The Looming Problem of CAA Football

[Lehigh Football Nation]

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/ncaa-division-i-sports/fcs-football/247-the-looming-problem-of-caa-football


For Albany and Stony Brook, two prestigious universities in the SUNY system, it's supposed to be a banner day for their football programs.

The Great Danes and Seawolves were announced yesterday as the newest members of the CAA football conference - a huge step up in weight class from their former conferences, the NEC and Big South, respectively.

For them, it's a great day.

But in the announcement of their inclusion in one of the best conferences in FCS football, plenty of questions remain about their CAA-sponsored football conference.

Too many, in fact.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

The UMBC argument is a bit off - if UMBC were to start a football program they would have to petition the CAA for inclusion as a new member and pass a 2/3 majority vote. Current CAA members can start football and automatically join (so, if say Drexel or George Mason suddenly wanted a football team, they're in) but AE members are no different in the eyes of the CAA than any other non-conference members.

Also, as far as TV deals go, the current bylaws allow the conference to negotiate any TV contracts on behalf of member institutions, no vote would be needed. If the AE schools felt they weren't being represented in a TV deal they could throw a fit, but they can't do anything to stop the deal from happening. They could, I suppose, band together to block any changes to the bylaws, but there aren't enough of them to change the bylaws on their own, and changes to the bylaws aren't something that really needs to happen very often if ever. Also, the current arrangement works for the AE teams. There aren't any other options for Northeast full scholarship FCS football.

Plus, even conferences which are by and large homogeneous, such as the Patriot League, aren't free from the effects of strife from member institutions with differing goals and priorities, as we've seen multiple times.

[nj alum]

I disagree that there is a looming problem. Most football conferences have stability issues right now...it is inherent in the landscape.

CAA football is likely to add 1 - 3 SoCon football schools in the next few weeks. That will bring full-time CAA numbers from 4 to 5 - 7.

Additionally, SB and Albany, within the next 3 years, will be full-time CAA members, IMO.

[Tribe4SF]

Love the headline, Chuck. The LOOMING problem. Like so many blogs these days, the article is nothing more than the fanciful musings of the writer.

Welcome Stony Brook, and Albany! CAA Football is stronger than it was two weeks ago, and is populated by schools who have a clear commitment to play in a top-level FCS conference. If UMBC (you're right...that was ridiculous) starts a program, and shows a similar commitment coupled with early success, they might be a good candidate. And if Lehigh remains at the top of a Patriot League that sees little competitive improvement, and no expansion from the addition of scholarships, they might be a good candidate as well.

[henfan]

Chuck, while I agree with you that the mish-mash of various conference allegiances will continue to be problematic for the CAA (as it was for the A-10 and YankCon post-1986), it's important to note that CAA members have a voice & vote in which schools may be admitted as members to CAA FB. CAA FB members do not have the same privilege when it comes to determining CAA membership. Additionally important to note that all members of the CAA automatically receive membership in CAA FB, whether a quorum of CAA FB approve or not. As Tribe4SF suggested, the CAA could very well invite members with FCS programs to the Association and schools like UR, VU, UMaine & UNH have absolutely no vote in determining their eligibility for CAA FB.

It's also important to recognize that, while the schools that have made up the CAA/A-10/YankCon conglomeration have had their differences over the last two and half decades, they have managed to keep it going and even become competitively stronger. The road ahead may continue to be rocky with constant change in membership but there's no end in sight.

[bluehenbillk]

Who really shot JFK? LFN knows....

[aceinthehole]

Additionally important to note that all members of the CAA automatically receive membership in CAA FB, whether a quorum of CAA FB approve or not. As Tribe4SF suggested, the CAA could very well invite members with FCS programs to the Association and schools like UR, VU, UMaine & UNH have absolutely no vote in determining their eligibility for CAA FB.

Exactly. This is the 'back door' that the CAA has on CAA Football memebership. IMO the "looming problem" doesn't really exist on the football side.

However, do you think the CAA will get consensus on additional all-sports members (other than Charleston)? This is an internal CAA discussion/debate. For example, does all the CAA memebers really want an Elon/Furman? Sure, if addmited they automatically would get CAA Football memebrship (which the 'affiliates" couldn't stop), but does NU, Hofstra, Drexel, GMU even want Elon/Furman for hoops?

I think the CAA all sports expansion is more complex than FB. Getting to 10 is pretty easy for the CAA. But what is the risk/reward for going to 12 on the hoops side? Will they be adding value or diluting the CAA brand?

[ccd494]

That "looming problem" also assumes that Maine and UNH would care in the least about making sure that America East got taken care of in this arrangement.

Neither school cares about basketball, ergo neither school is going to stomp its feet to get GMU or Delaware hoops into Orono or Durham.

I've said it before but America East is probably the third highest priority for each school, behind maintaining Hockey East as one of the nation's premiere hockey conferences, behind staying tied to the big East Coast FCS schools, and honestly for Maine, behind being in a conference that sponsors baseball.

[jmufan]

Who really shot JFK? LFN knows....

Ask LBJ.

[henfan]

I think the CAA all sports expansion is more complex than FB. Getting to 10 is pretty easy for the CAA. But what is the risk/reward for going to 12 on the hoops side? Will they be adding value or diluting the CAA brand?

Spot on. Clearly, expansion in the Association is more complex than with CAA FB, which is likely why its taking longer to announce additions on that side of the ledger.

[nj alum]

For example, does all the CAA memebers really want an Elon/Furman? Sure, if addmited they automatically would get CAA Football memebrship (which the 'affiliates" couldn't stop), but does NU, Hofstra, Drexel, GMU even want Elon/Furman for hoops?

I think the CAA all sports expansion is more complex than FB. Getting to 10 is pretty easy for the CAA. But what is the risk/reward for going to 12 on the hoops side? Will they be adding value or diluting the CAA brand?

NU, Hofstra, Drexel, GMU want CofC and Davidson. CofC and Davidson aren't coming without Elon / Furman. Furman has previously been pursued by the CAA, as have CofC and Davidson...don't know about Elon. It's a compromise, something that's occurred before in the CAA...and will occur again when SB and Albany join for all sports.

[fc97]

elon was pursued by the caa in 2001/2002, back when we were independent in football, before the big south sponsored. the reason elon went the socon route was strictly because they sponsored football.

[WMTribe90]

Exactly. This is the 'back door' that the CAA has on CAA Football memebership. IMO the "looming problem" doesn't really exist on the football side.

