FCS playoff at-large invitations.

[Panther88]

What's the method for the selection? [criteria]

[Catsfan90]

Play in the MVFC.

[Hammerhead]

Strength of schedule. Some also might argue that a few bubble teams make the cut to maximize the number of games where the visiting team is less than 400 miles away so the NCAA doesn't have to charter flights and pay for hotel rooms. :)

[Panther88]

Strength of schedule. Some also might argue that a few bubble teams make the cut to maximize the number of games where the visiting team is less than 400 miles away so the NCAA doesn't have to charter flights and pay for hotel rooms. :)

I figured body of work and location (saving $$$) would be @ the forefront during consideration.

[DFW HOYA]

What's the method for the selection? [criteria]

1, Win at least seven games in the Valley or the CAA.
2. Win at least eight games in the Southern or Big Sky.
3. Win at least nine in all other leagues except the Pioneer and,
4. Doesn't play in the Ivy or SWAC.

[Panther88]

1, Win at least seven games in the Valley or the CAA.
2. Win at least eight games in the Southern or Big Sky.
3. Win at least nine in all other leagues except the Pioneer and,
4. Doesn't play in the Ivy or SWAC.

Alrighty now. Biased much?

[Daytripper]

Reputation.

[IBleedYellow]

Win.

[Stonewall D]

SWAG (stupid wild arse guess).

[kalm]

1, Win at least seven games in the Valley or the CAA.
2. Win at least eight games in the Southern or Big Sky.
3. Win at least nine in all other leagues except the Pioneer and,
4. Doesn't play in the Ivy or SWAC.

The Big Sky has received 7-4 at large bids before (probably Southern too) and every conference including the Valley has 7-4 teams sit at home.

[eiu1999]

Play in the MVFC.


This

[centennial]

This
16-3 FCS OOC and we are going to get 3 teams in. Why? Because we beat up on each other enough so there aren't 5 teams to qualify.

[Lehigh'98]

16-3 FCS OOC and we are going to get 3 teams in. Why? Because we beat up on each other enough so there aren't 5 teams to qualify.

Thinking UNI will be the 4th if they win out.

[Panther88]

SWAG (stupid wild arse guess).

WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!!! :D

[BisonFan02]

1, Win at least seven games in the Valley or the CAA.
2. Win at least eight games in the Southern or Big Sky.
3. Win at least nine in all other leagues except the Pioneer and,
4. Doesn't play in the Ivy or SWAC.

Agree completely.... xnodx xthumbsupx

[JayJ79]

Thinking UNI will be the 4th if they win out.

they'll definitely be in if they win out. But with the way that the MVFC tends to be (and the way UNI FB has been the past few years), they're likely to lose to Indiana State (or SIU, or it wouldn't even shock me if they laid an egg at Missouri State and lost)

[centennial]

they'll definitely be in if they win out. But with the way that the MVFC tends to be (and the way UNI FB has been the past few years), they're likely to lose to Indiana State (or SIU, or it wouldn't even shock me if they laid an egg at Missouri State and lost)
A 6 win MVFC team is still better than a third(if not more) of the teams in the playoffs. Not sure they get in however.

[walliver]

Although people will argue about the criteria, and someone will come by shortly and post a link to the NCAA site, reputation is probably one of the more important factors (that doesn't show up on the NCAA list). Teams with recent playoff exposure tend to beat out other teams.

There is always at least one WTF? pick every year.

[citdog]

A 6 win MVFC team is still better than a third(if not more) of the teams in the playoffs. Not sure they get in however.

Coastal Carolina didn't think so...

[PAllen]

A 6 win MVFC team is still better than a third(if not more) of the teams in the playoffs. Not sure they get in however.

But that's not the point. Are they better than the top 1 or two teams in the playoffs? No. The other conferences for the most part, you don't know. The playoffs are about deciding a national champion on the field. There aren't enough interconference matchups to truly determine whether conference champion A is better than conference champion B. Therefore, you need to include the conference champs from every league (at least those that are willing to come). At large bids are there for those instances where a dominant team slips up in conference play or looses a tie breaker for the auto bid. The rest are there for window dressing. All of this crying and acting like a playoff appearance is a reward for being better than some is a joke. I honestly wish we could go back to 16 teams and have the conference champ from each conference seeded along with a few other at large teams who meet the WTF criteria above. Then we'd be back to determining a national champion as our primary goal. If you want a reward for a winning season, then go to FBS and look for the invite to the nobody cares bowl played on December 19th in Calgary.

