Predict the next team to announce move up to FBS and the next team to drop football

[UNH Fanboi]

AGS, what are your predictions? State one official guess for each question. Bonus points if you correctly name the FBS conference.

[citdog]

unh to the SEC

[The Cats]

Predict the next team to announce move up to FBS - UT Chattanooga


and the next team to drop football - The Citadel xprayx

[CID1990]

Predict the next team to announce move up to FBS - UT Chattanooga


and the next team to drop football - The Citadel xprayx

Drop football? That would be like WCU adding football.

[Laker]

Move up to FBS- App State

Move down to FCS- Idaho

Dropping football- now I assume that you mean a FCS team and not a FBS team? Hmmm. I haven't studied this at all. I would guess a team in the Northeast? Would Monmouth be thinking about it?

[Apphole]

Next team to announce: Georgia Southern (They will announce just before ASU does even though it is basically the same time because of how zealous their athletic department has become about the whole thing.

Bonus: The SunBelt Conference.


Next team to drop football: This one is WAY harder. It's tough because the kind of programs that would drop are the kind you aren't likely to hear of too often. I guess I'll go with Georgia State. xlolx

[danefan]

Move Up - App State
Drop Football - Nichols State

[Laker]

Had to add potential conferences-

Move up to FBS- App State- forgot to say Sun Belt

Move down to FCS- Idaho to the Big Sky.

Dropping football- now I assume that you mean a FCS team and not a FBS team? Hmmm. I haven't studied this at all. I would guess a team in the Northeast? Would Monmouth be thinking about it?

[citdog]

Bonus: The SunBelt Conference.





only time those words have ever been uttered anywhere around each other.

[Apphole]

only time those words have ever been uttered anywhere around each other.

Sunbelt > SoCon in every conceivable way sans travel costs. Shut up already.

[citdog]

Sunbelt > SoCon in every conceivable way sans travel costs. Shut up already.


http://images.t-nation.com/forum_images/1/8/185e5_ORIG-cool_story_bro_4.jpg

[Apphole]

http://images.t-nation.com/forum_images/1/8/185e5_ORIG-cool_story_bro_4.jpg

Has no valid response. Posts meme.

[superman7515]

Move up: Georgia Southern to Sun Belt
Drop football: Drake

[ASUMountaineer]

Has no valid response. Posts meme.

xlolx

[citdog]

Has no valid response. Posts meme.


Jeff Sagarin has my back. Historically the bletch has been rated lower than than the SoCon and as we all know I base ALL my smack on HISTORY and not what has occurred recently. It is INCREDIBLY important to be CONSISTENT.






http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4YLUVDPFbQ

[frozennorth]

i'm gonna go with a long shot. Illinois state to the mac.

[SU_IT_able]

Sunbelt > SoCon in every conceivable way sans travel costs. Shut up already.

I'm guessing you've never set foot in Troy, AL. xlolx

[Apphole]

Jeff Sagarin has my back. Historically the bletch has been rated lower than than the SoCon and as we all know I base ALL my smack on HISTORY and not what has occurred recently. It is INCREDIBLY important to be CONSISTENT.


HISTORICALLY, the Confederate States of America existed. That sure as hell doesn't make it true now.

You abandoned your consistency when you posted "what have you done for me lately" in regards to ASU owning our series/CIt beating us last year.

[Apphole]

I'm guessing you've never set foot in Troy, AL. xlolx

Couldn't be worse than Cuttaweed, NC and at least they have a great program.

[citdog]

HISTORICALLY, the Confederate States of America existed. That sure as hell doesn't make it true now.

You abandoned your consistency when you posted "what have you done for me lately" in regards to ASU owning our series/CIt beating us last year.


don't be a cock your WHOLE life........take a day off occasionally.

was being self deprecating and BELIEVE me when you have ALL THIS it's hard.

[Apphole]

don't be a cock your WHOLE life........take a day off occasionally.

was being self deprecating and BELIEVE me when you have ALL THIS it's hard.

I'm a devout *** hole, what can I say?

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

Move Up: GSU

I think Drake is almost on its last stand WRT to football, I think they drop.

[ASUMountaineer]

don't be a cock your WHOLE life........take a day off occasionally.

was being self deprecating and BELIEVE me when you have ALL THIS it's hard.

xlolx He has "ALL THAT," and that's why he sells (or used to sell) used cars. xthumbsupx

[citdog]

xlolx He has "ALL THAT," xthumbsupx


I was referring to my physique. Pear shaped is what's cool RIGHT NOW.

[ASUMountaineer]

I was referring to my physique. Pear shaped is what's cool RIGHT NOW.

Word...

[TheRevSFA]

to move up? Georgia Southern, Appalachian State to the Sun Belt

to drop to D2? Nicholls.

to drop football totally? St Francis, PA

[Appaholic]

Move up: Ga Southern

Drop: I'd say Western, but they've already dropped haven't they? Or do they just not show?

[dgtw]

UP:Georgia Southern
DROP:UNC-Charlotte

[CID1990]

Move up: Ga Southern

Drop: I'd say Western, but they've already dropped haven't they? Or do they just not show?

They have yet to add football

[walliver]

Move to FBS (not up): GSU to Sunbelt (ASU may have to wait to the next round if the westernmost teams in the SBC want a western team)
Drop football: Davidson

[marenlee]

How about moving past the obvious gsu and asu moving up? Who's next after them?

