind it out game, The Citadel forced the turnover in OT and found a way to survive.

I haven't seen SHSU take a punch but that is what happens when you play a bunch of teams that don't know how to throw one.

JSU hung tough with an SEC (lSU) team that got its coach fired for being so ****ty on offense BTW. That was the game that MILES finally gave up on the Starting QB and turned it over to the back up for the first time. So JSU hung around with a team playing a QB for the first time.

And Nicholls hung tough with a then #9 Georgia who is still 4-4. Didn't hang so tough with us. But keep ignoring factual situations.




"I may already be inside you"

[Professor Chaos]

"Cullhane and Jorgenson"


lololllllllllolololololololll

Damn man, if that's not a Nordic Tag Team i don't know what is.


"I may already be inside you"
Hearing he's going on Texas radio next with Shooter and Billy Ray. ;)

[milleniumkat]

Hearing he's going on Texas radio next with Shooter and Billy Ray. ;)

hellz yeah!!! But they're ain't no one named Shooter in Texas you corn fed jamoke, it's "Junior and Billy Ray" and they dominate the airways like 24/7!


"I may already be inside you"

[milleniumkat]

I think that if Sammy had played NDSU's schedule they would be at best 6-2. Could they have beaten EWU or Iowa? How would they do in the Valley week in and week out? The Valley wears on you. 2013 was the only season the Bison didn't lose a conference game.
NDSU isn't dominant this year but 7-1 against that schedule is impressive.

Well, that's like you're opinion man.

You have a right to it. But it's all speculation and doesn't mean anything more than anyone else's so enjoy your day.


"I may already be inside you"

[milleniumkat]

So if a team goes on the road and gives a head coach firing LSU a good game they get respect.

But a team goes on the road and gives a young Georgia team a tough game they suck?

Interesting.


"I may already be inside you"

[Elcid1995]

Also, to get off the current discussion. What has James Madison did to deserve to be 5, and especially be above The Citadel?

Good press for Mike Houston who will be moving on from the Dukes shortly.

As to why they are ahead...the rankings are broke and the committee is jank. I fear if we run the FCS table and lose to UNC they will drop us from the top 8. They are morons.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RootinFerDukes]

BisonTru,

I thought we were only the #16 team in the nation? You may have been off by a bit.

[Milktruck74]

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161104/bb4d05d980912ded4da62f541dc29210.png

muuuuahhahahah. "much tougher"". riiiiiiggt. North Greenville D2 38-14? Really? 5 point win over a 2 win Furman?? Really?

The Briscoe inferno would drop 75 on those teams if he played a full 4 qtrs. 55-65 if he played 2.



"I may already be inside you"

Seriously? Do you know anything about The Citadel? I know you guys in the SLC don't really play much defense, but it is hard for a QB to score from the bench....Citadel's O is not designed to throw up a ton of points, if they win by 14 it is a big margin of victory....they hold the ball forever...look at their TOP, if Briscoe scored on every drive you still would only score 42. Citadel would give you 18 minutes and about 6 chances to score.

[Professor Chaos]

So if a team goes on the road and gives a head coach firing LSU a good game they get respect.

But a team goes on the road and gives a young Georgia team a tough game they suck?

Interesting.


"I may already be inside you"
Well, LSU has proven to be much better than Georgia this year. And I at least gave some respect to Nicholls until they went and lost by 25 to MacKnees.

[FUBeAR]

Thought I would have some fun looking at the SOS, at least according to Massey. It is obvious that the committee did not use SOS as a major criteria. What their magic formula consists of is actually anyone's guess. Some combination of record, SOS, home versus road, and margin of victory obviously, but I can't seem to crack the code. Sagarin is not bad as well, but since they do not even account for Div II games, their overall ratings are a bit off. I put them below as well so you can see.

In any event here are the SOS numbers and some notes for these 10. In regard to the Current SOS, I wanted to give a team that represents the value that Massey gave to a team's current SOS. I also wanted it to be from another conference instead of their own. So the teams that represent the SOS rating are the closest non-conference team that represents the current SOS for each team. The Final SOS is the final projected after all games are played. Anyway, just a little perspective. For those who have never gone to the Massey site, you should. Lots of good info there even if you don't necessarily agree with the data always. http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016&sub=11605




Rank
Team
record
Notes
Current SOS
Projected Final SOS
Team representing current SOS


1
JSU
7-1
Lost to FBS, Div II win
36.21
34.29
N Arizona - 35.84


2
SHSU
8-0
Div II win
19.94
25.00
Holy Cross - 19.60


3
EWU
7-1
Lost to NDSU, Beat FBS
43.83
41.15
The Citadel - 43.83


4
NDSU
7-1
Lost to SDSU, Beat FBS
47.06
45.35
C Ark - 47.64


5
JMU
7-1
Lost to FBS
27.38
29.36
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


6
The Cid
8-0
Div II win
30.50
34.24
Tenn-Martin - 30.54


7
Rich
7-1
Beat FBS, Lost to Stony Brook
30.13
29.91
Nicholls St - 30.14


8
UTC
8-1
Lost to The Cid, Div II win
27.50
33.45
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


9
CSU
5-2
Lost to FBS, NDSU, Div II win
34.80
34.07
S Utah - 34.83


10
C Ark
7-1
Lost to Samford, Beat FBS
32.54
33.25
Albany - 32.54




In case you wanted to see it just by current SOS here it is in SOS order.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
47.06


3
EWU
43.83


1
JSU
36.21


9
CSU
34.80


10
C Ark
32.54


6
The Cid
30.50


7
Richmond
30.13


8
UTC
27.50


5
JMU
27.38


2
SHSU
19.94




In case you wanted to see it in order for the projected final SOS.



Rank
Team
Final SOS


4
NDSU
45.35


3
EWU
41.15


1
JSU
34.29


6
The Cid
34.24


9
CSU
34.07


8
UTC
33.45


10
C Ark
33.25


7
Richmond
29.91


5
JMU
29.36


2
SHSU
25.00





Here are the current Sagarin SOS ratings. You can see by looking at The Citadel it jumped one spot and CSU jumped two spots because Sagarin does not account for Div II games in the ratings. The gap for how far SHSU is behind got smaller as well since it did not account for their Div II game.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
59.36


9
CSU
57.61


3
EWU
56.86


1
JSU
49.77


6
The Cid
48.25


7
Richmond
46.94


5
JMU
42.92


10
C Ark
42.04


8
UTC
41.99




...and Samford's SoS is 35.85, which would be #4 on the list of Top 10...and they beat #10. With their only FCS loss being to #8 and another while pushing an FBS P5 SEC Team to the wire, the Committee practiced the equivalent of 'jury nullification' to leave the Bulldogs out of the Top 10. No way would they 'allow' the SoCon to have 3 Teams in the Top 10 when their 'darlings' in the MVFC, the CAA, and the Big Sky only have 1 or 2. Absolute travesty! I fear this is an indicator of the SoCon getting screwed (again) when the at-large berths are 'gifted' out. If these tough SoCon matchups in the next 3 weeks (El Cid v Sammy, Furman v Woffy, Woffy v Chatt, Mercer v Sammy, etc.) don't fall just the right way, I could see the Committee closing their squinty eyes and only putting 2 SoCon Teams in the Playoffs - heck, maybe even only 1, the AutoBid....when at least 4 SoCon Teams should be in...maybe 5!

[7yearkat]

Seriously? Do you know anything about The Citadel? I know you guys in the SLC don't really play much defense, but it is hard for a QB to score from the bench....Citadel's O is not designed to throw up a ton of points, if they win by 14 it is a big margin of victory....they hold the ball forever...look at their TOP, if Briscoe scored on every drive you still would only score 42. Citadel would give you 18 minutes and about 6 chances to score.

"Citadel's O is not designed to throw up a ton of points"

Really? What exactly are they designed to do? First time I've heard of an offense designed to score just a few points.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[clenz]

The mantra for schedule now is take an easy OOC schedule. Why bother playing at Montana, Eastern Washington, NDSU or UNI in the OOC? Call every D2, STACY, MEACHAM, Patriot and Pioneer team and get them to come for a game.

Exactly right. I think it was this thread that I posted I hope our AD is calling Drake, Upper Iowa (D2), SEMO, Valpo, etc... until they have no choice but to accept just to get him to stop calling.

No reason to play anyone good anymore.

[Milktruck74]

"Citadel's O is not designed to throw up a ton of points"

Really? What exactly are they designed to do? First time I've heard of an offense designed to score just a few points.





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


They are designed to control the TOP and and limit the opportunities of the other team. And it has worked for them.

[kalm]

Thought I would have some fun looking at the SOS, at least according to Massey. It is obvious that the committee did not use SOS as a major criteria. What their magic formula consists of is actually anyone's guess. Some combination of record, SOS, home versus road, and margin of victory obviously, but I can't seem to crack the code. Sagarin is not bad as well, but since they do not even account for Div II games, their overall ratings are a bit off. I put them below as well so you can see.

In any event here are the SOS numbers and some notes for these 10. In regard to the Current SOS, I wanted to give a team that represents the value that Massey gave to a team's current SOS. I also wanted it to be from another conference instead of their own. So the teams that represent the SOS rating are the closest non-conference team that represents the current SOS for each team. The Final SOS is the final projected after all games are played. Anyway, just a little perspective. For those who have never gone to the Massey site, you should. Lots of good info there even if you don't necessarily agree with the data always. http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016&sub=11605




Rank
Team
record
Notes
Current SOS
Projected Final SOS
Team representing current SOS


1
JSU
7-1
Lost to FBS, Div II win
36.21
34.29
N Arizona - 35.84


2
SHSU
8-0
Div II win
19.94
25.00
Holy Cross - 19.60


3
EWU
7-1
Lost to NDSU, Beat FBS
43.83
41.15
The Citadel - 43.83


4
NDSU
7-1
Lost to SDSU, Beat FBS
47.06
45.35
C Ark - 47.64


5
JMU
7-1
Lost to FBS
27.38
29.36
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


6
The Cid
8-0
Div II win
30.50
34.24
Tenn-Martin - 30.54


7
Rich
7-1
Beat FBS, Lost to Stony Brook
30.13
29.91
Nicholls St - 30.14


8
UTC
8-1
Lost to The Cid, Div II win
27.50
33.45
Gardner-Webb - 27.50


9
CSU
5-2
Lost to FBS, NDSU, Div II win
34.80
34.07
S Utah - 34.83


10
C Ark
7-1
Lost to Samford, Beat FBS
32.54
33.25
Albany - 32.54




In case you wanted to see it just by current SOS here it is in SOS order.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
47.06


3
EWU
43.83


1
JSU
36.21


9
CSU
34.80


10
C Ark
32.54


6
The Cid
30.50


7
Richmond
30.13


8
UTC
27.50


5
JMU
27.38


2
SHSU
19.94




In case you wanted to see it in order for the projected final SOS.



Rank
Team
Final SOS


4
NDSU
45.35


3
EWU
41.15


1
JSU
34.29


6
The Cid
34.24


9
CSU
34.07


8
UTC
33.45


10
C Ark
33.25


7
Richmond
29.91


5
JMU
29.36


2
SHSU
25.00





Here are the current Sagarin SOS ratings. You can see by looking at The Citadel it jumped one spot and CSU jumped two spots because Sagarin does not account for Div II games in the ratings. The gap for how far SHSU is behind got smaller as well since it did not account for their Div II game.



Rank
Team
SOS


4
NDSU
59.36


9
CSU
57.61


3
EWU
56.86


1
JSU
49.77


6
The Cid
48.25


7
Richmond
46.94


5
JMU
42.92


10
C Ark
42.04


8
UTC
41.99


2
SHSU
34.25




Good stuff here Elcid. I'm not a fan of the computer rankings in general but the SoS stuff is helpful. Especially how you corresponded the SoS to a team representing that ranking.

Another stat to throw out there is that SHSU has not played a single opponent ranked in the top 50 in either total defense or scoring defense and they will only have played one all season when they face UCA.

Kudo's to the JSU fans for being mostly reasonable in this thread. They tend to admit it's a favorable ranking and understand there should be more to the process than the "eyeball test, past success, and MOV. Regarding MOV, I think back to EWU's National Championship season and almost every game was tight including against teams like UNC and Southern Utah who were not that good back then. And we got blown out by MSU that year. A ton of blowout wins is impressive but it's not everything.

SHSU is a very good team deserving of a seed but for now, they belong below anywhere from 2-5 other teams. It's not punishment but there are more deserving teams. I'm honestly concerned about how deep the committee members have really dug into this. As most of us know and support, a number of elite progams have taken on the challenge of scheduling tough OOC opponents. As mentioned earlier these matchups help sort out the selection process. They also raise FCS brand awareness on a national level. These are athletic directors casting these votes and I would like to think they're aware of the implications on future scheduling this message sends. But maybe not.

[penguinpower]

I have said it before. The selection process is a ****ed up POS with POS people. It is 100% politics and personal agendas. Just like our political system. They only thing that holds them halfway accountable is the win-loss record and who you play. Now they've gotten even bolder. Someone needs to go to their meeting swinging a 2x4 and inflict heavy damage to their heads.

[Big_Fan]

"Citadel's O is not designed to throw up a ton of points"

Really? What exactly are they designed to do? First time I've heard of an offense designed to score just a few points.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

erm...really? You don't know the difference in a run and gun spread variant v/s a triple option three yards and a cloud of dust offense? The reason the service academies run the option is that it shortens the game, limits possessions, and is an equalizer when they are outmatched in terms of talent. It does that... it doesn't score a ton of points but it makes their opponent play disciplined football to beat them. That is why commentators say things like "it is important that they don't get too far behind because their offense isn't designed to play catch-up." They run clock. They chew yards... and hopefully they score at the end of it.

Our defense is fantastic, but we are not the most disciplined team on earth. I would like to avoid option teams... but we will probably end up facing one in the playoffs.

[PantherRob82]

So what will all of you say when Sam and UCA kicks everyone but and met in Frisco? Better watch what you say if this does happen. You could be calling your team trash team. Let's let it play out on the field.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

SHSU 10
CSU 1
USD 1

[Serpentor]

SHSU 10
CSU 1
USD 1

Bearkat94 has been a member since 2005. Fail.

[Gil Dobie]

The committee's top ten really doesn't mean anything. The championship is always determined on the field.

[PantherRob82]

Just let it play out on the field. I don't bet on anything, but crazy things have happen. Then you all will have a full plate of crow to eat.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

...or you will.xrolleyesx

[Katfan]

It's projected to move to 70th once you get past Central Arkansas. I for one, will watch that game closely as that will tell us a lot about both those squads, but to place them ahead of a team with a top 25 FBS victory with it's only knock an OT loss on the road to the allegedly 4th best team in the nation. That's nuts.

As far as MOV. Yes, you are beating a much weaker slate of teams by more than you beat better teams in '11. I can't take much away from that.

Let me ask you this, do you think Sam Houston would fair any better than EWU with their schedule?
Based on a very limited sample size, that is watching the game with NDSU, I think we would do very similar. I think our offense is very similar and I think our D is better. We will find out a lot about our team when we play UCA, as we will have to compete for 4quarters to have a chance to win. A lot of football to play we shall see. Based on these rankings and games remaining on everyone's schedule, it will be interesting to see what happens is UCA wins the game with us.

- - - Updated - - -


It's projected to move to 70th once you get past Central Arkansas. I for one, will watch that game closely as that will tell us a lot about both those squads, but to place them ahead of a team with a top 25 FBS victory with it's only knock an OT loss on the road to the allegedly 4th best team in the nation. That's nuts.

As far as MOV. Yes, you are beating a much weaker slate of teams by more than you beat better teams in '11. I can't take much away from that.

