In Alphabetical order...who is your top 30?

[ursus arctos horribilis]

I'll provide the list again for reference or copy purposes. Don't put them in any order other than alpha please.

Just want to talk about who should be in the group of 30 or 40.

--------------------

Last years final poll top 40 (alpha) was:

Alcorn State Braves
Bethune-Cookman Wildcats
Bryant Bulldogs
Cal Poly Mustangs
Charleston Southern Buccaneers
Chattanooga Mocs
Coastal Carolina Chanticleers
Dartmouth Big Green
Eastern Kentucky Colonels
Eastern Washington Eagles
Fordham Rams
Harvard Crimson
Idaho State Bengals
Illinois State Redbirds
Indiana State Sycamores
Jacksonville State Gamecocks
James Madison Dukes
Liberty Flames
McNeese State Cowboys
Montana Grizzlies
Montana State Bobcats
Morgan State Bears
New Hampshire Wildcats
North Carolina A&T Aggies
North Dakota State Bison
Northern Iowa Panthers
Richmond Spiders
Sacred Heart Pioneers
Sam Houston State Bearkats
Samford Bulldogs
San Diego Toreros
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
Southern Illinois Salukis
Southern Jaguars
Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks
Villanova Wildcats
William & Mary Tribe
Yale Bulldogs
Youngstown State Penguins

--------------------

I will provide the full list of team names in the second post.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Alabama A&M Bulldogs
Alabama State Hornets
Albany Great Danes
Alcorn State Braves
Arkansas Pine Bluff Golden Lions
Austin Peay Governors

Bethune-Cookman Wildcats
Brown Bears
Bryant Bulldogs
Bucknell Bison
Butler Bulldogs

Cal Poly Mustangs
Campbell Fighting Camels
Central Arkansas Bears
Central Connecticut State Blue Devils
Charleston Southern Buccaneers
Chattanooga Mocs
Coastal Carolina Chanticleers
Colgate Raiders
Columbia Lions
Cornell Big Red

Dartmouth Big Green
Davidson Wildcats
Dayton Flyers
Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens
Delaware State Hornets
Drake Bulldogs
Duquesne Dukes

Eastern Illinois Panthers
Eastern Kentucky Colonels
Eastern Washington Eagles
Elon Phoenix

Florida A&M Rattlers
Fordham Rams
Furman Paladins

Gardner-Webb Runnin' Bulldogs
Georgetown Hoyas
Grambling State Tigers

Hampton Pirates
Harvard Crimson
Holy Cross Crusaders
Howard Bison

Idaho State Bengals
Illinois State Redbirds
Indiana State Sycamores

Jackson State Tigers
Jacksonville Dolphins
Jacksonville State Gamecocks
James Madison Dukes

Lafayette Leopards
Lamar Cardinals
Lehigh Mountain Hawks
Liberty Flames

Maine Black Bears
Marist Red Foxes
McNeese State Cowboys
Mississippi Valley State Delta Devils
Missouri State Bears
Monmouth Hawks
Montana Grizzlies
Montana State Bobcats
Morehead State Eagles
Morgan State Bears
Murray State Racers

New Hampshire Wildcats
Nicholls State Colonels
Norfolk State Spartans
North Carolina A&T Aggies
North Carolina Central Eagles
North Dakota (UND)
North Dakota State Bison
Northern Arizona Lumberjacks
Northern Colorado Bears
Northern Iowa Panthers
Northwestern State Demons


Pennsylvania Quakers
Portland State Vikings
Prairie View A&M Panthers
Presbyterian Blue Hose
Princeton Tigers

Rhode Island Rams
Richmond Spiders
Robert Morris Colonials

Sacramento State Hornets
Sacred Heart Pioneers
Saint Francis Red Flash
Sam Houston State Bearkats
Samford Bulldogs
San Diego Toreros
Savannah State Tigers
South Carolina State Bulldogs
South Dakota Coyotes
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
Southeast Missouri State Redhawks
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
Southern Illinois Salukis
Southern Jaguars
Southern Utah Thunderbirds
Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks
Stony Brook Seawolves