[Laker]

How about moving past the obvious gsu and asu moving up? Who's next after them?

NDSU????????;);)

[Babar]

To move up (other than ASU, GSU): Liberty

To drop football (from FCS to nothing): Georgetown

Bonus: the first conference to drop football completely will be the Ivy League, and it will happen within ten years.

[Saint3333]

Move to FBS (not up): GSU to Sunbelt (ASU may have to wait to the next round if the westernmost teams in the SBC want a western team)
Drop football: Davidson

That is an interesting call. I can see DC dropping football. I was shocked they turned down a move to the CAA. It had to be for travel reasons, so why fly your football team all over the country.

[Laker]

To move up (other than ASU, GSU): Liberty

To drop football (from FCS to nothing): Georgetown

Bonus: the first conference to drop football completely will be the Ivy League, and it will happen within ten years.

Have things really gotten that bad that they would even consider that? I just can't imagine that happening.

[citdog]

How about moving past the obvious gsu and asu moving up? Who's next after them?

The Citadel and VMI to form the 'War League' featuring

Hudson High
Canoe U
Colorado Springs Golf Instruction School
The Citadel
VMI
Duke
Wake Forest
Richmond
William and Mary

[Babar]

Have things really gotten that bad that they would even consider that? I just can't imagine that happening.

I think when it happens it will happen suddenly. The concussion research we're funding with the Big Ten will culminate in a report. Or another report will appear from left field. Or one of the presidents will decide to go out on a limb. The thing is, it'll only take one of the Big 3. Maybe even just one of the others. The rest of the IL won't keep playing if one institution declares it's dangerous to players and "doesn't fit our mission or identity."

The biggest supporters are older alums, and each year tilts the focus farther from football. It's not even what brings most alums back to campus--at Princeton it's not even the biggest sport on campus.

[Laker]

The biggest supporters are older alums, and each year tilts the focus farther from football. It's not even what brings most alums back to campus--at Princeton it's not even the biggest sport on campus.

That would be a sad day. With all of the history in the Ancient Eight it would be a sad day for college football.

[CID1990]

The Citadel and VMI to form the 'War League' featuring

Hudson High
Canoe U
Colorado Springs Golf Instruction School
The Citadel
VMI
Duke
Wake Forest
Richmond
William and Mary

Lol wouldn't that be an awesome conference?

[CID1990]

Move up: Marshall
Drop football: Boston University

[walliver]

The Citadel and VMI to form the 'War League' featuring

Hudson High
Canoe U
Colorado Springs Golf Instruction School
The Citadel
VMI
Duke
Wake Forest
Richmond
William and Mary

Maybe these guys could form a team: http://news.yahoo.com/another-survivalist-development-idaho-182136900.html

[Ivytalk]

I think when it happens it will happen suddenly. The concussion research we're funding with the Big Ten will culminate in a report. Or another report will appear from left field. Or one of the presidents will decide to go out on a limb. The thing is, it'll only take one of the Big 3. Maybe even just one of the others. The rest of the IL won't keep playing if one institution declares it's dangerous to players and "doesn't fit our mission or identity."

The biggest supporters are older alums, and each year tilts the focus farther from football. It's not even what brings
most alums back to campus--at Princeton it's not even the biggest sport on campus.

Babar, you've just driven me to drink! I am an older alum!:(

Seriously, I'll say App State to the SunBelt, and the next to drop football will be URI.

[Ivytalk]

Move up: Marshall
Drop football: Boston University

Rip van CIDkle!:p

[Babar]

Babar, you've just driven me to drink! I am an older alum!:(

Seriously, I'll say App State to the SunBelt, and the next to drop football will be URI.

Just never alone and never till you can't tell the good bourbon from the bad, friend! I could see URI next.

[DFW HOYA]

I think when it happens it will happen suddenly. The concussion research we're funding with the Big Ten will culminate in a report. Or another report will appear from left field. Or one of the presidents will decide to go out on a limb. The thing is, it'll only take one of the Big 3. Maybe even just one of the others. The rest of the IL won't keep playing if one institution declares it's dangerous to players and "doesn't fit our mission or identity."


Fix the helmets and adjust the rules. This is an eminently solvable problem.

[Sader87]

Move "up": One of the many "directional" or geographically-based state schools

Drop football: A school that is actually an institution of higher learning.

[HailSzczur]

Move up: App to Sunbelt

Drop: Georgetown to flag football

[Skjellyfetti]

Jeff Sagarin has my back. Historically the bletch has been rated lower than than the SoCon and as we all know I base ALL my smack on HISTORY and not what has occurred recently. It is INCREDIBLY important to be CONSISTENT.


Oh, you mean the kind of history where you substitute your own facts as necessary? (Kinda like your version of mid-19th century history? ;))

xrolleyesx



2012:
Sun Belt - 9
SoCon - 14

2011:
Sun Belt - 12
SoCon - 17

2010:
SoCon - 12
Sun Belt - 16

2009:
Sun Belt - 13
SoCon - 15

2008:
Sun Belt - 13
SoCon - 14

2007:
SoCon - 10
Sun Belt - 13

2006:
Sun Belt - 13
SoCon - 17

2005:
Sun Belt - 13
SoCon - 16

2004:
Sun Belt - 12
SoCon - 18

2003:
Sun Belt - 13
SoCon - 17

2002:
Sun Belt - 12
SoCon - 17

2001:
SoCon - 15
Sun Belt - 16



Since the Sun Belt began sponsoring football in 2001...

