Big East Press Release - Villanova Football to Big East?

[Go...gate]

A portion of the statement released by the Big East about 90 minutes ago:

"The BIG EAST Conference Board of Directors also unanimously voted to continue working closely with Villanova University regarding its FBS football future and, in doing so, take into account its longstanding relationship and many contributions to the Conference over the past three decades to give all due consideration to a football membership application.

The Conference also fully supports the extensive, thoughtful and thorough process that Villanova is utilizing to evaluate its football program. To validate the BIG EAST Conference's support of Villanova and its potential admission as a football program, the Conference has committed to offer financial assistance to cover future costs incurred by Villanova to exploring BIG EAST football membership.

In addition and to further demonstrate its support and consideration, the Conference will pledge to waive the football entry fee if Villanova is admitted within the next three years into the Conference as a football playing member, provided that it satisfies the Conference’s requirements for membership and the NCAA’s requirements for membership. We are confident that Villanova's process will result in an outcome that's in the best interest of the University and its accomplished athletics program."

Wildcats and their fans, what say you?

[asumike83]

Follow-up question: would they build a new stadium or play off campus?

[Go...gate]

I have to think off-campus. Villanova Stadium is too small and they cannot expand in that neighborhood.

[49RFootballNow]

Follow-up question: would they build a new stadium or play off campus?

Or, is part of the deal with Temple to let Villanova share the Linc with them? A lot of Villanova's problems get solved quickly if it does. On the negative, the Eagles can't be happy if this happens. The Linc is mostly natural grass ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desso_GrassMaster ).

If there's no deal to share the Linc, Nova has the same problems as before.

[Go...gate]

I don't think the Linc can handle the Eagles and two college FB teams. Think Shea Stadium in 1975, when it hosted the Mets, Yankees, Giants and Jets. it took years for the turf to get back to normal.

[danefan]

I don't think the Linc can handle the Eagles and two college FB teams. Think Shea Stadium in 1975, when it hosted the Mets, Yankees, Giants and Jets. it took years for the turf to get back to normal.

Field turf.

[ngineer]

Unreal. VU, legends in their own mind. What about the 1980's did not learn?

[pleahy1]

I thought they were talking about using the MLS stadium PPL park and expanding that, or has that been abandoned?

[superman7515]

Or, is part of the deal with Temple to let Villanova share the Linc with them? A lot of Villanova's problems get solved quickly if it does. On the negative, the Eagles can't be happy if this happens. The Linc is mostly natural grass ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desso_GrassMaster ).

If there's no deal to share the Linc, Nova has the same problems as before.

Temple couldn't make that deal, it would have to be made with the Eagles who have already come out in the local papers as saying they would not allow an additional team there, regardless of the team. Temple is allowed there basically because the Eagles used public funds to get the stadium built and Temple is a public school in Philly. Villanova is neither in Philly nor public, so the Eagles don't owe them anything.

[superman7515]

I thought they were talking about using the MLS stadium PPL park and expanding that, or has that been abandoned?

The owner's of PPL Park said they'd like to expand to 20-25k sometime in the next 10-20 years, nothing concrete or soon, and at the time Pitt, Rutgers, and West Virginia were all blocking saying even that was too small and they wanted at least 50k seats.

[TheValleyRaider]

The owner's of PPL Park said they'd like to expand to 20-25k sometime in the next 10-20 years, nothing concrete or soon, and at the time Pitt, Rutgers, and West Virginia were all blocking saying even that was too small and they wanted at least 50k seats.

How convenient then, that 2 of those schools are now gone....

[Seawolf97]

How convenient then, that 2 of those schools are now gone....

Sure sounds that way. A more open invitation to move up to the Big East couldn't be had. So the CAA shrinks a little more as does the MAC the shuffle continues.

[NoCoDanny]

Franklin Field, capacity 52,593, problem solved.

[49RFootballNow]

Franklin Field, capacity 52,593, problem solved.

It is artificial turf, but Nova would have to schedule around Penn's schedule; and knowing the Ivy, they probably have a rule against sharing a facility with another university.

[Mr. C]

It is artificial turf, but Nova would have to schedule around Penn's schedule; and knowing the Ivy, they probably have a rule against sharing a facility with another university.

Villanova actually played a "home" game at Franklin Field this season, against Penn.

[Mr. C]

The owner's of PPL Park said they'd like to expand to 20-25k sometime in the next 10-20 years, nothing concrete or soon, and at the time Pitt, Rutgers, and West Virginia were all blocking saying even that was too small and they wanted at least 50k seats.

I attended Villanova's home game at PPL Park against Delaware in the regular-season finale. I loved the view and thought it worked great for a game.

[superman7515]

I attended Villanova's home game at PPL Park against Delaware in the regular-season finale. I loved the view and thought it worked great for a game.

I was there too. A majority of those in attendance were from Delaware, but attendance issues aside it's still a too small stadium, that's too far for the students to attend games, in one of the most dangerous cities in the state.

[Mr. C]

Unreal. VU, legends in their own mind. What about the 1980's did not learn?
The current position of Villanova football has nothing to do with what was going on in the 1980s when Villanova make the mistake of dropping the sport.

[Mr. C]

I was there too. A majority of those in attendance were from Delaware, but attendance issues aside it's still a too small stadium, that's too far for the students to attend games, in one of the most dangerous cities in the state.
The part about Villanova students is funny, since most don't attend football games at Villanova Stadium, either. The stadium can be easily expanded. I know of the reputation of the area, but I didn't feel unsafe either coming, or going. I thought security did a very good job with the Villanova-Delaware game. I know Villanova insiders would like to get away from the campus influences that inhibit the pre- and post-game atmosphere at Villanova games.

[superman7515]

The part about Villanova students is funny, since most don't attend football games at Villanova Stadium, either.

That's kind of the point. They barely move the needle when the game is right in town, moving it to the ghetto isn't going to improve it.

[henfan]

Despite its capacity, Franklin Field has several issues that make it unsuitable for major conference FBS football, even temporarily. PPL is also NOT suitable for FBS major conference ball given that it is at least twice a small as it would need to be.

[Mr. C]

That's kind of the point. They barely move the needle when the game is right in town, moving it to the ghetto isn't going to improve it.

A lot of the folks inside the program think it would have a BIG difference, moving games to the Hood.

[Mr. C]

Despite its capacity, Franklin Field has several issues that make it unsuitable for major conference FBS football, even temporarily. PPL is also NOT suitable for FBS major conference ball given that it is at least twice a small as it would need to be.
Someone who attends games at Delaware Stadium is trashing on Franklin Field?