Tennessee State Tigers
Tennessee Tech Golden Eagles
Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
Texas Southern Tigers
The Citadel Bulldogs
Towson Tigers

UC Davis Aggies

Valparaiso Crusaders
Villanova Wildcats
Virginia Military Institute Keydets

Wagner Seahawks
Weber State Wildcats
Western Carolina Catamounts
Western Illinois Leathernecks
William & Mary Tribe
Wofford Terriers

Yale Bulldogs
Youngstown State Penguins

[FUBeAR]

McNeese State Cowboys

http://media.giphy.com/media/1Zbeweu52ZaQE/giphy.gif

Mississippi Valley State Delta Devils



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtFK0iGXz70

[clenz]

I have 40 on my preseason ranked list...so...sorry for breaking the rules

Bryant
Cal Poly
Central Arkansas
Charleston Southern
Chattanooga
Coastal Carolina
Dartmouth
Eastern Illinois
Eastern Kentucky
Eastern Washington
Fordham
Harvard
Idaho State
Illinois State
Indiana State
Jacksonville State
James Madison
Liberty
McNeese State
Missouri State
Montana
Montana State
New Hampshire
North Dakota State
Northern Arizona
Northern Iowa
Northwestern Louisiana
Richmond
Sam Houston State
Samford
South Dakota State
Southeastern Louisiana
Southern Illinois
Stephen. F Austin
UT Martin
Villanova
Western Carolina
Western Illinois
William & Mary
Youngstown State

[SENOREIDA]

Bethune-Cookman Wildcats


Charleston Southern Buccaneers


Chattanooga Mocs


Coastal Carolina Chanticleers


Eastern Kentucky Colonels


Eastern Washington Eagles


Furman Paladins


Idaho State Bengals


Jacksonville State Gamecocks


James Madison Dukes


Liberty Flames


Maine Black Bears


Montana Grizzlies


Montana State Bobcats


New Hampshire Wildcats


North Dakota State Bison


Northern Arizona Lumberjacks


Northern Iowa Panthers


Richmond Spiders


Sam Houston State Bearkats


Samford Bulldogs


South Dakota State Jackrabbits


Southeastern Louisiana Lions


Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks


Stony Brook Seawolves


Towson Tigers


Villanova Wildcats


Western Carolina Catamounts


William & Mary Tribe


Youngstown State Penguins

[ursus arctos horribilis]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtFK0iGXz70

If you look around you'll see that there is another thread in process working on that topic and making sure Mercer is eligible so if you have definitive information on the matter I could use your assistance in that thread.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

I have 40 on my preseason ranked list...so...sorry for breaking the rules

Bryant
Cal Poly
Central Arkansas
Charleston Southern
Chattanooga
Coastal Carolina
Dartmouth
Eastern Illinois
Eastern Kentucky
Eastern Washington
Fordham
Harvard
Idaho State
Illinois State
Indiana State
Jacksonville State
James Madison
Liberty
McNeese State
Missouri State
Montana
Montana State
New Hampshire
North Dakota State
Northern Arizona
Northern Iowa
Northwestern Louisiana
Richmond
Sam Houston State
Samford
South Dakota State
Southeastern Louisiana
Southern Illinois
Stephen. F Austin
UT Martin
Villanova
Western Carolina
Western Illinois
William & Mary
Youngstown State

Oh I don't care if people go over but figured 30 gets more involvement than asking for 40.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

BTW, thanks to both of you for listening to the structions and putting them alphabetically. I do appreciate it.