[CSU18]

I think back to the days when it was 16 teams and Ga Southern, App, and Furman all got in. They finished 1, 2, & 3 in the SoCon. Any of the 3 had a viable chance to win it all. I think 24 is too much and 16 isn't enough. Anyone can win or lose once the playoffs start.

[kalm]

But that's not the point. Are they better than the top 1 or two teams in the playoffs? No. The other conferences for the most part, you don't know. The playoffs are about deciding a national champion on the field. There aren't enough interconference matchups to truly determine whether conference champion A is better than conference champion B. Therefore, you need to include the conference champs from every league (at least those that are willing to come). At large bids are there for those instances where a dominant team slips up in conference play or looses a tie breaker for the auto bid. The rest are there for window dressing. All of this crying and acting like a playoff appearance is a reward for being better than some is a joke. I honestly wish we could go back to 16 teams and have the conference champ from each conference seeded along with a few other at large teams who meet the WTF criteria above. Then we'd be back to determining a national champion as our primary goal. If you want a reward for a winning season, then go to FBS and look for the invite to the nobody cares bowl played on December 19th in Calgary.

Nova in 2010 wasn't a dominant team. They squeezed into the playoffs, went on a run, and almost played for a title. JMU did it a few years before that and won a title. A team like UNI could do that this year.

[PAllen]

Nova in 2010 wasn't a dominant team. They squeezed into the playoffs, went on a run, and almost played for a title. JMU did it a few years before that and won a title. A team like UNI could do that this year.

So we should include any team that might go on a run and almost play for the title? You'd need a field of 64 teams if that's your criteria. My point is, if you don't come close to winning your own conference, how can you claim to be the best in the country? Is the 5th best team in the Valley better than the Pioneer League Champ? Most seasons, probably. But that's the wrong question. The question is, is the best team in the Valley better than the Pioneer League Champ? Again, probably, but you don't know until you play the game. Come playoff time, we've already seen what the 5th place team in the Valley can do against the top 4 teams in conference. By definition, they were not as good. Could they get lucky and win a few games in the playoffs? Sure, but that's not the point. The point is to ensure that the top team in the nation is playing in the championship game. You can't ensure that without including the best team from each conference. Some years (most from some conferences) a second or third place conference team has an argument for being the better team than their league champ. That should be the at large criteria, not "hey, we had a winning record."

[PAllen]

I think back to the days when it was 16 teams and Ga Southern, App, and Furman all got in. They finished 1, 2, & 3 in the SoCon. Any of the 3 had a viable chance to win it all. I think 24 is too much and 16 isn't enough. Anyone can win or lose once the playoffs start.

And at the time, they were three dominant teams in FCS and those missing the autobid were doing so with one conference loss or losing out on the tie breaker.

[PantherRob82]

Nova in 2010 wasn't a dominant team. They squeezed into the playoffs, went on a run, and almost played for a title. JMU did it a few years before that and won a title. A team like UNI could do that this year.

In 2005 UNI was sitting at 4-3 with a D-II win. They went on to win 4 straight (7-3 in against D-I teams, 5-2 in conference play), and won 3 straight playoff games to get to the championship which they lost by 5 on a fumble return.

[kalm]

In 2005 UNI was sitting at 4-3 with a D-II win. They went on to win 4 straight (7-3 in against D-I teams, 5-2 in conference play), and won 3 straight playoff games to get to the championship which they lost by 5 on a fumble return.

I knew there was another recent one. Thanks!

The playoffs aren't watered down by 4th place CAA and MVFC teams. They are watered down by AQ's from weaker conferences who won't step up their programs.

The Big South and Southland have stepped up their game to relevance. I hope the others can too.

[PAllen]

I knew there was another recent one. Thanks!

The playoffs aren't watered down by 4th place CAA and MVFC teams. They are watered down by AQ's from weaker conferences who won't step up their programs.

The Big South and Southland have stepped up their game to relevance. I hope the others can too.

SMFH, and 2003, who should have been in the title game? I mean Colgate didn't play anybody but Ivies, Patriot and a a very weak transitional I-A team. If they had played in the CAA, they wouldn't have finished in the top half. Or so you experts said at the time. You still haven't answered the pertinent question: How does a fourth place MVFC team lay claim to being the best team in the country? Not one of, but THE best.

Oh, and the Southland has been relevant for quite a while.