However, do you think the CAA will get consensus on additional all-sports members (other than Charleston)? This is an internal CAA discussion/debate. For example, does all the CAA memebers really want an Elon/Furman? Sure, if addmited they automatically would get CAA Football memebrship (which the 'affiliates" couldn't stop), but does NU, Hofstra, Drexel, GMU even want Elon/Furman for hoops?

I think the CAA all sports expansion is more complex than FB. Getting to 10 is pretty easy for the CAA. But what is the risk/reward for going to 12 on the hoops side? Will they be adding value or diluting the CAA brand?

You're right in assuming that GMU, Drexel, Hofstra, and NU probably aren't wild about adding a Furman and/or Elon, and wouldn't vote for their addmission on an individual basis. However, Yeager is going to present this to GMU, Drexel, Hofstra and NU as a package (i.e., all or nothing type deal). The only school that might come by themsleves is CoC. Beyond them, I think we are looking at a package deal that would involve at least three schools (i.e., Davidson, CoC and Elon). I imagine the b-ball schools would be willing to hold their noses and vote in Elon in order to get CoC and Davidson in the fold.

Edit: NJ beat me to the punch. Compromise is the key and I think the FB-first and B-ball schools will meet in middle and keep both sports strong in the CAA.

[DFW HOYA]

This could have easily been titled The Looming Problem of NEC Football:


With just eight schools remaining, half of which eye a move to 63 scholarships and half which would rather not, what is the future viability of the NEC?

Or, The Looming Problem of Patriot Football


"Imagine a league where if any founding member withdraws from the league, football is rendered defunct as a conference. Imagine if merely one ACC school or one Big East school held the entire future of the league in their hands. Crazy? Such are the bylaws of the Patriot League, which relies on two associate members with increasingly diverging philosophies and five other members that absolutely must stay together--or perish--to keep the league solvent."

In fact, this is the best case scenario for the CAA--it reestablishes the framework for scholarship football for the northern schools, reestablishes a more regional footprint for the southern tier, and reestablishes the groundwork for the CAA to compete in basketball against the A-10 (or 14, or 16), a league that is quickly in danger of becoming too big for its own good.

[aceinthehole]

elon was pursued by the caa in 2001/2002, back when we were independent in football, before the big south sponsored. the reason elon went the socon route was strictly because they sponsored football.

But that was a long time ago. That was when the CAA had mass defections and was on the brink of collapse. Since then they have had 2 Final Four apperances and have a national TV contract with NBC Sports.

I won't pretent to know what the CAA will do, but by making these FB-only additions in the North, it is clear the focus is on BASKETBALL. IMO - Any CAA expansion members must add value to hoops first and foremost; football will be an afterthought.

[UNH Fanboi]

I eagerly await Part II of this article detailing how these membership additions were secretly foisted upon the CAA by Comcast because they have a broadcast van based in Poughkeepsie.

[aceinthehole]

You're right in assuming that GMU, Drexel, Hofstra, and NU probably aren't wild about adding a Furman and/or Elon, and wouldn't vote for their addmission on an individual basis. However, Yeager is going to present this to GMU, Drexel, Hofstra and NU as a package (i.e., all or nothing type deal). The only school that might come by themsleves is CoC. Beyond them, I think we are looking at a package deal that would involve at least three schools (i.e., Davidson, CoC and Elon). I imagine the b-ball schools would be willing to hold their noses and vote in Elon in order to get CoC and Davidson in the fold.

Edit: NJ beat me to the punch. Compromise is the key and I think the FB-first and B-ball schools will meet in middle and keep both sports strong in the CAA.

I agree, and Charleston is the key right now. If they are willing to come to the CAA alone, there is very little incentive to go to 12. The hoops schools will very likey balk at a Davidson/Elon or Davidson/Furman "package deal" to get to 12 on the hoops side.

[fc97]

it isnt about it being long ago, it is about the fact that furman, charleston, elon and others were all pursued in a failed move in the past. so there is precedent that a core group of schools were on board with them in the past when their athletic departments were much worse.

and sure, the caa has had 2 final four appearances, but only 1 out of the group that remains.

i think also that charleston doesnt want to go to a sucky baseball league, since, like many other socon schools, baseball gets a lot of donations. bringing that program down might hurt.

[nj alum]

I won't pretent to know what the CAA will do, but by making these FB-only additions in the North, it is clear the focus is on BASKETBALL. IMO - Any CAA expansion members must add value to hoops first and foremost; football will be an afterthought.

Respectfully, you're wrong.

It's been hinted that UNH and Maine were going to bolt, CAA football was in trouble, and SB and Albany were approached. If football was an afterthought, that would not have occurred.

The focus is on CofC and Davidson, and the CAA will do what it has to to allow as many SoCon members in so that CofC and Davidson come in. After that occurs, IMO, Albany and SB will also be added for all sports, simply because Stony Brook baseball is a sweetener for CofC which is facing baseball resistance.

[NHwildEcat]

Respectfully, you're wrong.

It's been hinted that UNH and Maine were going to bolt, CAA football was in trouble, and SB and Albany were approached. If football was an afterthought, that would not have occurred.

The focus is on CofC and Davidson, and the CAA will do what it has to to allow as many SoCon members in so that CofC and Davidson come in. After that occurs, IMO, Albany and SB will also be added for all sports, simply because Stony Brook baseball is a sweetener for CofC which is facing baseball resistance.

Where were UNH & Maine going to go, more specifically, UNH. The only league I would think that would be the most fitting would be the PL, and I really doubt we would have been going there. Maine, I guess could threaten to move to the NEC, but what is the point of that.

[fc97]

elon baseball is also a sweetener for charleston baseball.

[Sandlapper Spike]

Would it be enough of a sweetener? There would still be a sizable gulf between the CAA and SoCon in baseball. Davidson doesn't offer much in that respect.

[MplsBison]

You guys are talking about baseball? Come on...

[fc97]

yes we are, it is popular down here, like hockey is popular up there. give it a rest

[MplsBison]

Respectfully, you're wrong.

It's been hinted that UNH and Maine were going to bolt, CAA football was in trouble, and SB and Albany were approached. If football was an afterthought, that would not have occurred.

The focus is on CofC and Davidson, and the CAA will do what it has to to allow as many SoCon members in so that CofC and Davidson come in. After that occurs, IMO, Albany and SB will also be added for all sports, simply because Stony Brook baseball is a sweetener for CofC which is facing baseball resistance.

The CAA is a basketball conference. If Albany and SB aren't brought in and Maine and UNH do leave, who cares? Maybe Delaware gets all huffy because their dreams come crumbling down. So what?