Let me ask you this, do you think Sam Houston would fair any better than EWU with their schedule?
Based on a very limited sample size, that is watching the game with NDSU, I think we would do very similar. I think our offense is very similar and I think our D is better. We will find out a lot about our team when we play UCA, as we will have to compete for 4quarters to have a chance to win. A lot of football to play we shall see. Based on these rankings and games remaining on everyone's schedule, it will be interesting to see what happens is UCA wins the game with us.

[Thumper 76]

Bearkat94 has been a member since 2005. Fail.
Oh you can be a Novemberist and been a member for a while. Its more when you show up, how you act, and for how long.

[POD Knows]

"Cullhane and Jorgenson"


lololllllllllolololololololll

Damn man, if that's not a Nordic Tag Team i don't know what is.


"I may already be inside you"

I think Cullhane is a mick

[BigSouthFan]

Let's erase FBS and D2.. After all, this is FCS Football. Here are my realistic rankings based on performance and SOS.

1. NDSU (6-1)
2. EWU (6-1)
3. JSU (6-0)
4. The Citadel (7-0)
5. JMU (6-0)
6. SHSU (7-0)
7. CSU (4-1)
8. Richmond (6-1)
9. UTC (7-1)
10. UCA (6-1)


First off, playing more FCS teams does not make your schedule tougher IMO. You can play all the Campbells, Presbyterians, and Incarnate Words of the world, it carries no weight. Here is my thought behind the ranking up here..

1. Toughest schedule by far, probably in FCS. One slip up, and the slip up came in a close game. Multiple ranked teams on the schedule, 5 I heard? Amazing. Best team in the country still.
2. Another tough schedule, only loss came to the #1 team. Can't fault that. If it weren't for head to head, they would be #1. Moving on.
3. Undefeated in FCS play. Amongst those undefeated, highest strength of schedule, including a win over two Top 30 teams.
4. Undefeated in FCS play as well. Some unconvincing wins, but also a great win over UTC. 2nd ranked SOS of undefeated teams.
5. Undefeated in FCS play. No great wins, but 3rd ranked SOS of undefeated teams.
6. Undefeated in FCS play. No quality wins of any sort, 4th ranked SOS of undefeated teams.
7. Win over 1 current Top 20 team. Best remaining SOS of remaining 1-loss teams. Only loss came to #1.
8. Win over 1 current Top 15 team. Next best remaining SOS. Loss came to Stony Brook.
9. No wins over current Top 25. Though their SOS is lowest of 1-loss teams, only loss came in a close game with #4.
10. No wins over current Top 25. Second worse SOS of 1-loss teams. Only loss came to Top 20 team, Samford.

Just IMO a good way to look at it.

[POD Knows]

Let's erase FBS and D2.. After all, this is FCS Football. Here are my realistic rankings based on performance and SOS.

1. NDSU (6-1)
2. EWU (6-1)
3. JSU (6-0)
4. The Citadel (7-0)
5. JMU (6-0)
6. SHSU (7-0)
7. CSU (4-1)
8. Richmond (6-1)
9. UTC (7-1)
10. UCA (6-1)


First off, playing more FCS teams does not make your schedule tougher IMO. You can play all the Campbells, Presbyterians, and Incarnate Words of the world, it carries no weight. Here is my thought behind the ranking up here..

1. Toughest schedule by far, probably in FCS. One slip up, and the slip up came in a close game. Multiple ranked teams on the schedule, 5 I heard? Amazing. Best team in the country still.
2. Another tough schedule, only loss came to the #1 team. Can't fault that. If it weren't for head to head, they would be #1. Moving on.
3. Undefeated in FCS play. Amongst those undefeated, highest strength of schedule, including a win over two Top 30 teams.
4. Undefeated in FCS play as well. Some unconvincing wins, but also a great win over UTC. 2nd ranked SOS of undefeated teams.
5. Undefeated in FCS play. No great wins, but 3rd ranked SOS of undefeated teams.
6. Undefeated in FCS play. No quality wins of any sort, 4th ranked SOS of undefeated teams.
7. Win over 1 current Top 20 team. Best remaining SOS of remaining 1-loss teams. Only loss came to #1.
8. Win over 1 current Top 15 team. Next best remaining SOS. Loss came to Stony Brook.
9. No wins over current Top 25. Though their SOS is lowest of 1-loss teams, only loss came in a close game with #4.
10. No wins over current Top 25. Second worse SOS of 1-loss teams. Only loss came to Top 20 team, Samford.

Just IMO a good way to look at it.

xthumbsupx Lock down the thread

[PantherRob82]

One thing I can say about Sam is they do play down to the level of the team they are playing. So I think when we will play top notch teams who know what our team will be like.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You think....xlolx

[BEAR]

Do you really want to erase the FBS wins or losses? I get the D2 because they have less scholarships, but DI FBS have more scholarships. I can see keeping that win or lose.

[PantherRob82]

Bearkat94 has been a member since 2005. Fail.

And only posts about football in November and December. Boom. Roasted.

[BigSouthFan]

Do you really want to erase the FBS wins or losses? I get the D2 because they have less scholarships, but DI FBS have more scholarships. I can see keeping that win or lose.

I understand it's shaky to not include FBS wins. But to include the losses are not a fair assessment of a team's record. So I wanted to even the field and not include either. If you include FBS wins the only thing it does to my ranking is probably move Richmond up even though UVA is bad. #1 and #2 stays put.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Bearkat94 has been a member since 2005. Fail.

And has 392 posts. So there is that...

[Daytripper]

And has 392 posts. So there is that...

Haven't you ever heard of quality over quantity?? xcoffeex

[BamKat]

And only posts about football in November and December. Boom. Roasted.

Dude, some people like beer and pussy! Not key boards and computer screens all year long, brah!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[DirtyDukes]

Let's wait until after this Saturday before wondering why El Cid is ranked #6.

BTW if we manage to win Sat, I'm pullin for the Spidahs!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You misspelled Spatters.


I think there are a lot of assumptions that go into your assertion that looking at Richmond's schedule shows it to clearly be better than JSU's.

Lets look at Richmond's schedule objectively.

Virginia is a solid win against a (now 2-5) P5 program. Props for that one.

Norfolk State is a MEAC team, and a bad one at that. They are arguably worse than anyone JSU has played. Norfolk has 2 wins, including a 20-12 win over a Elizabeth City team that Fordham beat 83-21. Norfolk is bad.

Stony Brook Blowout loss... Ok, so SB beat ND 13-9 to open the season. That was a solid win, albeit unspectacular. Still, their blowout losses to Sacred Heart and UNH make me question whether or not that was a fluke. Beating Rhode Island 14-3? That is like losing to Austin Peay...maybe worse. RI can't spell defense. Still, I will give them credit for a decent win.

Beating Colgate by a TD. Only your dentist thinks Colgate (3-4) is good.

Townson... how the mighty have fallen. They are a bad team... 1-7 bad. How does one lose to Dartmouth? I mean, UNH did as well... Dartmouth lost to Columbia, the answer to the question "what team holds the second longest losing streak in D1 history?"

Albany OT win... Albany isn't much. They beat G5 bottomfeeder Buffalo. The only team with a winning record they have beaten is Saint Francis (who lost to Townson).

'Nova 23-0... FINALLY a marquis FCS name... but how good are they this season, really? Nova beat Lehigh, who has a lot of wins... by about the same margin as Monmouth. The same Monmouth team that lost to Liberty 52-28. The same Liberty team that JSU beat (in Lynchburg) 48-19. Transitive property doesn't always work in Football, but I think it is fair to say that Liberty is on a different level from Monmouth, and JSU is on a different level than Liberty. Monmouth vs 'Nova would likely be competitive.

Elon is just bad...blown out by everyone but a D2 team... and what happened to Bill & Mary? They lost to Elon?!?

JSU played LSU tough for most of the game... if not for a 3 minute stretch just before halftime, the game may have ended differently. That is a tougher game than UVA.

Coastal and Liberty are on par with anyone else on Richmond's schedule. Coastal ranks higher than anyone, and Liberty is one spot below Nova.

EIU has wins over ISUr and Miami (OH) - a marginally better MAC team than Buffalo. I would rank EIU above Albany and probably on-par with SB. According to Massey, they rank 180, 167, and 178 respectively... close enough to argue who is better, but not clear-cut.

Our D2 opponent is ranked #3, and Steven Pugh's simulator has them 8 points better than SB on a neutral field (3 points inferior to Nova). I would love to run sims of all of our opponents, but you only get one or two shots per day on that site. According to Massey, UNA ranks 155 - higher than anyone Richmond has played aside from Nova (138)...and higher than anyone SHSU will have played until they meet UCA.

...what I am saying is, Richmond's schedule isn't massively better than JSU's. If all we had played were OVC teams, that might be true... but we haven't. NEC and Patriot teams are not great opponents, and Richmond hasn't played the best in the CAA. That happens this week. JMU should be a good barometer of where you are. Honestly, I don't think the CAA is that good. It definitely isn't what it once was. Bill & Mary and Delaware are dumpster fires. Albany and SB are OVC level. Nova is pretty good. UNH looks fairly solid, but that loss to Dartmouth stings. Given that UNH is the #2 team in CAA, that would be like Youngstown losing to Duquesne...and they won that game 45-3.

LSU at 10 jacks our SOS way up... but if you removed LSU from ours, and UVA from Richmond's, you would find the two schedules are not much different in terms of how they compare. The average ranking of Richmond's opponents in that instance is 242. The average ranking of JSU's is 208.14. Truthfully, Norfolk State kills your SOS. They are so bad that they drag it down... if you remove them, it is closer...but if we remove APSU, it doesn't really change anything.

So, your assertion that "just look at Richmond's schedule and you will see it is tougher!" doesn't hold up. I looked. It isn't.

Thank you so much. Spatter fans have been saying all along "JMU's schedule is weak" (which I don't deny) but then pointing to their own as hard. Gimme a break.

[BEAR]

I understand it's shaky to not include FBS wins. But to include the losses are not a fair assessment of a team's record. So I wanted to even the field and not include either. If you include FBS wins the only thing it does to my ranking is probably move Richmond up even though UVA is bad. #1 and #2 stays put.

If we base the FBS losses on the assumption that FCS is supposed to lose to FBS as proven by historic record, then the FBS wins should count more toward how a team is actually playing.

For example, UCA played 4 time Sunbelt champion (yes, the sunbelt..I know) at their house and beat them. They had more scholarships, more fans at their stadium, and were favorites especially since UCA was FCS, lost 30 players, lost to another FCS team, and had only beat a lowly FCS school. UCA didn't SNEAK by in that game. They held ASU to 45 rushing yards. Forced 4 turnovers. Even though the final score was close, UCA won it in every way. Their stadium was EMPTY in the third quarter. Even their fans saw it.
The game we did lose this year we dominated that 2X over..but still lost. Even Samford fans that were there said to me they were just happy to come away with a win.
Now flip those two games. Give Samford the loss and FBS Arkansas State the win. Samford and ASU have both gone on after that to win 4 in a row (minus Samford's expected FBS loss as I stated above.) Both teams are rolling. BUT Arkansas State had the advantage over Samford in number of scholarship players, home environment, and every other advantage FBS schools have over FCS schools. That's why I'd still look at FBS wins but not FBS losses.

[Drblankstare]

I think Cullhane is a mick

Definitely. Fargo has been a Mick resettlement town for a few years now. :D Thats how I got here

[JSUSoutherner]

erm...really? You don't know the difference in a run and gun spread variant v/s a triple option three yards and a cloud of dust offense? The reason the service academies run the option is that it shortens the game, limits possessions, and is an equalizer when they are outmatched in terms of talent. It does that... it doesn't score a ton of points but it makes their opponent play disciplined football to beat them. That is why commentators say things like "it is important that they don't get too far behind because their offense isn't designed to play catch-up." They run clock. They chew yards... and hopefully they score at the end of it.

Our defense is fantastic, but we are not the most disciplined team on earth. I would like to avoid option teams... but we will probably end up facing one in the playoffs.
I honestly wouldn't mind an option team. Most of our discipline problems have been with the corners but our D-line and safeties have been lights out. I know Coastal isn't a true option team, but they ran quite a bit of it and we still held them to like 40 yards rushing.

We have a lot of speed on defense (cue the "southern speed" quips) and stopped the run well all year. We may not be the most disciplined but we have a nose for the ball and get to it in a hurry.

[BigSouthFan]

If we base the FBS losses on the assumption that FCS is supposed to lose to FBS as proven by historic record, then the FBS wins should count more toward how a team is actually playing.

For example, UCA played 4 time Sunbelt champion (yes, the sunbelt..I know) at their house and beat them. They had more scholarships, more fans at their stadium, and were favorites especially since UCA was FCS, lost 30 players, lost to another FCS team, and had only beat a lowly FCS school. UCA didn't SNEAK by in that game. They held ASU to 45 rushing yards. Forced 4 turnovers. Even though the final score was close, UCA won it in every way. Their stadium was EMPTY in the third quarter. Even their fans saw it.
The game we did lose this year we dominated that 2X over..but still lost. Even Samford fans that were there said to me they were just happy to come away with a win.
Now flip those two games. Give Samford the loss and FBS Arkansas State the win. Samford and ASU have both gone on after that to win 4 in a row (minus Samford's expected FBS loss as I stated above.) Both teams are rolling. BUT Arkansas State had the advantage over Samford in number of scholarship players, home environment, and every other advantage FBS schools have over FCS schools. That's why I'd still look at FBS wins but not FBS losses.

I understand that breakdown completely. But I think including FBS in general makes you have to go way more in depth to the FBS teams then it's not worth it. Every team in this Top 10 would have a legitimate shot at beating a FBS like Arkansas State, Georgia State, even Georgia Southern right now. You include FBS wins and it sounds good but then you don't include the weight of the FBS win, you know? As the rankings are showing now as it has in the past, it's much better to beat a NDSU or an EWU than a mid to low level SunBelt team.

[Big_Fan]

You misspelled Spatters.



Thank you so much. Spatter fans have been saying all along "JMU's schedule is weak" (which I don't deny) but then pointing to their own as hard. Gimme a break.

It kind of is what it is... pot/kettle. I don't feel that our schedule was the toughest on earth because we are in the OVC... but there are a few dangerous teams in the OVC. EIU, EKU, and UTM can all be dangerous, though EKU is down...even SEMO and Murray can sneak up on you if you overlook them. SEMO is roughly analogous to Indiana State, and Murray is improving. We beefed up our schedule by playing Coastal and Liberty. They aren't top-level MVFC teams, but Liberty did beat Montana last season, and Coastal is solid. They would be a playoff team if they weren't transitioning.

The Richmond folk throwing rocks at our schedule are in a glass house.

JMU has done what SHSU has done... mudholed teams they should mudhole. As with SHSU I question your defense. Morehead was terrible, but probably better than Norfolk. Colgate is better than UCC. UNC is better than UVA. There isn't a huge difference in your schedules. Theirs may be marginally tougher, but it isn't a massive difference. You guys drew URI in conference... that is probably the biggest difference, and I doubt you have any say in that. Your schedule average is 198, theirs is 178... so theirs is marginally tougher, but you didn't lose to Maine (164) whereas they lost to SB (178).

I am looking forward to you guys playing. It should be a fun game.

[ElCid]

Of course, this also demonstrates how SOS is completely broken in every system, since it somehow is trying to say that Jacksonville State's SOS is harder than Richmond's when any sane look at their schedules shows that's clearly not the case. Yes, LSU is better than Virginia. That does not make the FCS teams they played anywhere close to the four ranked or once-ranked FCS teams Richmond played. It also shouldn't cheapen Richmond's win over an P5 school.



So, your assertion that "just look at Richmond's schedule and you will see it is tougher!" doesn't hold up. I looked. It isn't.

The statement was ridiculous to begin with. JSU's schedule was harder than Richmond's. SOS is not perfect, but it is certainly much better than eyeballing it. There are always intangibles, but in general, it is close.