The Sun Belt has finished higher in Sagarin's ratings 9 times.
The SoCon has finished higher in Sagarin's ratings 3 times.



xcoffeexxcoffeexxcoffeex

[citdog]

Oh, you mean the kind of history where you substitute your own facts as necessary? (Kinda like your version of mid-19th century history? ;))

xrolleyesx












xcoffeexxcoffeexxcoffeex


Glad to see that 20 more free rides and MILLIONS OF LOST DOLLARS get you a godaddy.com bowl bid and a conference that SOMETIMES is better than a FCS Confederation.


I NEVER have to make up facts about the 2nd American Revolution. It's not necessary because they, along with the founding documents of the late union, are ALL ON OUR SIDE.


Deo Vindice

[citdog]

Move "up": One of the many "directional" or geographically-based state schools

Drop football: A school that is actually an institution of higher learning.


snob much?


holy cross is nothing special. at least 100 places to get the same education with the same experience.


and with ACTUAL FCS Football too

[darell1976]

Move up App State
Move down Idaho
Drop football Valpo

[CID1990]

Rip van CIDkle!:p

Huh? I think my prediction is quite sound.

[DFW HOYA]

holy cross is nothing special. at least 100 places to get the same education with the same experience.
and with ACTUAL FCS Football too

Holy Cross actually has a unique experience (a Catholic liberal arts college, not a university) and a fairly large stadium (Fitton Field, 23,500). Football used to be big time there, much bigger than most I-AA schools can claim. The hope is that 60 scholarships brings back better times to HC.

[iBOsbu]

App to Sunbelt
JMU to MAC??? (becuase Umass to new big east???)

We just moved to CAA.. Although unlikely because of the new northern teams.. I would hate if URI drops football.

Georgetown Hoyas might drop??? they were against PL adding scholarships

[BlackNGoldR3v0lut10n]

App State and Georgia Southern -> Sun Belt
Drop football - no one.

[THE HERD]

I sure hope Appy makes one trip to the Fargo Dome at least before moving up. I think moving to FBS is ultimitaley in NDSU's plans, I just don't think it will be for a few years, unless you start to see a mass exodus of the upper tier teams in the FCS(App, G.Southern, Montana etc.) Really it all probably depends on when/if we get an invite to an FBS conference, although I don't think we would just go to any old conference. I guess the only conferences that would potentially work would be the MAC, MWC or something similiar. It would be really interesting to see if we would go in the next one or two years if we actually got in invite from one of these conferences. I definitely think we would compete well in those types of conferences, but I have mixed feelings about moving up. Although like I said if App, G. Southern, Montana, Mont. St start all leaving in the near future, I definitely say move up as well. Heres to App St. in the Fargo Dome this coming Decemberxthumbsupx

[laxVik]

PSU should move back to D2. Yes I said it. The viks glory days (wins and attendance) was in D2 when UO and OSU stunk. PDX is a finicky sports town and PSU will never average 10K or above in attendance. Period. Sad testimony is that if D3 Linfield's stadium held more people they'd average more than PSU.

[ASUMountaineer]

I sure hope Appy makes one trip to the Fargo Dome at least before moving up. I think moving to FBS is ultimitaley in NDSU's plans, I just don't think it will be for a few years, unless you start to see a mass exodus of the upper tier teams in the FCS(App, G.Southern, Montana etc.) Really it all probably depends on when/if we get an invite to an FBS conference, although I don't think we would just go to any old conference. I guess the only conferences that would potentially work would be the MAC, MWC or something similiar. It would be really interesting to see if we would go in the next one or two years if we actually got in invite from one of these conferences. I definitely think we would compete well in those types of conferences, but I have mixed feelings about moving up. Although like I said if App, G. Southern, Montana, Mont. St start all leaving in the near future, I definitely say move up as well. Heres to App St. in the Fargo Dome this coming Decemberxthumbsupx

How about you guys come down to the not-so-inviting confines of KBS? :)

A trip to the dome would be pretty cool.

[citdog]

How about you guys come down to the not-so-inviting confines of KBS? :)

A trip to the dome would be pretty cool.


nothing intimidating about KBS. score a few TD's and the app st 'fans' pour out of that place like when my cousin Moses parted the Red Sea.

[Apphole]

nothing intimidating about KBS. score a few TD's and the app st 'fans' pour out of that place like when my cousin Moses parted the Red Sea.

I don't think you'll find any school at any level that will have a full/rowdy stadium when they trail by 3-4 TDs.

[asumike83]

nothing intimidating about KBS. score a few TD's and the app st 'fans' pour out of that place like when my cousin Moses parted the Red Sea.

On the other hand, maybe y'all would have two straight wins over App if a few of your 'fans' stuck around to see the comeback attempt in 2011.

[CID1990]

On the other hand, maybe y'all would have two straight wins over App if a few of your 'fans' stuck around to see the comeback attempt in 2011.

Maybe we'll take care of that this year!

[ASUMountaineer]

nothing intimidating about KBS. score a few TD's and the app st 'fans' pour out of that place like when my cousin Moses parted the Red Sea.

I know you had a hard-on for App State, but you'll notice the :) which indicated it was TIC. Keep trying Citdog...