[Bogus Megapardus]

Why release this public statement placating Villanova? My understanding is that the time extension, the fee wavier and the offer of financial assistance already were out there. I'm just not reading this the same way as most here are reading it.

[GannonFan]

Someone who attends games at Delaware Stadium is trashing on Franklin Field?

I don't think anyone is advocating Delaware Stadium, in its current state, as a top notch FBS stadium. If UD ever moved up, it would have a stadium option on the table. I mean, who would think of moving up without having a stadium option?

As for PPL, sure it can be expanded up to 30k. Of course, the stadium cost $120M up front and the expansion, not wanted by the MLS tennant at this time, would probably cost about $60M. So yeah, if someone had $60M to expand it, it could be done "easily".

[MplsBison]

I was there too. A majority of those in attendance were from Delaware, but attendance issues aside it's still a too small stadium, that's too far for the students to attend games, in one of the most dangerous cities in the state.

Gentrification has to start somewhere. Why not a shiny new stadium and maybe a new residential development next to it? New upscale condos, shops, etc.

Displace the poor people to somewhere else.

[MplsBison]

Why release this public statement placating Villanova? My understanding is that the time extension, the fee wavier and the offer of financial assistance already were out there. I'm just not reading this the same way as most here are reading it.

Scared they're going to move out to another conference and possibly ask G-Town to come with?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Despite its capacity, Franklin Field has several issues that make it unsuitable for major conference FBS football, even temporarily.

That's not how the Big East felt in 2004, when Temple was hosting "BCS" games and BCS teams there.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Why release this public statement placating Villanova? My understanding is that the time extension, the fee wavier and the offer of financial assistance already were out there. I'm just not reading this the same way as most here are reading it.

There's more, apparently, to the story, Bogie, than just the statement. Apparently Father Donohue was present at the press conference and talked about this as well.

On a different note, this makes some interesting reading now:

http://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2012/02/is-temple-big-east-domino.html

My piece did mention the amount of face that Villanova could lose in all of this. Fr. Donohue's presence at the press conference seems to have been in part to either save face, to reassert Villanova's place in the universe, or both.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Gentrification has to start somewhere. Why not a shiny new stadium and maybe a new residential development next to it? New upscale condos, shops, etc.

Displace the poor people to somewhere else.

Mitt? xlolx

[Bogus Megapardus]

Franklin Field is very old but it had millions worth of structural renovation in the 1990s. It would be fine for Villanova's Big East games. The drawbacks will always remain - the stadium has an unusually wide track (after all it was constructed originally to hold the Penn Relays), and parking is at a premium in Philadelphia.

At one time Penn lead the nation in football attendance. Then it joined the Ivies. Penn coulda been in the Big 10, you know . . .

[ngineer]

The current position of Villanova football has nothing to do with what was going on in the 1980s when Villanova make the mistake of dropping the sport.

Actually, I think history does show us that VU students/alums/community will not support 'big time' football. They don't support the current team to the degree necessary, and lack of support in the '80's caused the sport to be dropped.

[ngineer]

Franklin Field is very old but it had millions worth of structural renovation in the 1990s. It would be fine for Villanova's Big East games. The drawbacks will always remain - the stadium has an unusually wide track (after all it was constructed originally to hold the Penn Relays), and parking is at a premium in Philadelphia.

At one time Penn lead the nation in football attendance. Then it joined the Ivies. Penn coulda been in the Big 10, you know . . .

"I coulda been a champion!"--with apologies to Marlon Brando.

[Bogus Megapardus]

Fr. Donohue's presence at the press conference seems to have been in part to either save face, to reassert Villanova's place in the universe, or both.

That's what I was thinking. It really hasn't much at all to do with "inviting" Villanova anew to play Big East football, IMHO.

[Bogus Megapardus]

"I coulda been a champion!"--with apologies to Marlon Brando.


We coulda been in the Big East! - with apologies to Sader87.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Gentrification has to start somewhere. Why not a shiny new stadium and maybe a new residential development next to it? New upscale condos, shops, etc.

Displace the poor people to somewhere else.


Mitt? xlolx

With apologies to Mitt Romney. Associating him with Mpls? It feels like I crossed some sort of line.

[Mr. C]

Actually, I think history does show us that VU students/alums/community will not support 'big time' football. They don't support the current team to the degree necessary, and lack of support in the '80's caused the sport to be dropped.
There was a lot more to Villanova dropping football than fan support. It had more to do with institutional support and a group of administrators that were anti-football (like a lot of Catholic schools were during that time frame). A good read on the subject is the Tony Moss book "A Season in Purgatory."

[mainejeff]

Villanova doesn't want to make the "Holy Cross Mistake". This is make or break time for their entire athletic dept.

[Tribe4SF]

Seems to me the press conference was about placating Villanova basketball, and presenting a united front for the league. The issues for Nova football moving up remain the same. Lacking a new stadium option, the current plan for PPL does not fit with a BCS conference. If the Big East wants to keep their football schools, and remain BCS, Nova still looks like a bad fit.

[aceinthehole]

Why release this public statement placating Villanova? My understanding is that the time extension, the fee wavier and the offer of financial assistance already were out there. I'm just not reading this the same way as most here are reading it.


… take into account its longstanding relationship and many contributions to the Conference over the past three decades to give all due consideration to a football membership application.

The Conference also fully supports the extensive, thoughtful and thorough process that Villanova is utilizing to evaluate its football program. To validate the BIG EAST Conference's support of Villanova …

IMO - This was done at Villanova's request to help them "save face" with the addition of a direct competitor in their media market. This is a PR move more than anything.

As others have indicated, this does not remove the institutional barriers 'Nova faces in upgrading football to FBS.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Seems to me the press conference was about placating Villanova basketball, and presenting a united front for the league. The issues for Nova football moving up remain the same. Lacking a new stadium option, the current plan for PPL does not fit with a BCS conference. If the Big East wants to keep their football schools, and remain BCS, Nova still looks like a bad fit.

I agree. Here's problem one: how will Villanova, long-time member of the Big East, be able to feel masculine playing in, say, PPL park, which can't hold 30,000 fans and is an hour drive from campus, while leaguemate Temple is playing in the Linc where the Eagles play?

The only way this works is with Nova playing in Franklin Field. And then you have to involve Penn.

[RichH2]

Dont know how thin skinned Nova may be, but I do wonder why so many feel that Nova had to be placated. As far as I know Temple has maintained same street address all these many years. They were in BE , thrown out , now back. So? Only competition is bball where both have mostly been very good each yr. Only change is that instead of being merely a Big5 competiton it will be a BE competion starting in 2013. TU and Nova have never, in recent memory, been on the same page in football

[henfan]

Someone who attends games at Delaware Stadium is trashing on Franklin Field?