[kalm]

SMFH, and 2003, who should have been in the title game? I mean Colgate didn't play anybody but Ivies, Patriot and a a very weak transitional I-A team. If they had played in the CAA, they wouldn't have finished in the top half. Or so you experts said at the time. You still haven't answered the pertinent question: How does a fourth place MVFC team lay claim to being the best team in the country? Not one of, but THE best.

Oh, and the Southland has been relevant for quite a while.

One example from 13 years ago and I'm not suggesting AQ's from a weak conference shouldn't be in the tourney. My point is that the weaker conference champs diminish the quality of the field far more than the bubble teams from power conferences. It isn't really debatable so I reject your premise. FTR, I like the current field size and think there's room for both.

A 4th place MVFC bubble team lays claim by going on a run in the playoffs like the other examples cited.

The Southland suddenly became relevant again in 2011. Before that it was bleak for quite some time and they were clearly not a power conference. At this point, I think they've more than pulled even with the Southern and perhaps even the CAA and BSC.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I'm not suggesting AQ's from a weak conference shouldn't be in the tourney. My point is that the weaker conference champs diminish the quality of the field far more than the bubble teams from power conferences...A 4th place MVFC bubble team lays claim by going on a run in the playoffs like the other examples cited.

So you're just saying that the Big Sky and MVFC just play their own championship and nobody else need apply to your precious, beautiful tournament of directional state schools.

[ElCid]

The Southland suddenly became relevant again in 2011. Before that it was bleak for quite some time and they were clearly not a power conference. At this point, I think they've more than pulled even with the Southern and perhaps even the CAA and BSC.

Perhaps even the CAA and BSC? As an arguable opinion, possibly. And when talking about the top 2-3 teams maybe. But also, the talk of SOCON decline keeps getting unwarranted traction as your comparison narrative implies. Sure, the top of the SOCON is not as high due to our late departures, but the SOCON depth is still there and is still as good as any, except the Chosen Ones of course.

For an arguably objective rating, the computers say no to your comparison when looking at the entire depth of conferences. And even while the top of the CAA or BS might be pretty good, the quality drops off somewhere badly. Both have 4 teams not in the top 200 Div I. The SOCON also has 2 but slightly small number of teams. The Southland seriously suffers from lack of depth. They only have 4 teams out of 11 which are in the top 200 Div I. Lots of new/young teams though so that is expected. So they have not pulled even with CAA, BSC or even the higher rated SOCON.:D At least higher in the Massey rating for overall conference ratings.

The MVFC is obviously out front in both computer ratings. Massey then has it (cough) Ivy, then SOCON, BSC, CAA, BSouth, then a gap to the Patriot, OVC, then Southland, etc.

And even in Sagarin the BS, CAA and SOCON are still clumped together followed closely by OVC and (Cough) the Ivy. Small gap then Southland etc.

The Southland top is good (I think), but the depth is not there. Hence McNeese and SHSU have the lowest SOS in the AGS top 25, including Fordham, which is blasphemy to some. Central Arkansas SOS is better but that shows in their record as well.

Take these computer ratings as you will, but they are at least devoid of human biases. Except maybe the programmers who goosed the Ivy ratings.xcrazyx


Massey




Team




Record




Tms




Rat




Off




Def




SoS




Missouri Valley (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=85697&s=279541)


18-12

0.600




10




1

1.23




1 46.68




1

20.26




1

38.26




Ivy League (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=12206&s=279541)


16-8

0.667




8




2

1.05




3

43.39




2

18.03




4

30.03




Southern (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=14064&s=279541)


15-13

0.536




8




3

0.93




4

42.10




5

15.52




5

29.10




Big Sky (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=10668&s=279541)


15-17

0.469




13




4

0.92




2

43.78




7

13.29




2

30.71




Colonial (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=11246&s=279541)


16-18

0.471




12




5

0.91




5

39.84




3

16.80




3

30.58




Big South (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=10672&s=279541)


19-14

0.576




7




6

0.86




8

38.62




4

16.38




8

25.59




Patriot League (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=13333&s=279541)


16-19

0.457




7




7

0.77




7

38.63




6

13.49




6

27.44




OH Valley (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=13193&s=279541)


10-18

0.357




9




8

0.73




6

39.55




8

11.48




7

26.81




Southland (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=14112&s=279541)


7-14

0.333




11




9

0.60




9

37.75




10

9.29




9

21.71




Northeast (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=13046&s=279541)


13-21

0.382




7




10

0.50




10

34.04




9

10.72




10

19.11




Pioneer (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=13408&s=279541)