The important thing is the basketball conference and the TV deal for basketball. That's why the focus is bringing in name recognition bball teams, like CoC and Davidson. No SoCon football teams are on the table.

[fc97]

wrong again. there are 8 schools on the table right now. only two of them are named charleston and davidson. seriously, quit while youre not too far behind.

and the caa is a basketball FIRST conference. to say it is a basketball conference says that thats all they offer.

[MplsBison]

wrong again. there are 8 schools on the table right now. only two of them are named charleston and davidson. seriously, quit while youre not too far behind.

and the caa is a basketball FIRST conference. to say it is a basketball conference says that thats all they offer.

They don't offer football.

That's a completely separate entity. The CAA takes care of bball because that's the only important sport in the conference that matters. No other sport.


Elon and any other SoCon football school you claim is on the table has nothing to offer CAA bball.

[fc97]

answer my question, does the caa sponsor other sports? outside of the football conference (separate entity or not is run by the same commish) and logistics of which can be voted on by all caa members if you read the bylaws.

does the caa offer only basketball? and is the caa offering basketball-only membership?

and why does this all concern you so much?

[MplsBison]

answer my question, does the caa sponsor other sports? outside of the football conference (separate entity or not is run by the same commish) and logistics of which can be voted on by all caa members if you read the bylaws.

does the caa offer only basketball? and is the caa offering basketball-only membership?

and why does this all concern you so much?

For sports that matter, yes the CAA only sponsors men's basketball.

[fc97]

ah, so youre the expert on what sports matter. this is awesome to know.

i think you need to go and correct all the newspapers, sportswriters, twitter posters of sportswriters, BoTs, ADs, CAA officials, newsrooms and most importantly players and coaches to inform them of your finding. i think you also need to go talk to the charleston ad and tell them that baseball isnt important. you know, after his comments about baseball.

so roughly, youve proven you know really little about any of this.

recommendation. go read some before you post anymore.

[Sitting Bull]

it isnt about it being long ago, it is about the fact that furman, charleston, elon and others were all pursued in a failed move in the past. so there is precedent that a core group of schools were on board with them in the past when their athletic departments were much worse.

and sure, the caa has had 2 final four appearances, but only 1 out of the group that remains.

i think also that charleston doesnt want to go to a sucky baseball league, since, like many other socon schools, baseball gets a lot of donations. bringing that program down might hurt.

A sucky baseball league? Have I missed something with the SoCon? Have they ever had a team in the CWS or close?

I try to follow it a little but if any school from the SoCon would turn down the CAA because of baseball is missing the whole point.

[fc97]

i didnt say they would turn down based on baseball. i said there are more considerations for schools than just basketball.

and yes, the socon has had many CWS teams, they are a multiple bid league in baseball and usually 5-8 in conference rpi with 6-7 schools in the top 100 RPI. the big south is also of the same type performance.

[BucBisonAtLarge]

The CAA remains the premier FCS conference in football and the schools participating in it know that they have an asset. Adding Albany and Stony Brook shut down the possible fraying of the America East in all sports, further adding to the stability of the football conference. JMU would be the next all-sports bird off the wire due to football, but otherwise, look up-- this FCS conference just snagged two tournament football schools, added to their already formidable roster.

It would be wise to not add a Georgia State or Old Dominion Bowl Subdivision wannabe, and deal with the fluidity of all-sports conference membership by simply demanding better performance within the conference. There is a core there which, if committed, could provide such a platform. This however is a football page and whoever manages this collection of fb programs well, landing TV packages, limiting costs and promoting natural rivalries, will have a golden goose.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

In addition to basketball the CAA is one of the premier lacrosse leagues in D1, and is very strong across most olympic sports. Basketball and Football pay the bills (and the difference between CAA and CAA Football exists primarily for administrative purposes, they share the same staff and are run out of the same office, there's just no reason schools like Drexel or Northeastern should have a say in football matters, and no reason that football-only affiliates should have a say in all-other-sports matters) but lacrosse is big in the mid atlantic and northeast, and given that most of the CAA membership are flagship public or nationally recognized private institutions having a wide variety of competitive olympic sports is important.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Chuck, while I agree with you that the mish-mash of various conference allegiances will continue to be problematic for the CAA (as it was for the A-10 and YankCon post-1986), it's important to note that CAA members have a voice & vote in which schools may be admitted as members to CAA FB. CAA FB members do not have the same privilege when it comes to determining CAA membership.

CAA all-sport members have a voice and vote, but admission cannot go forward without 3/4s on both sides.


2.02 Membership shall be restricted to NCAA Division I Football Championship Subdivision institutions that award scholarships in the sport of football.

2.03 Active members of the Colonial Athletic Association (CAA") who sponsor Championship Subdivision championship caliber football shall be entitled to membership in the Conference if desired, by submitting a formal application and operational plan for approval by the Board of Directors no later than July 1, 2017. Membership applications from active CAA members received after July 1, 2017 will be considered in accordance with the process for non-active CAA members seeking membership.

...

2.05 Membership matters (including admission, probation suspension or expulsion) must be decided by an affirmative vote of at least three-fourths (3/4) of the members in “good standing”. Three-fourths of the CAA Football member institutions and three-fourths of the CAA member institutions must approve a new CAA Football member who is not an active CAA member. A member who would have its membership affected by the motion; has been suspended; or has announced its intention to terminate its membership in the Conference, is not eligible to vote on membership motions. Abstentions shall be considered “affirmative” votes for the purpose of this legislation. The three-fourths standard shall be rounded up to the next whole number.

Can you say "gridlock'?

[BlueHenSinfonian]

CAA all-sport members have a voice and vote, but admission cannot go forward without 3/4s on both sides.

Can you say "gridlock'?

Henfan is right. Both full CAA and CAA Football memberships have to pass a new CAA Football member, but CAA Football-only members don't get a vote on CAA All Sports members. You are quoting from the CAA Football handbook, which is a separate publication from the full CAA regs.



4.03 Membership matters (including admission, probation, suspension or expulsion) must be decided by an affirmative vote of at least three-fourths (3/4) of the members in “good standing”. A member who: would have its membership affected by the motion; has been suspended; or has announced their intention to terminate its membership in the Association, is not eligible to vote on membership motions. Abstentions shall be considered “affirmative” votes for the purposes of this legislation. The three-fourths standard shall be rounded up to the next whole number. [Adopted: June 28, 2000]

[dgtw]

Has there ever been talk of the CAA football schools breaking off and forming an all sports league and leaving the non-football schools to fend for themselves?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Henfan is right. Both full CAA and CAA Football memberships have to pass a new CAA Football member, but CAA Football-only members don't get a vote on CAA All Sports members. You are quoting from the CAA Football handbook, which is a separate publication from the full CAA regs.