Oh, did you agree to the bet, or are you still not ready to back up you claim?

[Hambone]

i'm gonna go with a long shot. Illinois state to the mac.

This one I like. Although with basketball being the more popular sport at ISU a move to the MAC would only work from a football only membership perception. I do like it, though.

Drop football: St Francis PA

[carney2]

Dropping football- now I assume that you mean a FCS team and not a FBS team? Hmmm. I haven't studied this at all. I would guess a team in the Northeast? Would Monmouth be thinking about it?

A stab in the dark, and not a very good one. If Monmouth drops - and it could happen to many schools, I guess - they won't be at the front of the line.

MOVING UP? The obvious: Appalachian State, Georgia Southern, Liberty and James Madison. Not at the front of the line, but how about Stony Brook?

GETTING OUT? This list will get a lot longer over the next few years. Going with the obvious, how about Columbia, Drake, Rhode Island, St. Francis (PA), and a pick 'em from the Big South, NEC and Pioneer?

[Pard4Life]

A stab in the dark, and not a very good one. If Monmouth drops - and it could happen to many schools, I guess - they won't be at the front of the line.

MOVING UP? The obvious: Appalachian State, Georgia Southern, Liberty and James Madison. Not at the front of the line, but how about Stony Brook?

GETTING OUT? This list will get a lot longer over the next few years. Going with the obvious, how about Columbia, Drake, Rhode Island, St. Francis (PA), and a pick 'em from the Big South, NEC and Pioneer?

Columbia will never drop football, c2. They are eternally locked in their cosmic dance with the other 7, and the team has too many rich benefactors behind it.

My guess is that it will be out of the Pioneer or NEC... a private school with struggling enrollment and endowment issues... if one fits the profile.

[Babar]

Columbia will never drop football, c2. They are eternally locked in their cosmic dance with the other 7, and the team has too many rich benefactors behind it.

My guess is that it will be out of the Pioneer or NEC... a private school with struggling enrollment and endowment issues... if one fits the profile.

It won't be money that pushes the change in the IL, it'll be safety and culture.

Not sure Columbia would be the first to go, in any case. But you're right that they'll all keep dancing together. If somebody drops it, others will. And then everybody will.

[Redbirdz]

Jacksonville State to Sunbelt.

[Pard4Life]

It won't be money that pushes the change in the IL, it'll be safety and culture.

Not sure Columbia would be the first to go, in any case. But you're right that they'll all keep dancing together. If somebody drops it, others will. And then everybody will.

Ah right, was not thinking of the safety angle. Ivy is usually first to innovate in college football; they were concerned about safety 100 years ago. I think the game would be changed before it is completely eliminated. I was watching Rugby Sevens earlier and noted how fundamentally different they tackle.

[UNH Fanboi]

Ah right, was not thinking of the safety angle. Ivy is usually first to innovate in college football; they were concerned about safety 100 years ago. I think the game would be changed before it is completely eliminated. I was watching Rugby Sevens earlier and noted how fundamentally different they tackle.

Rugby players tackle in a safer manner because they don't wear helmets. Helmets have ultimately made football less safe.

[Babar]

Rugby players tackle in a safer manner because they don't wear helmets. Helmets have ultimately made football less safe.

Possibly. It may have a lot more to do with lots of subconcussive hits than the huge open-field explosions. Rugby may wind up showing some of the same problems. Hockey almost certainly will. There's just less scrutiny of those sports because fewer people play them.

[Tealblood]

The next to move up outside of the obvious 2 ---Liberty, or Coastal, or JMU

The next to move down members of the big south go non-scholly minus CCU and Liberty

[gr8ness97]

Up: the obvious two, plus UNC-Charlotte

Down: Idaho and Idaho State

Drop: A Pioneer League team

[Catproud61]

unh to the SEC

Okay but we don't want to hear it when they complain that we are dominating the SEC !

[Ivytalk]

Columbia will never drop football, c2. They are eternally locked in their cosmic dance with the other 7, and the team has too many rich benefactors behind it.

My guess is that it will be out of the Pioneer or NEC... a private school with struggling enrollment and endowment issues... if one fits the profile.
Agree about Columbia, especially the "cosmic dance" part. Very good!xsmileyclapxxbowx

[Ivytalk]

It won't be money that pushes the change in the IL, it'll be safety and culture.

Not sure Columbia would be the first to go, in any case. But you're right that they'll all keep dancing together. If somebody drops it, others will. And then everybody will.

And that would be a sad day, Babar, but I don't think it will come to that. I still think that football is so ingrained in the Ivy "culture," such as it is, that the sport will be preserved despite falling attendance. Even though the current "millennial" generation doesn't seem to care much about the sport, the IL does a remarkable job of selling "tradition" and living in the past.

[walliver]

I wouldn't be surprised if one or two Big South teams go to non-scholarship football. Presbyterian most likely. They have a long football tradition, but the D-I transition hasn't worked out well for them. If some combination of CCU, Liberty, and VMI leave the Big South, their auto bid leaves with them, and PC, GW, and CSU has no where to go, and a competitive PFL team may be more desirable than a non-competitive scholarship team. CSU might even be a candidate to drop football.

[Pard4Life]

And that would be a sad day, Babar, but I don't think it will come to that. I still think that football is so ingrained in the Ivy "culture," such as it is, that the sport will be preserved despite falling attendance. Even though the current "millennial" generation doesn't seem to care much about the sport, the IL does a remarkable job of selling "tradition" and living in the past.

Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Lafayette and Lehigh are essentially "one game" schools. Nobody shows up for games except "the big one" at the end of the year. Penn seems to attract reasonable attendance on its own annually (12,000+) and so does Yale. Our 'big games' drag everyone else along, I sense. Millennials do care for that one game, or if the team wins, or has some national motivation to attend. See recent Harvard and Cornell basketball success.

In hockey, you still have high hits, the boards (a solid, nearly immovable object), and guys skating as fast as 25mph. I don't know about subconcussive hits in rugby, but it seems like when guys are getting hit in the open field, it's not 'knock 'em out of your shoes' hits... more like 'let me grab on and tear your shorts off' hits. And I remember reading awhile ago that head injuries in rugby account for less than 2% of injuries in the sport. Even if you get rid of the helmet in football, violence will still remain; it has been an issue even before the helmet era and you would need a sea change in culture and fundamentals. But, anything would be better than watching Ed Reed launch his shoulder or head into ball carriers' head.

[catamount man]

Moving up by 2020: App, Ga Southern, JMU, Liberty and N.Dakota State.
Dropping: Idaho, I don't see HOW they can maintain I-A independent status past 2014.
Dropping football: Sadly, I can see the Ivy league doing such. Too many liberal minds there warp common sense. Other than anybody from the NE, I don't see it. ETSU is coming back, all over the south smaller schools are adding it on an almost daily basis.
By 2020, God only knows what the SoCon will look like?

[Brad82]

URI has new weight room & training facility due to open this summer. Feel it will give them an edge in recruiting.
There is a plan for about $2.2M fund raising effort for synthetic turf and lights at Meade. That should be in place in 2 years (hopefully).
Scheduling a # of attractive guarantee games to help raise more $$ for asst. coaches salaries.
They are studying the UNH model closely to see what makes them so successful under less than ideal circumstances.
FB brings too many people to campus and too much in the works to drop-just what I am told and believe.
Never say never,but I will believe it (dropping FB) when I see it.

[hebmskebm]

Rugby players tackle in a safer manner because they don't wear helmets. Helmets have ultimately made football less safe.

Players getting bigger, faster, and stronger have made the game less safe. In the days of helmetless football, it was routine to have a few players a year die during the season. Helmets may make a few idiots feel like they're invincible, leading to poor tackling techniques, but they unquestionably do more good than harm.

[DFW HOYA]

I'll take a contrary view--private schools that have football seems to be as or more committed than they have been in previous years. By contrast,, the pressure on margins at the second-level state and HBCU programs with legislative budget cutbacks is a more pressing danger. Columbia won't be under any financial pressure to drop sports, but can Nicholls or Mississippi Valley State say the same?

[Pard4Life]

I'll take a contrary view--private schools that have football seems to be as or more committed than they have been in previous years. By contrast,, the pressure on margins at the second-level state and HBCU programs with legislative budget cutbacks is a more pressing danger. Columbia won't be under any financial pressure to drop sports, but can Nicholls or Mississippi Valley State say the same?

Right, good point... I'll add that to my "small private school with struggling enrollment and endowment issues" criteria.

[citdog]

endowment issues" .


REGARDLESS of how much money y'all have the ENTIRE patriot league suffers from the above.

[Go Green]

And that would be a sad day, Babar, but I don't think it will come to that. I still think that football is so ingrained in the Ivy "culture," such as it is, that the sport will be preserved despite falling attendance. Even though the current "millennial" generation doesn't seem to care much about the sport, the IL does a remarkable job of selling "tradition" and living in the past.

There's also the matter that most Ivy schools have made multi-million dollar improvements to their football facilities in recent years. No one at Penn (for example) is going to be thinking about dropping football for a while after the Weiss Pavillion has opened.

And you can't discuss "falling attendance" without also mentioning the explosion of television coverage and/or webcast for Ivy games in recent years. Ten years ago, I'd watch one or two Dartmouth games by making a long trip. Past few years, I've seen most of Dartmouth's games via either on TV or the web.

[Dave195]

Monmouth to the Big Ten & Rutgers to the NEC :)

[dgtw]

Since numbers really don't matter for Ivy football (they don't use their AQ), would the league still sponsor football as an official league sport if only five members played the sport?

[Model Citizen]

Drop football Valpo

I disagree. Using football as a tool to get tuition paying male students is important to them, regardless of the results on the field. If they needed wins to justify the program, football would have disappeared from Valpo years ago.

Keep an eye on Georgetown. Not keeping up with scholarships in their league...seemingly unwilling to change leagues. Not building new facilities. Where are they headed?

[Babar]

Since numbers really don't matter for Ivy football (they don't use their AQ), would the league still sponsor football as an official league sport if only five members played the sport?

I don't think the potential AQ threshold would be significant, but I think the peer pressure would be huge. Nobody would want to have to explain why the other Ivies had dropped the sport for safety reasons but it was still plenty safe to play at _______. And it will get hard to justify reserving X number of admit slots per year for football when the other Ivies aren't. That's why I think once one drops, especially if it's one of the Big 3, everybody else will follow. I hope I'm wrong, though. I hope they figure out some ways to fix the game while preserving it.