And it certainly does not mean that either team is better than the other, it just means they played tougher/easier opponents. I think too many people equate tougher schedule with being better. It's only one data point.

If I have team A and they play the toughest schedule out there and they lose one game and win others by a FG or 1 TD how good are they? And if I have team B and they play an ok schedule not nearly as tough as team A, but they don't lose any and win by two or three touchdowns each game, who is better?

Guess what? It is a judgment call at that point. SOS is just a data point like all others. You take it and evaluate it and then look for how a team did against that schedule. Was it at home or away? Was it against an FBS or Div II? Was it a bad FBS or really good Div II? Were any starters out due to injuries? Was it their third road game in a row? Was it a rivalry game? Was it raining? They are all data points that need to be digested.

[Big_Fan]

I honestly wouldn't mind an option team. Most of our discipline problems have been with the corners but our D-line and safeties have been lights out. I know Coastal isn't a true option team, but they ran quite a bit of it and we still held them to like 40 yards rushing.

We have a lot of speed on defense (cue the "southern speed" quips) and stopped the run well all year. We may not be the most disciplined but we have a nose for the ball and get to it in a hurry.

There is just something satisfying about shutting down the run and teeing off on the QB that you don't get when playing an option team.

You are right though, we have good lateral pursuit on defense. I grin when I see teams throw screen passes. They seldom work against us... slants on the other hand...

[Big_Fan]

The statement was ridiculous to begin with. JSU's schedule was harder than Richmond's. SOS is not perfect, but it is certainly much better than eyeballing it. There are always intangibles, but in general, it is close.

And it certainly does not mean that either team is better than the other, it just means they played tougher/easier opponents. I think too many people equate tougher schedule with being better. It's only one data point.

If I have team A and they play the toughest schedule out there and they lose one game and win others by a FG or 1 TD how good are they? And if I have team B and they play an ok schedule not nearly as tough as team A, but they don't lose any and win by two or three touchdowns each game, who is better?

Guess what? It is a judgment call at that point. SOS is just a data point like all others. You take it and evaluate it and then look for how a team did against that schedule. Was it at home or away? Was it against an FBS or Div II? Was it a bad FBS or really good Div II? Were any starters out due to injuries? Was it their third road game in a row? Was it a rivalry game? Was it raining? They are all data points that need to be digested.

Yeah, you definitely have to take all the variables into consideration, and look at the whole body of work when evaluating matchups. NDSU is way better than the loss to SDSU would indicate, but that hurts their ranking - and deservedly so. We struggled offensively against EKU... and that is putting it lightly. We tore Liberty to shreds, and the Flames are easily the better team. The scoreboard says that we struggled with Coastal, but that game felt like a dominant win in spite of the margin being 1 point. The scoreboard says that we mudholed TTU, but that game felt competitive for the most part. Sometimes the ball bounces weird. At the end of the day we have taken care of business and the committee rewarded us.

[Bison56]

Nice to see Cluck U getting the attention he gets on here since he gets so little at home.

[WileECoyote06]

I recall saying JSU would be a 1 or 2 seed.

IMHO, the knock on NDSU is two-fold; a home-loss to SDSU and SDSU's loss to ISU-r. Now where SHSU fits, I can't call it, but I'm sure MOV is being considered by the committee. Even with a H-2-H win, EWU's loss to NDSU on the road is better than NDSU's loss to SDSU at home. I had it 1. JSU 2. EWU 3. NDSU 4. SHSU.

[Bisonator]

IMO EWU has the biggest gripe. They should have been #1. They have a better FBS win and a better loss then NDSU. And both of those teams SOS is way better then either JSU or SHSU. It'll be interesting how the last 3 weeks play out and whether or not the committee makes any changes and how they would justify those changes now that they put these rankings out there.

Either way it will be won or lost on the field. I look forward to NDSU proving the doubters wrong if they do have to go on the road come PO time.

[Professor Chaos]

I recall saying JSU would be a 1 or 2 seed.

IMHO, the knock on NDSU is two-fold; a home-loss to SDSU and SDSU's loss to ISU-r. Now where SHSU fits, I can't call it, but I'm sure MOV is being considered by the committee. Even with a H-2-H win, EWU's loss to NDSU on the road is better than NDSU's loss to SDSU at home. I had it 1. JSU 2. EWU 3. NDSU 4. SHSU.
The problem with this take is you put all the focus one the one loss for your top 3 and none on the 7 wins. You're just assuming those 7 wins are equal or you're just ignoring the fact that they aren't.

[flyrod]

WOW 36 pages in like not even 24hrs , damn those rankings got a lot of peeps' panties in bunches......


and theres still 3 weeks to go before the final ranks......

[F'N Hawks]

Woke up and am still trying to figure out the method to their madness. Excited to hear some interviews and read some articles that have the committee explaining how they went about it.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The statement was ridiculous to begin with. JSU's schedule was harder than Richmond's. SOS is not perfect, but it is certainly much better than eyeballing it. There are always intangibles, but in general, it is close.

And it certainly does not mean that either team is better than the other, it just means they played tougher/easier opponents. I think too many people equate tougher schedule with being better. It's only one data point.

If I have team A and they play the toughest schedule out there and they lose one game and win others by a FG or 1 TD how good are they? And if I have team B and they play an ok schedule not nearly as tough as team A, but they don't lose any and win by two or three touchdowns each game, who is better?

Guess what? It is a judgment call at that point. SOS is just a data point like all others. You take it and evaluate it and then look for how a team did against that schedule. Was it at home or away? Was it against an FBS or Div II? Was it a bad FBS or really good Div II? Were any starters out due to injuries? Was it their third road game in a row? Was it a rivalry game? Was it raining? They are all data points that need to be digested.

So let me get this straight - you're saying that SOS should matter for the committee, until it doesn't?

I think everyone can agree that games on the road vs. Washington, Virginia and LSU are "tough", and games at home vs. Arkansas-Monticello, Morehead State and URI are "not tough". But how much of a numeric SOS ranking is based on that one 70-ish point SOS outlying data point? And, more importantly, how does it affect other ratings?

When you go through a fine-toothed comb on both JSU's and Richmond's schedule, you see a schedule that is shockingly even, with Albany/UT Martin and Stony Brook/EIU literally right next to each other in Sagarin. So why is JSU's SOS a full five points higher than Richmond? Because LSU's schedule is deemed harder than Virginia's.

An important element of this is JSU's "win" over Coastal Carolina. They are NOT an FBS team. They are an FCS team, and a win over them isn't nearly as impressive as a win over Villanova.

So what do you do? Do you go with an obviously imperfect model that puts JSU's schedule a full five points stronger than Richmond's for no real good FCS-level reason? Or throw it out and go completely subjective? There is no good answer.

[UNIFanSince1983]

IMO EWU has the biggest gripe. They should have been #1. They have a better FBS win and a better loss then NDSU. And both of those teams SOS is way better then either JSU or SHSU. It'll be interesting how the last 3 weeks play out and whether or not the committee makes any changes and how they would justify those changes now that they put these rankings out there.

Either way it will be won or lost on the field. I look forward to NDSU proving the doubters wrong if they do have to go on the road come PO time.

Okay so if you compare wins does EWU have 3 wins as good as the 3 NDSU has with: Iowa, EWU, and CSU?

[WileECoyote06]

The problem with this take is you put all the focus one the one loss for your top 3 and none on the 7 wins. You're just assuming those 7 wins are equal or you're just ignoring the fact that they aren't.

Not really. The committee has long shown favoritism towards teams who are undefeated against FCS competition. Especially if the undefeated team has a few wins against other playoff caliber teams (i.e. JSU's wins against Liberty, Coastal Carolina, Eastern Illinois). I can't explain Sam Houston State, other than Margin of Victory.

As far as NDSU goes, they reap the benefit of playing strong teams in conference, but I suspect that the committee gives more weight to your OOC schedule, especially if those games are on the road. That philosophy is throughout the NCAA (i.e. the RPI, etc). NDSU narrowly defeated Chuck South and E. Washington at home. Perhaps their opinion is if they played either on the road they would have lost one or both of those games. NDSU lost to Montana on the road last year and still garnered a three seed.

I still expect some shuffling. If EWU defeats Cal Poly handily on the road, they may jump into the #1 spot.

[dewey]

Here is a video from Bison Media Blog and WDAY sports director Dom Izzo. Before you discount what he says because he covers NDSU know that he is the best at covering the FCS as a whole then anyone else I have seen out there.

https://www.bisonmediazone.com/bison-video-blog-fcs-playoffs-rankings-unveiled/

Dewey

[BisonBacker]

What a ****ing joke. I'm hoping our AD is on the phone with EWU's AD to get next years game cancelled. Hell it would help both teams to dump that game and schedule D2's! If this ends up the seeding they just **** on the entire subdivision and any chance at improving OOC competition. Not sure how these brain dead idiots get on these committee's but they all need to be held to the fire. Yet another reason to look at an FBS move.

Amen to that!

[kalm]

Okay so if you compare wins does EWU have 3 wins as good as the 3 NDSU has with: Iowa, EWU, and CSU?

No. And if both win out, NDSU would still have a slightly better resume.

Iowa, EWU, CSU, WIU, YSU

Vs

Wazzu, UNI, Montana, Poly, NAU

[dewey]

No. And if both win out, NDSU would still have a slightly better resume.

Iowa, EWU, CSU, WIU, YSU

Vs

Wazzu, UNI, Montana, Poly, NAU

I assume you are counting UNI a good win for EWU since UNI was ranked at the time, right?

If so NDSU has a win over #18/#20 at the time Illinois State.

Good wins versus ranked teams (at the time they played).
NDSU
Charleston Southern #6/#7
Eastern Washington #8
Iowa (FBS #13/#11)
Illinois State #18/#20
Youngstown State (assuming a win #15/#13)
South Dakota (might be a top 25 team when NDSU plays them in 2 weeks)

Eastern Washington
Washington State
Northern Iowa
Montana
Cal Poly (assuming a win)

I couldn't find the rankings for EWU quickly so I didn't enter them.

Both teams have very impressive resumes and IMHO they should be #1 and #2 in the rankings. Either order I could understand.

Dewey

[Sammy94]

Not that SOS has a thing to do with the committee's choices, its always had more to do with politics and money than anything else but I am intrigued by all the crying and complaining.

Where is the line drawn for a good win? Top 50, top 20, top 10, in the MVFC or not? Do polls matter? If so which one? AGS, Masseys, STATS, Coach's poll.

Why wasn't SFA a good win for Sam at the time? They were in the top 30 in AGS at the time.

Why punish the rest of the country because they don't play in the MFVC? The good conferences (MVFC, CAA) will always beat up on each on other but whose to say any other team is better or worse because they don't play in those conferences? Sure some conferences are known to be very weak and their representatives are one and done in the playoffs but don't judge other conferences that have shown recent proven winners (SLC, OVC) as not worthy of the top spot because conference foes may not be as good.

[kalm]

I assume you are counting UNI a good win for EWU since UNI was ranked at the time, right?

If so NDSU has a win over #18/#20 at the time Illinois State.

Good wins versus ranked teams (at the time they played).
NDSU
Charleston Southern #6/#7
Eastern Washington #8
Iowa (FBS #13/#11)
Illinois State #18/#20
Youngstown State (assuming a win #15/#13)
South Dakota (might be a top 25 team when NDSU plays them in 2 weeks)

Eastern Washington
Washington State
Northern Iowa
Montana
Cal Poly (assuming a win)

I couldn't find the rankings for EWU quickly so I didn't enter them.

Both teams have very impressive resumes and IMHO they should be #1 and #2 in the rankings. Either order I could understand.

Dewey

I listed UNI because it's still EWU's fifth best win. The only way that changes is if both NAU and UNC win out. Not likely.

Agree with the rest of your post.

[semobison]

I recall saying JSU would be a 1 or 2 seed.

IMHO, the knock on NDSU is two-fold; a home-loss to SDSU and SDSU's loss to ISU-r. Now where SHSU fits, I can't call it, but I'm sure MOV is being considered by the committee. Even with a H-2-H win, EWU's loss to NDSU on the road is better than NDSU's loss to SDSU at home. I had it 1. JSU 2. EWU 3. NDSU 4. SHSU.

You do know that ISUr also has a Big Ten win over Northwestern. Nobody goes undefeated in the Valley.

[Professor Chaos]

So here's Massey's rankings (http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016) for all the wins that the top 4 teams have:

JSU
1. Coastal Carolina (117)
2. Liberty (139)
3. North Alabama (155)
4. Eastern Illinois (180)
5. Tennessee Tech (230)
6. Eastern Kentucky (249)
7. Austin Peay (387)

So a D2 school was their 3rd best win according to Massey... that should tell you something.


SHSU
1. Nicholls (174)
2. Lamar (199)
3. Stephen F Austin (203)
4. Houston Baptist (242)
5. Abilene Christian (284)
6. Incarnate Word (315)
7. Texas Southern (405)
8. Oklahoma Panhandle State (429 I think - if NE Oklahoma isn't them they're not rated amongst the 500 teams listed)

I'd say the numbers speak for themselves here.


EWU
1. Washington St (17)
2. Northern Iowa (113)
3. Montana (123)
4. Northern Arizona (145)
5. Northern Colorado (175)
6. UC Davis (208)
7. Montana St (231)

Clearly the best of the 3 so far.


NDSU
1. Iowa (34)
2. Eastern Washington (57)
3. Charleston Southern (97)
4. Western Illinois (106)
5. Northern Iowa (113)
6. Illinois St (128)
7. Missouri St (149)

You be the judge...

[dewey]

You can listen to Bison 1660 am this morning and they are talking rankings. The show started at 1100 CDT and goes to 1300 CDT. They are talking with FCS committee chair during this time. Podcasts are also available for the show.

http://radio.securenetsystems.net/v5/KQWBAM

Dewey

[JSUSoutherner]

So here's Massey's rankings (http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016) for all the wins that the top 4 teams have:

JSU
1. Coastal Carolina (117)
2. Liberty (139)
3. North Alabama (155)
4. Eastern Illinois (180)
5. Tennessee Tech (230)
6. Eastern Kentucky (249)
7. Austin Peay (387)

So a D2 school was their 3rd best win according to Massey... that should tell you something.


SHSU
1. Nicholls (174)
2. Lamar (199)
3. Stephen F Austin (203)
4. Houston Baptist (242)
5. Abilene Christian (284)
6. Incarnate Word (315)
7. Texas Southern (405)
8. Oklahoma Panhandle State (429 I think - if NE Oklahoma isn't them they're not rated amongst the 500 teams listed)

I'd say the numbers speak for themselves here.


EWU
1. Washington St (17)
2. Northern Iowa (113)
3. Montana (123)
4. Northern Arizona (145)
5. Northern Colorado (175)
6. UC Davis (208)
7. Montana St (231)

Clearly the best of the 3 so far.


NDSU
1. Iowa (34)
2. Eastern Washington (57)
3. Charleston Southern (97)
4. Western Illinois (106)
5. Northern Iowa (113)
6. Illinois St (128)
7. Missouri St (149)

You be the judge...
I love how our D2 would be the hardest team on Sammy's schedule so far.

[Professor Chaos]

Not really. The committee has long shown favoritism towards teams who are undefeated against FCS competition. Especially if the undefeated team has a few wins against other playoff caliber teams (i.e. JSU's wins against Liberty, Coastal Carolina, Eastern Illinois). I can't explain Sam Houston State, other than Margin of Victory.

As far as NDSU goes, they reap the benefit of playing strong teams in conference, but I suspect that the committee gives more weight to your OOC schedule, especially if those games are on the road. That philosophy is throughout the NCAA (i.e. the RPI, etc). NDSU narrowly defeated Chuck South and E. Washington at home. Perhaps their opinion is if they played either on the road they would have lost one or both of those games. NDSU lost to Montana on the road last year and still garnered a three seed.