Correct. CAA non-football members can effectively veto new football members, and CAA football members can also effectively veto new football members. And America East now has a large enough block in which no business in CAA football can go forward without their collective say-so.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Correct. CAA non-football members can effectively veto new football members, and CAA football members can also effectively veto new football members. And America East now has a large enough block in which no business in CAA football can go forward without their collective say-so.

But since what is good for CAA Football is also good for those organizations, there's no reason they'd shoot themselves in the foot. The only 'business' that requires a 3/4 vote is adding a new member, and as shown by the addition of SBU and Albany, the CAA Football teams can come together and recognize a good thing when they see it. TV Contracts are already handed over to the conference per the bylaws. If the AE schools really wanted to band together to block changes to how comp tickets are handed out to cheerleaders or bands, or what kinds of facilities have to be made available to the refs I guess they could, but they would have no reason to.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Has there ever been talk of the CAA football schools breaking off and forming an all sports league and leaving the non-football schools to fend for themselves?

The reason CAA Football exists is that the schools that have history playing football against each other and who value that relationship have rather disparate goals and priorities when it comes to other athletic matters. You have UNH and Maine which have strong hockey programs but don't put much of a focus on basketball, Villanova, Richmond and URI which are extremely basketball-centric, and Delaware and W&M who try to offer the most well rounded athletic departments possible offering the greatest number of scholarship sports. All of the organizations involved can come together and say they want to offer the highest quality FCS Football product possible, but for the other stuff there isn't a consensus. CAA Football allows the schools to find common ground on football, and go their own ways for other athletic matters.

[henfan]

And America East now has a large enough block in which no business in CAA football can go forward without their collective say-so.

In terms of membership decision, that is only true when it comes to awarding CAA FB membership to non-CAA members.

AEC schools cannot stop the CAA from adding additional Olympic members who also have FCS FB. For example, if the CAA decided that they wanted to invite, say, Elon tomorrow, then Elon would also receive an automatic invitation to CAA FB. UM, UNH, VU, UR, URI, etc. would have absolutely no vote in the matter.

[aceinthehole]

In addition to basketball the CAA is one of the premier lacrosse leagues in D1, and is very strong across most olympic sports. Basketball and Football pay the bills (and the difference between CAA and CAA Football exists primarily for administrative purposes, they share the same staff and are run out of the same office, there's just no reason schools like Drexel or Northeastern should have a say in football matters, and no reason that football-only affiliates should have a say in all-other-sports matters) but lacrosse is big in the mid atlantic and northeast, and given that most of the CAA membership are flagship public or nationally recognized private institutions having a wide variety of competitive olympic sports is important.

But this flies straight in the face of offering UA and SBU football-only memebrships, instead of all sports memeberships.

What other candidates out there could have offered the CAA solid programs like football, basketball, lax, and baseball in one package like the SUNYs?

[MplsBison]

ah, so youre the expert on what sports matter. this is awesome to know.

i think you need to go and correct all the newspapers, sportswriters, twitter posters of sportswriters, BoTs, ADs, CAA officials, newsrooms and most importantly players and coaches to inform them of your finding. i think you also need to go talk to the charleston ad and tell them that baseball isnt important. you know, after his comments about baseball.

so roughly, youve proven you know really little about any of this.

recommendation. go read some before you post anymore.

Baseball won't have any say in the matter. That's that.

[MplsBison]

i didnt say they would turn down based on baseball. i said there are more considerations for schools than just basketball.

and yes, the socon has had many CWS teams, they are a multiple bid league in baseball and usually 5-8 in conference rpi with 6-7 schools in the top 100 RPI. the big south is also of the same type performance.

When was the last SoCon team to make it all the way to the CWS?

[MplsBison]

The CAA remains the premier FCS conference in football and the schools participating in it know that they have an asset. Adding Albany and Stony Brook shut down the possible fraying of the America East in all sports, further adding to the stability of the football conference. JMU would be the next all-sports bird off the wire due to football, but otherwise, look up-- this FCS conference just snagged two tournament football schools, added to their already formidable roster.

It would be wise to not add a Georgia State or Old Dominion Bowl Subdivision wannabe, and deal with the fluidity of all-sports conference membership by simply demanding better performance within the conference. There is a core there which, if committed, could provide such a platform. This however is a football page and whoever manages this collection of fb programs well, landing TV packages, limiting costs and promoting natural rivalries, will have a golden goose.

Just playing devil's advocate: SB and Albany were only in the tournament last year because the Big South and NEC got auto-bids, which only happened because the playoffs expanded and the false rule requiring half the spots go to auto-bids if possible.

If it had correctly stayed at 16, neither would've gotten in the playoffs.


But that said, I'm sure both are capable of being as competitive as Maine.

[MplsBison]

In addition to basketball the CAA is one of the premier lacrosse leagues in D1, and is very strong across most olympic sports. Basketball and Football pay the bills (and the difference between CAA and CAA Football exists primarily for administrative purposes, they share the same staff and are run out of the same office, there's just no reason schools like Drexel or Northeastern should have a say in football matters, and no reason that football-only affiliates should have a say in all-other-sports matters) but lacrosse is big in the mid atlantic and northeast, and given that most of the CAA membership are flagship public or nationally recognized private institutions having a wide variety of competitive olympic sports is important.

Nothing untrue said there.

That said, basketball is the sole driver of the bus in this situation. Nothing else matters.

[MplsBison]

Has there ever been talk of the CAA football schools breaking off and forming an all sports league and leaving the non-football schools to fend for themselves?

The only full members of such a conference would be JMU, W&M, Towson and Delaware.

They'd be leaving GMU, Hofstra and UNCW behind.


(Football only: the AE 4 and Villanova - maybe RI)

[MplsBison]

But this flies straight in the face of offering UA and SBU football-only memebrships, instead of all sports memeberships.

What other candidates out there could have offered the CAA solid programs like football, basketball, lax, and baseball in one package like the SUNYs?

Membership offers to the CAA is going to be driven solely by how much the bball team can help maintain the TV contract. End

[nj alum]

But this flies straight in the face of offering UA and SBU football-only memebrships, instead of all sports memeberships.

What other candidates out there could have offered the CAA solid programs like football, basketball, lax, and baseball in one package like the SUNYs?

This whole process is very logical.

Hoops wants CofC and Davidson. That is going to require other SoCon teams to come as well. How many? No one is sure.