I've noticed lately how touchy you've been where UD FB is concerned. Weird.xeyebrowx

Anyway, I didn't "trash" Franklin Field. I've never hesitated to take the train up when I've had the desire to see an Ivy League game. I merely stated that FF is not suited for big time FBS football, regardless of upgrades that were done nearly a couple of decades ago. It's not just my opinion. The Big East insisted that Franklin Field was not a long-term option for TU just prior to their deal with the city to use the Linc. Anyone who's visited FF knows that it does not have the infrastructure and parking available to accommodate big time college FB.

And since you've made DE Stadium a topic of discussion here, I'll mention that it also is not suitable for big-time FBS FB. Then again, UD has no plans for FB reclassification or invitation to play in the Big East.

[bluehenbillk]

It's been reported that no decision to VU's future will be made either way until first the Big East gets their TV deal out of the way.

When decision day comes down there will be two key issues:

1- Where is VU going to play? Apparently the first time around this was the biggest hang-up on it's sure to be again this time. VU can't fill PPL Park now at a measley 18-19K. Even if they did trick it out years from now it only goes to a facility that could seat in the high-20's. Granted, other than Boise St, whose Big East longevity nobody is sure of, what teams left in the Big East would be a draw? Other than Temple I don't see any. And speaking of Temple, what was missed in the fine print yesterday is lines drawn in the sand. VU gets exclusive use of playing Big East hoops games at the Wells Fargo Center. It's been discussed here before and I'll say it again - VU would never play home football games at the Linc.

2- What does VU really want to do? The Big East that VU was exploring for football 18 months ago is markedly different than the Big East VU could possibly choose to enter in the future. This is a school that is currently taking a financial bath on FCS football. They've dropped 1-A level football in the past, are they willing to make a greater financial commitment to play FBS level football again, in a watered down conference that may be a longshot to see the kind of BCS money they made in the past as a league when the format will most likely change again in 2014, meaning no more BCS AQ coin coming the Big East's way more years than not.

[Wildcat80]

I've noticed lately how touchy you've been where UD FB is concerned. Weird.xeyebrowx

Anyway, I didn't "trash" Franklin Field. I've never hesitated to take the train up when I've had the desire to see an Ivy League game. I merely stated that FF is not suited for big time FBS football, regardless of upgrades that were done nearly a couple of decades ago. It's not just my opinion. The Big East insisted that Franklin Field was not a long-term option for TU just prior to their deal with the city to use the Linc. Anyone who's visited FF knows that it does not have the infrastructure and parking available to accommodate big time college FB.

And since you've made DE Stadium a topic of discussion here, I'll mention that it also is not suitable for big-time FBS FB. Then again, UD has no plans for FB reclassification or invitation to play in the Big East.

Franklin Field is a grand old stadium! Would need major renovation though. But WHY would VU spend that in the city instead of a likely cheaper green field new stadium somewhere near campus?

[BisonHype!]

If Villanova can compete at the FBS level, and in that conference (which they won't right away), then it only makes sense. Sounds like a solid move for them, and they get into a above average football conference.

[aceinthehole]

And speaking of Temple, what was missed in the fine print yesterday is lines drawn in the sand. VU gets exclusive use of playing Big East hoops games at the Wells Fargo Center.

Interesting. It seemed clear that VU was trying to "protect" certain market preferences.

VU only plays premier BE teams (UConn, Syr) or marquee non-conf games (Duke, etc) downtown, right? The rest of the games are at the Pavilion.

Has Temple ever played any non-conf home games at Wells Fargo?

I wonder if this exclusivity agreement between VU and the Well Fargo Center apply to both conference and non conference games.

Temple does have a much larger and newer on campus facility than 'Nova, correct? (although I've understand Temple isn't in an ideal Philly neighborhood)

[aceinthehole]

For now, it looks like the BE game 'Nova a $1million bribe for FCS football, even if they don't upgrade to FBS. More from Philly:


Because all indications are that Villanova, which last April was set to vote to move up from the FCS level before the Big East backed off its invitation at the last moment, could be back in the serious discussion at some point.

"The circumstances have to be right, but I think there's definitely [mutual] interest," said Villanova athletic director Vince Nicastro. "And [the conference has] made a tangible investment to help us to continue to position ourselves for a potential move."

While he wouldn't go into specifics, sources said that includes $1 million as a "good faith" gesture to enhance the football facilities. And if the program does come in, there would be another $2 million made available. Also, the reported $2.5 million entry fee will be waived if it happens within the next 3 years. Such a move requires a mandatory 2-year transition period.

Villanova, which has been a member of the Big East for most sports since 1981, plays football in the Colonial Athletic Association.
http://mobile.philly.com/sports/?wss=/philly/sports/colleges/villanova/&id=141822943&viewAll=y#more

[bluehenbillk]

Interesting. It seemed clear that VU was trying to "protect" certain market preferences.

VU only plays premier BE teams (UConn, Syr) or marquee non-conf games (Duke, etc) downtown, right? The rest of the games are at the Pavilion.

Has Temple ever played any non-conf home games at Wells Fargo?

I wonder if this exclusivity agreement between VU and the Well Fargo Center apply to both conference and non conference games.

Temple does have a much larger and newer on campus facility than 'Nova, correct? (although I've understand Temple isn't in an ideal Philly neighborhood)

VU plays about 6 games a year at the WFC - Temple plays there sparingly for big non-conference games in the past such as Duke.

Temple's arena holds about 3500 more than VU's. Yes, Temple plays in North Philly which isn't a great neighborhood but put it this way - it's not nearly as bad as where VU is talking about playing football.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

Interesting. It seemed clear that VU was trying to "protect" certain market preferences.

VU only plays premier BE teams (UConn, Syr) or marquee non-conf games (Duke, etc) downtown, right? The rest of the games are at the Pavilion.

Has Temple ever played any non-conf home games at Wells Fargo?

I wonder if this exclusivity agreement between VU and the Well Fargo Center apply to both conference and non conference games.

Temple does have a much larger and newer on campus facility than 'Nova, correct? (although I've understand Temple isn't in an ideal Philly neighborhood)

Temple played Duke at the WFC this year so i'm not sure if the new agreement is just conference games or OOC game as well. In the past Temple hasn't had trouble getting big names on campus. Kansas, Georgetown, Indiana, Michigan State, Illinois, Tennessee etc have all visited the Liacouras Center.