I still expect some shuffling. If EWU defeats Cal Poly handily on the road, they may jump into the #1 spot.
No they haven't. Maybe this year they are but they haven't in the past. Last year McNeese was undefeated and was seeded below NDSU (who had two FCS losses) and Illinois St (who had 1 FCS loss). Quality wins have mattered in the past. And let's not act like NDSU has a bad loss. SDSU is solid. If you're going to use their Illinois St loss as your sole gauge for how good SDSU is you're falling into the same trap of judging a team by one loss instead of factoring in their 5 wins.

I continue to see new arguments pop up justifying these rankings and they just don't hold water IMO. NDSU gets less credit for beating CSU and EWU in OT at home? Well, JSU's signature win is a one point victory at home over Coastal Carolina. Sam Houston didn't even play an OOC out of conference. And let's not forget the fact that NDSU won on the road OOC at Iowa.

[Htownbearkat]

You can listen to Bison 1660 am this morning and they are talking rankings.

http://radio.securenetsystems.net/v5/KQWBAM

Dewey
thanks for the link.

[Thumper 76]

You do know that ISUr also has a Big Ten win over Northwestern. Nobody goes undefeated in the Valley.

Pfffft. Obviously you haven't paid attention. The UNI thing has been beaten into the dirt that they aren't good, SDSU is next to go down as a complete trash team. What an awful loss for NDSU. Truly embarrassing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[nevadagriz]

My dream playoff matchups that would make for great discussion and solve a lot of what ifs.
Ndsu @ SHSU semi finals
Montana @ UND any round
Ndsu @ Ewu in Frisco !

[PantherRob82]

Haven't you ever heard of quality over quantity?? xcoffeex

He doesn't have either.

- - - Updated - - -


Dude, some people like beer and pussy! Not key boards and computer screens all year long, brah!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

xrolleyesx

[dewey]

thanks for the link.

Right now they think Eastern Washington has a HUGE gripe and rightfully so.

I am not complaining about the rankings I would just want the criteria being fully applied to all teams.

So the committee is now saying one (1) FCS loss wipes out the entire strength of schedule. NDSU needs to schedule cupcakes like Oklahoma Panhandle State, name your Southland team, MEAC, SWAC or even a D2.

Dewey

[kalm]

So here's Massey's rankings (http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016) for all the wins that the top 4 teams have:

JSU
1. Coastal Carolina (117)
2. Liberty (139)
3. North Alabama (155)
4. Eastern Illinois (180)
5. Tennessee Tech (230)
6. Eastern Kentucky (249)
7. Austin Peay (387)

So a D2 school was their 3rd best win according to Massey... that should tell you something.


SHSU
1. Nicholls (174)
2. Lamar (199)
3. Stephen F Austin (203)
4. Houston Baptist (242)
5. Abilene Christian (284)
6. Incarnate Word (315)
7. Texas Southern (405)
8. Oklahoma Panhandle State (429 I think - if NE Oklahoma isn't them they're not rated amongst the 500 teams listed)

I'd say the numbers speak for themselves here.


EWU
1. Washington St (17)
2. Northern Iowa (113)
3. Montana (123)
4. Northern Arizona (145)
5. Northern Colorado (175)
6. UC Davis (208)
7. Montana St (231)

Clearly the best of the 3 so far.


NDSU
1. Iowa (34)
2. Eastern Washington (57)
3. Charleston Southern (97)
4. Western Illinois (106)
5. Northern Iowa (113)
6. Illinois St (128)
7. Missouri St (149)

You be the judge...

Hard to argue with this.

[UNIFanSince1983]

So here's Massey's rankings (http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016) for all the wins that the top 4 teams have:

JSU
1. Coastal Carolina (117)
2. Liberty (139)
3. North Alabama (155)
4. Eastern Illinois (180)
5. Tennessee Tech (230)
6. Eastern Kentucky (249)
7. Austin Peay (387)

So a D2 school was their 3rd best win according to Massey... that should tell you something.


SHSU
1. Nicholls (174)
2. Lamar (199)
3. Stephen F Austin (203)
4. Houston Baptist (242)
5. Abilene Christian (284)
6. Incarnate Word (315)
7. Texas Southern (405)
8. Oklahoma Panhandle State (429 I think - if NE Oklahoma isn't them they're not rated amongst the 500 teams listed)

I'd say the numbers speak for themselves here.


EWU
1. Washington St (17)
2. Northern Iowa (113)
3. Montana (123)
4. Northern Arizona (145)
5. Northern Colorado (175)
6. UC Davis (208)
7. Montana St (231)

Clearly the best of the 3 so far.


NDSU
1. Iowa (34)
2. Eastern Washington (57)
3. Charleston Southern (97)
4. Western Illinois (106)
5. Northern Iowa (113)
6. Illinois St (128)
7. Missouri St (149)

You be the judge...

I probably could go look it up, but I am curious to see where The Citadel ranks.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Right now they think Eastern Washington has a HUGE gripe and rightfully so.

I am not complaining about the rankings I would just want the criteria being fully applied to all teams.

So the committee is now saying one (1) FCS loss wipes out the entire strength of schedule. NDSU needs to schedule cupcakes like Oklahoma Panhandle State, name your Southland team, MEAC, SWAC or even a D2.

Dewey

Clearly in the Top 4 it is all about an FCS loss. JSU doesn't have one, SHSU doesn't have one, EWU has one strong FCS loss, and NDSU has one not as strong FCS loss. But this loses a little water when you get to JMU and The Citadel because neither has an FCS loss and are behind teams with an FCS loss.

So it is something strange going on.

[70MilesFromCanada]

UND is #1 (or maybe #30). And I could be RIGHT!

This WHOLE thread is all a cluster****** about HOME field in the playoffs. Nobody is making a strong argument about the 10 teams. Another 14 are gonna join them any fight it out. A couple of locations make for a strong home field, but going to the FDome or the Inferno is the whole point of finding the best. Everyone please take a chill pill.

[Sammy94]

Right now they think Eastern Washington has a HUGE gripe and rightfully so.

I am not complaining about the rankings I would just want the criteria being fully applied to all teams.

So the committee is now saying one (1) FCS loss wipes out the entire strength of schedule. NDSU needs to schedule cupcakes like Oklahoma Panhandle State, name your Southland team, MEAC, SWAC or even a D2.

Dewey

Didn't y'all play Incarnate Word and Ferris State recently?

[70MilesFromCanada]

UND is #1 (or maybe #30). And I could be RIGHT!

This WHOLE thread is all a cluster****** about HOME field in the playoffs. Nobody is making a strong argument about the 10 teams flat out being wrong. Another 14 are gonna join them any fight it out. A couple of locations make for a strong home field, but going to the FDome or the Inferno is the whole point of finding the best. Everyone please take a chill pill.

[bostonspider]

The Citadel
1. UTC (98)
2. Wofford (137)
3. Mercer (185)
4. Furman (188)
5. G-W (221)
6. WCU (232)
7. ETSU (293)
8. N. Greenvile (341)

Richmond
1. UVA (90)
2. Villanova (136)
3. Albany (167)
4. Colgate (198)
5. Towson (260)
6. Elon (279)
7. Norfolk St. (461)

JMU
1. UNH (153)
2. Maine (164)
3. W&M (233)
4. UD (247)
5. URI (336)
6. CCSU (398)
7. Moorehead (424)

[70MilesFromCanada]

UND is #1 (or maybe #30). And I could be RIGHT!

This WHOLE thread is all a cluster****** about HOME field in the playoffs. Nobody is making a strong argument about the 10 teams flat out being wrong. Another 14 are gonna join them and fight it out. A couple of locations make for a strong home field, but going to the FDome or the Inferno is the whole point of finding the best. Everyone please take a chill pill.

[WileECoyote06]

No they haven't. Maybe this year they are but they haven't in the past. Last year McNeese was undefeated and was seeded below NDSU (who had two FCS losses) and Illinois St (who had 1 FCS loss). Quality wins have mattered in the past. And let's not act like NDSU has a bad loss. SDSU is solid. If you're going to use their Illinois St loss as your sole gauge for how good SDSU is you're falling into the same trap of judging a team by one loss instead of factoring in their 5 wins.

I continue to see new arguments pop up justifying these rankings and they just don't hold water IMO. NDSU gets less credit for beating CSU and EWU in OT at home? Well, JSU's signature win is a one point victory at home over Coastal Carolina. Sam Houston didn't even play an OOC out of conference. And let's not forget the fact that NDSU won on the road OOC at Iowa.

2015 McNeese also didn't play anyone of note OOC on the road. Their toughest in-conference game (Sam Houston State) was at home.

2016 JSU also won handily at Liberty.

If NDSU loses at SDSU, this isn't a conversation. Home losses count. They probably cost NDSU the #2 seed last year, if not the #1 seed. If the other wins were being discounted, then NDSU would be behind JMU and The Citadel too.

That being said, this doesn't in anyway indicate that NDSU is no longer the favorite to win it all. Y'all will be alright.

[dewey]

But this loses a little water when you get to JMU and The Citadel because neither has an FCS loss and are behind teams with an FCS loss.

So it is something strange going on.

^^^^This right here. If they are going with that criteria it loses water like you said when it gets to The Citadel and James Madison. Plus then what about Charleston Southern? They basically have the same loss as EWU does to NDSU but also a loss to FBS Florida State (basically the same loss as Jacksonville State).

Dewey

[dewey]

So here's Massey's rankings (http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016) for all the wins that the top 10 teams have:

1. Jacksonville St
2. Sam Houston St
3. Eastern Washington
4. North Dakota St
5. James Madison
6. The Citadel
7. Richmond
8. Chattanooga
9. Charleston Southern
10. Central Arkansas

#1 JSU (7-1)
1. Coastal Carolina (117)
2. Liberty (139)
3. North Alabama (155)
4. Eastern Illinois (180)
5. Tennessee Tech (230)
6. Eastern Kentucky (249)
7. Austin Peay (387)

Loss
1. LSU (10)

#2 SHSU (8-0)
1. Nicholls (174)
2. Lamar (199)
3. Stephen F Austin (203)
4. Houston Baptist (242)
5. Abilene Christian (284)
6. Incarnate Word (315)
7. Texas Southern (405)
8. Oklahoma Panhandle State (429 I think - if NE Oklahoma isn't them they're not rated amongst the 500 teams listed)

Loss
1. None

#3 EWU (7-1)
1. Washington St (17)
2. NDSU (40)3
3. Northern Iowa (113)
4. Montana (123)
5. Northern Arizona (145)
6. Northern Colorado (175)
7. UC Davis (208)
8. Montana St (231)

Loss
1. NDSU (40)

#4 NDSU
1. Iowa (34)
2. Eastern Washington (57)
3. Charleston Southern (97)
4. Western Illinois (106)
5. Northern Iowa (113)
6. Illinois St (128)
7. Missouri St (149)

Loss
1. South Dakota St (91)

#5 JMU
1. UNH (153)
2. Maine (164)
3. W&M (233)
4. UD (247)
5. URI (336)
6. CCSU (398)
7. Moorehead (424)

Loss
1. North Carolina (25)

#6 The Citadel
1. UTC (98)
2. Wofford (137)
3. Mercer (185)
4. Furman (188)
5. G-W (221)
6. WCU (232)
7. ETSU (293)
8. N. Greenvile (341)

Loss
None

#7 Richmond
1. UVA (90)
2. Villanova (136)
3. Albany (167)
4. Colgate (198)
5. Towson (260)
6. Elon (279)
7. Norfolk St. (461)

Loss
1. Stony Brook (178)

#8 Chattanooga
1. Shorter (D2)
2. Presbyterian
3. Furman
4. Samford
5. ETSU
6. Mercer
7. The Citadel
8. VMI
9. Western Carolina
10. Wofford
11. Alabama (FBS)

Loss
1. The Citadel (87)

#9 Charleston Southern
1. NDSU
2. Kentucky State (D2)
3. Florida State (FBS)
4. Monmouth
5. Coastal Carolina
6. Albany State (CANCELED)
7. Presbyterian
8. Bucknell
9. Gardner-Webb
10. Liberty
11. Kennesaw St

Loss
1. Florida St (16)
2. North Dakota St (40)

#10 Central Arkansas
1. Houston Baptist (242)
2. Samford (105)
3. Northwestern State (290)
4. Arkansas State (FBS) (86)
5. Abilene Christian (284)
6. McNeese State (163)
7. Lamar (199)
8. SE Louisiana (165)
9. SF Austin
10. Nichollos
11. Sam Houston State

Loss
1. Samford (105)

I would like to thank the other posters having posted the information and I just compile them. I will add #9 when others post them up:D

Losses have been added per a request from PC.

Dewey

[Professor Chaos]

2015 McNeese also didn't play anyone of note OOC on the road. Their toughest in-conference game (Sam Houston State) was at home.

2016 JSU also won handily at Liberty.

If NDSU loses at SDSU, this isn't a conversation. Home losses count. They probably cost NDSU the #2 seed last year, if not the #1 seed. If the other wins were being discounted, then NDSU would be behind JMU and The Citadel too.

That being said, this doesn't in anyway indicate that NDSU is no longer the favorite to win it all. Y'all will be alright.
NDSU has 3 road wins (@WIU, @UNI, and @Iowa) that are better than JSU's win at Liberty. I'm sorry man but I just don't see how this argument holds any water. You may be right that this is how the committee sees it but my point is that's a bass ackwards way of looking at.

[bostonspider]

The Citadel
1. UTC (98)
2. Wofford (137)
3. Mercer (185)
4. Furman (188)
5. G-W (221)
6. WCU (232)
7. ETSU (293)
8. N. Greenvile (341)

Richmond
1. UVA (90)
2. Villanova (136)
3. Albany (167)
4. Colgate (198)
5. Towson (260)
6. Elon (279)
7. Norfolk St. (461)

JMU
1. UNH (153)
2. Maine (164)
3. W&M (233)
4. UD (247)
5. URI (336)
6. CCSU (398)
7. Moorehead (424)

Dewey

Didn't I just post that??

[dewey]

Didn't I just post that??

I am working on compiling all top 10 teams. I just grabbed your list first.

Dewey

[Bison56]

UND is #1 (or maybe #30). And I could be RIGHT!

This WHOLE thread is all a cluster****** about HOME field in the playoffs. Nobody is making a strong argument about the 10 teams flat out being wrong. Another 14 are gonna join them and fight it out. A couple of locations make for a strong home field, but going to the FDome or the Inferno is the whole point of finding the best. Everyone please take a chill pill.

Heard you the first time.xbangx

[dudeitsaid]

Okay so if you compare wins does EWU have 3 wins as good as the 3 NDSU has with: Iowa, EWU, and CSU?

NDSU should be number 1. I don't gripe about EWU yet, but if they beat Cal Poly, I may. And if EWU wins out, they would deserve to be one of the top two, IMO. If NDSU wins out, they should be number 1, without a doubt. However, if both Jax St and SHSU win their remaining games, I have a feeling nothing will change with their rankings.

[YoUDeeMan]

No. And if both win out, NDSU would still have a slightly better resume.

Iowa, EWU, CSU, WIU, YSU

Vs

Wazzu, UNI, Montana, Poly, NAU


JFC, kalm...UNI is NOT a good team.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Richmond
1. UVA (90)
2. Villanova (136)
3. Albany (167)
4. Colgate (198)
5. Towson (260)
6. Elon (279)
7. Norfolk St. (461)

JSU
1. Coastal Carolina (117)
2. Liberty (139)
3. North Alabama (155)
4. Eastern Illinois (180)
5. Tennessee Tech (230)
6. Eastern Kentucky (249)
7. Austin Peay (387)

So the questions start to become, "Is 0-8 Austin Peay better than 2-6 Norfolk State?" when it comes to evaluating these schedules or getting numeric values for SOS or "quality wins"... or you could just eyeball the schedule and say "gee both teams are really bad" and put them at about level in terms of "quality win".