In the meantime, SB and Albany get added for football ... for now.

When the SoCon teams come on board, if there are spots remaining, SB and Albany get converted to all sports members, IMO.

[MplsBison]

This whole process is very logical.

Hoops wants CofC and Davidson. That is going to require other SoCon teams to come as well. How many? No one is sure.

In the meantime, SB and Albany get added for football ... for now.

When the SoCon teams come on board, if there are spots remaining, SB and Albany get converted to all sports members, IMO.

Why should other SoCon teams get a ride along?

CAA has UNCW. There. That's the other southern member.

If that's not good enough, then just stay in the SoCon.

[aceinthehole]

This whole process is very logical.

Hoops wants CofC and Davidson. That is going to require other SoCon teams to come as well. How many? No one is sure.

In the meantime, SB and Albany get added for football ... for now.

When the SoCon teams come on board, if there are spots remaining, SB and Albany get converted to all sports members, IMO.

Not happening. Albany and SBU are snug as a bug in the AE with this move. They honestly have little reason to leave right now.

I'm not 100% sure the CAA needs to add 2 hoops teams - Charleston may just be enough. Going past 10 teams, and certainly more than 12 teams, is a higher risk move right now.

We will see what happens next.

[Tim James]

CAA should just add all 3 non football SoCon schools(COC,Davidson,UNCG) and 1 more nothern school for football only (CCSU) and thats it. Boom. Done.

[nj alum]

Guys, not going to re-invent the wheel. Just follow the postings on caazone. Within last two days, three different posters from three different schools indicate that CofC, Davidson, Elon, Furman, and Wofford are going to CAA. This is similar to what was going to happen ten years ago before Richmond suddenly bolted to A-10, and caused the plan to unravel.

This, too, may unravel...but, as of now, this is the plan.

[Pard4Life]

LFN: how does this news conform to your UNH and Maine to the Patriot League views?

Why would the CAA invite two America East members if they were so concerned about losing control of the league?

[aceinthehole]

Guys, not going to re-invent the wheel. Just follow the postings on caazone. Within last two days, three different posters from three different schools indicate that CofC, Davidson, Elon, Furman, and Wofford are going to CAA. This is similar to what was going to happen ten years ago before Richmond suddenly bolted to A-10, and caused the plan to unravel.

This, too, may unravel...but, as of now, this is the plan.

Ok, if you think so. After addressing football with FB-only members, full CAA expansion must address hoops first and foremost. So let's look at your candidates:

IMO - Davidson would be the best get, although all indications from their head coach is that they are very happy with their current situation. I think the odds of them accepting an invite are 50/50.

Charleston has publically stated they are look at their options. They have a nice basketball pedigree (but only have 1 SoCon championship) and would be a good add. have higher possibility of accepting the invite 75%.

Wofford has had some recent success in the SoCon - winning 2 of the last 3 championships.

Elon has never been to the NCAAs in basketball and Furman's last appearance was in 1980. Why would 3/4 of the CAA approve these schools for membership - what do they offer in terms of value? Not saying it won't happen, but on the surface it does not make the CAA better, just bigger.

[Sandlapper Spike]

It is much more likely that just one SoCon school (College of Charleston) moves to the CAA than the everybody-and-the-kitchen-sink theory posted above.

Among other problems, I'm trying to see how the troika of schools apparently not excited about Stony Brook joining the CAA for all sports would be okay with so many new additions, most of which wouldn't benefit the northern hoops schools in any way.

What you're saying, essentially, is that in order to get Davidson to join the league the CAA would have to bring in three other schools. That can't be worth it for the existing CAA membership.

[Go...gate]

NJ Alum, I take it Villanova will stay put?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Albany and SBU are snug as a bug in the AE with this move. They honestly have little reason to leave right now.

That's true. The four AE schools have an incredible amount of power right now in the day-to-day operations of CAA football.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

LFN: how does this news conform to your UNH and Maine to the Patriot League views?

Why would the CAA invite two America East members if they were so concerned about losing control of the league?

Maybe they felt they had no choice. If UNH and Maine left, they'd have been at six football members total, and would have been a "JMU to the MAC" away from losing the autobid. And the only place a 63 scholarship UNH/Maine could have really gone, realistically, was the PL.

You wonder if UNH's AD said, "Give us some Northern teams, or we're gone." Those PL rumors weren't out there by accident.

[nj alum]

.What you're saying, essentially, is that in order to get Davidson to join the league the CAA would have to bring in three other schools. That can't be worth it for the existing CAA membership.

Option One is CofC, Davidson, App. St.

Option Two is CofC, Davidson, Furman, Elon, Wofford.

Carolina Sports Thoughts floated most of these schools months ago, and it's popped up again on the CAA boards.

I'm just repeating where the process apparently is. Questioning why certain members of the CAA would go for this is a waste of energy...they apparently have.

The only issues are whether the SoCon schools are coming, when, and how many, and those answers will possiby affect SB and Albany.

[DFW HOYA]

You wonder if UNH's AD said, "Give us some Northern teams, or we're gone." Those PL rumors weren't out there by accident.

Is the previous league talk about PL expansion, at this point, essentially over?

[Go...gate]

Is the previous league talk about PL expansion, at this point, essentially over?

Certainly seems to me there are not many other moves which can be made for PL football, unless the Big South collapses (VMI).

Looks like the BU all-sports addition, though IMO a good one, was not the gateway to other PL moves that it was thought to be.

[RichH2]

As it is playing out, it does appear that PL options are severely ltd . Absent other events a new football member seems unlikely. Will there be continued tremors in CAA. Perhaps but not necessarily involving schools which might consider a move to PL. It may well be that Bball will get another member first. Time will tell , perhaps the next round of movement. Agree with LFN that CAA does not look to be very stable.

[Sader87]

I still contend that Villanova will be in the PL within the decade...just makes too much sense.

No skin off my back if they don't join though....I like the fact that we have 6 PL games, 3 Ivies and 2 to play around with i.e. a CAA game and hopefully a FBS game down the road.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Option One is CofC, Davidson, App. St.

Option Two is CofC, Davidson, Furman, Elon, Wofford.

Carolina Sports Thoughts floated most of these schools months ago, and it's popped up again on the CAA boards.

I'm just repeating where the process apparently is. Questioning why certain members of the CAA would go for this is a waste of energy...they apparently have.

The only issues are whether the SoCon schools are coming, when, and how many, and those answers will possiby affect SB and Albany.