[DFW HOYA]

Keep an eye on Georgetown. Not keeping up with scholarships in their league...seemingly unwilling to change leagues. Not building new facilities. Where are they headed?

Doing fine, thank you. May not be willing to offer scholarships, but may be willing to consider other alliances if the PL is no longer interested or practical (see "basketball, Big East").

[Go...gate]

I was referring to my physique. Pear shaped is what's cool RIGHT NOW.

Hear, hear!!!

[Go...gate]

Georgetown and Monmouth are in it for the long haul.

[Model Citizen]

... may be willing to consider other alliances if the PL is no longer interested or practical (see "basketball, Big East").

Since I am not a Big East basketball fan, please describe this concept. If Georgetown leaves Patriot football, who will be on the Hoyas schedule in October and November? Don't tell me you'll play Ivy leaguers after the first week in October. That's not happening.

[Go Green]

That's why I think once one drops, especially if it's one of the Big 3, everybody else will follow.

I think that any Ivy that dropped football would risk being booted from the league. Maybe that wouldn't make too much of a difference for a member of the Big 3, but for the other 5, being part of the "Ivy League" is a huge part of their brands.

[THE HERD]

How about you guys come down to the not-so-inviting confines of KBS? :)

A trip to the dome would be pretty cool.

In December?! No way man its too cold down there.xlolx

[ASUMountaineer]

In December?! No way man its too cold down there.xlolx

xlolx

[Southern Bison]

How about you guys come down to the not-so-inviting confines of KBS? :)

A trip to the dome would be pretty cool.

You'll have a good crowd of Bison fans just from the Carolinas that would jump like a duck on a junebug to see NDSU @ KBS!!

[ASUMountaineer]

You'll have a good crowd of Bison fans just from the Carolinas that would jump like a duck on a junebug to see NDSU @ KBS!!

Sounds good to me. We may be looking for another home opponent for this year. Pull some strings, SB!

[Southern Bison]

Sounds good to me. We may be looking for another home opponent for this year. Pull some strings, SB!

What are y'all's open dates? Looks like 9/14, 9/21, & 11/2 are open for the Bison right now.

[ASUMountaineer]

What are y'all's open dates? Looks like 9/14, 9/21, & 11/2 are open for the Bison right now.

9/14 and 9/21 are open, but one of them will be against Elon.

[Saint3333]

First week in January is wide open.

[DFW HOYA]

Since I am not a Big East basketball fan, please describe this concept. If Georgetown leaves Patriot football, who will be on the Hoyas schedule in October and November? Don't tell me you'll play Ivy leaguers after the first week in October. That's not happening.

Obviously, this would not be the preferred option, but I would suggest it could end up with NEC teams, a Marist or Davidson, or a couple of MEAC or Patriot teams that have an early bye filling out the slate, with the season ending in the first week of November.

Then again, if the scenario is going 0-7 in the PL every year, Georgetown could just as easily take 0-7 in the CAA or Big South, too, which is less likely.

The best case scenario was discussed last year.

http://georgetownfootball.blogspot.com/2012/02/opportunity.html

[citdog]

Obviously, this would not be the preferred option, but I would suggest it could end up with NEC teams, a Marist or Davidson, or a couple of MEAC or Patriot teams that have an early bye filling out the slate, with the season ending in the first week of November.

The best case scenario?

http://georgetownfootball.blogspot.com/2012/02/opportunity.html

the MEAC? just how long do you think your alumni would tolerate losing by 35pts to SC State?

[DFW HOYA]

the MEAC? just how long do you think your alumni would tolerate losing by 35pts to SC State?

Georgetown has won two of its last three over Howard and could probably schedule Del State or Morgan if it had to.

[citdog]

Georgetown has won two of its last three over Howard and could probably schedule Del State or Morgan if it had to.


PEER institutions ALL

[ElCid]

My predictions have a Baptist theme...for no particular reason.

The next team to drop football entirely:

Baptist College (AKA Charleston Southern) -
- Average attendance is south of 2300
- Big South on verge of collapse
- No historic football legacy (begin football in 1985, Div IAA in 1993)
- Relatively small enrollment (3300 undergrad and grad)
- Record last 5 years - 12-34 (Div I only), 19-35 (overall)


The next team to actually announce the move up to FBS (and not just talk about it endlessly):

Liberty University - They have stated intentions and some will say it is a bit of a long shot but....
- Average attendance is 16K+ and stadium is expanding
- Big South on verge of collapse (better to move up as an FBS independent if they don’t get an invite rather than languish as an FCS independent)
- Relatively young football program (begin football in 1973, Div IAA in 1989), but they have been fairly successful (over .500)
- Adequate enrollment (13K+ undergrads)
- Record last 5 years - 34-17 (Div I only), 39-17 (Overall)

[DFW HOYA]

PEER institutions ALL

No, but technically neither are any Patriot League schools.

Agree above on Liberty--there is a manifest destiny for Liberty to want to be at the I-A level.

[The Moody1]

My predictions have a Baptist theme...for no particular reason.