Do that with Coastal Carolina and UVA, though... brother, it ain't close. The win over UVA was way more impressive on every level that Jax beating Coastal. I don't need any math to tell me that.

[Professor Chaos]

NDSU should be number 1. I don't gripe about EWU yet, but if they beat Cal Poly, I may. And if EWU wins out, they would deserve to be one of the top two, IMO. If NDSU wins out, they should be number 1, without a doubt. However, if both Jax St and SHSU win their remaining games, I have a feeling nothing will change with their rankings.
I think most of us Bison bellyachers (yes, I'm one of them) wouldn't be nearly as frustrated if EWU was the only team ahead of NDSU. There's an argument that EWU's loss to NDSU does more for them then NDSU's win over EWU does and Wazzu continues to make EWU look better. It's the two team above both EWU and NDSU that are in the focus of our crosshairs.


JFC, kalm...UNI is NOT a good team.
UNI is a much better team than anything SHSU has played to this point.


So the questions start to become, "Is 0-8 Austin Peay better than 2-6 Norfolk State?" when it comes to evaluating these schedules or getting numeric values for SOS or "quality wins"... or you could just eyeball the schedule and say "gee both teams are really bad" and put them at about level in terms of "quality win".

Do that with Coastal Carolina and UVA, though... brother, it ain't close. The win over UVA was way more impressive on every level that Jax beating Coastal. I don't need any math to tell me that.
Don't kid yourself... Richmond's convincing loss to Stony Brook isn't included in those numbers.

[BEAR]

UCA Ranking for the year:

UCA
1. Houston Baptist (242)...won by 43
2. Samford (105)... lost by 5 (4 turnovers doomed us)
3. NWST (290)...won by 14 (two turnovers in first half plus missed field goal. Gotta get those points!)
4. Arkansas State (86)...won by 5
5. ACU (284)...won by 31
6. McNeese (163)...won by 35 (2 scores in first quarter we didn't get)
7. Lamar (199)..won by 10 ( 1 missed score and two turnovers in 2nd qtr on scoring drives screwed us. )
8. SLU (165)..won by 35

Not sure what to make of it. Held court with higher ranked teams Samford and Arkansas State. Our offense has got to get it together.
UCA has offense ranking 110, defense ranking 65th, Schedule ranking 162.
SHSU has offense ranking 33, defense ranking 209. Schedule ranking 224.

The Bipolar SLC. xlolx

[sgt smash]

Didn't y'all play Incarnate Word and Ferris State recently?


Yes, right after wins against K-State and Iowa State.

[Gangtackle11]

I have to say that I would rank NDSU & EWU 1 & 2. Looks like the committee is forcing NDSU to defend their titles away from Fargo in the semis.

[Bisonator]

Pfffft. Obviously you haven't paid attention. The UNI thing has been beaten into the dirt that they aren't good, SDSU is next to go down as a complete trash team. What an awful loss for NDSU. Truly embarrassing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yet another reason to hate the Jacks!xshakefistx

[Sammy94]

Yes, right after wins against K-State and Iowa State.

Yep but NDSU is not above scheduling the weak SLC and D2 cupcakes also. Its not like we didn't want to play our FBS paycheck this year but as you can tell those wins or losses don't do a thing for you.

[dewey]

Looks like the committee is forcing NDSU to defend their titles away from Fargo in the semis.

This very well could be. I have no issue with an NDSU team that can run the ball and is good on the OL and DL going on the road.

Dewey

[MR. CHICKEN]

.......E. WASHINGTON'S OT LOSS..... IN FARGO TO #1......TRUMPS......NORFF DAKOTA STATES LOSS...TA #11/12 (AT DUH TIME)....'JACKS.......ALSO IN FARG0.......AWK!

[dewey]

JFC, kalm...UNI is NOT a good team.

UNI was top when they played and that is what we were comparing (good wins at the time of the win).

Dewey

[dewey]

.......E. WASHINGTON'S OT LOSS..... IN FARGO TO #1......TRUMPS......NORFF DAKOTA STATES LOSS...TA #11/12 (AT DUH TIME)....'JACKS.......ALSO IN FARG0.......AWK!

I understand that argument and have no issue with Eastern Washington being above NDSU (EWU is #1 and NDSU #2 for that reasoning).

How does JSU and SHSU get to #1 and #2 then?

Dewey

[Bisonator]

JFC, kalm...UNI is NOT a good team.
OK so who are the good teams that SHSU has beaten? I'll hang up and listen.xcoffeex

[Professor Chaos]

So here's Massey's rankings (http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016) for all the wins that the top 10 teams have:

...

I would like to thank the other posters having posted the information and I just compile them.

I will add #9 and #10 when others post them up:D

Dewey
I'd say if we're going to include all 10 teams it might be useful to add losses for "full disclosure".

#1 JSU
1. LSU (10)

#2 SHSU
None

#3 EWU
1. North Dakota St (40)

#4 NDSU
1. South Dakota St (91)

#5 JMU
1. North Carolina (25)

#6 The Citadel
None

#7 Richmond
1. Stony Brook (178)

#8 Chattanooga
1. The Citadel (87)

#9 Charleston Southern
1. Florida St (16)
2. North Dakota St (40)

#10 Central Arkansas
1. Samford (105)

[BadlandsGrizFan]

2015 McNeese also didn't play anyone of note OOC on the road. Their toughest in-conference game (Sam Houston State) was at home.

2016 JSU also won handily at Liberty.

If NDSU loses at SDSU, this isn't a conversation. Home losses count. They probably cost NDSU the #2 seed last year, if not the #1 seed. If the other wins were being discounted, then NDSU would be behind JMU and The Citadel too.
That being said, this doesn't in anyway indicate that NDSU is no longer the favorite to win it all. Y'all will be alright.

All true...does it really matter where EWU plays tho??? The only home field advantage they get by staying on the inferno is the other team has to spend a night in Spokompton the night before.........EWUs best advantage is that theyre likely just more talented than whomever they will be playing..... playing on that high school field in cheney means nothing for them. I feel like theres maybe only 20 teams in the fcs here home field really matters.

[BisonTru]

Didn't y'all play Incarnate Word and Ferris State recently?

We did. We've got Robert Morris and MVSU next year. Hopefully we can get out of the EWU game so we can fill it with a quality OOC.

**** football,
Sincerely this hack of a committee

[dudeitsaid]

UNI is a much better team than anything SHSU has played to this point.



I don't know if we can trust this comment. What metrics would you use to justify this statement?
For me, I think we need to consult Cluck U's "eye test". Apparently it is the most infallible system for determining the strength and quality of FCS teams this year. My guess is it is the very thing the committee consulted before doing their rankings. xsmiley_wix

[Professor Chaos]

Brian Hutchinson, AD for Morehead St and selection committee chair in on AM1660 in Fargo right now.

Listen live: http://radio.securenetsystems.net/v5/KQWBAM

[Drblankstare]

Everyone relax, the Committee just wants NDSU to play this one on Legendary mode to up the degree of difficulty.

[Professor Chaos]

Interesting... "no conversation at all" between the selection committee members themselves before voting on these rankings. They only talked to their corresponding regional committees to this point and then voted accordingly.

Another interesting comment: "I guarantee you the ADs on this committee will look deeper into each team before the final selections are determined".

[No_Skill]

Yes, right after wins against K-State and Iowa State.

Hey that's right. I can't remember, did they score 50 on us?

[dudeitsaid]

All true...does it really matter where EWU plays tho??? The only home field advantage they get by staying on the inferno is the other team has to spend a night in Spokompton the night before.........EWUs best advantage is that theyre likely just more talented than whomever they will be playing..... playing on that high school field in cheney means nothing for them. I feel like theres maybe only 20 teams in the fcs here home field really matters.

Hey, it may be our only advantage...but it's worth at least a six points.

[Bisonator]

Interesting... "no conversation at all" between the selection committee members themselves before voting on these rankings. They only talked to their corresponding regional committees to this point and then voted accordingly.

Another interesting comment: "I guarantee you the ADs on this committee will look deeper into each team before the final selections are determined".
So basically:http://www.menemshagroup.com/Portals/133175/images/darts-blindfolded.jpg

[MR. CHICKEN]

.....NORFF DAKOTAH STATE.....WOOD RUN THRU...DUH SOUFFLAND...SKED....IN SAME MANNER......AS SAM STATE.....POLLSTERS BELIEVE 'KATS ARE REAL...PRETTY OBVIOUS DEY ARE.....CAIN'T DENY....BIZONSSSSS SKED....TOUGHER DEN HENRIETTAH'S....LIVER & ONION DINNER......BUT BIZON FANS PROMISED...DUH DAY....YA'S SLIPPED IN POLL....YA'D...HANDLE IT WHIFF CLASS...AN' ACCEPT IT......WELL?

[Professor Chaos]

So basically:http://www.menemshagroup.com/Portals/133175/images/darts-blindfolded.jpg
Yep, he even said that before the next rankings come out there will be "extensive conversation" comparing these teams. So pretty much this first round of rankings was "a baseline" that can easily shift. I kinda question why they released them then.

[Daytripper]

Interesting... "no conversation at all" between the selection committee members themselves before voting on these rankings. They only talked to their corresponding regional committees to this point and then voted accordingly.

Another interesting comment: "I guarantee you the ADs on this committee will look deeper into each team before the final selections are determined".

https://media.giphy.com/media/BSfaQwnMxZWG4/giphy.gif

[ElCid]

So let me get this straight - you're saying that SOS should matter for the committee, until it doesn't?

I think everyone can agree that games on the road vs. Washington, Virginia and LSU are "tough", and games at home vs. Arkansas-Monticello, Morehead State and URI are "not tough". But how much of a numeric SOS ranking is based on that one 70-ish point SOS outlying data point? And, more importantly, how does it affect other ratings?

When you go through a fine-toothed comb on both JSU's and Richmond's schedule, you see a schedule that is shockingly even, with Albany/UT Martin and Stony Brook/EIU literally right next to each other in Sagarin. So why is JSU's SOS a full five points higher than Richmond? Because LSU's schedule is deemed harder than Virginia's.

An important element of this is JSU's "win" over Coastal Carolina. They are NOT an FBS team. They are an FCS team, and a win over them isn't nearly as impressive as a win over Villanova.

So what do you do? Do you go with an obviously imperfect model that puts JSU's schedule a full five points stronger than Richmond's for no real good FCS-level reason? Or throw it out and go completely subjective? There is no good answer.

I didn't say it matters until it doesn't. I said it is a data point that needs to be taken with all other factors as well. A complete picture needs to be viewed and SOS is one part.

I do get what you are saying but once you have a frame for the SOS, we just need to use our judgment. An objective data point is just that. You originally said that Richmond's schedule was by far harder than JSU's. That simply is not true by one of the few objective means we have for comparison. Yes, LSU's strength pushed them higher. But if we knock out the top JSU opponent, then why can't we knock out the highest Richmond one? Maybe we can knock out JMU's UNC game. Do they deserve a boost for that? Did CSU deserve a boost for FSU? You just don't do it. JSU had to travel to LSU, just like Richmond traveled to UVA and all the other FSC teams that played FBS. They had to play them and get beat up a bit. It all adds up in the end.

But I see you now say that their schedules are shockingly even, but that a win over CCU is not as impressive as a win over Nova. Really? Please tell me how you came to that conclusion. Villanova is ranked by Massey at 22, CCU at 15. Villanova is ranked by Sagarin at 124 (55.96), CCU is ranked at 129 (55.18)-less than a point difference. Villanova is 6-2 and CCU at 5-2. The victories were both at home. The only thing different is the margin of victory which Richmond takes. At best these games are about even in "impressiveness."

I get the feeling that somehow if the SOS numbers were the other way around it would all of a sudden be the greatest thing and be proof of Richmond's or "fill in the blank" of whatever school someone is arguing for, that they deserve to be where they are. I certainly try to be objective myself and not biased based upon my desires. I personally do not care about either of these teams other than are they where they are supposed to be in regard to my Bulldogs. And since the final SOS has my Bulldogs ahead of both, it must be accurate.xthumbsupx

[Professor Chaos]

Basically the guy is using the cop out response that "he can only speak for himself" so he can't justify the committee's rankings without "making answers up" because they haven't really talked about it as a group yet. xrotatehx

[Daytripper]

Interesting... "no conversation at all" between the selection committee members themselves before voting on these rankings. They only talked to their corresponding regional committees to this point and then voted accordingly.

Another interesting comment: "I guarantee you the ADs on this committee will look deeper into each team before the final selections are determined".

Basically he said they did not do any real research and just followed the STATS and Coaches poll. But now, because of the gnashing and wailing of those who feel wronged, they will adjust the ranking appropriately to sooth the communal rash of Bisonville.

[Professor Chaos]

Basically he said they did not do any real research and just followed the STATS and Coaches poll. But now, because of the gnashing and wailing of those who feel wronged, they will adjust the ranking appropriately to sooth the communal rash of Bisonville.
Trust me, nothing sort of the Bison winning each of their next three games 80-0 and running through the playoffs with no team getting within 35 of them will help that rash.

But yes, your appraisal of the rankings to this point seems very accurate.

[jacksfan29]

We did. We've got Robert Morris and MVSU next year. Hopefully we can get out of the EWU game so we can fill it with a quality OOC.

**** football,
Sincerely this hack of a committee

Just move up the Delaware series, get them on the schedule for next year and you have your third patsy for 2017.

[BEAR]

So do they offer up one of these each week? If so, do they "slot" vote the next week and the week after that? xeyebrowx

[milleniumkat]

Seriously? Do you know anything about The Citadel? I know you guys in the SLC don't really play much defense, but it is hard for a QB to score from the bench....Citadel's O is not designed to throw up a ton of points, if they win by 14 it is a big margin of victory....they hold the ball forever...look at their TOP, if Briscoe scored on every drive you still would only score 42. Citadel would give you 18 minutes and about 6 chances to score.

We scored 63 points in 19 minutes on A UIW. So challenge accepted. So one minute less is about 55 give it take. Citadel is slow and lumbering. They will stroke out by middle of third qtr.


"I may already be inside you"

[sgt smash]

We scored 63 points in 19 minutes on A UIW. So challenge accepted. So one minute less is about 55 give it take. Citadel is slow and lumbering. They will stroke out by middle of third qtr.


"I may already be inside you"

UIW

[ElCid]

The Citadel
1. UTC (98)
2. Wofford (137)
3. Mercer (185)
4. Furman (188)
5. G-W (221)
6. WCU (232)
7. ETSU (293)
8. N. Greenvile (341)

Richmond
1. UVA (90)
2. Villanova (136)
3. Albany (167)
4. Colgate (198)
5. Towson (260)
6. Elon (279)
7. Norfolk St. (461)

JMU
1. UNH (153)
2. Maine (164)
3. W&M (233)
4. UD (247)
5. URI (336)
6. CCSU (398)
7. Moorehead (424)

One thing about using the rank # instead of the raw data, it is not as accurate. It may be good for a big picture, but you may need to dig down a bit more to get a more accurate picture.

For example, if the #100, 101, and 102 teams had raw numbers of 30.1, 30.0, and 10.0 then it might look pretty good to have such a good average of 101, but the average of the raw numbers, the only thing that matters, would be 23.4. That would not look as good. This is an extreme example, but you get the picture. There are a lot of teams that are clumped up and have only minor differences in their raw numbers but great differences in their # rank.

Here is a good actual example, Albany is ranked 167 and Colgate 198. A bit of a difference at 21 spots. But Albany's power rating is 32.35. Colgate's is 31.31. A one point difference. Throw in UNH at 153 and they have a power rating of 33.65. Not a huge difference from Colgate at a little over 2 points in raw data, but fully 45 rank spots over Colgate. I have been trying to get away from just looking at the rank# as a result.