[GannonFan]

Temple currently gets to have one game a year at the Wells Fargo Center - nova typically has a 6 game package there (5 premier games and one dud typically). What they draw is dependent on the year either team is having and the quality of the opponent. Temple packed the place this year for I think Georgetown and nova has suffered the past two years in attendance as the on-the-court performance has waned. Thing is, though, nova has previously brought some bigger conference mates into the Wells Fargo - Syracuse, West Virginia, Louisville, and UConn to name a few. When those schools leave, that just makes less teams that are big enough draws to even warrant playing at the Wells Fargo (capacity is just over 20k). Seton Hall is not going to make that building no matter how good nova is that year.

But the thing to pick out of this is actually two things - the Big East is only ponying up roughly $3.5M to help nova move up in football. Considering that just expanding PPL to just under 30k seats would probably cost at least $60M, if not more, and that other costs would go up as well (schollies, coaches, other facilities, etc), while the Big East says they are going to help nova, it's not really a lot of help in the grand scheme of things. The second thing is, if nova was that resistant to giving up the Wells Fargo, it probably follows that Temple was just as resistant to give nova any of its dates in the Linc. The Eagles aren't going to allow more games to be played, but there was a possibility that Temple could give nova some of its dates in that stadium. I wouldn't think from the sound of this that that happened and it still means there's no stadium solution for nova.

[ngineer]

Franklin Field is a grand old stadium! Would need major renovation though. But WHY would VU spend that in the city instead of a likely cheaper green field new stadium somewhere near campus?

Nowhere near campus available. Hence the PPL Park option which won't work. heck they can't fill 13,000 on campus, let alone a 25,000 venue 1/2 hour away.

[RichH2]

One may speculate that a FBS Nova team could draw more just from the nature of the opponents. Increase in attendance from other school's fans?

[Dane96]

I've noticed lately how touchy you've been where UD FB is concerned. Weird.xeyebrowx

Anyway, I didn't "trash" Franklin Field. I've never hesitated to take the train up when I've had the desire to see an Ivy League game. I merely stated that FF is not suited for big time FBS football, regardless of upgrades that were done nearly a couple of decades ago. It's not just my opinion. The Big East insisted that Franklin Field was not a long-term option for TU just prior to their deal with the city to use the Linc. Anyone who's visited FF knows that it does not have the infrastructure and parking available to accommodate big time college FB.

And since you've made DE Stadium a topic of discussion here, I'll mention that it also is not suitable for big-time FBS FB. Then again, UD has no plans for FB reclassification or invitation to play in the Big East.

Forgetting the stadium, when was the last time you went to a BC game. Parking is horrendous...they bus people in for miles...and their is a crappy tailgate situation...with now, new rules in place, Shea Field the only place you can have a BBQ. It costs a min of 7-10k per year in donations to even get on the Shea Field pass list.

I think they can deal with the parking situation at Franklin Field just fine. The Stadium, not sure...haven't been inside in years.

[bluehenbillk]

One may speculate that a FBS Nova team could draw more just from the nature of the opponents. Increase in attendance from other school's fans?

By the time VU would ever get into the Big East, I can list Temple and Boise St (who I doubt will still be there by that point in time) as teams that would play in front of a sold-out PPL crowd with today's capacity, much less adding any seats. Am I missing anybody? Maybe Navy....

[HailSzczur]

Just got back from a disappointing BE tourney game last night, boy did I miss some fun on here last night. Honestly you guys are talking more about what this means for Villanova people than all the Nova fans I saw up at MSG yesterday. To address a few points, clarify a few things, and most likely restate whats been said over 6 pages:

The Big East right now is sitting on a conference of 13 football schools once the traitors leave and we bring in reinforcements. The word around the the Big East is that the target number is 14. They seem to be "entertaining" the idea of Villanova Football, but it may be nothing more than just that. Rumor has it Big East that they are looking for another Western team, possibly a WAC team. We are getting 1 million dollars from the Big East for facilities improvements, and IF we join them for football we will get another 2 million dollars in support. $3 million is not enough to pay off Randor township to do something on campus, or to buy land somewhere else and make a stadium (see UCONN), or to light a fire under PPL for some larger scale upgrades in the very near future. One idea that had been thrown around before was to try and outbid Temple for their deal with the Linc, but now I think the BE would frown upon that. Another idea was to purchase Archbishop Carroll High School down the street and build a stadium their; but the Archdiocese has already released their list of school closings, and Carroll was not one of them.
Bottom line is without a stadium we don't have a leg to stand on. Forget budgets, forget commitment, forget practice facilities, and forget fan support. We don't have a leg to stand on anyone. I just hope we take the BE's money, and make Villanova Stadium look presentable and alittle more hospitable.

[HailSzczur]

One may speculate that a FBS Nova team could draw more just from the nature of the opponents. Increase in attendance from other school's fans?

That's been the argument on campus, that if you bring in Pitts and WVUs and Syracuses that fans will go because we're playing good teams. All it will take is a few losses and we'd back to the same home attendance we have now. It happened this year with basketball.

[MplsBison]

Just got back from a disappointing BE tourney game last night, boy did I miss some fun on here last night. Honestly you guys are talking more about what this means for Villanova people than all the Nova fans I saw up at MSG yesterday. To address a few points, clarify a few things, and most likely restate whats been said over 6 pages:

The Big East right now is sitting on a conference of 13 football schools once the traitors leave and we bring in reinforcements. The word around the the Big East is that the target number is 14. They seem to be "entertaining" the idea of Villanova Football, but it may be nothing more than just that. Rumor has it Big East that they are looking for another Western team, possibly a WAC team. We are getting 1 million dollars from the Big East for facilities improvements, and IF we join them for football we will get another 2 million dollars in support. $3 million is not enough to pay off Randor township to do something on campus, or to buy land somewhere else and make a stadium (see UCONN), or to light a fire under PPL for some larger scale upgrades in the very near future. One idea that had been thrown around before was to try and outbid Temple for their deal with the Linc, but now I think the BE would frown upon that. Another idea was to purchase Archbishop Carroll High School down the street and build a stadium their; but the Archdiocese has already released their list of school closings, and Carroll was not one of them.
Bottom line is without a stadium we don't have a leg to stand on. Forget budgets, forget commitment, forget practice facilities, and forget fan support. We don't have a leg to stand on anyone. I just hope we take the BE's money, and make Villanova Stadium look presentable and alittle more hospitable.

So what's the plan then? Stay in the Big East for bball and move to the Pioneer with G-town, cutting scholarship costs from the program?

If you're not going to go for the big time (FBS) in football, no sense in losing money in FCS.

[HailSzczur]

So what's the plan then? Stay in the Big East for bball and move to the Pioneer with G-town, cutting scholarship costs from the program?

If you're not going to go for the big time (FBS) in football, no sense in losing money in FCS.