The next team to drop football entirely:

Baptist College (AKA Charleston Southern) -
- Average attendance is south of 2300
- Big South on verge of collapse
- No historic football legacy (begin football in 1985, Div IAA in 1993)
- Relatively small enrollment (3300 undergrad and grad)
- Record last 5 years - 12-34 (Div I only), 19-35 (overall)


The next team to actually announce the move up to FBS (and not just talk about it endlessly):

Liberty University - They have stated intentions and some will say it is a bit of a long shot but....
- Average attendance is 16K+ and stadium is expanding
- Big South on verge of collapse (better to move up as an FBS independent if they don’t get an invite rather than languish as an FCS independent)
- Relatively young football program (begin football in 1973, Div IAA in 1989), but they have been fairly successful (over .500)
- Adequate enrollment (13K+ undergrads)
- Record last 5 years - 34-17 (Div I only), 39-17 (Overall)


Liberty won't be the next to go FBS because there are several other schools that conferences will want before them. You can no longer move up to FBS as an Independant.

[ElCid]

Liberty won't be the next to go FBS because there are several other schools that conferences will want before them. You can no longer move up to FBS as an Independant.

Is that an NCAA rule or are you saying it is just not practical. I must have missed it if it is a rule.

[ElCid]

Liberty won't be the next to go FBS because there are several other schools that conferences will want before them. You can no longer move up to FBS as an Independant.


Is that an NCAA rule or are you saying it is just not practical. I must have missed it if it is a rule.

Nevermind. I did miss it. Must have been brain dead that year. Makes sense. I still think Liberty is a top 5 candidate, but agree there may be hotter prospects.

[frozennorth]

i hate to say it but liberty might get an invite before the others.

[Apphole]

i hate to say it but liberty might get an invite before the others.

They aren't on the Sun Belt radar. You thinking MAC?

There's also the stigma against religious extremism to consider...

Liberty is stuck in the Big South for a while IMO.

[ElCid]

They aren't on the Sun Belt radar. You thinking MAC?

There's also the stigma against religious extremism to consider...

Liberty is stuck in the Big South for a while IMO.

You mean like BYU?

[Apphole]

You mean like BYU?

Does BYU have a very public anti-gay stance like Liberty?

[citdog]

Does BYU have a very public anti-gay stance like Liberty?


it's worse than that.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HSlbuli7HM&list=WLT-Y-cXUMi_OMZV4m9NAJO9IIdf1sRj5v

[ElCid]

Does BYU have a very public anti-gay stance like Liberty?


They have their beliefs. You may personally think they are extreme, but your opinion does not count towards establishing their beliefs. If you think it is justifiable to bar them from a football conference for simply voicing their beliefs, then you are discriminating against them. They are exercising their opinion.

Thankfully, the number of people who actually discriminate against other people's political or religious beliefs is still relatively low. And that discrimination is usually carried out by a small core of zealots who want to silence all opposition to the "cause de jure." Again, and thankfully, anyone who sincerely stands up for what they believe is right will usually be supported; at the very least in order to exercise that right.

We all know how the Chick-fillet thing worked out....

I do not think Liberty needs to worry too much about this boogieman issue in regard to football.

[Skjellyfetti]

They have their sexual orientation. You may personally think they are a sinners, but your opinion does not count towards establishing morality. If you think it is justifiable to bar them from a university for simply voicing their sexuality, then you are discriminating against them.

Thankfully, the number of people who actually discriminate against other people's political or religious beliefs or sexuality is still relatively low. And that discrimination is usually carried out by a small core of zealots who want to silence all opposition to the "cause de jure." Again, and thankfully, anyone who sincerely stands up for what they believe is right will usually be supported; at the very least in order to exercise that right.

FIFY.

xcoffeex

[citdog]

FIFY.

xcoffeex


it takes courage to come out. glad for you lubeboy!

[CID1990]

Know what the queers and the bible thumpers have in common? The homos like to define themselves by their sexuality, and the religios are happy to oblige them. Sounds like a match made in heaven.

[ElCid]

FIFY.

xcoffeex

I don't see them voting against anyone joining a conference because of it. So you can claim it is the same, but everyone sees right through that charade. I am glad you came out also.xsmiley_wix

[dgtw]

Does BYU have a very public anti-gay stance like Liberty?

The Mormon Church was actively involved in the gay marriage vote in California.

[boonegoon]

The Mormon Church was actively involved in the gay marriage vote in California.

For or against? I have seen in places that some mormons support the right for gay marriage so they can have their right to plural marriage.

[Laker]

For or against? I have seen in places that some mormons support the right for gay marriage so they can have their right to plural marriage.

I can't remember the number- was it Prop 8 in California? Anyway, the LDS was very much against gay marriage and put a lot of effort into defeating it.

[Sly Fox]

Wow, this has been insightful. And for the record, Liberty is very much on the Sun Belt radar and has been for some time. Granted we are behind the two SoCon schools in the SBC's pecking order, but we are very much under consideration. And yes, we recognize that our religious stance doesn't play well with many university presidents. Although our views on the issue referenced above are often completely misunderstood.

[Skjellyfetti]

I don't think Liberty's religious conservatism would hurt much with the Sun Belt schools.

There was talk about it hurting BYU when they were being mentioned for the Pac 12... because there are more liberal schools in the conference that would be more likely to take a stand against a religiously conservative school.

I can't imagine Troy, Arkansas State, ULL, etc. taking a stand against religious conservatism in the Bible Belt. They'd be roasted by their alumni.

[Go Green]

If you think it is justifiable to bar them from a football conference for simply voicing their beliefs, then you are discriminating against them. They are exercising their opinion.

BYU's social conservatism is only part of the story.