Adding one more southern football team makes sense - it would allow for an even 12 (given that URI seems to be sticking around) and allow for a North/South divisional split to allow more regional scheduling and to keep the travel-averse northern schools happy. Adding three southern football teams, I guess there could still be a divisional split with 7 in each, but how would it break down?

North:
Maine
UNH
URI
SBU
Albany
Nova
Delaware

South:
Towson
W&M
JMU
Richmond
Elon
Furman
Wofford

I guess that could work too, but with 7 teams in each division that's one less OOC game per season, or a move to 2 cross-division games per year, which becomes unbalanced with 7 teams per. Of course, I'm sure the scheduling pros have some means to get around that, it just seems clunky to me.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Is the previous league talk about PL expansion, at this point, essentially over?

I am not at all sure about that. There's simply too much evolution happening in the NEC, Big South, and CAA to say anything for certain.

[WMTribe90]

Adding one more southern football team makes sense - it would allow for an even 12 (given that URI seems to be sticking around) and allow for a North/South divisional split to allow more regional scheduling and to keep the travel-averse northern schools happy. Adding three southern football teams, I guess there could still be a divisional split with 7 in each, but how would it break down?

North:
Maine
UNH
URI
SBU
Albany
Nova
Delaware

South:
Towson
W&M
JMU
Richmond
Elon
Furman
Wofford

I guess that could work too, but with 7 teams in each division that's one less OOC game per season, or a move to 2 cross-division games per year, which becomes unbalanced with 7 teams per. Of course, I'm sure the scheduling pros have some means to get around that, it just seems clunky to me.

Agreed, seven team divisions, while doable is far from ideal. I think we'll see either one team (CoC) or three teams (CoC, Davidson and a football school) join the CAA. Main reason, I can see the b-ball schools in the CAA getting behind Elon to get Davidson and CoC, if that's what it takes. I don't think it would take adding three football schools (Wofford and Furman) to get Davidson. The b-ball schools have no incentive to add three football programs with relatively weak basketball.

There's and outside chance of ASU jumping, but my money would be on Davidson, CoC and Elon.

[tribefan40]

This makes more sense to me:

North:
Maine
UNH
URI
SBU
Albany
Nova

South:
Towson
W&M
JMU
Richmond
Elon
UDel

Just feels better and I would think Elon would move before Furman or Wofford. I suppose we'll see.

Edit: 90 Beat me to it. I'm with him.

[RichH2]

Death and taxes are sure things. Close behind is the absence of any indication of movement anywhere which would result in a.suitable football school appearing at our doorstep given the current state of affairs which admittedly are far from set in concrete. The interior machinations of other conferencesmay result in a candidat . Seems FCS is accepting the free agency philosophy so prevalent elsewhere. Schools are the free agents and leagues the owners. Perhaps we should plan a fantasy realignment board for AGS.

[HailSzczur]

I still contend that Villanova will be in the PL within the decade...just makes too much sense.

No skin off my back if they don't join though....I like the fact that we have 6 PL games, 3 Ivies and 2 to play around with i.e. a CAA game and hopefully a FBS game down the road.

Our AD has stated that we have all types of contingency plans for conference realignment, but they are all reactionary. We are not moving from the spot we are in now unless we have to. And basketball is the sport we care about, the sport we are looking out for the most. In other words you won't see Nova leaving the CAA unless
1) we go up in football (so unlikely I'm not sure it's even worth mentioning)
2) the CAA folds, becomes so uncompetitive that we are forced to take action

Sure Nova makes sense as a PL team. I just don't see us actually doing anything unless the status quo changes drastically.

[nj alum]

So, the SEC can make a 14 team conference work, but the CAA can't?

Once again, whether any of us like it or not, this appears to be what's on the table, and the ball is in the hands of the SoCon schools...App. St. or Elon, Furman, Wofford.

Funny thing, though. CAA football is set. CAA hoops is not. Wonder if the SoCon schools don't act by a certain date that SB and Albany come in for all sports?

[Tribe4SF]

So, the SEC can make a 14 team conference work, but the CAA can't?

Once again, whether any of us like it or not, this appears to be what's on the table, and the ball is in the hands of the SoCon schools...App. St. or Elon, Furman, Wofford.

Funny thing, though. CAA football is set. CAA hoops is not. Wonder if the SoCon schools don't act by a certain date that SB and Albany come in for all sports?

The SEC makes 14 teams work partly because they have 12 games to work with, and 13 in some years.

[aceinthehole]

Option One is CofC, Davidson, App. St.

Option Two is CofC, Davidson, Furman, Elon, Wofford.

Carolina Sports Thoughts floated most of these schools months ago, and it's popped up again on the CAA boards.

I'm just repeating where the process apparently is. Questioning why certain members of the CAA would go for this is a waste of energy...they apparently have.

The only issues are whether the SoCon schools are coming, when, and how many, and those answers will possiby affect SB and Albany.

A lot of people on this board have been watching the landscape closely, and you are treating what has been posted on those 2 sites as gospel. It isn't.

[aceinthehole]

The SEC makes 14 teams work partly because they have 12 games to work with, and 13 in some years.

Also because those 14 schools have a media value greater with a SEC with 12 or 10 teams (greater television inventory). Let's not comapre the SEC to the CAA in anything - the operating model is vastly different.

The CAA is not getting any more $$ by expanding to 14 teams and it complicates the existing dynamics of the league memebership. They just need to replacing departing members to maintain a high-quality mid-major hoops league.

[danefan]

The only reason to go to 14 is because it reprsents an effective takeover of the SoCon.

Other than that, I think we'll be at 12 come 2013.


And btw....I love that I can say "we". :D

[Lehigh Football Nation]

A 14 team SEC also works because they have a championship game to determine their overall conference winner, and don't have an FCS playoff to qualify for that starts right after Thanksgiving.

I'm not saying a 14 team CAA cannot work, but it requires some creative thinking to determine its conference champion the last weekend of the year.

[danefan]

A 14 team SEC also works because they have a championship game to determine their overall conference winner, and don't have an FCS playoff to qualify for that starts right after Thanksgiving.

I'm not saying a 14 team CAA cannot work, but it requires some creative thinking to determine its conference champion the last weekend of the year.

Will it really matter though?

A 14 team CAA would get 4+ bids every year in a 24 team playoff.

No one joins the CAA to win conference championships.

[nj alum]

A lot of people on this board have been watching the landscape closely, and you are treating what has been posted on those 2 sites as gospel. It isn't.

You're right...it's not gospel.

It's picking and choosing pieces of information, a very subjective process, combined with a knowledge of history.