I really don't know to be honest. Until last year we seemed content to just ride along in FCS. Some have said that the only reason we brought football back was to return to FBS. Some real negative people have gone as far to suggest that after being rejected for FBS we might end up dropping football down the road; that without the carrot of BE football in front of us the program would just lose gas. I don't think its quite that grim. I think we stay CAA for a while at least and see where the next few years take us.

[GannonFan]

That's been the argument on campus, that if you bring in Pitts and WVUs and Syracuses that fans will go because we're playing good teams. All it will take is a few losses and we'd back to the same home attendance we have now. It happened this year with basketball.

God forbid it ever gets as bad as it did in the Lappas years - I remember being able to walk up to whatever Wells Fargo was called back then and getting seats just a few rows up off the floor to watch nova-UConn and that was during UConn's title runs. If you can't win at a national scale, people won't come to watch, and Big East football, while stretching nationally, is not going to be a player in terms of the national title in football.

[Bogus Megapardus]

I really have no business editorializing here, but I will anyhow. I hope that Villanova stays put in FCS.

The odds against an academically-focused private institution of Villanova's size succeeding in BCS football against massive, state-run sports factories are astronomical. There are a couple examples of success (Boston College being the closest parallel) but they are rare. The cost of failure would be having a program of middling success and low attendance or worse, dropping football completely becasue of the cost.

Villanova does not need BCS football to assist in name recognition or to attract students. I'm sure it has no illusions of stuffing its coffers or erasing operating budget deficits with football revenue. The only question is - will it be a positive move for the students, alumni, community and the overall Catholic service and educational mission of the University?

Those who opine from afar should take into account Villanova's size, history, location and unique mission. BCS football is not something the University must do simply becasue it can do it. Villanova doesn't confuse aspiration with ambition - as odd as it might seem to some, the University's overall national reputation could be better served by remaining in FCS. In considering that "reputation," I'm sure that the University's administrators look far beyond the the number of highlights and talking head mentions Villanova gets on ESPN.

IMHO, knowing something about the University and the neighborhood in which it sits, the only real way for BCS football to thrive at Villanova would be to construct a low-key facility at or near the confluence of Lancaster Avenue and the Blue Route, or out west a bit, such as the area around the Exton Mall, near Rt. 202. It would require not only community support but a government-backed bond issue as well. If built near Rt. 202, it would not be unthinkable to work in cooperation with West Chester State. The soccer stadium in Chester simply is a non-starter.

Personally, I like to root for Villanova as an FCS team. I can't say that I would do so as a BCS team, but that's just me.

[GannonFan]

Just got back from a disappointing BE tourney game last night, boy did I miss some fun on here last night. Honestly you guys are talking more about what this means for Villanova people than all the Nova fans I saw up at MSG yesterday. To address a few points, clarify a few things, and most likely restate whats been said over 6 pages:

The Big East right now is sitting on a conference of 13 football schools once the traitors leave and we bring in reinforcements. The word around the the Big East is that the target number is 14. They seem to be "entertaining" the idea of Villanova Football, but it may be nothing more than just that. Rumor has it Big East that they are looking for another Western team, possibly a WAC team. We are getting 1 million dollars from the Big East for facilities improvements, and IF we join them for football we will get another 2 million dollars in support. $3 million is not enough to pay off Randor township to do something on campus, or to buy land somewhere else and make a stadium (see UCONN), or to light a fire under PPL for some larger scale upgrades in the very near future. One idea that had been thrown around before was to try and outbid Temple for their deal with the Linc, but now I think the BE would frown upon that. Another idea was to purchase Archbishop Carroll High School down the street and build a stadium their; but the Archdiocese has already released their list of school closings, and Carroll was not one of them.
Bottom line is without a stadium we don't have a leg to stand on. Forget budgets, forget commitment, forget practice facilities, and forget fan support. We don't have a leg to stand on anyone. I just hope we take the BE's money, and make Villanova Stadium look presentable and alittle more hospitable.

I agree that the $3.5M the Big East is saying they'll give to nova (well, really just $1M as the waiver of the $2.5M is just money you don't need to fork over) is just a drop in the bucket of what would be needed to financially make the move.

But hey, if you're going to use that $3.5M, forget the track and field stadium on campus - I think you need more than that to make that place suitable for even FCS football (let's face it, it's a dump and an unmanageable dump whenever it's more than half full). I say just use that money to keep renting out PPL when you can - as a UD fan, even though it's a longer drive for me (I'm north of nova), I'd rather go to PPL every other year than have to suffer sitting in that stadium in Radnor.

[GannonFan]

IMHO, knowing something about the University and the neighborhood in which it sits, the only real way for BCS football to thrive at Villanova would be to construct a low-key facility at or near the confluence of Lancaster Avenue and the Blue Route, or out west a bit, such as the area around the Exton Mall, near Rt. 202. It would require not only community support but a government-backed bond issue as well. If built near Rt. 202, it would not be unthinkable to work in cooperation with West Chester State. The soccer stadium in Chester simply is a non-starter.

Personally, I like to root for Villanova as an FCS team. I can't say that I would do so as a BCS team, but that's just me.

Huh, out on 202? Exton? It's not going to be any cheaper or any easier to find open space out there than it would be in Radnor or Conshohocken. And considering the state's current path to drastically cut higher education spending at state schools, getting West Chester's help in funding a sports stadium they wouldn't really use and certainly don't need is just pie in the sky thinking. I agree with you on the idea that BCS football isn't necessary to be a good University, and I agree without a stadium they are sunk. That part has not changed and won't.

[henfan]

HS, thanks for the comments regarding the Cats' football future. I hope that VU does maintain an FCS program into the future (and in the CAA) but, given the type of FB losses VU has reported in the past, do you think the drumbeat will get louder to drop FB if the BEC window closes?

[HailSzczur]

Huh, out on 202? Exton? It's not going to be any cheaper or any easier to find open space out there than it would be in Radnor or Conshohocken. And considering the state's current path to drastically cut higher education spending at state schools, getting West Chester's help in funding a sports stadium they wouldn't really use and certainly don't need is just pie in the sky thinking. I agree with you on the idea that BCS football isn't necessary to be a good University, and I agree without a stadium they are sunk. That part has not changed and won't.

I agreed with everything bogie said except this. Other than that he really hit the nail on the head.

I live in Exton, and I'm not too sure where we would put a stadium out here. Had they decided to do this in the late 90's they might have been able to find some land at a decent price. Now a days, the only place I could see them going in around here is Chester Springs, and they would pay a pretty penny for it. If they were going to build an off campus stadium Monsignor Bonner (which got the axe, and then was reprieved) and Archbishop Carroll were considered because 1. they're closer to campus and 2 they have public transportation around; the R5 only runs like every hour on the weekend to Exton.