They also refuse to play on Sundays. That creates problems with some sports that other conferences don't want to deal with.

They also aren't considered a major research institution, which is a big reason they aren't in the Pac-10/12 or Big 10. (And its also the reason why Virginia Tech wasn't originally invited to the ACC way back when).

[Babar]

BYU's social conservatism is only part of the story.

They also refuse to play on Sundays. That creates problems with some sports that other conferences don't want to deal with.

They also aren't considered a major research institution, which is a big reason they aren't in the Pac-10/12 or Big 10. (And its also the reason why Virginia Tech wasn't originally invited to the ACC way back when).

And for all that BYU could be in the MWC, Big East, or Conference USA in a heartbeat if they so desired. And they might still be an option for the Big 12.

[Saint3333]

Wow, this has been insightful. And for the record, Liberty is very much on the Sun Belt radar and has been for some time. Granted we are behind the two SoCon schools in the SBC's pecking order, but we are very much under consideration. And yes, we recognize that our religious stance doesn't play well with many university presidents. Although our views on the issue referenced above are often completely misunderstood.

You're also behind Mizz St., Southland schools, and JMU (not that they are interested). I'd put Liberty ~6th in the pecking order.

[dgtw]

The Catholic church is opposed to abortion, won't allow women to be priests and had the child abuse scandal. but I'd bet the Pac 12 would take Notre Dame as a member.

[Go Green]

The Catholic church is opposed to abortion, won't allow women to be priests and had the child abuse scandal. but I'd bet the Pac 12 would take Notre Dame as a member.

Notre Dame also is willing to play on Sundays (as is SMU, Baylor, Georgetown, and pretty much everyone else).

Notre Dame is also more respected as a major research institution.

And even if you disagree with the politics of the Church, there's also debate about how rigorously Notre Dame imposes the Church's rules onto its students. If Notre Dame has thrown any of its kids out of school for having consensual premartial sex, I'm not aware of it.

[major095]

Alabama State has basically announced they are moving up. they just don't have a landing spot yet. with the death of the wac it seems that the ncaa would allow for the creation of another fbs conference to take their place. anyway, bama state has designs on the sunbelt as well. informally they were told they had to improve the competitiveness of all their athletic teams. new facilities for almost every sport now as well, they have replaced coaches that weren't winning. baseball now 4 - 0 to start the season. they are determined to move up and soon.

[superman7515]

http://toppatime.wordpress.com/2013/02/20/sbc-to-discuss-future/


The Sun Belt Conference and presidents and athletic directors of its member schools will meet March 9 and discuss future conference membership during the league’s annual basketball tournament in Hot Springs, Ark., according to sources.

The Sun Belt is losing Florida Atlantic, Florida International, Middle Tennessee and North Texas to Conference USA on July 1, leaving the league with 10 schools, eight of which field football programs. Georgia State, Texas State and Texas-Arlington join the conference this summer

No invitations to prospective schools have been issued at this time, but current administrators will discuss the possible additions of Appalachian State, Delaware, Georgia Southern, Idaho, James Madison and New Mexico State, among others.

Schools in the current geographical range of the Sun Belt stand a better chance of being invited to the 37-year-old league, according to one source.

[Laker]

App State, Delaware, GA Southern and James Madison would make much more sense geographically than Idaho and NM State. Adding four would give them 12 football teams and a playoff.

[ncbears]

The Catholic church is opposed to abortion, won't allow women to be priests and had the child abuse scandal. but I'd bet the Pac 12 would take Notre Dame as a member.

They also save the weak, and care for the poor.

[DFW HOYA]

Delaware is not moving, otherwise, if the Sun Belt wants to go all in, here's the lineup:

West
Ark State
Idaho
LA-Laf (SW Louisiana)
LA-Monroe (NE Louisiana)
NM State
Texas State (SW Texas)
Western Kentucky

East
App State
Georgia Southern
Georgia State
James Madison
Liberty
South Alabama
Troy

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Delaware is not moving, otherwise, if the Sun Belt wants to go all in, here's the lineup:

West
Ark State
Idaho
LA-Laf (SW Louisiana)
LA-Monroe (NE Louisiana)
NM State
Texas State (SW Texas)
Western Kentucky

East
App State
Georgia Southern
Georgia State
James Madison
Liberty
South Alabama
Troy

Liberty will join the Sun Belt for perhaps 2 years, then leave and become an FBS Independent, which is why the Sun Belt is hesitant to take them on.

[NoDak 4 Ever]

Delaware is not moving, otherwise, if the Sun Belt wants to go all in, here's the lineup:

West
Ark State
Idaho
LA-Laf (SW Louisiana)
LA-Monroe (NE Louisiana)
NM State
Texas State (SW Texas)
Western Kentucky

East
App State
Georgia Southern
Georgia State
James Madison
Liberty
South Alabama
Troy

That's exactly what you think of when you think FBS.

[WH49er]

The Sun Belt may close their doors for some time based on how the revenue sharing is determined.


http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/blog/jeremy-fowler/21599899/smaller-conferences-crafting-blueprint-for-playoff-revenue-sharing



If the 8 remaining schools are guaranteed a set amount in the 1st tier regardless of performance, there would be little to incentive to add schools unless they thought the school was a game changer and could gain the conference more money based on the 2nd and 3rd tiers.



The decision on ACC vs. Maryland is also a huge factor on whether or not the wheels are set in motion again.