Hope that made sense.

[Bisonator]

So do they offer up one of these each week? If so, do they "slot" vote the next week and the week after that? xeyebrowx

From what I heard is they basically won't do any group discussions really until the actual PO selection and seeding. So they will just keep putting out trash to rile people. They are trolling us. xlolx

[JSUSoutherner]

So, I went and checked the Massey rankings.

UVA is 89. #90 is SDSU. #88 is YSU. Interesting.

[Professor Chaos]

So do they offer up one of these each week? If so, do they "slot" vote the next week and the week after that? xeyebrowx
Yes and no, based on what the committee chair just said. They'll release another ranking next Thursday and there will be "extensive discussion" between the selection committee members themselves comparing and contrasting the contending teams. He said that while these first rankings are a baseline they are subject to change based on that discussion and what happens over the last 3 weeks of the season.

[YoUDeeMan]

Where do you think WIU and YSU should be? Legitimately asking.

I don't think YSU is top 20....probably just outside the top 20.

Their QB, Davis, isn't impressive. He can run and does a decent job with the read option. But, in the passing game when he is pressured (YSU can run block well enough, but their pass blocking is suspect so he ends pressured too often), decides to run too early...probably because he'd rather run than throw from the get go. He doesn't throw a good pass, is not very accurate, and he makes some judgement errors that will result in turnovers against a good secondary. Frankly, the YSU receivers are sub par...bad hands (some of those drops might have something to do with the QBs throws), and they don't run routes very well. There is nothing special about the YSU offense.

All in all, no one should fear facing the YSU offense. Stuff their run, make them throw, and they won't win many games.

Their defense looks good. The key to their whole defense is the two DEs that cause enough havoc to allow YSU to cheat towards short pass routes and the run. #11 is a handful off the edge, has good speed and can cover most RBs for a short time out of the backfield. The other DE, #9, gives them two solid QB rushers. Both rely on speed and aren't going to bull rush many OLs. However, their interior DLs are nothing to write home about and can be exploited by a good OL. YSU has a solid DB in #11...big and fast enough. Bishop, on the other side, uses his hands waaaaaaaaaay to often and will get called for it, especially on extended plays. Their CBs play up because their DEs can pressure the QB. While they can defend the run well enough against most teams, I am not sold on their safeties or LBs as pass defenders.

So, if you are a running team without a creative passing game, the YSU D will give you fits. The DEs won't let you get to the edge and the DBs are already there, and the outside LBs have some freedom to roam to find the ball.

The problem YSU's D has is that if you spread them out, and certain teams can, their interior is not good enough to stop a good run game. I wanted to watch the YSU-SDSU game, but I can't get it to play on ESPN3. That would be the best match up, although SDSU only has a few good receivers, not a fleet of them. And SDSU could use some help on their OL. I saw YSU's D try to defend 3 wide outs on one side a couple times in two other games and was surprised to see YSU, several times, not match up numbers on that side. They were willing to concede the 5-7 yard pass. SHSU or some other smart team like EWU, will absolutely kill that defense and it won't be funny. That is the gamble most teams take...they figure you might take the easy pass a couple times, but they'll stay in their base defense hoping you'll get bored and then try to go into their teeth. Good OCs simply throw that thinking out the door and keep taking what you are giving until you move your players to stop them. then, they go where the new weakness is. YSU, spread out, doesn't have the talent in their interior to stop a good running game.

NDSU should beat YSU because YSU isn't going to be able to move the ball much.

WIU? I'll watch more film, but from what little I've seen, I don't think they belong among the elite.

[jacksfan29]

This is why I really want them to send SDSU south or east in the playoffs, it won't happen. Instead they will put NDSU, EWU, SDSU, UND, Cal Poly on the same side of the bracket. I would absolutely love to go down to Texas or Arkansas instead of North Dakota or Washington.

FYI, the Bison; who aren't winning big will win a 6th title and they will blow out a Southland or OVC team in the championship game.


Pfffft. Obviously you haven't paid attention. The UNI thing has been beaten into the dirt that they aren't good, SDSU is next to go down as a complete trash team. What an awful loss for NDSU. Truly embarrassing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Daytripper]

Yes and no, based on what the committee chair just said. They'll release another ranking next Thursday and there will be "extensive discussion" between the selection committee members themselves comparing and contrasting the contending teams. He said that while these first rankings are a baseline they are subject to change based on that discussion and what happens over the last 3 weeks of the season.


Sam Houston must crush McNeese by 5+ touchdowns to keep their #2 ranking. This, I believe. And it still might not be enough.

[jacksfan29]

Maybe you need to watch it. One dimensional SDSU didn't throw the ball all that much against YSU. We ran it.

Please feel free to continue your uninformed rants.


I don't think YSU is top 20....probably just outside the top 20.

Their QB, Davis, isn't impressive. He can run and does a decent job with the read option. But, in the passing game when he is pressured (YSU can run block well enough, but their pass blocking is suspect so he ends pressured too often), decides to run too early...probably because he'd rather run than throw from the get go. He doesn't throw a good pass, is not very accurate, and he makes some judgement errors that will result in turnovers against a good secondary. Frankly, the YSU receivers are sub par...bad hands (some of those drops might have something to do with the QBs throws), and they don't run routes very well. There is nothing special about the YSU offense.

All in all, no one should fear facing the YSU offense. Stuff their run, make them throw, and they won't win many games.

Their defense looks good. The key to their whole defense is the two DEs that cause enough havoc to allow YSU to cheat towards short pass routes and the run. #11 is a handful off the edge, has good speed and can cover most RBs for a short time out of the backfield. The other DE, #9, gives them two solid QB rushers. Both rely on speed and aren't going to bull rush many OLs. However, their interior DLs are nothing to write home about and can be exploited by a good OL. YSU has a solid DB in #11...big and fast enough. Bishop, on the other side, uses his hands waaaaaaaaaay to often and will get called for it, especially on extended plays. Their CBs play up because their DEs can pressure the QB. While they can defend the run well enough against most teams, I am not sold on their safeties or LBs as pass defenders.

So, if you are a running team without a creative passing game, the YSU D will give you fits. The DEs won't let you get to the edge and the DBs are already there, and the outside LBs have some freedom to roam to find the ball.

The problem YSU's D has is that if you spread them out, and certain teams can, their interior is not good enough to stop a good run game. I wanted to watch the YSU-SDSU game, but I can't get it to play on ESPN3. That would be the best match up, although SDSU only has a few good receivers, not a fleet of them. And SDSU could use some help on their OL. I saw YSU's D try to defend 3 wide outs on one side a couple times in two other games and was surprised to see YSU, several times, not match up numbers on that side. They were willing to concede the 5-7 yard pass. SHSU or some other smart team like EWU, will absolutely kill that defense and it won't be funny. That is the gamble most teams take...they figure you might take the easy pass a couple times, but they'll stay in their base defense hoping you'll get bored and then try to go into their teeth. Good OCs simply throw that thinking out the door and keep taking what you are giving until you move your players to stop them. then, they go where the new weakness is. YSU, spread out, doesn't have the talent in their interior to stop a good running game.

NDSU should beat YSU because YSU isn't going to be able to move the ball much.

WIU? I'll watch more film, but from what little I've seen, I don't think they belong among the elite.

[Bison56]

We scored 63 points in 19 minutes on A UIW. So challenge accepted. So one minute less is about 55 give it take. Citadel is slow and lumbering. They will stroke out by middle of third qtr.


"I may already be inside you"
Lol UIW?

[JSUSoutherner]

FYI, the Bison; who aren't winning big will win a 6th title and they will blow out a Southland or OVC team in the championship game.xrolleyesx

[Drblankstare]

I dont know what everyone ones so worked up about. I mean sure, it turns out the committee chair just admitted that they gave almost zero thought to this 1st round of rankings, but they did give a bunch of football nerds a weeks worth of something to argue over. In the end, that is the greatest give we can receive.

[Bison56]

xrolleyesx

Remember JSU didn't play well in Frisco, it had nothing to do with NDSU being a better team. At least that's what the average JSU fan believes.

[Daytripper]

I dont know what everyone ones so worked up about. I mean sure, it turns out the committee chair just admitted that they gave almost zero thought to this 1st round of rankings, but they did give a bunch of football nerds a weeks worth of something to argue over. In the end, that is the greatest give we can receive.

Great spin on this misery of a thread.... and how did you know I was a football nerd?

https://media.giphy.com/media/jyQKWAGAJfa24/giphy.gif

[ElCid]

We scored 63 points in 19 minutes on A UIW. So challenge accepted. So one minute less is about 55 give it take. Citadel is slow and lumbering. They will stroke out by middle of third qtr.


Slow and lumbering? I don't think so, but keep thinking that. You obviously have not seem Cam Jackson or Reggie Williams take one outside and accelerate right through an opponents secondary like they were standing still. Your defense, if you had one, not sure you really do, would be gassed before half time.

[Daytripper]

Slow and lumbering? I don't think so, but keep thinking that. You obviously have not seem Cam Jackson or Reggie Williams take one outside and accelerate right through an opponents secondary like they were standing still. Your defense, if you had one, not sure you really do, would be gassed before half time.

He was trolling you....and it worked.

[YoUDeeMan]

Based on a very limited sample size, that is watching the game with NDSU, I think we would do very similar. I think our offense is very similar and I think our D is better. We will find out a lot about our team when we play UCA, as we will have to compete for 4quarters to have a chance to win. A lot of football to play we shall see. Based on these rankings and games remaining on everyone's schedule, it will be interesting to see what happens is UCA wins the game with us.

- - - Updated - - -


Based on a very limited sample size, that is watching the game with NDSU, I think we would do very similar. I think our offense is very similar and I think our D is better. We will find out a lot about our team when we play UCA, as we will have to compete for 4quarters to have a chance to win. A lot of football to play we shall see. Based on these rankings and games remaining on everyone's schedule, it will be interesting to see what happens is UCA wins the game with us.

You can say that again.

[ElCid]

He was trolling you....and it worked.

I know, that's ok. I needed some trolling. I have been far too sedentary lately.

[TransAmBison]

He was trolling you....and it worked.It was well played...

[Drblankstare]

Great spin on this misery of a thread.... and how did you know I was a football nerd?

https://media.giphy.com/media/jyQKWAGAJfa24/giphy.gif

Its 1 on a Friday and were posting on AGS. We're all nerds here:D

[ElCid]

Its 1 on a Friday and were posting on AGS. We're all nerds here:D

It's either this or clean the garage.

[Thumper 76]

I don't think YSU is top 20....probably just outside the top 20.

Their QB, Davis, isn't impressive. He can run and does a decent job with the read option. But, in the passing game when he is pressured (YSU can run block well enough, but their pass blocking is suspect so he ends pressured too often), decides to run too early...probably because he'd rather run than throw from the get go. He doesn't throw a good pass, is not very accurate, and he makes some judgement errors that will result in turnovers against a good secondary. Frankly, the YSU receivers are sub par...bad hands (some of those drops might have something to do with the QBs throws), and they don't run routes very well. There is nothing special about the YSU offense.

All in all, no one should fear facing the YSU offense. Stuff their run, make them throw, and they won't win many games.

Their defense looks good. The key to their whole defense is the two DEs that cause enough havoc to allow YSU to cheat towards short pass routes and the run. #11 is a handful off the edge, has good speed and can cover most RBs for a short time out of the backfield. The other DE, #9, gives them two solid QB rushers. Both rely on speed and aren't going to bull rush many OLs. However, their interior DLs are nothing to write home about and can be exploited by a good OL. YSU has a solid DB in #11...big and fast enough. Bishop, on the other side, uses his hands waaaaaaaaaay to often and will get called for it, especially on extended plays. Their CBs play up because their DEs can pressure the QB. While they can defend the run well enough against most teams, I am not sold on their safeties or LBs as pass defenders.

So, if you are a running team without a creative passing game, the YSU D will give you fits. The DEs won't let you get to the edge and the DBs are already there, and the outside LBs have some freedom to roam to find the ball.

The problem YSU's D has is that if you spread them out, and certain teams can, their interior is not good enough to stop a good run game. I wanted to watch the YSU-SDSU game, but I can't get it to play on ESPN3. That would be the best match up, although SDSU only has a few good receivers, not a fleet of them. And SDSU could use some help on their OL. I saw YSU's D try to defend 3 wide outs on one side a couple times in two other games and was surprised to see YSU, several times, not match up numbers on that side. They were willing to concede the 5-7 yard pass. SHSU or some other smart team like EWU, will absolutely kill that defense and it won't be funny. That is the gamble most teams take...they figure you might take the easy pass a couple times, but they'll stay in their base defense hoping you'll get bored and then try to go into their teeth. Good OCs simply throw that thinking out the door and keep taking what you are giving until you move your players to stop them. then, they go where the new weakness is. YSU, spread out, doesn't have the talent in their interior to stop a good running game.

NDSU should beat YSU because YSU isn't going to be able to move the ball much.

WIU? I'll watch more film, but from what little I've seen, I don't think they belong among the elite.

So basically there is one boarder line top 10 team and a couple fringe top 25 teams in the MVFC according to you. Can't wait to see the list of teams you have in your top 20 xcoffeex


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JSUSoutherner]

It's either this or clean the garage.
I'm just trying to put off this physics test as long as I can.

[YoUDeeMan]

Nice to see Cluck U getting the attention he gets on here since he gets so little at home.

Tell your mom that leaving her panties here won't entice my 12 year old son. No simply means no.

[JSUSoutherner]

Tell your mom that leaving her panties here won't entice my 12 year old son. No simply means no.
Wow, a guy old enough to have a 12 year old kid making mom jokes. Jesus that's sad.

[ElCid]

I'm just trying to put off this physics test as long as I can.


E=MC2

Now go do it.

[Bison56]

Tell your mom that leaving her panties here won't entice my 12 year old son. No simply means no.

Mom jokes xbowx

[YoUDeeMan]

So let me get this straight - you're saying that SOS should matter for the committee, until it doesn't?

I think everyone can agree that games on the road vs. Washington, Virginia and LSU are "tough", and games at home vs. Arkansas-Monticello, Morehead State and URI are "not tough". But how much of a numeric SOS ranking is based on that one 70-ish point SOS outlying data point? And, more importantly, how does it affect other ratings?

When you go through a fine-toothed comb on both JSU's and Richmond's schedule, you see a schedule that is shockingly even, with Albany/UT Martin and Stony Brook/EIU literally right next to each other in Sagarin. So why is JSU's SOS a full five points higher than Richmond? Because LSU's schedule is deemed harder than Virginia's.

An important element of this is JSU's "win" over Coastal Carolina. They are NOT an FBS team. They are an FCS team, and a win over them isn't nearly as impressive as a win over Villanova.

So what do you do? Do you go with an obviously imperfect model that puts JSU's schedule a full five points stronger than Richmond's for no real good FCS-level reason? Or throw it out and go completely subjective? There is no good answer.

And yee, thinker, shall be banished from the North, forever, for your blasphemy! xspankx

[JSUSoutherner]

E=MC2

Now go do it.
Nahhhh.

[YoUDeeMan]

UND is #1 (or maybe #30). And I could be RIGHT!

This WHOLE thread is all a cluster****** about HOME field in the playoffs. Nobody is making a strong argument about the 10 teams flat out being wrong. Another 14 are gonna join them and fight it out. A couple of locations make for a strong home field, but going to the FDome or the Inferno is the whole point of finding the best. Everyone please take a chill pill.

It's deja vu all over again, again.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Let's just cut the playoffs back to 4 teams. Simplify things a little bit.

[Bison56]

It's deja vu all over again, again.

You should say something funny about his mom.xthumbsupx

[YoUDeeMan]

UNI was top when they played and that is what we were comparing (good wins at the time of the win).