As far as West Chester goes, I don't think they are really looking for much upgrades either, and they aren't shelling out the money either. The students are complaining about a $800 tuition increase next year, imagine the fees they'd have to charge to cover what the state didn't pick up. Plus a lot of the high schools around here already have pretty nice facilities and so you couldn't even guarantee their use.

[HailSzczur]

HS, thanks for the comments regarding the Cats' football future. I hope that VU does maintain an FCS program into the future (and in the CAA) but, given the type of FB losses VU has reported in the past, do you think the drumbeat will get louder to drop FB if the BEC window closes?

There's no real talk of them dropping football at the moment. This year aside, we've still had a pretty good run over the 15 years or so, looking at our playoff appearances, Payton winners, draft picks, etc. Right after we won the NC they launched a fundraising campaign, which I never heard how it turned out. The goal was to build a football house on the site of or in the general area of the concession stand. Supposedly they were talking with big named donors (word was Westbrook/Howie/Finneran) who would make some contributions. All talk of that though died pretty quickly.

At a preseason BBQ in 2010 Andy Talley informed us that they had endowed the coaching positions and that VU football was setting itself up to be strong in the years to come, lets hope thats true

[Bogus Megapardus]

I agreed with everything bogie said except this. Other than that he really hit the nail on the head.

I live in Exton, and I'm not too sure where we would put a stadium out here. Had they decided to do this in the late 90's they might have been able to find some land at a decent price. Now a days, the only place I could see them going in around here is Chester Springs, and they would pay a pretty penny for it. If they were going to build an off campus stadium Monsignor Bonner (which got the axe, and then was reprieved) and Archbishop Carroll were considered because 1. they're closer to campus and 2 they have public transportation around; the R5 only runs like every hour on the weekend to Exton.

As far as West Chester goes, I don't think they are really looking for much upgrades either, and they aren't shelling out the money either. The students are complaining about a $800 tuition increase next year, imagine the fees they'd have to charge to cover what the state didn't pick up. Plus a lot of the high schools around here already have pretty nice facilities and so you couldn't even guarantee their use.

I can't disagree at all with the practicalities of anything you wrote. My original thought on this (way back when) was to move Archbishop Carroll in its entirety to the Villanova campus, and build a stadium on the Carroll site which would be used by Villanova, Carroll and Radnor H.S. A non-starter, I know, but you have to agree it's an ideal location.

I'm sure the good folks at Villanova already have explored the notion of adding to the existing football stadium footprint by eliminating the track, digging a bowl and double-decking the stands. Either that, or building where the soccer and tennis facilities now sit. But if the bluebloods in Radnor Twp. won't support those ideas, I suppose they won't go for anything else in the township.

Question - what was the impetus behind the "home game" last season vs. Penn at Franklin Field?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

If the BE's only option for a 14th team is Villanova, will they really be that picky? Franklin Field is turf, it's big enough, and it's even hosted a former Big East team, fer Gosh sakes. Is a second Big East team in the Philadelphia market in a conference still, for the time being, called the Big East really that much worse than Boise?

People are forgetting that a huge part of this deal is an open-ended invite for the next three years for Big East football. Things might continue to happen where the Big East will be begging Villanova to join in football. After all, it worked for Temple.

[GannonFan]

If the BE's only option for a 14th team is Villanova, will they really be that picky? Franklin Field is turf, it's big enough, and it's even hosted a former Big East team, fer Gosh sakes. Is a second Big East team in the Philadelphia market in a conference still, for the time being, called the Big East really that much worse than Boise?

People are forgetting that a huge part of this deal is an open-ended invite for the next three years for Big East football. Things might continue to happen where the Big East will be begging Villanova to join in football. After all, it worked for Temple.

There's been an open ended invite from parts of the Big East for 2-3 years now - the only two things that are changing are the diminishing criteria from the Big East as to what nova needs to bring to the table and a even more diminishing revenue stream that nova could hope to get by joining the Big East (heck, the purported $3.5M being offered now is tiny compared to the projected share of a new contract and guaranteed gates nova was supposed to be getting prior to everything falling apart). By the time they decide, the Big East won't be a BCS conference anymore (the BCS will likely not exist, and if it does, will likely not include the Big East), and there'll be even less reason to join it. Heck, the Big East, or portions of it, has been begging for nova to join for awhile now and they can't seem to make the numbers work out to pull the trigger.

[HailSzczur]

I can't disagree at all with the practicalities of anything you wrote. My original thought on this (way back when) was to move Archbishop Carroll in its entirety to the Villanova campus, and build a stadium on the Carroll site which would be used by Villanova, Carroll and Radnor H.S. A non-starter, I know, but you have to agree it's an ideal location.

It almost didn't even need to be that complicated, the archdiocese was supposed to shut down high schools (they have since changed their mind) and there was a rumor that Carroll would go because the land was worth so much it would cover all the legal fees they are facing.


I'm sure the good folks at Villanova already have explored the notion of adding to the existing football stadium footprint by eliminating the track, digging a bowl and double-decking the stands. Either that, or building where the soccer and tennis facilities now sit. But if the bluebloods in Radnor Twp. won't support those ideas, I suppose they won't go for anything else in the township.

We are a track school, we aren't touching the track. As far as the Soccer complex idea, there would not nearly be enough room for parking or anything up on West Campus. And Radnor will have nothing to do with either of those plans. They are giving us a hard enough time about building another dorm and some shops on the current main lot

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Heck, the Big East, or portions of it, has been begging for nova to join for awhile now and they can't seem to make the numbers work out to pull the trigger.

I see it more as "mixed signals". Some anonymous sources seemed gung-ho for them to join, but after Nova embarked on their athletics study, other anonymous came out of the woodwork saying PPL was inadequate for football. That can't have sat well with Nova folks.

[HailSzczur]

I see it more as "mixed signals". Some anonymous sources seemed gung-ho for them to join, but after Nova embarked on their athletics study, other anonymous came out of the woodwork saying PPL was inadequate for football. That can't have sat well with Nova folks.

The nay-sayers weren't anonymous. It was Rutgers and Pitt

[Bogus Megapardus]

The nay-sayers weren't anonymous. It was Rutgers and Pitt

The problem I'm having is with state institutions using public money to drown out a private, Catholic-based university's aspirations. It goes much deeper than this one example.

[GannonFan]

The problem I'm having is with state institutions using public money to drown out a private, Catholic-based university's aspirations. It goes much deeper than this one example.