[superman7515]

Alcorn State Braves
Bucknell Bison
Cal Poly Mustangs
Chattanooga Mocs
Coastal Carolina Chanticleers
Delaware State Hornets
Eastern Kentucky Colonels
Eastern Washington Eagles
Fordham Rams
Harvard Crimson
Illinois State Redbirds
Indiana State Sycamores
Jacksonville State Gamecocks
James Madison Dukes
Liberty Flames
Montana Grizzlies
Montana State Bobcats
New Hampshire Wildcats
North Carolina A&T Aggies
North Dakota State Bison
Northern Iowa Panthers
Richmond Spiders
Sam Houston State Bearkats
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
Southern Jaguars
Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks
Villanova Wildcats
William & Mary Tribe
Youngstown State Penguins

[clenz]

This is as good as any to ask this:

Thoughts on not considering non playoff conferences for the top 25?

In the past I've never considered the Ivy or SWAC (or PFL pre playoff bid) I've added the MEAC to that list but am thinking about lifting my Ivy ban.

Am I the only one that does this?

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[ursus arctos horribilis]

This is as good as any to ask this:

Thoughts on not considering non playoff conferences for the top 25?

In the past I've never considered the Ivy or SWAC (or PFL pre playoff bid) I've added the MEAC to that list but am thinking about lifting my Ivy ban.

Am I the only one that does this?

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

The poll does a good job of projecting participants but it is not what it is about. I don't think you are the only one that does it but I think you are in a minority by a wide margin. As a philosophy clenzy I personally feel it's elitist and wrong to exclude anyone that you might think deserves a spot. Not too many times do those teams deserve a spot anyway but when they do I have to put them in there.

Great place to ask that btw.

[clenz]

The poll does a good job of projecting participants but it is not what it is about. I don't think you are the only one that does it but I think you are in a minority by a wide margin. As a philosophy clenzy I personally feel it's elitist and wrong to exclude anyone that you might think deserves a spot. Not too many times do those teams deserve a spot anyway but when they do I have to put them in there.

Great place to ask that btw.
To be honest it probably cost the Ivy more points than the MEAC. I never bought into any hype on them that's others seemed too

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[PantherRob82]

Wow. Just a quick peak through teams knocks my list down to 47 with no thought required.

[OhioHen]

This is as good as any to ask this:

Thoughts on not considering non playoff conferences for the top 25?

In the past I've never considered the Ivy or SWAC (or PFL pre playoff bid) I've added the MEAC to that list but am thinking about lifting my Ivy ban.

Am I the only one that does this?

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Based on comments by several pollsters in the past, I would say you're definitely NOT the only one to do this.

Just as you choose this route and are able to justify it to the poll committee when you refuse to vote for a team that many have highly ranked (e.g. an undefeated Ivy team in November), some of us (well, at least ONE of us) choose to never rank a team with a losing record. One reason I never submit a pre-season poll is so that I am not locked in to keeping a team in my Week 1 Top 25 following a close loss to a BCS conference team - it's easier to justify to the committee that I didn't rank UNI because they lost a close game at Iowa (while at least 25 other teams won a game) than to explain how that close loss dropped the Panthers from #8 to out of my poll entirely.

Consistency in how you determine your list is the key - pick a method and stick with it.

[PantherRob82]

My rough, no research list. Just removed the teams I thought didn't belong and ended up with this. For the preseason poll I'm going to do some research.:

Cal Poly Mustangs
Central Arkansas Bears
Chattanooga Mocs
Coastal Carolina Chanticleers
Eastern Illinois Panthers
Eastern Kentucky Colonels
Eastern Washington Eagles
Illinois State Redbirds
Indiana State Sycamores
Jacksonville State Gamecocks
James Madison Dukes
Liberty Flames
Maine Black Bears
McNeese State Cowboys
Montana Grizzlies
Montana State Bobcats
New Hampshire Wildcats
North Dakota State Bison
Northern Arizona Lumberjacks
Northern Iowa Panthers
Richmond Spiders
Sam Houston State Bearkats
Samford Bulldogs
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks
Towson Tigers
Villanova Wildcats
Western Carolina Catamounts
William & Mary Tribe

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

1. Bryant
2. Bucknell
3. Cal Poly
4. Central Arkansas
5. Chattanooga
6. Coastal Carolina
7. Dartmouth
8. Eastern Illinois
9. Eastern Kentucky
10. Eastern Washington
11. Fordham
12. Harvard
13. Illinois State
14. Jacksonville State
15. James Madison
16. Liberty
17. Montana State
18. Montana
19. New Hampshire
20. North Dakota State
21. Northern Iowa
22. Richmond
23. Sam Houston State
24. South Dakota State
25. Southeastern Louisiana
26. Villanova
27. William & Mary
28. Wofford
29. Yale
30. Youngstown State

[clenz]

Based on comments by several pollsters in the past, I would say you're definitely NOT the only one to do this.