18-14

0.563




11




11

0.31




12

30.88




11

6.33




12

10.43




Mid-Eastern AC (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=12545&s=279541)


8-23

0.258




11




12

0.19




14

29.52




12

4.48




11

12.89




SWAC West (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=14269&s=279541)


14-13

0.519




5




13

0.04




11

32.41




15

-3.77




15

2.08




Southwestern AC (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=14163&s=279541)


4-14

0.222




10




14

-.02




13

29.61




14

-2.25




14

3.77




SWAC East (http://masseyratings.com/team.php?t=14267&s=279541)


8-19

0.296




5




15

-.07




15

26.81




13

-0.73




13

5.46







Sagarin

CONFERENCE CENTRAL MEAN
15 MISSOURI VALLEY (AA)= 58.76
21 BIG SKY (AA) = 47.88
22 COLONIAL (AA) = 46.76
23 SOUTHERN (AA) = 46.40
24 OHIO VALLEY (AA) = 44.91
25 IVY LEAGUE (AA) = 44.02
26 SOUTHLAND (AA) = 41.41
27 BIG SOUTH (AA) = 40.75
28 PATRIOT (AA) = 38.73
29 NORTHEAST (AA) = 34.00
30 MID-EASTERN (AA) = 31.60
31 SWAC-WEST (AA) = 29.23
32 SWAC-EAST (AA) = 25.82
33 PIONEER (AA) = 24.39

[Bisonwinagn]

And at the time, they were three dominant teams in FCS and those missing the autobid were doing so with one conference loss or losing out on the tie breaker.

Look at the GPI if you want to know which teams should be in the tournament based on the their resume.

[kalm]

So you're just saying that the Big Sky and MVFC just play their own championship and nobody else need apply to your precious, beautiful tournament of directional state schools.

Good lord that's not even close to what I suggested. How do you know you've frustrated an Ivy or PL grad with unfortunate facts? When the directional school pejorative comes out. xsmiley_wix

Another indication that football ain't the only over-rated part of those educations.

[kalm]

Perhaps even the CAA and BSC? As an arguable opinion, possibly. And when talking about the top 2-3 teams maybe. But also, the talk of SOCON decline keeps getting unwarranted traction as your comparison narrative implies. Sure, the top of the SOCON is not as high due to our late departures, but the SOCON depth is still there and is still as good as any, except the Chosen Ones of course.

For an arguably objective rating, the computers say no to your comparison when looking at the entire depth of conferences. And even while the top of the CAA or BS might be pretty good, the quality drops off somewhere badly. Both have 4 teams not in the top 200 Div I. The SOCON also has 2 but slightly small number of teams. The Southland seriously suffers from lack of depth. They only have 4 teams out of 11 which are in the top 200 Div I. Lots of new/young teams though so that is expected. So they have not pulled even with CAA, BSC or even the higher rated SOCON.:D At least higher in the Massey rating for overall conference ratings.

The MVFC is obviously out front in both computer ratings. Massey then has it (cough) Ivy, then SOCON, BSC, CAA, BSouth, then a gap to the Patriot, OVC, then Southland, etc.

And even in Sagarin the BS, CAA and SOCON are still clumped together followed closely by OVC and (Cough) the Ivy. Small gap then Southland etc.

The Southland top is good (I think), but the depth is not there. Hence McNeese and SHSU have the lowest SOS in the AGS top 25, including Fordham, which is blasphemy to some. Central Arkansas SOS is better but that shows in their record as well.

Take these computer ratings as you will, but they are at least devoid of human biases. Except maybe the programmers who goosed the Ivy ratings.xcrazyx



Good thoughts here El Ciddo...

I'm luke warm at best regarding computer rankings. Human bias is also a legit criticism but just like with how the computers tend to improve as the season goes on , I think human historical bias eventually catches up as well. Recognizing that certain historically great teams no longer deserve to be ranked or that running the gauntlet in a historically tough conference isn't as difficult as it used to be may not occur fast enough for some but they eventually work themselves out.

I considered the Southern to have been down, not just because of secession, but because of the new teams needing time to elevate their programs and the recent record against the Big South. However, even as I'm typing that the Southern is down and the Southland has risen, I've already taken notice that Samford has a nice OOC win against UCA, Furman picked off an FBS, Chatty passes the eyeball test as a NC contender, and you guys are on the rise as well. At the same time, I'm now downgrading the Southland a bit as their OOC schedules have been weak and the new members are still struggling quite a bit. That's reflected in my polls. Perhaps I lag behind the computers but not by much.