I'm not sure what you mean by that. nova, when they were first looking to move up last year, were basing the moving up on getting a lot of assistance from the state instituitions (guaranteed gates, seed money, etc). And if nova had come forward with a legitimate plan to bring something to the table in the Big East (a real stadium for instance) then I don't think anyone would've batted an eyelash to let them in. It was only when it became clear that nova wanted to move up and not put a lot of their own money into it and instead just saddle up to the Big East trough and take their full share that other schools balked. I'm sure someone like Rutgers probably didn't want nova to move up at all anyway, but it was much easier to block them from moving up when it became apparent they wanted to take more from the Big East arrangement than they were willing to put into it. If they hadn't lowballed their approach initially (and frankly, it may just be because that's the only approach they could take financially and realistically since there is no easy answer to the stadium issue) then we wouldn't be talking about this - they'd already be in the Big East.

[ktuck911]

The nay-sayers weren't anonymous. It was Rutgers and Pitt

Well at least Pitt should NOT count... They aren't even a part of the Big East any longer... As for RU, IMO, they might be afraid that you guys might be good in Football at the FBS level real fast... which could potentially demoralize their Athletic program a little more... They're already behind the curve in MBB although things are looking up... But, to be honest, 'Nova football belongs in the Big East ( FBS level ) ... Stop messin around and make it happen... You'll now have a natural rivalry with Temple...

- UCONN fan here ( as well as UCONN alumn )

[superman7515]

Stop messin around and make it happen...

There ya go, that's all it took. Ignore the fact you have nowhere to play or money to build it if you could, no money to pay for the added scholarships & Title IX issues, no fan interest, and part of your conference doesn't even want you and just make it happen. I can't understand why there is hesitation on the part of Nova.

[MplsBison]

There ya go, that's all it took. Ignore the fact you have nowhere to play or money to build it if you could, no money to pay for the added scholarships & Title IX issues, no fan interest, and part of your conference doesn't even want you and just make it happen. I can't understand why there is hesitation on the part of Nova.

LOL !!

If they at least had a stadium to play in....the rest might fall in place. They'd need UConn's practice facility - located on or very near campus, no less - to have a chance. Then factor in scholarship costs and consider the increases that would be needed in coaching salaries and recruiting budget....lot of dough.


I see 'Nova partnering with G-town to go to the non-scholarship league and stripping the scholarship costs out of the program as the more likely outcome. At least they can still "claim" to have a varsity football team, rather than a club team. I guess you can still get something for nothing in this world.

[MplsBison]

I really have no business editorializing here, but I will anyhow. I hope that Villanova stays put in FCS.

The odds against an academically-focused private institution of Villanova's size succeeding in BCS football against massive, state-run sports factories are astronomical. There are a couple examples of success (Boston College being the closest parallel) but they are rare. The cost of failure would be having a program of middling success and low attendance or worse, dropping football completely becasue of the cost.

Villanova does not need BCS football to assist in name recognition or to attract students. I'm sure it has no illusions of stuffing its coffers or erasing operating budget deficits with football revenue. The only question is - will it be a positive move for the students, alumni, community and the overall Catholic service and educational mission of the University?

Those who opine from afar should take into account Villanova's size, history, location and unique mission. BCS football is not something the University must do simply becasue it can do it. Villanova doesn't confuse aspiration with ambition - as odd as it might seem to some, the University's overall national reputation could be better served by remaining in FCS. In considering that "reputation," I'm sure that the University's administrators look far beyond the the number of highlights and talking head mentions Villanova gets on ESPN.

IMHO, knowing something about the University and the neighborhood in which it sits, the only real way for BCS football to thrive at Villanova would be to construct a low-key facility at or near the confluence of Lancaster Avenue and the Blue Route, or out west a bit, such as the area around the Exton Mall, near Rt. 202. It would require not only community support but a government-backed bond issue as well. If built near Rt. 202, it would not be unthinkable to work in cooperation with West Chester State. The soccer stadium in Chester simply is a non-starter.

Personally, I like to root for Villanova as an FCS team. I can't say that I would do so as a BCS team, but that's just me.

Stanford.

[henfan]

But, to be honest, 'Nova football belongs in the Big East ( FBS level ) ... Stop messin around and make it happen... UCONN fan here ( as well as UCONN alumn )

What in the world leads you to believe VU FB BELONGS in the Big East? Have you ever walked their campus or been to Villanova Stadium to watch a FB game? xcrazyx

'Nova isn't fortunate enough to be THE state university in the wealthiest state in the country, nor are they positioned, as the Sleddogs were, for state taxpayers to bail them out with a sweetheart stadium deal.

It's about the Benjamins. If you don't have them and can't raise or pilfer them from taxpayers, you're not playing major conference football.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I'm not sure what you mean by that. nova, when they were first looking to move up last year, were basing the moving up on getting a lot of assistance from the state instituitions (guaranteed gates, seed money, etc). And if nova had come forward with a legitimate plan to bring something to the table in the Big East (a real stadium for instance) then I don't think anyone would've batted an eyelash to let them in. It was only when it became clear that nova wanted to move up and not put a lot of their own money into it and instead just saddle up to the Big East trough and take their full share that other schools balked. I'm sure someone like Rutgers probably didn't want nova to move up at all anyway, but it was much easier to block them from moving up when it became apparent they wanted to take more from the Big East arrangement than they were willing to put into it. If they hadn't lowballed their approach initially (and frankly, it may just be because that's the only approach they could take financially and realistically since there is no easy answer to the stadium issue) then we wouldn't be talking about this - they'd already be in the Big East.

Come on. You start by implying that it was the money, somehow, that was making people balk at the BE, but then you say, "I'm sure someone like Rutgers probably didn't want nova to move up at all anyway..." So it wouldn't have mattered for Villanova whether they lowballed it or not - people like Rutgers were going to be against it anyway. Ergo, it's not all about the money.

It is much more likely that Marinatto pushed the Villanova-to-FBS plan before he got full signoff from the ADs and presidents - which made some presidents mighty pissed, and allowed them to deep-six whatever plan they did, no matter how reasonable it was. This has always been more about internal Big East politics than money in my opinion. If it were all about money, they'd have moved Nova up to FBS long ago to "grow the Philadelphia college football market". This just in: Philadelphia has a whole lot more TV viewers than Boise.

[henfan]

It is much more likely that Marinatto pushed the Villanova-to-FBS plan before he got full signoff from the ADs and presidents - which made some presidents mighty pissed, and allowed them to deep-six whatever plan they did, no matter how reasonable it was.

Well, it's either that or certain schools had second thoughts about adding a program that was going to drain their revenues, particularly when they couldn't come up with a solid stadium plan.