The CAA hoops schools want Davidson. Davidson comes with a price. The CAA hoops schools are willing to pay a price. We're all going to find out what that price is.

Personally, I don't think Davidson is a good long term fit. I think SB and Albany are better long term fits.

But I'm beyond wasting time on who should be added, and who shouldn't. The process is coming to a conclusion, a bunch of SoCon schools are in play, and we're just waiting on who, when, and whether SB and Albany also come in.

[nj alum]

The SEC makes 14 teams work partly because they have 12 games to work with, and 13 in some years.

The SEC only plays 8 conference games. I don't think the 4 non-conference games have any bearing on how they work out the annual 8 game conference schedule for a 14 team conference.

[nj alum]

A 14 team SEC also works because they have a championship game to determine their overall conference winner, and don't have an FCS playoff to qualify for that starts right after Thanksgiving.

I'm not saying a 14 team CAA cannot work, but it requires some creative thinking to determine its conference champion the last weekend of the year.

I'll chalk this up to you just got out of bed.

The 12 team CAA figured out their champion without a championship game; what new hurdle does 14 present?

[DFW HOYA]

Another take: why does the CAA even need to look south of Richmond? How does it change the calculation if it starts approaching the NEC, PL schools, or even a Youngstown State?

[nj alum]

The only reason to go to 14 is because it reprsents an effective takeover of the SoCon.

Other than that, I think we'll be at 12 come 2013.


And btw....I love that I can say "we". :D

The theory being advanced, which makes sense to me, is that the replacements being contemplated for CofC and Davidson are certain public schools that Furman wants no part of...and that rather than wait for those state schools to come on board, and leave then, Furman might as well leave now.

While this theory may leave many scratching their heads, it makes complete sense to W&M and Richmond folks. First, W&M and Richmond left the SoCon for the very same reason in the 70's. Second, Furman was thinking of coming to the CAA ten years ago before that plan fell apart.

Take it for what it's worth.

[Sandlapper Spike]

Furman is part of a bloc within the SoCon that can prevent larger state schools from being admitted. The last two schools to join the league were Elon and Samford. The SoCon has not added a football-playing public school member since Georgia Southern in 1991.

It is probably true that Furman would want assurances from the league and fellow members about the future composition of the conference. The same could be said for Wofford and The Citadel (and Davidson, for that matter).

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I'll chalk this up to you just got out of bed.

The 12 team CAA figured out their champion without a championship game; what new hurdle does 14 present?

You mean, through a coin flip, which actually happened one year? That's no way to determine a champion. People on here think being "CAA champions" means nothing, but nothing could be further from the truth.

[OL FU]

Furman is part of a bloc within the SoCon that can prevent larger state schools from being admitted. The last two schools to join the league were Elon and Samford. The SoCon has not added a football-playing public school member since Georgia Southern in 1991.

It is probably true that Furman would want assurances from the league and fellow members about the future composition of the conference. The same could be said for Wofford and The Citadel (and Davidson, for that matter).

I hope all of this is simply conjecture. I do not want the Socon to fall apart

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Another take: why does the CAA even need to look south of Richmond? How does it change the calculation if it starts approaching the NEC, PL schools, or even a Youngstown State?

They need all-sports schools with football, no matter where they come from, but if you dip too far south, you have the same regionality problem you had earlier with Georgia State in the league. But people are floating Southern schools because that's where the schools are in both football and basketball.

The real problem is people want a replacement for Old Dominion - the third-best state flagship in a state, not too far south, with exceptional mid-major hoops available. This school just doesn't exist.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

They need all-sports schools with football, no matter where they come from, but if you dip too far south, you have the same regionality problem you had earlier with Georgia State in the league. But people are floating Southern schools because that's where the schools are in both football and basketball.

The real problem is people want a replacement for Old Dominion - the third-best state flagship in a state, not too far south, with exceptional mid-major hoops available. This school just doesn't exist.

In terms of what? As far as athletics go they have to fall in line behind UVA, VT, and JMU (just more history there) and possibly W&M. In terms of reputation and academics certainly behind UVA, VT and W&M with JMU being a coin-flip.

[aceinthehole]

They need all-sports schools with football, no matter where they come from, but if you dip too far south, you have the same regionality problem you had earlier with Georgia State in the league. But people are floating Southern schools because that's where the schools are in both football and basketball.

The real problem is people want a replacement for Old Dominion - the third-best state flagship in a state, not too far south, with exceptional mid-major hoops available. This school just doesn't exist.

1. Not true. At 11 CAA Football teams (with URI returning) they could easily get 1 more FB-only program for an even 12 - without any effect on the CAA.

2. True. There are no ODU or VCU clones out there. But at this time the basketball-focused schools that bring value and willing to join appear to be located south of Virginia.

[dgtw]

The reason CAA Football exists is that the schools that have history playing football against each other and who value that relationship have rather disparate goals and priorities when it comes to other athletic matters. You have UNH and Maine which have strong hockey programs but don't put much of a focus on basketball, Villanova, Richmond and URI which are extremely basketball-centric, and Delaware and W&M who try to offer the most well rounded athletic departments possible offering the greatest number of scholarship sports. All of the organizations involved can come together and say they want to offer the highest quality FCS Football product possible, but for the other stuff there isn't a consensus. CAA Football allows the schools to find common ground on football, and go their own ways for other athletic matters.

If it works for them, that's fine. I'm just not a big fan of hybrid leagues or a football only league. Things would seem to work better if everyone is singing from the same page of the hymnal.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

1. Not true. At 11 CAA Football teams (with URI returning) they could easily get 1 more FB-only program for an even 12 - without any effect on the CAA.

2. True. There are no ODU or VCU clones out there. But at this time the basketball-focused schools that bring value and willing to join appear to be located south of Virginia.

You seem to think a football construct with 8 affiliates and 4 all-sport members is perfectly healthy. I do not. You also seem to think adding more non-football schools will be a healthy development for CAA football. I do not.

[ccd494]

You mean, through a coin flip, which actually happened one year? That's no way to determine a champion. People on here think being "CAA champions" means nothing, but nothing could be further from the truth.

Why does it matter? Name me a scenario where someone tied for a CAA title isn't invited to the playoffs. There isn't one, barring everyone going 4-4.

There were big ties before, and pretty much everyone was fine with it.

This isn't the FBS where you have to have that "BIG TWELVE CHAMPION" title in order to get to the Fiesta Bowl.