Regarding human consideration of conference strength there are of course many metrics one can use as you suggest. I happen to think W-L gets too much credit..especially at this point in the season. For example, we all know (or should) that OOC scheduling is a tremendous drag as you move west due to a lack of FCS teams. The BSC and MVFC and Southland have each other to schedule and then it's either DII or 1 or 2 FBS depending on your finances. Conversley, being able to pad a schedule with MEAC's, NEC's, and Ivy's inflates the record of eastern conferences.

Not to diminish the importance of winning a high number of games but I happen to think SOS, FBS wins, and OOC wins are more important indicators than many recognize (BSC bias acknowledged :D). I also think recent conference playoff performance is another strong indicator. SHSU was able to tear through a widely considered weak Southland but it was evidently strong enough to prepare them for title runs.

[clenz]

Take these computer ratings as you will, but they are at least devoid of human biases. Except maybe the programmers who goosed the Ivy ratings.xcrazyx




Been discussed in other threads, but computers will struggle with the Ivy because of how insulated they are. They play only themselves and the PL. It creates a very, very, small rating pool. They just continue to inflate themselves, regardless what happens for the most part.

[PAllen]

There aren't enough games for computer rankings to overcome human bias. Kalm, you can dismiss my argument all you want. You do it everytime anyone has a valid point that disagrees with your tinted view of the world. That doesn't change the fact that you still haven't answered the question: How does a fourth or fifth ranked team in the MVFC lay claim to being THE best team in the country?

Since you'll never answer that question without trying to deflect, I'll help you out. They can't. If you can't claim that you're the best team in your conference, then you can't claim that you're the best team in the country, and that is what the playoffs are here to determine.

[Lehigh'98]

It's kind of silly to say the MVFC shouldn't have 4 teams in assuming they get 7 wins in a 24 team field. Can't argue with their OOC FCS record the last 2 years. Can't really say that about any other conference right now though.

[kalm]

There aren't enough games for computer rankings to overcome human bias. Kalm, you can dismiss my argument all you want. You do it everytime anyone has a valid point that disagrees with your tinted view of the world. That doesn't change the fact that you still haven't answered the question: How does a fourth or fifth ranked team in the MVFC lay claim to being THE best team in the country?

Since you'll never answer that question without trying to deflect, I'll help you out. They can't. If you can't claim that you're the best team in your conference, then you can't claim that you're the best team in the country, and that is what the playoffs are here to determine.

Jesus Christo! since when have PL IQ's taken such a downward turn. My tinted view of the world? I love VALID points that challenge my world views. (Not sure what my world view has to do with football)xcoffeex

I answered your silly question already. I'd like to give the benefit of the doubt that you just missed it but I'm not so sure now. xsmiley_wix

I'll type more slowly this time so you can follow along...

No...one... is... claiming... that... the... 4th... place... MVFC... team... is... currently... the... best... team... in... the... land. Polls rank teams on the best available current data. Playoffs determine the final outcome.

So a 4th place MVFC lays claim to the best team in the land by going on a run and winning the NC.

But you go ahead and run with the PL champ having a legitimate claim to best team in the land because they won their AQ. xlolxxlolxxthumbsupx

[gotts]

Jesus Christo! since when have PL IQ's taken such a downward turn. My tinted view of the world? I love VALID points that challenge my world views. (Not sure what my world view has to do with football)xcoffeex

I answered your silly question already. I'd like to give the benefit of the doubt that you just missed it but I'm not so sure now. xsmiley_wix

I'll type more slowly this time so you can follow along...

No...one... is... claiming... that... the... 4th... place... MVFC... team... is... currently... the... best... team... in... the... land. Polls rank teams on the best available current data. Playoffs determine the final outcome.

So a 4th place MVFC lays claim to the best team in the land by going on a run and winning the NC.

But you go ahead and run with the PL champ having a legitimate claim to best team in the land because they won their AQ. xlolxxlolxxthumbsupx

If I'm reading the thread correctly, I am understanding your point to be that a 4th/5th place team from a "power" conference is more likely to strengthen the playoff field vs. the autobid from reduced/no scholarship conferences. Am I on target here?

[Cocky]

It's kind of silly to say the MVFC shouldn't have 4 teams in assuming they get 7 wins in a 24 team field. Can't argue with their OOC FCS record the last 2 years. Can't really say that about any other conference right now though.