Dewey

No...UNI was ranked high, but they were not a good team.

Someone mentioned that the 2006 Bison beat a 21st ranked GSU team. WTF? GSU finished 3-8 that year. They might have been ranked 21st at the time they played the Bison, but in no way shape or form was GSU the 21st ranked team in the country.

I've watched several UNI games and they are not a good team. What is funny as hell is that their own fans will tell you they aren't a good team, and yet others, struggling to gain some validation of their victory, will still try to hold UNI up as some sort of trophy.

You shot Bambi...don't try to take credit for Godzilla.

[dewey]

So here's Massey's rankings (http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016) for all the wins that the top 10 teams have:

1. Jacksonville St
2. Sam Houston St
3. Eastern Washington
4. North Dakota St
5. James Madison
6. The Citadel
7. Richmond
8. Chattanooga
9. Charleston Southern
10. Central Arkansas

#1 JSU (7-1)
1. Coastal Carolina (117)
2. Liberty (139)
3. North Alabama (155)
4. Eastern Illinois (180)
5. Tennessee Tech (230)
6. Eastern Kentucky (249)
7. Austin Peay (387)

Loss
1. LSU (10)

#2 SHSU (8-0)
1. Nicholls (174)
2. Lamar (199)
3. Stephen F Austin (203)
4. Houston Baptist (242)
5. Abilene Christian (284)
6. Incarnate Word (315)
7. Texas Southern (405)
8. Oklahoma Panhandle State (429 I think - if NE Oklahoma isn't them they're not rated amongst the 500 teams listed)

Loss
1. None

#3 EWU (7-1)
1. Washington St (17)
2. NDSU (40)3
3. Northern Iowa (113)
4. Montana (123)
5. Northern Arizona (145)
6. Northern Colorado (175)
7. UC Davis (208)
8. Montana St (231)

Loss
1. NDSU (40)

#4 NDSU (7-1)
1. Iowa (34)
2. Eastern Washington (57)
3. Charleston Southern (97)
4. Western Illinois (106)
5. Northern Iowa (113)
6. Illinois St (128)
7. Missouri St (149)

Loss
1. South Dakota St (91)

#5 JMU (7-1)
1. UNH (153)
2. Maine (164)
3. W&M (233)
4. UD (247)
5. URI (336)
6. CCSU (398)
7. Moorehead (424)

Loss
1. North Carolina (25)

#6 The Citadel (8-0)
1. UTC (98)
2. Wofford (137)
3. Mercer (185)
4. Furman (188)
5. G-W (221)
6. WCU (232)
7. ETSU (293)
8. N. Greenvile (341)

Loss
None

#7 Richmond (7-1)
1. UVA (90)
2. Villanova (136)
3. Albany (167)
4. Colgate (198)
5. Towson (260)
6. Elon (279)
7. Norfolk St. (461)

Loss
1. Stony Brook (178)

#8 Chattanooga (8-1)
1. Shorter (D2)
2. Presbyterian
3. Furman
4. Samford
5. ETSU
6. Mercer
7. The Citadel
8. VMI
9. Western Carolina
10. Wofford
11. Alabama (FBS)

Loss
1. The Citadel (87)

#9 Charleston Southern (5-2)
1. NDSU
2. Kentucky State (D2)
3. Florida State (FBS)
4. Monmouth
5. Coastal Carolina
6. Albany State (CANCELED)
7. Presbyterian
8. Bucknell
9. Gardner-Webb
10. Liberty
11. Kennesaw St

Loss
1. Florida St (16)
2. North Dakota St (40)

#10 Central Arkansas (7-1)
1. Houston Baptist (242)
2. Samford (105)
3. Northwestern State (290)
4. Arkansas State (FBS) (86)
5. Abilene Christian (284)
6. McNeese State (163)
7. Lamar (199)
8. SE Louisiana (165)
9. SF Austin
10. Nichollos
11. Sam Houston State

Loss
1. Samford (105)

I would like to thank the other posters having posted the information and I just compile them. Losses have been added. Can someone add the Massey rankings for #9 Charleston Southern?

Thanks.

Dewey

[YoUDeeMan]

Just move up the Delaware series, get them on the schedule for next year and you have your third patsy for 2017.

Not so fast...we removed our coach and will have a new set of coaches soon. We have no QB, we have a power running game, and we have a slow, but dependable defense, so we should be able to match up with most MVFC teams next year. In fact, we'll probably get an honorary invitation to the MVFC.

However, if we get a QB and an OC, and one WR, we'll be right there with NDSU. xthumbsupx

[dewey]

No...UNI was ranked high, but they were not a good team.

Someone mentioned that the 2006 Bison beat a 21st ranked GSU team. WTF? GSU finished 3-8 that year. They might have been ranked 21st at the time they played the Bison, but in no way shape or form was GSU the 21st ranked team in the country.

I've watched several UNI games and they are not a good team. What is funny as hell is that their own fans will tell you they aren't a good team, and yet others, struggling to gain some validation of their victory, will still try to hold UNI up as some sort of trophy.

You shot Bambi...don't try to take credit for Godzilla.

OK. So should good wins only be compiled at the end of the year when the final regular season rankings are done?

Dewey

[Professor Chaos]

No...UNI was ranked high, but they were not a good team.

Someone mentioned that the 2006 Bison beat a 21st ranked GSU team. WTF? GSU finished 3-8 that year. They might have been ranked 21st at the time they played the Bison, but in no way shape or form was GSU the 21st ranked team in the country.

I've watched several UNI games and they are not a good team. What is funny as hell is that their own fans will tell you they aren't a good team, and yet others, struggling to gain some validation of their victory, will still try to hold UNI up as some sort of trophy.

You shot Bambi...don't try to take credit for Godzilla.
You know I remember back in 1952 someone mentioned that Delaware beat Rutgers, who was ranked 3rd at the time right below Yale and Princeton....

UNI isn't a world beating win but if SHSU had a win against UNI would be far and away their best win. If JSU would have a UNI win it would be their 2nd best win. As it sits they're NDSU's 5th best win and EWU's 3rd best win. It's not meant to be proof that UNI is that good, it's proof that they're better than most everything on JSU and SHSU's schedules so far this year.

[Bisonator]

No...UNI was ranked high, but they were not a good team.

Someone mentioned that the 2006 Bison beat a 21st ranked GSU team. WTF? GSU finished 3-8 that year. They might have been ranked 21st at the time they played the Bison, but in no way shape or form was GSU the 21st ranked team in the country.

I've watched several UNI games and they are not a good team. What is funny as hell is that their own fans will tell you they aren't a good team, and yet others, struggling to gain some validation of their victory, will still try to hold UNI up as some sort of trophy.

You shot Bambi...don't try to take credit for Godzilla.
This is basically what we are trying to get you and the other SHSU fans to realize. Glad you're finally starting to get the picture.xrolleyesx

[clenz]

UNI was top when they played and that is what we were comparing (good wins at the time of the win).

Dewey
Doesn't matter.

Retrospectively it's not a good win.

UNI isn't a good team.

People need to stop trying to spin them into one.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Doesn't matter.

Retrospectively it's not a good win.

UNI isn't a good team.

People need to stop trying to spin them into one.

This. UNI should not be a good win for anyone. Not for EWU not for NDSU not for anyone. We are 3-5 with an outside chance of finishing with our worst record in a long long time. I guess technically NDSU's win over UNI is slightly better since it was on the road and EWU was at home, but it isn't a good win by any means.

[Mayville Bison]

So basically there is one boarder line top 10 team and a couple fringe top 25 teams in the MVFC according to you. Can't wait to see the list of teams you have in your top 20 xcoffeex


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I've been asking for his top 25 for a few weeks now and haven't received a response. Hopefully, you get one as I need a good laugh on a Friday.

These selection committee rankings are yesterday's news. Cluck U's rankings are the next big thing!

[YoUDeeMan]

Maybe you need to watch it. One dimensional SDSU didn't throw the ball all that much against YSU. We ran it.

Please feel free to continue your uninformed rants.



st and 10 at SDSU25
Taryn Christion pass complete to Dallas Goedert for 61 yards to the YSU14, 1ST DOWN SDSU (Dortch, Nate).


1st and 10 at YSU14
Taryn Christion pass complete to BradyMengarelli for 6 yards to the YSU8 (Dortch, Nate).


2nd and 4 at YSU08
Taryn Christion pass complete to Jake Wieneke for 4 yards to the YSU4, 1ST DOWN SDSU (Smith, Jameel).


1st and Goal at YSU04
Taryn Christion rush for 2 yards to the YSU2 (Dellovade, A.;Bishop, Kenny).


2nd and Goal at YSU02
BradyMengarelli rush for 2 yards to the YSU0, TOUCHDOWN, clock 12:22.



Chase Vinatieri kick attempt good.



Youngstown State 0, South Dakota State 7


5 plays, 75 yards, 2:38 elapsed



SOUTH DAKOTA STATE AT 11:17


1st and Goal at YSU04
SOUTH DAKOTA STATE drive start at 11:17.


1st and Goal at YSU04
Taryn Christion pass complete to Connor Landberg for 4 yards to the YSU0, TOUCHDOWN, clock 11:12.



Chase Vinatieri kick attempt good.



Youngstown State 0, South Dakota State 14


1 plays, 4 yards, 0:05 elapsed




SOUTH DAKOTA STATE AT 02:22


1st and 10 at SDSU50
SOUTH DAKOTA STATE drive start at 02:22.


1st and 10 at SDSU50
Taryn Christion pass complete to Marquise Lewis for 27 yards to the YSU23, 1ST DOWN SDSU (Dortch, Nate).


1st and 10 at YSU23
Taryn Christion pass complete to Jake Wieneke for 13 yards to the YSU10, 1ST DOWN SDSU (Bishop, Kenny).


1st and Goal at YSU10
Taryn Christion pass incomplete to Adam Anderson (Thompson, Eric), PENALTY YSU pass interference (Thompson, Eric) 8 yards to the YSU2, 1ST DOWN SDSU, NO PLAY.


1st and Goal at YSU02
Taryn Christion rush for loss of 1 yard to the YSU3 (Moss, Avery).


2nd and Goal at YSU03
Taryn Christion pass incomplete to Dallas Goedert (Moss, Avery).


3rd and Goal at YSU03
Taryn Christion pass incomplete to Jake Wieneke.


4th and Goal at YSU03
Chase Vinatieri field goal attempt from 20 GOOD, clock 00:25.



Youngstown State 3, South Dakota State 17


6 plays, 47 yards, 1:57 elapsed










Hmmmmm...gosh, the first quarter...how did SDSU get the lead?

Let me think....

Still thinking...

Still thinking....

Wait...don't help me...I think it begins with a P.

And, at the start of the half, with a 17-3 lead...YSU coughs up the ball in their own territory. Two long...wait for it...runs...put SDSU on the 3, and two plays later, SDSU scores on a ru....wait! A PASS!

Now, if a team is up 24-3 on YSU, a team with no offense, what do you think they will do for the rest of the game?

Let me think...

Still thinking...

Still thinking...

Wait...don't help me...I think it begins with an R.

So maybe the stats guys were wrong and you got the lead by running. You should call them up and explain their mistake.

What I would really like to know is what kind of formation were you in with those two runs...and what kind of runs were they? My guess is that you lined up in a smash mouth, power I, right? xlolx

[mamberso]

Remember JSU didn't play well in Frisco, it had nothing to do with NDSU being a better team. At least that's what the average JSU fan believes.

The consensus among logical JSU fans is that NDSU had the better team and cleaned our clocks that day. One team looked like they had been there before, and one didn’t.

[clenz]

OK. So should good wins only be compiled at the end of the year when the final regular season rankings are done?

Dewey
The "good win" list is fluid and should change as the year goes on.

I firmly believe UNI is a one loss team with JSU's schedule and undefeted with SHSUs. But they don't play that schedule. Hell, I think UD would have a pretty damn good record with that schedule.

That doesn't make UNI a good win. What UNI was ranked 3 months ago shouldn't have any bearing on the win. It's not as though UNI has been decimated by injuries meaning this isn't the same UNI team. This team is mostly healthy (as healthy as you can be in week 10). This just isn't a good team.

[Professor Chaos]

I firmly believe UNI is a one loss team with JSU's schedule and undefeted with SHSUs. But they don't play that schedule.

Nail hit on the head right there. That's why I have a hard time justifying JSU and SHSU as 1/2. If you flip the script and have either of those teams play a schedule like UNI's or NDSU's are they 3-5 like UNI right now or 7-1 like NDSU (or even 8-0)? We just don't know.

[fmrbearkat]

The "good win" list is fluid and should change as the year goes on.

I firmly believe UNI is a one loss team with JSU's schedule and undefeted with SHSUs. But they don't play that schedule. Hell, I think UD would have a pretty damn good record with that schedule.

That doesn't make UNI a good win. What UNI was ranked 3 months ago shouldn't have any bearing on the win. It's not as though UNI has been decimated by injuries meaning this isn't the same UNI team. This team is mostly healthy (as healthy as you can be in week 10). This just isn't a good team.

they may go undefeated with our schedule but smart money says they do it 30-14 or 28-10. Not out scoring their opponents 270 whatever to 50 whatever in the first half before we put the backups in early in the 3rd. Yall just turn on ESPN 3 Saturday at 6 and ask yourself how many teams could look that good playing against a high school team much less an fcs team.

If your not impressed you might be a midwesterner who thinks the 85' bears were the last REAL pro team, the steelers throw to much, or the Viking under utilize Adrian Peterson.

Some notes to watch for:

the number of OL and DL that take snaps
how many different WR's catch passes
the yards after catch is mind blowing
how many running back me get touches and the yards per carry of each
the first group defense is actually pretty good

#yeswewilldothattoyourteamtoo

[TransAmBison]

they may go undefeated with our schedule but smart money says they do it 30-14 or 28-10. Not out scoring their opponents 270 whatever to 50 whatever in the first half before we put the backups in early in the 3rd. Yall just turn on ESPN 3 Saturday at 6 and ask yourself how many teams could look that good playing against a high school team much less an fcs team.

If your not impressed you might be a midwesterner who thinks the 85' bears were the last REAL pro team, the steelers throw to much, or the Viking under utilize Adrian Peterson.

Some notes to watch for:

the number of OL and DL that take snaps
how many different WR's catch passes
the yards after catch is mind blowing
how many running back me get touches and the yards per carry of each
the first group defense is actually pretty good

#yeswewilldothattoyourteamtoo

This is too cute. I love it when fans of teams that don't play defense think won't be stopped.

[Bisonator]

they may go undefeated with our schedule but smart money says they do it 30-14 or 28-10. Not out scoring their opponents 270 whatever to 50 whatever in the first half before we put the backups in early in the 3rd. Yall just turn on ESPN 3 Saturday at 6 and ask yourself how many teams could look that good playing against a high school team much less an fcs team.

If your not impressed you might be a midwesterner who thinks the 85' bears were the last REAL pro team, the steelers throw to much, or the Viking under utilize Adrian Peterson.

Some notes to watch for:

the number of OL and DL that take snaps
how many different WR's catch passes
the yards after catch is mind blowing
how many running back me get touches and the yards per carry of each
the first group defense is actually pretty good

#yeswewilldothattoyourteamtoo
https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--jiX7vu-o--/c_fill,fl_progressive,g_center,h_180,q_80,w_320/18j4ol3i3mu4djpg.jpg

[TransAmBison]

https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--jiX7vu-o--/c_fill,fl_progressive,g_center,h_180,q_80,w_320/18j4ol3i3mu4djpg.jpgAnd that was just the beginning...that was when they still played defense.

[BEAR]

Uh oh...Massey Ratings went from giving UCA a 48% chance of beating SHSU to now a 58% chance...xlolx

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=23804&stc=1

[jacksfan29]

st and 10 at SDSU25
Taryn Christion pass complete to Dallas Goedert for 61 yards to the YSU14, 1ST DOWN SDSU (Dortch, Nate).