[GannonFan]

Come on. You start by implying that it was the money, somehow, that was making people balk at the BE, but then you say, "I'm sure someone like Rutgers probably didn't want nova to move up at all anyway..." So it wouldn't have mattered for Villanova whether they lowballed it or not - people like Rutgers were going to be against it anyway. Ergo, it's not all about the money.

It is much more likely that Marinatto pushed the Villanova-to-FBS plan before he got full signoff from the ADs and presidents - which made some presidents mighty pissed, and allowed them to deep-six whatever plan they did, no matter how reasonable it was. This has always been more about internal Big East politics than money in my opinion. If it were all about money, they'd have moved Nova up to FBS long ago to "grow the Philadelphia college football market". This just in: Philadelphia has a whole lot more TV viewers than Boise.

Come on, now you're just arguing to argue. Rutgers by themselves would never have been able to block a reasonable plan to move up to FBS, and that's where you're missing the point - there was never a reasonable plan to move up. nova never even had the $60M-$70M, or the approval of the main tennant, to enlarge PPL to just under 30k to begin with, and it was never reasonable that they would play in a stadium that small anyway. If they had a reasonable stadium option then all of this would be moot and they would probably be in the Big East. But they didn't and won't really ever have a reasonable stadium option and hence, that's why they aren't going to move. To say it's about politics is silly - that just ignores the fact that a stadium was never in the offing. If nova had full access to the Linc Rutgers could've bellyached all they want and nova would be in the Big East in a heartbeat. Politics didn't matter when a reasonable option was never on the table.

[HailSzczur]

Come on, now you're just arguing to argue. Rutgers by themselves would never have been able to block a reasonable plan to move up to FBS, and that's where you're missing the point - there was never a reasonable plan to move up. nova never even had the $60M-$70M, or the approval of the main tennant, to enlarge PPL to just under 30k to begin with, and it was never reasonable that they would play in a stadium that small anyway. If they had a reasonable stadium option then all of this would be moot and they would probably be in the Big East. But they didn't and won't really ever have a reasonable stadium option and hence, that's why they aren't going to move. To say it's about politics is silly - that just ignores the fact that a stadium was never in the offing. If nova had full access to the Linc Rutgers could've bellyached all they want and nova would be in the Big East in a heartbeat. Politics didn't matter when a reasonable option was never on the table.

It almost seems like we were playing chicken with the conference:
For Nova: You let us in the BE and we will find a stadium solution with the momentum and donations we will get from the prospect of big time football
For BE: You give us a viable stadium option and we will let you in

Neither side is going to budge. Even if we did have a money, land, permission, whatever we need to get a place to stay, we certainly wouldn't act on it until we got the BE go ahead. And the Big East isn't going to take a risk on us and just let us in

[GannonFan]

It almost seems like we were playing chicken with the conference:
For Nova: You let us in the BE and we will find a stadium solution with the momentum and donations we will get from the prospect of big time football
For BE: You give us a viable stadium option and we will let you in

Neither side is going to budge. Even if we did have a money, land, permission, whatever we need to get a place to stay, we certainly wouldn't act on it until we got the BE go ahead. And the Big East isn't going to take a risk on us and just let us in

Well, in the Big East's defense, they know just as well as we know that there isn't a very good likliehood of getting the money, land, permission, etc to build a suitable stadium, nor get the use of a suitable stadium. Putting a label on it as "Big East" isn't going to make all of those things magically appear. Would you take a chance on nova getting all those things knowing what you know?

[Bossanova]

It is already been said that the Big East will be looking out west to add a 14th member for football . That's it then, unless somebody else, like UCONN exits. There will be no more room at the Inn.

My take on this whole situation is the BIG EAST knows VU has put much money and athletic successes in the 30 years they have been conference members doing it the right way academically and so on. They also know they jerked Nova around having Nova spend millions in time and money on a feasibility study to join BE and then invite was pulled at last minute back last April

They gave Nova a few million and said all the right things politically letting Temple back in the Big East for football. I agree with the poster who said Marinatto jumped the gun and led VU on without getting the consent of some of the other schools.

Marinatto is a joke as a commissioner of a BCS conference. He should not even be a commissioner of a CYO League.

[MplsBison]

It is already been said that the Big East will be looking out west to add a 14th member for football . That's it then, unless somebody else, like UCONN exits. There will be no more room at the Inn.

My take on this whole situation is the BIG EAST knows VU has put much money and athletic successes in the 30 years they have been conference members doing it the right way academically and so on. They also know they jerked Nova around having Nova spend millions in time and money on a feasibility study to join BE and then invite was pulled at last minute back last April

They gave Nova a few million and said all the right things politically letting Temple back in the Big East for football. I agree with the poster who said Marinatto jumped the gun and led VU on without getting the consent of some of the other schools.

Marinatto is a joke as a commissioner of a BCS conference. He should not even be a commissioner of a CYO League.

Here's the problem, the Big East champion is no longer going to have a free pass to the Orange, Sugar or Fiesta bowl via the BCS.

BCS bowls are done.


Therefore, there's no incentive for Boise and San Diego to join the conf in football anymore and their agreement with the Big East gives them a very wide berth to back out.

[superman7515]

Enter UMass who has a decent chance of getting cut loose from the MAC now that they no longer have Temple to be tied to. If San Diego State & Boise bail, bring in UMass and Buffalo and starting getting the EAST back in Big East.

[MplsBison]

Enter UMass who has a decent chance of getting cut loose from the MAC now that they no longer have Temple to be tied to. If San Diego State & Boise bail, bring in UMass and Buffalo and starting getting the EAST back in Big East.

Buffalo makes sense. They could play at Bills stadium and they're basically the flagship campus of the SUNY system (most research dollars, anyway).

UMass would have to be playing at the Patriots stadium, though. Long ways from campus.

[superman7515]

UMass is already going to be playing at Gillette (the Patriots stadium).

[MplsBison]

UMass is already going to be playing at Gillette (the Patriots stadium).

I know they played a game there last year, but I'd think they'd have to play the entire schedule there to satisfy the Big East.

Otherwise they'd need to double the capacity of the stadium there in western Mass (as well as add concourses, club seating, suites, etc.).


Is that reasonable? I'm sure most UMass alumni living in Mass are on the eastern side...but still.

[UNH Fanboi]

Man, the Delaware posters swarm to Nova to Big East threads like flies on $h*t.

[MplsBison]

http://gazettenet.com/2011/04/21/import-no-headline-0

Thanks for the info. I don't follow UMass, so I didn't know - and I sure wasn't about to look it up.

PS - nonsensical fruit pictures not necessary