The playoffs should consist of team from this year not the past two years.

[Lehigh'98]

The playoffs should consist of team from this year not the past two years.

Even if you stick with just this year, I believe they are something like 16-3? against FCS OOC. With 24 teams there is room.

[Catsfan90]

Although people will argue about the criteria, and someone will come by shortly and post a link to the NCAA site, reputation is probably one of the more important factors (that doesn't show up on the NCAA list). Teams with recent playoff exposure tend to beat out other teams.

There is always at least one WTF? pick every year.
Very true. Like if UNH were to have the same record as another team. UNH would most likely get the nod based off of reputation. It kinda sucks, but that's what you get when humans are deciding.

[Lehigh'98]

Although people will argue about the criteria, and someone will come by shortly and post a link to the NCAA site, reputation is probably one of the more important factors (that doesn't show up on the NCAA list). Teams with recent playoff exposure tend to beat out other teams.

There is always at least one WTF? pick every year.

This is the reason I think Lehigh should have got the benefit of the doubt in 2012 at 10-1. In 2010, they beat UNI in their house and 2011 beat Towson, CAA champ, at their house. I suppose they couldn't overcome the PL reputation even though the top teams have a history of competitiveness in the playoffs.

[kalm]

If I'm reading the thread correctly, I am understanding your point to be that a 4th/5th place team from a "power" conference is more likely to strengthen the playoff field vs. the autobid from reduced/no scholarship conferences. Am I on target here?

Yeah, I probably over-reached a bit there. Lol.

Sometimes weaker conference champs put up a great fight and sometimes 4th place teams get rolled. But in general, they're probably equally deserving and I'm glad there's room for both.

[Mayville Bison]

SMFH, and 2003, who should have been in the title game? I mean Colgate didn't play anybody but Ivies, Patriot and a a very weak transitional I-A team. If they had played in the CAA, they wouldn't have finished in the top half. Or so you experts said at the time. You still haven't answered the pertinent question: How does a fourth place MVFC team lay claim to being the best team in the country? Not one of, but THE best.

Oh, and the Southland has been relevant for quite a while.

UNI lost on the road by one score to both ISUr and NDSU and then went to beat SDSU on the road. All three games on the road.

Are they the best team in the conference? I personally don't think so, but you should be able to see why they are optimistic.

[DFW HOYA]

At-large bids come down to reputation, which is why an 7-5 Eastern Kentucky team got in for 2011 and an 8-3 Georgetown team had no chance whatsoever.

[I-AA Fan]

I think back to the days when it was 16 teams and Ga Southern, App, and Furman all got in. They finished 1, 2, & 3 in the SoCon. Any of the 3 had a viable chance to win it all. I think 24 is too much and 16 isn't enough. Anyone can win or lose once the playoffs start.

Know as the "big-3", the SoCon had Marshall, Furman and GA Southern. GAS basically replaced Marshall in the SoCon. Prior to that they were an independent. At that point, (early-to-mid 90's) the "big-3" became Ga Southern, Furman and App State.

There were some powerful independents back then, which in included not only GA Southern, but team like Boise State, Central Florida, Hofstra, Liberty, Troy State, Western Kentucky, Youngstown State and several more (I guess my mind is going). In fact, GaS and YSU won the majority of their titles as independents. At that point it was much easier to get an game outside of your own conference and not play someone from another conference. I have never liked the idea of playing up or down, as PAllen said, you never know. If you only play I-AA/FCS teams, then you have a better idea of how good someone is. Also if no one is playing money games, then we do not have to worry about financial superiority of some clubs.

I will further state that if the NCAA does not take equal post-season representation from ALL conferences, then there will be an unfair shift in the recruiting base, which basically means that a bad team and/or conference will always be just that.

[eiu1999]

Yeah, I probably over-reached a bit there. Lol.

Sometimes weaker conference champs put up a great fight and sometimes 4th place teams get rolled. But in general, they're probably equally deserving and I'm glad there's room for both.

At least you admit it.

[EKU Toss Sweep]

At-large bids come down to reputation, which is why an 7-5 Eastern Kentucky team got in for 2011 and an 8-3 Georgetown team had no chance whatsoever.

Not to split hairs, but EKU was 7-4 going in to the playoffs in 2011. 7-5 coming out of the playoffs that year after losing to JMU. But yes, reputation has always played a part in the selection process.

[Thumper 76]

What's the method for the selection? [criteria]

You know how they select the new pope? A lot like that.