Just as you choose this route and are able to justify it to the poll committee when you refuse to vote for a team that many have highly ranked (e.g. an undefeated Ivy team in November), some of us (well, at least ONE of us) choose to never rank a team with a losing record. One reason I never submit a pre-season poll is so that I am not locked in to keeping a team in my Week 1 Top 25 following a close loss to a BCS conference team - it's easier to justify to the committee that I didn't rank UNI because they lost a close game at Iowa (while at least 25 other teams won a game) than to explain how that close loss dropped the Panthers from #8 to out of my poll entirely.

Consistency in how you determine your list is the key - pick a method and stick with it.
I have an issue with that. A poll shouldn't be entirely about record. A team losing a one score game to a B10 is a **** load more impressive than a CAA team beating the **** out of a NEC, PFL, PL, or MEAC team. Or do you mean to tell me that a PFL team that beat a NAIA is better and should be ranked over NDSU should they drop their FBS game this year? I mean, should that happen you wouldn't rank them, right? A loss doesn't, and shouldn't equal a drop in a poll. If that's the case then teams that win 8 games in the PFL should be ranked a head of teams from the MVFC or Big Sky that had 4 or 5 conference wins.

Rank the team not the record.

I'm trying to be nice about that system but ranking based on record first is insanity.

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[BisonTru]

Or do you mean to tell me that a PFL team that beat a NAIA is better and should be ranked over NDSU should they drop their FBS game this year?

We don't have a FBS game this year. Most of the almighty FBS put us on the "do not answer" list after K State.

[clenz]

We don't have a FBS game this year. Most of the almighty FBS put us on the "do not answer" list after K State.
My point remains the same. It would be silly not to rank Nova, NDSU, Illinois State, UNH or Chatty if they all played an FBS school and lost.

I hope the committee would reject a poll that said "Nope, none of those. However, Duquesne, South Dakota and VMI laid pretty damn big beat downs on those NAIA schools and so they should be top 10"

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[ursus arctos horribilis]

I have an issue with that. A poll shouldn't be entirely about record. A team losing a one score game to a B10 is a **** load more impressive than a CAA team beating the **** out of a NEC, PFL, PL, or MEAC team. Or do you mean to tell me that a PFL team that beat a NAIA is better and should be ranked over NDSU should they drop their FBS game this year? I mean, should that happen you wouldn't rank them, right? A loss doesn't, and shouldn't equal a drop in a poll. If that's the case then teams that win 8 games in the PFL should be ranked a head of teams from the MVFC or Big Sky that had 4 or 5 conference wins.

Rank the team not the record.

I'm trying to be nice about that system but ranking based on record first is insanity.

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well clenz, people would also have an issue with your philosophy. You get your own vote and if you have a logic to it then so be it.

There a couple of hard and fast rules that are abided by and from there questions are asked to help voters hone their ballots but that is basically up to the voter as to their philosophy.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

My point remains the same. It would be silly not to rank Nova, NDSU, Illinois State, UNH or Chatty if they all played an FBS school and lost.

I hope the committee would reject a poll that said "Nope, none of those. However, Duquesne, South Dakota and VMI laid pretty damn big beat downs on those NAIA schools and so they should be top 10"

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

In the first few weeks a ballot like that could go to committee but it would be accepted based on the simple argument. "how do we know what any of these teams really are yet?". His ballot has been questioned and has always passed muster when the debate was had...in the first few weeks. His system starts rolling and working very well about the same time that everyone else has a pretty solid understanding of where teams might be headed...week 4 or 5.