1st and 10 at YSU14
Taryn Christion pass complete to BradyMengarelli for 6 yards to the YSU8 (Dortch, Nate).


2nd and 4 at YSU08
Taryn Christion pass complete to Jake Wieneke for 4 yards to the YSU4, 1ST DOWN SDSU (Smith, Jameel).


1st and Goal at YSU04
Taryn Christion rush for 2 yards to the YSU2 (Dellovade, A.;Bishop, Kenny).


2nd and Goal at YSU02
BradyMengarelli rush for 2 yards to the YSU0, TOUCHDOWN, clock 12:22.



Chase Vinatieri kick attempt good.



Youngstown State 0, South Dakota State 7


5 plays, 75 yards, 2:38 elapsed



SOUTH DAKOTA STATE AT 11:17


1st and Goal at YSU04
SOUTH DAKOTA STATE drive start at 11:17.


1st and Goal at YSU04
Taryn Christion pass complete to Connor Landberg for 4 yards to the YSU0, TOUCHDOWN, clock 11:12.



Chase Vinatieri kick attempt good.



Youngstown State 0, South Dakota State 14


1 plays, 4 yards, 0:05 elapsed




SOUTH DAKOTA STATE AT 02:22


1st and 10 at SDSU50
SOUTH DAKOTA STATE drive start at 02:22.


1st and 10 at SDSU50
Taryn Christion pass complete to Marquise Lewis for 27 yards to the YSU23, 1ST DOWN SDSU (Dortch, Nate).


1st and 10 at YSU23
Taryn Christion pass complete to Jake Wieneke for 13 yards to the YSU10, 1ST DOWN SDSU (Bishop, Kenny).


1st and Goal at YSU10
Taryn Christion pass incomplete to Adam Anderson (Thompson, Eric), PENALTY YSU pass interference (Thompson, Eric) 8 yards to the YSU2, 1ST DOWN SDSU, NO PLAY.


1st and Goal at YSU02
Taryn Christion rush for loss of 1 yard to the YSU3 (Moss, Avery).


2nd and Goal at YSU03
Taryn Christion pass incomplete to Dallas Goedert (Moss, Avery).


3rd and Goal at YSU03
Taryn Christion pass incomplete to Jake Wieneke.


4th and Goal at YSU03
Chase Vinatieri field goal attempt from 20 GOOD, clock 00:25.



Youngstown State 3, South Dakota State 17


6 plays, 47 yards, 1:57 elapsed









Hmmmmm...gosh, the first quarter...how did SDSU get the lead?

Let me think....

Still thinking...

Still thinking....

Wait...don't help me...I think it begins with a P.

And, at the start of the half, with a 17-3 lead...YSU coughs up the ball in their own territory. Two long...wait for it...runs...put SDSU on the 3, and two plays later, SDSU scores on a ru....wait! A PASS!

Now, if a team is up 24-3 on YSU, a team with no offense, what do you think they will do for the rest of the game?

Let me think...

Still thinking...

Still thinking...

Wait...don't help me...I think it begins with an R.

So maybe the stats guys were wrong and you got the lead by running. You should call them up and explain their mistake.

What I would really like to know is what kind of formation were you in with those two runs...and what kind of runs were they? My guess is that you lined up in a smash mouth, power I, right? xlolx

Again, you prove your a moron. What were the final stats. You stated we are one dimensional, with "a few good receivers" but not a slew of them (dumb comment of the day) who can't run the ball. I'm not saying we are a smash mouth running team but yet somehow we were able to run the ball against YSU. A team that you said had to be spread out yet somehow we spent 3/4 of the game not spreading them out. Yes YSU don't have a great offense though they do have two backs who are better than anything the Hens can put on the field. Why do I have a feeling your a pimpled faced kid typing on your computer in your parents basement.

[UNIFanSince1983]

they may go undefeated with our schedule but smart money says they do it 30-14 or 28-10. Not out scoring their opponents 270 whatever to 50 whatever in the first half before we put the backups in early in the 3rd. Yall just turn on ESPN 3 Saturday at 6 and ask yourself how many teams could look that good playing against a high school team much less an fcs team.

If your not impressed you might be a midwesterner who thinks the 85' bears were the last REAL pro team, the steelers throw to much, or the Viking under utilize Adrian Peterson.

Some notes to watch for:

the number of OL and DL that take snaps
how many different WR's catch passes
the yards after catch is mind blowing
how many running back me get touches and the yards per carry of each
the first group defense is actually pretty good

#yeswewilldothattoyourteamtoo

Funny you bring up the NFL because who was the last NFL team that had the best offense that won the championship? Even the unstoppable Patriots in 2007 lost the Championship. The unstoppable Broncos of a few years ago lost the Championship. The Panthers last year lost in the Championship. All to teams with better defenses.

Turns out the majority of the time it happens in college football as well. Pass happy all offense will get you a ways, but defense will never fail you. The best team the last 5 years has been a team that relies on TOP on offense and a strong defense. So lets just wait and see what happens when your team plays someone with a defense.

[Professor Chaos]

they may go undefeated with our schedule but smart money says they do it 30-14 or 28-10. Not out scoring their opponents 270 whatever to 50 whatever in the first half before we put the backups in early in the 3rd. Yall just turn on ESPN 3 Saturday at 6 and ask yourself how many teams could look that good playing against a high school team much less an fcs team.

If your not impressed you might be a midwesterner who thinks the 85' bears were the last REAL pro team, the steelers throw to much, or the Viking under utilize Adrian Peterson.

Some notes to watch for:

the number of OL and DL that take snaps
how many different WR's catch passes
the yards after catch is mind blowing
how many running back me get touches and the yards per carry of each
the first group defense is actually pretty good

#yeswewilldothattoyourteamtoo
Why is the smart money that they'd only win by 15-20? They beat Missouri St by 54 and MSU is ranked higher in Massey and Sagarin than any team on SHSU's schedule to date.

[clenz]

Why is the smart money that they'd only win by 15-20. They beat Missouri St by 54 and MSU is ranked higher in Massey and Sagarin than any team on SHSU's schedule to date.
The funny thing is I ran UNI through SHSU's schedule using 4 different computer models and averaged it out

UNI would be undefeated right now having given up less than all year than SHSU did to UIW and the D2.

I know computers have their limitations but the average UNI v SHSU score was something like 39-8. The scores UNI "would" have given up were 7, 0, 8, 11, 10 and another single digit number (I don't truly remember.

MOV is a strange thing that doesn't truly tell as much as people think it does.

21-3 is a 18 point MOV
68-48 is a 20 point MOV

Holding a team to 3 points is significantly more impressive than 48

[centennial]

I have to say that I would rank NDSU & EWU 1 & 2. Looks like the committee is forcing NDSU to defend their titles away from Fargo in the semis.
Ding ding ding. The committee needs to not have special interests of their schools and conferences in mind. Publish a damn computer rating, or an objective human poll. Instead we have a bunch of politicians acting dirty. Would anything close to this happen in the FBS ever? ESecPN would be crying bloody murder that Western Michigan is ahead of 1 loss Alabama. Let the best team win, be that EWU, or NDSU.

Same **** last year. Make NDSU go through the MVFC again. Someone can go look at the level of SOS of the playoffs for NDSU vs Sam Houston. The committee isn't stupid they know what they are doing, and then intentionally acting ignorant.

[Professor Chaos]

In case you missed it here's the interview a local Fargo radio station did with FCS playoff selection committee chair and Morehead St AD Brian Hutchinson: https://soundcloud.com/user-744211984/morehead-state-ad-and-fcs-committee-chair-brian-hutchinson-nov-4-2016


Ding ding ding. The committee needs to not have special interests of their schools and conferences in mind. Publish a damn computer rating, or an objective human poll. Instead we have a bunch of politicians acting dirty. Would anything close to this happen in the FBS ever? ESecPN would be crying bloody murder that Western Michigan is ahead of 1 loss Alabama. Let the best team win, be that EWU, or NDSU.

Same **** last year. Make NDSU go through the MVFC again. Someone can go look at the level of SOS of the playoffs for NDSU vs Sam Houston. The committee isn't stupid they know what they are doing, and then intentionally acting ignorant.
Calm down bud, did you listen to the interview the selection committee chair gave above? They didn't have nearly the organization to mastermind the conspiracy you're claiming with these rankings. IMO this is much moreso just a poor effort without much organization than some sort of politically driven conspiracy.

[Sammy94]

Uh oh...Massey Ratings went from giving UCA a 48% chance of beating SHSU to now a 58% chance...xlolx

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=23804&stc=1

Massey must know about the hit out on our QB this week .

[Gangtackle11]

This selection process had 1 objective and that was to make NDSU defend their 5 FCS championships on the road at some point. They put 2 teams that are very solid clubs that had the highest probability to stay 1-2. Thus NDSU can only move to 3 and will play on the road if they make it to the semi-finals. Pretty obvious.

They put them @ 4 just in case UCA takes out SHSU.

[JSUSoutherner]

E=MC2

Now go do it.
Good news. I bombed. Yayyyyy.

[Daytripper]

Good news. I bombed. Yayyyyy.

Don't sweat it. It's all relative.

[Sammy94]

The funny thing is I ran UNI through SHSU's schedule using 4 different computer models and averaged it out

UNI would be undefeated right now having given up less than all year than SHSU did to UIW and the D2.

I know computers have their limitations but the average UNI v SHSU score was something like 39-8. The scores UNI "would" have given up were 7, 0, 8, 11, 10 and another single digit number (I don't truly remember.

MOV is a strange thing that doesn't truly tell as much as people think it does.

21-3 is a 18 point MOV
68-48 is a 20 point MOV

Holding a team to 3 points is significantly more impressive than 48

Now run it using only 3 quarters if you really want to compare the 2 teams

[JSUSoutherner]

Don't sweat it. It's all relative.
Final replaces it anyway. So I don't really care.

[clenz]

Now run it using only 3 quarters if you really want to compare the 2 teams
That....that isn't how any of that works.

I'm well on record that I don't think UNI is a good team. HOWEVER, it's quite interesting to see how pretty much every single computer model would have UNI doing what SHSU did against SHSU's schedule and would have SHSU with a the exact same record as UNI at this point in the year.

It's just interesting to see how SOS could actually impact things.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Now run it using only 3 quarters if you really want to compare the 2 teams

Okay so using the game in question the score would have been 56-35 after 3 quarters. So you gain 1 point in MOV for that game by it only being 3 quarters.

Should also be noted Briscoe was still in, in the 4th quarter of that game.

[No_Skill]

Now run it using only 3 quarters if you really want to compare the 2 teams

Why do you feel that is a good thing? What happens when they have to face some adversity? In my experience teams like SHSU crumble when they get to the 4th qtr and find themselves in a close game. Give me the team who has faced adversity and overcame it.

[Professor Chaos]

Tim Tebow could've never made the cut at SHSU... he never started really playing until the 4th quarter.

[Gangtackle11]

The MVFC is slightly overrated except for NDSU. The computers overvalue the occasional win in season over the Bison and give the rest too much credit.

I believe it's the best conference currently, but only a computer program where garbage in gives you garbage out would tell you UNI would consistently beat SHSU or Jacksonville State or.......

Solid football conference for sure is the MVFC, but the hype is because of the dominance in Fargo period. Too much credit for the rest of the blind squirrels that grab an occasional nut from NDSU.

The MVFC is solid, but gets way too much credit for being dominant & alone at the top by nerds inputting info into a computer program.

A rising Bison tide floats the rest of the MVFC boats for sure.

[Sammy94]

That....that isn't how any of that works.

I'm well on record that I don't think UNI is a good team. HOWEVER, it's quite interesting to see how pretty much every single computer model would have UNI doing what SHSU did against SHSU's schedule and would have SHSU with a the exact same record as UNI at this point in the year.

It's just interesting to see how SOS could actually impact things.


Exactly, see why they actually play football games. You can't compare the 2 teams unless they actually play. Matchups, injuries, coaching, depth, etc. all this comes into play before SOS, perhaps the committee thinks the same way I do?

[Sammy94]

Okay so using the game in question the score would have been 56-35 after 3 quarters. So you gain 1 point in MOV for that game by it only being 3 quarters.

Should also be noted Briscoe was still in, in the 4th quarter of that game.

Unfortunately he doesn't play defense I guess.

[Bisonator]

The MVFC is overrated except for NDSU. The computers overvalue the occasional win in season over the Bison and give the rest too much credit.

I believe it's currently the best conference currently, but only a computer program where garbage in gives you garbage out would tell you UNI would consistently beat SHSU or Jacksonville State or.......

Solid football conference for sure is the MVFC, but the hype is because of the dominance in Fargo period. Too much credit for the rest of the blind squirrels that grab an occasional nut from NDSU.

The MVFC is solid, but gets way too much credit for being dominant & alone at the top by nerds inputting info into a computer program.

A rising Bison tide floats the rest of the MVFC boats for sure.
The MVFC may be down slightly this year but that certainly wasn't the case the last 2 years.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Unfortunately he doesn't play defense I guess.

So are you saying you had your 2nd string defense in, but not 2nd string QB?

[centennial]

The MVFC is slightly overrated except for NDSU. The computers overvalue the occasional win in season over the Bison and give the rest too much credit.

I believe it's currently the best conference currently, but only a computer program where garbage in gives you garbage out would tell you UNI would consistently beat SHSU or Jacksonville State or.......

Solid football conference for sure is the MVFC, but the hype is because of the dominance in Fargo period. Too much credit for the rest of the blind squirrels that grab an occasional nut from NDSU.

The MVFC is solid, but gets way too much credit for being dominant & alone at the top by nerds inputting info into a computer program.

A rising Bison tide floats the rest of the MVFC boats for sure.
Sagarin considers the middle of the conference a lot more. NDSU's significance on the conference ratings is very minimal. You know we are only 4-3 vs the FBS with 3 P5 wins. Also a really solid FCS OOC, UNI has 2 of the 5 losses. The computers rank the MVFC along with the G5 conferences because they are.

[Sammy94]

So are you saying you had your 2nd string defense in, but not 2nd string QB?

Briscoe has been on the field in more 4th quarters than PJ Hall yes that is what I am saying. Are we talking one game or the season so far? There has been many games where the starters on defense were done at the half and many times the starters on the other side played well into the 2nd half.

[BisonTru]

Just move up the Delaware series, get them on the schedule for next year and you have your third patsy for 2017.

We've been in talks but we are holding out hope we can get a DIII in the schedule. Can't half ass this **** with this committee.

[Gangtackle11]

Sagarin considers the middle of the conference a lot more. NDSU's significance on the conference ratings is very minimal. You know we are only 4-3 vs the FBS with 3 P5 wins. Also a really solid FCS OOC, UNI has 2 of the 5 losses. The computers rank the MVFC along with the G5 conferences because they are.

Again, I think it's the best just a bit overrated outside of NDSU.

The CAA has 2 FBS wins & 1 P5 win. I would love to see Richmond, JMU, Villanova square off against SDSU, WIU, Youngstown State or whomever to prove it on the field, but that's not happening in regionalization nor is any more likely in regular season play after this top 10 list was announced.

[CappinHard]

Interesting... "no conversation at all" between the selection committee members themselves before voting on these rankings. They only talked to their corresponding regional committees to this point and then voted accordingly.

Another interesting comment: "I guarantee you the ADs on this committee will look deeper into each team before the final selections are determined".

Pencil whip FTW!

[dewey]

Here is an interview from Bison 1660 am with NCAA FCS playoff chair Brian Hutchinson (Morehead State Athletic Director).

https://soundcloud.com/user-744211984/morehead-state-ad-and-fcs-committee-chair-brian-hutchinson-nov-4-2016

Dewey