[henfan]

Some wondered aloud when the CAA FB faced having only 9 teams that the league could, oooh, possibly be in its death knell. Interesting that some of the same folks now have issues with the league going beyond 9. Sheesh.xrotatehx

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Some wondered aloud when the CAA FB faced having only 9 teams that the league could, oooh, possibly be in its death knell. Interesting that some of the same folks now have issues with the league going beyond 9. Sheesh.xrotatehx

Which people were that?

If Albany & SBU were full CAA members we wouldn't be having this conversation.

[UNH Fanboi]

Which people were that?

If Albany & SBU were full CAA members we wouldn't be having this conversation.

How do Albany and Stony Brook destabilize the conference? They're going to gang up with UNH and Maine to blow-up the conference if they don't like their TV coverage? What conference would they join after destroying the CAA? Let me guess, the Patriot League?

[henfan]

Which people were that?

Gee, I wonder who that could have been? xlolx

We haven't heard the tired old "vital importance of determining a conference champ through round robin play" chestnut in months.

[ccd494]

How do Albany and Stony Brook destabilize the conference? They're going to gang up with UNH and Maine to blow-up the conference if they don't like their TV coverage? What conference would they join after destroying the CAA? Let me guess, the Patriot League?

We can tell him over and over again that Maine and UNH value the CAA Football membership over AE membership, but he won't believe it.

NEITHER school will do ANYTHING to possibly create a scenario where they aren't in a conference with UD/Villanova/W&M/JMU, etc. The day may come where the split happens, but it won't be Maine or UNH's doing.

Who are they going to die on that hill for to create a more AE-centric football league? UVM's basketball ambitions? CCSU's desire to join AE/CAAF? Please. I like CCSU, but it's not worth crapping all over a good thing to get them in AE.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

We haven't heard the tired old "vital importance of determining a conference champ through round robin play" chestnut in months.

The battle lines of this debate have been drawn eons ago. Some fans on this board feel that having a "conference champion" means nothing if you've got the postseason. And I (and the players, and the coaches, and the athletic department people, and many fans) feel otherwise.

There's a reason why there's no "debate" in college basketball to get rid of, say, the Big East Championship, or the ACC championship, because the champion is going to be in the NCAAs anyway.

And let's be clear: there are ways, within the confines of a 14-team conference, to determine a champion without a championship game. Matter of fact, I've detailed such a solution before. So it's not like I'm totally opposed to a 14 team conference in theory.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

We can tell him over and over again that Maine and UNH value the CAA Football membership over AE membership, but he won't believe it.

You're missing something. The real question is, are Maine and UNH going to willingly let go of the unbelievable power they have in the new configuration of CAA football?

There is no question Maine and UNH are in control here. Of course they value membership in the CAA football conference. They're driving the bus.

[danefan]

The battle lines of this debate have been drawn eons ago. Some fans on this board feel that having a "conference champion" means nothing if you've got the postseason. And I (and the players, and the coaches, and the athletic department people, and many fans) feel otherwise.

There's a reason why there's no "debate" in college basketball to get rid of, say, the Big East Championship, or the ACC championship, because the champion is going to be in the NCAAs anyway.

And let's be clear: there are ways, within the confines of a 14-team conference, to determine a champion without a championship game. Matter of fact, I've done so before.

Not being one involved in those discussion before.....I'll gladly throw my hat in the "Playoffs first....conference championship second" camp.

[ccd494]

The battle lines of this debate have been drawn eons ago. Some fans on this board feel that having a "conference champion" means nothing if you've got the postseason. And I (and the players, and the coaches, and the athletic department people, and many fans) feel otherwise.

The University of Maine has signage at its stadium commemorating conference championships in 2001 and 2002. Both are celebrated as such. I had to look up if, and with whom, Maine shared those titles with.

2001: Maine, Hofstra, Villanova and William & Mary all tied.

2002: Maine and Northeastern tied.

The ties don't diminish both teams being celebrated as conference champions.

[henfan]

Some fans on this board feel that having a "conference champion" means nothing if you've got the postseason. And I (and the players, and the coaches, and the athletic department people, and many fans) feel otherwise.

Hyperbole alert!

I don't pretend to speak for the players, the coaches, athletic department people, many fans, etc., (who does that?!), but I have to believe that many understand that there's some significance attached to winning conference titles, whether shared by multiple teams or won outright. How much significance is debatable, especially when compared with the higher goal of winning the NCAA national championship.

That said, CAA FB, like A-10 FB and the Yankee FB Conference before it, awards a conference championship each and every season; sometimes multiple teams share the title. As far as I've ever heard/read, the methodology used by CAA FB to determine its champion has always been a non-issue for all involved. If you know something I don't, please share.

[henfan]

The ties don't diminish both teams being celebrated as conference champions.

Agreed.

I could name each year that Delaware won a national championship, as I bet could many self-respecting Blue Hen. Doubtful that few of us could recite the years that the Hens won conference titles. Without looking it up, I couldn't even tell you how many they won. It's not that conference titles, Lambert Cups, etc. don't mean something; they just don't compare to and aren't as memorable as national titles.

[UNH Fanboi]

Conferences titles are more important to teams in conferences that have limited prospects of winning a national championship. In an ideal world each conference would have a round robin schedule, but nowadays with the constant threat of defections, size equals stability, which is more an important than the idealistic goal of having an undisputed conference champ.

The CAA is about as stable as any FCS conference other than the Ivy.

[GannonFan]

Conferences titles are more important to teams in conferences that have limited prospects of winning a national championship.

Bingo!

[DFW HOYA]

Conferences titles are more important to teams in conferences that have limited prospects of winning a national championship.

Not true. Conference titles are important where there is a tradition within the conference.

[mainejeff]

Just playing devil's advocate: SB and Albany were only in the tournament last year because the Big South and NEC got auto-bids, which only happened because the playoffs expanded and the false rule requiring half the spots go to auto-bids if possible.

If it had correctly stayed at 16, neither would've gotten in the playoffs.


But that said, I'm sure both are capable of being as competitive as Maine.

You mean Towson?

[Dane96]

HAHA...I was looking at one of three all-time cautions I received on this board. While I was slightly off on UMASS (off they wouldn't go...on in that they are not receiving ONE EXTRA DIME from the Commonwealth to support the move)...check this GEM OUT:

06-27-2007 08:05 PM #22 Dane96
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AGS FCS Champion


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Join Date:Jun 2003
Location:Boston, MA
Posts:7,080
Originally Posted by DFW HOYA
If Umass leaves the CAA, I guess the front runner is who...Lafayette?

(DANE96 Response)- "Albany...mark it down. Stony Brook would be #1 with the stadium and rides...but Hofstra won't go for it."


BOOM!