Early voting is extermely subjective.

If you'd like we could devise a point system to test week 1 ballots and I could go compare his and yours over the past few years just to see where they stand against each other after the preseason vote is over? It won't mean anyone has to change anything but I think you'd be surprised at how things work out.

[grizband]

In the first few weeks a ballot like that could go to committee but it would be accepted based on the simple argument. "how do we know what any of these teams really are yet?". His ballot has been questioned and has always passed muster when the debate was had...in the first few weeks. His system starts rolling and working very well about the same time that everyone else has a pretty solid understanding of where teams might be headed...week 4 or 5.

Early voting is extermely subjective.

If you'd like we could devise a point system to test week 1 ballots and I could go compare his and yours over the past few years just to see where they stand against each other after the preseason vote is over? It won't mean anyone has to change anything but I think you'd be surprised at how things work out.
This is why I've always thought polls shouldn't begin until week four or five. Not everyone agrees with that viewpoint, and I understand why they start in week 1.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

This is why I've always thought polls shouldn't begin until week four or five. Not everyone agrees with that viewpoint, and I understand why they start in week 1.

In theory I've always thought that as well. I can tell you that a guy voting in the first few weeks will have a better ballot than that same guy waiting until week 4 though. I mean if the guy puts any thought into it anyway.

Actually everybody is better. This is a really cool thing about the poll as a group. After the poll comes out a lot of people share their ballots and they get picked apart and because of that arguments are had and a much better product from everyone as a whole comes from it.

[grizband]

In theory I've always thought that as well. I can tell you that a guy voting in the first few weeks will have a better ballot than that same guy waiting until week 4 though. I mean if the guy puts any thought into it anyway.

Actually everybody is better. This is a really cool thing about the poll as a group. After the poll comes out a lot of people share their ballots and they get picked apart and because of that arguments are had and a much better product from everyone as a whole comes from it.
I remember people sharing polls when I last participated. The community aspect is a great part of the poll.

[Gangtackle11]

Top 30
Bryant Bulldogs
Cal Poly Mustangs
Charleston Southern Buccaneers
Chattanooga Mocs
Coastal Carolina Chanticleers
Eastern Kentucky Colonels
Eastern Washington Eagles
Fordham Rams
Idaho State Bengals
Illinois State Redbirds
Indiana State Sycamores
Jacksonville State Gamecocks
James Madison Dukes
Liberty Flames
McNeese State Cowboys
Montana Grizzlies
Montana State Bobcats
New Hampshire Wildcats
North Dakota State Bison
Northern Iowa Panthers
Richmond Spiders
Sacred Heart Pioneers
Sam Houston State Bearkats
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
Southern Illinois Salukis
Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks
Villanova Wildcats
William & Mary Tribe
Youngstown State Penguins

[superman7515]

Wow. Just a quick peak through teams knocks my list down to 47 with no thought required.

When I thought about it, I couldn't come up with 20 that I thought should be ranked in the Top 25... xlolx

[Evolution Prime]

Cal Poly
Central Arkansas
Chattanooga
Coastal Carolina
Eastern Illinois
Eastern Kentucky
Eastern Washington
Fordham
Idaho State
Illinois State
Indiana State
Jacksonville State
James Madison
Liberty
McNeese State
Montana
Montana State
New Hampshire
North Dakota State
Northern Iowa
Richmond
Sacred Heart
Sam Houston State
Samford
South Dakota State
Southeastern Louisiana
Stephen F. Austin
Villanova
William & Mary
Youngstown State

[clenz]

In the first few weeks a ballot like that could go to committee but it would be accepted based on the simple argument. "how do we know what any of these teams really are yet?". His ballot has been questioned and has always passed muster when the debate was had...in the first few weeks. His system starts rolling and working very well about the same time that everyone else has a pretty solid understanding of where teams might be headed...week 4 or 5.

Early voting is extermely subjective.

