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  1. #1
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    The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2018

    Brought to you courtesy of the Furman thread I was just reading.

    The SLC and OVC have taken so much flack over the years for conference strength or lack there of, I figured it was only fair to include the SoCon as they too have a serious lack of quality wins other than beating each other.

    As JSUSoutherner pointed out, here are the SoCon OOC wins this year:

    UTM
    Gardner-Webb

    Gardner-Webb
    Jacksonville
    Tennessee Tech
    Gardner-Webb

    The SLC at least has Nicholl's win over Kansas. McNeese's win @ 2-7 UNC might be better than any the SoCon has.

    At what point should you stop using the parity, cannibalize, beats each other up in conference arguments to justify at-larges?

    I'll see your 6-4 Furman or 8-3 JSU and raise you a 9-2 McNeese that got snubbed last year.

    Make the argument that any of these three conferences truly deserve more than the AQ this season.

    (And yes, I recognize we have some games left)
    Last edited by kalm; November 6th, 2018 at 03:51 PM.

  2. #2
    AGS FCS Champion youngterrier's Avatar
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    Because unlike the OVC and Southland, Socon at large teams actually win games with a level of frequency.

    If you're going to frame this as simplistically as "bad OOC=no soup for you" then the game is over and the Socon loses. I concede that. But if you look at overall playoff success, it's different.

    The OVC, with the exception of JSU, is, was, and will be for the forseeable future a bottom rung conference in terms of playoff participation. I'm pretty sure the only non-JSU OVC team to beat a non-OVC team in the playoffs in the last ~20 years was Tennessee State, and that was against Butler.

    The Southland is more comparable to the Socon, but outside of their top 2, UCA and SHSU, they only have 1 playoff win against non-Southland teams since 2011 (and none since 2015). I'm open to the possibility that the Southland has the new kids on the block, in fact I actually think teams like Houston Baptist, Abilene Christian, Incarnate Word, ETSU, Campbell, Monmouth, Kennesaw, and Mercer (maybe) who are new to full FCS or start up programs are finding their swagger. Houston Baptist, ACU, and Incarnate Word could be like ETSU and much better than we think!

    But for me, the conference blue bloods of the Southland don't perform in the playoffs like the bluebloods in the Socon.

    The socon has 4 teams with a playoff win since 2015 or 2013 (I don't go back farther because GSU and App were in the conference before then), each against non-Socon teams. Admittedly, many of those wins were against the Big South, but that charleston southern team took NDSU to OT.

    So, in sum, I may be framing this in terms of playoff wins because it makes the Socon look good. Having said that, the SLC and the Socon have more in common than the OVC. I think both the Southland and Southern Conference has teams that have been in start up mode and the perception of the conference is negative because of those teams making strides. I think that's both fair and unfair. It's fair because when you see top tier teams struggling with teams that weren't good in years prior, you can assume they just aren't as good. It's also not fair, because those teams are finally at full D1 strength and talent is at a parity at this level. Equal talent + experience + quality coaching=these teams are getting better.

    But, at the end of the day, I think the Socon is better than the Southland because only one of the new bloods has disrupted the natural order of things, and even then, you could argue that every team, with the exception of Furman, is on par with what they were last year (and the only reason they aren't is because Furman lost to ETSU and didn't play Colgate). But simply, there's more evidence that the Southland is down (UCA and SHSU not performing well and Nicholls/McNeese not having as good records) than the Socon is.

    Looking forward to a dumpster fire discussion!

  3. #3
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by kalm View Post
    Make the argument that any of these three conferences truly deserve more than the AQ this season.
    Because JSU's AD Greg Seitz is on the selection committee as he has been for the last 2 years when they've been grossly over-seeded.
    Professor Chaos is a proud supporter of the 6-time NCAA Division 1 Football National Champion North Dakota State Bison.

  4. #4
    Major FCS Advocate sudog03's Avatar
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by kalm View Post

    Make the argument that any of these three conferences truly deserve more than the AQ this season.

    (And yes, I recognize we have some games left)
    Because the unbiased computer ratings say so. And at least in years past, that is something the committee has relied very heavily on. Right now the computers have those 3 leagues in this order:

    SoCon
    Southland
    OVC

  5. #5
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by sudog03 View Post
    Because the unbiased computer ratings say so. And at least in years past, that is something the committee has relied very heavily on.
    Where are you getting the notion that they've relied heavily on computer ratings? The selection committee chair last year said point blank that they use no external ranking systems or polls other than the NCAA's SRS which is only used to quantify strength of schedule/wins.

    The SRS isn't released to the public until after the bracket is revealed (it would be nice if they had the "transparency" they claim to strive for to release it before then though wouldn't it?).
    Professor Chaos is a proud supporter of the 6-time NCAA Division 1 Football National Champion North Dakota State Bison.

  6. #6
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    The bubble sucks this year. 8-3 JSU is in.

    See: Jax State Football 2013

  7. #7
    AGS FCS Champion youngterrier's Avatar
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    I think it's worth mentioning that the Southeast bracket, whatever that will entail will be very competitive this year. It could include teams such as:

    Kennesaw State
    Southeast Missouri
    Jacksonville State
    Wofford
    Furman
    Samford
    ETSU (maybe? low likelihood IMO)
    Elon
    North Carolina A&T
    and a Southland team

    I feel like you have to be a homer to say that one teams sticks out among the above. Everyone could beat everyone. Southeastern FCS teams are good this year, yet at the same time they have a noticeable flaw.

  8. #8
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by JSUSoutherner View Post
    The bubble sucks this year. 8-3 JSU is in.
    I thought so too even after the games last Saturday but when you sit down and write it out it's actually not that weak. NC A&T swiping a bid won't help but unless there's quite a bit of pandemonium these last two weeks there's going to be a 7-4 CAA/MVFC/Big Sky team or two or an 8-3 SLC/SOCON/OVC team or two left out.
    Professor Chaos is a proud supporter of the 6-time NCAA Division 1 Football National Champion North Dakota State Bison.

  9. #9
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Professor Chaos View Post
    I thought so too even after the games last Saturday but when you sit down and write it out it's actually not that weak. NC A&T swiping a bid won't help but unless there's quite a bit of pandemonium these last two weeks there's going to be a 7-4 CAA/MVFC/Big Sky team or two or an 8-3 SLC/SOCON/OVC team or two left out.
    "Unless there's quite a bit of pandemonium”

    You been paying attention this this season, right?

    I actually made this quip yesterday with Rev and Clenz that given the crazy nature of this season I think JSU should be considered heavy favorites vs. KSU.



    Quote Originally Posted by chattownmocs View Post
    Grass is a disaster. He has 2 senior RBs and he brought in an auburn reject to be his starter. It's sad how in shambles your roster is right now. And it happened so quickly. Pathetic. I guess you should expect it from a career high school coach. Who btw, underachieved in high school. What a loser.

  10. #10
    AGS FCS Champion youngterrier's Avatar
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    Re: The Great SoCon, OVC, SLC Pillow Fight of 2019

    There's a maximum of like 10 teams that will finish 8-3 for at-large in the "power" conferences, with many of them likely not finishing that high.

    I don't see JSU or Wofford getting left out at 8-3. The playoff committee is not going to put 2 7-4 CAA/MVFC teams over 8-3 JSU/Wofford (especially not Wofford with a top 25 win). They aren't going to make it the MVFC/CAA open.

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