If you'd like we could devise a point system to test week 1 ballots and I could go compare his and yours over the past few years just to see where they stand against each other after the preseason vote is over? It won't mean anyone has to change anything but I think you'd be surprised at how things work out.
Last year was really the first time I've committed to submitting every week. I've always had a personal but never submitted.

I did some looking on last year though from where I had teams week 1 to where I had them in the final week



Final

Wk 1
Change


1: North Dakota State Bison

3
2


2: Illinois State Redbirds

28
26


3: New Hampshire Wildcats

10
7


4: Northern Iowa Panthers

1
-3


5: Coastal Carolina Chanticleers

5
0


6: Villanova Wildcats

6
0


7: Chattanooga Mocs

13
6


8: Sam Houston State Bearkats

15
7


9: Eastern Washington Eagles

2
-7


10: South Dakota State Jackrabbits

8
-2


11: Indiana State Sycamores

NR
40


12: Montana Grizzlies

9
-3


13: Southeastern Louisiana Lions

4
-9


14: Liberty Flames

30
16


15: James Madison Dukes

31
16


16: Jacksonville State Gamecocks

19
3


17: Richmond Spiders

18
1


18: Montana State Bobcats

26
8


19: Eastern Kentucky Colonels

35
16


20: Fordham Rams

7
-13


21: Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks

NR
40


22: Youngstown State Penguins

20
2


23: Idaho State Bengals

NR
40


24: William & Mary Tribe

NR
40


25: Sacred Heart Pioneers

NR
40





I'll compare it to the AGS final at some point today

[ursus arctos horribilis]

When I thought about it, I couldn't come up with 20 that I thought should be ranked in the Top 25... xlolx

You are one tough cookie.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Last year was really the first time I've committed to submitting every week. I've always had a personal but never submitted.

I did some looking on last year though from where I had teams week 1 to where I had them in the final week



Final

Wk 1
Change


1: North Dakota State Bison

3
2


2: Illinois State Redbirds

28
26


3: New Hampshire Wildcats

10
7


4: Northern Iowa Panthers

1
-3


5: Coastal Carolina Chanticleers

5
0


6: Villanova Wildcats

6
0


7: Chattanooga Mocs

13
6


8: Sam Houston State Bearkats

15
7


9: Eastern Washington Eagles

2
-7


10: South Dakota State Jackrabbits

8
-2


11: Indiana State Sycamores

NR
40


12: Montana Grizzlies

9
-3


13: Southeastern Louisiana Lions

4
-9


14: Liberty Flames

30
16


15: James Madison Dukes

31
16


16: Jacksonville State Gamecocks

19
3


17: Richmond Spiders

18
1


18: Montana State Bobcats

26
8


19: Eastern Kentucky Colonels

35
16


20: Fordham Rams

7
-13


21: Stephen F. Austin Lumberjacks

NR
40


22: Youngstown State Penguins

20
2


23: Idaho State Bengals

NR
40


24: William & Mary Tribe

NR
40


25: Sacred Heart Pioneers

NR
40





I'll compare it to the AGS final at some point today

cool man. It emphasizes a point in that we all have some misses for sure in as far under or over valuation.

[KPSUL]

This is why I've always thought polls shouldn't begin until week four or five. Not everyone agrees with that viewpoint, and I understand why they start in week 1.
I apologize for getting off topic, but don't you need to add CCU to your list of visiting team winners?

[grizband]

I apologize for getting off topic, but don't you need to add CCU to your list of visiting team winners?
It's been updated.

Here is my top 30 list:

Cal Poly
Central Arkansas
Chattanooga
Coastal Carolina
Eastern Kentucky
Eastern Washington
Fordham
Harvard
Idaho State
Illinois State
Indiana State
Jacksonville State
James Madison
Liberty
McNeese State
Montana
Montana State
New Hampshire
North Dakota State
Northern Iowa
Richmond
Sam Houston State
Samford
South Dakota State
Southeastern Louisiana
Stephen F. Austin
Villanova
Western Carolina
William & Mary
Youngstown State