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  1. #1
    First Class FCS Ruler Sir William's Avatar
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    Big South football

    It's going to be very interesting to see what happens to Big South football over the next few seasons. While they've added Kennesaw State, Campbell and North Alabama, they've lost Coastal and Liberty, and Chuck South lost the only successful coach in its history, along with several significant assistants.

    Predictions:
    1) Chuck South returns to its losing ways.

    2) Kennesaw and UNA become the perennial conference championship contenders.

    3) Monmouth leaves in few years when invited to the NEC.

    4) Jacksonville follows Campbell's lead and joins conference for football in couple of years.

    5) West Georgia follows UNA's lead and transitions to D1/FCS and joins conference for football in couple of years.

    6) Campbell begins seeking SoCon membership within 5-6 years. (Not saying they necessarily get invited.)

    What else?
    Last edited by Sir William; February 16th, 2017 at 06:43 PM.

  2. #2
    AGS FCS Champion FUBeAR's Avatar
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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir William View Post
    It's going to be very interesting to see what happens to Big South football over the next few seasons. While they've added Kennesaw State, Campbell and North Alabama, they've lost Coastal and Liberty and they've also lost the only successful coach in Chuck South history.

    Predictions:
    1) Chuck South returns to their losing ways.

    2) Kennesaw and UNA become the perennial conference championship contenders.

    3) Monmouth leaves in few years when invited to the NEC.

    4) Jacksonville follows Campbell's lead and joins conference for football in couple of years.

    5) West Georgia follows UNA's lead and transitions to D1/FCS and joins conference for football in couple of years.

    6) Campbell begins seeking SoCon membership within 5-6 years. (Not saying they necessarily get invited.)

    What else?
    No idea about #1 - They obviously lost most of their Coaching Staff + the Headman. Not sure about #6 - I don't know that Campbell will be any more or less interested in joining the SoCon than any of the other Big South schools. I'm SoCon-Centric (so, therefore, biased) so I would think all of the current and future Big South Members, with the exception of Monmouth, would prefer to be in the SoCon over the Big South. Maybe not.

    I think 2-5 are spot on...except I don't know that Monmouth goes NEC. Didn't they leave the NEC? Not sure...anyway, I could just as well see them in the Patriot or the CAA, but all those schools/conferences north of NC just run together for me (sorry for sounding a tad like Citdog, but I'm being honest...about my (chosen) ignorance). Hey, maybe Monmouth will join the Ivies (just kidding).
    NCAA DIVISION I MANUAL

    20.10.1 Commitments to the Division I Collegiate Model
    Bylaws proposed and enacted by member institutions governing the conduct of intercollegiate athletics shall be designed to foster competition in amateur athletics

    20.10.1.2 The Commitment to Amateurism
    Member institutions shall conduct their athletics programs…maintaining a line of demarcation between student-athletes who participate in the Collegiate Model and athletes competing in the professional model

  3. #3
    AGS FCS Champion Franks Tanks's Avatar
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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by FUBeAR View Post
    No idea about #1 - They obviously lost most of their Coaching Staff + the Headman. Not sure about #6 - I don't know that Campbell will be any more or less interested in joining the SoCon than any of the other Big South schools. I'm SoCon-Centric (so, therefore, biased) so I would think all of the current and future Big South Members, with the exception of Monmouth, would prefer to be in the SoCon over the Big South. Maybe not.

    I think 2-5 are spot on...except I don't know that Monmouth goes NEC. Didn't they leave the NEC? Not sure...anyway, I could just as well see them in the Patriot or the CAA, but all those schools/conferences north of NC just run together for me (sorry for sounding a tad like Citdog, but I'm being honest...about my (chosen) ignorance). Hey, maybe Monmouth will join the Ivies (just kidding).
    Monmouth is not joining the Patriot League, unless something happens to Georgetown and the league is forced to add another member.

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    AGS FCS Champion DFW HOYA's Avatar
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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by Franks Tanks View Post
    Monmouth is not joining the Patriot League, unless something happens to Georgetown and the league is forced to add another member.
    At some point the Patriot (and Georgetown) has to come to the reality that Georgetown is increasingly non-competitive with an NEC budget and an Ivy League admissions policy, either of which are incongruous with today's high-budget PL. Maybe the NEC would be interested in bringing them on, the Ivy less so.

    I really don't see Monmouth as interested in the PL. As Rev. John Brooks famously said, "We have set a course for others to follow. So far, no one has followed."
    Georgetown: "We play where we do not compete, and compete where we do not play."

  5. #5
    AGS FCS Champion Franks Tanks's Avatar
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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by DFW HOYA View Post
    At some point the Patriot (and Georgetown) has to come to the reality that Georgetown is increasingly non-competitive with an NEC budget and an Ivy League admissions policy, either of which are incongruous with today's high-budget PL. Maybe the NEC would be interested in bringing them on, the Ivy less so.

    I really don't see Monmouth as interested in the PL. As Rev. John Brooks famously said, "We have set a course for others to follow. So far, no one has followed."
    There would need to be a bit of desperation and compromise on both sides. Monmouth wound desperately need a league (if the Big South implodes) and the Patriot League wound desperately need a new member. Similar to the situation that brought Towson in as a member years ago.

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    AGS FCS Master aceinthehole's Avatar
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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by DFW HOYA View Post
    At some point the Patriot (and Georgetown) has to come to the reality that Georgetown is increasingly non-competitive with an NEC budget and an Ivy League admissions policy, either of which are incongruous with today's high-budget PL. Maybe the NEC would be interested in bringing them on, the Ivy less so.

    I really don't see Monmouth as interested in the PL. As Rev. John Brooks famously said, "We have set a course for others to follow. So far, no one has followed."
    I can't speak with any authority on the matter, but I feel very comfortable saying that the NEC office would consider it a huge coup to add Georgetown to the NEC in football. I honestly can't think of any downside for the NEC members to extend a football membership invite to Georgetown, however I doubt the interest is mutual from the Hoyas perspective.

    Monmouth presents a different set of issue for the NEC (mostly because of their departure from the league), but why wouldn't MU want to join the Patriot League?

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  7. #7
    AGS FCS Champion DFW HOYA's Avatar
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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by aceinthehole View Post
    I can't speak with any authority on the matter, but I feel very comfortable saying that the NEC office would consider it a huge coup to add Georgetown to the NEC in football. I honestly can't think of any downside for the NEC members to extend a football membership invite to Georgetown, however I doubt the interest is mutual from the Hoyas perspective.

    Monmouth presents a different set of issue for the NEC (mostly because of their departure from the league), but why wouldn't MU want to join the Patriot League?
    From 1887 to 1999, Georgetown never had more than three consecutive losing seasons. Since 2000, 15 losing seasons in 16 years with the PL and most haven't been close. (At some point, historical researchers will consider the 2011 standings to be some sort of typo.) How many consecutive losing seasons await them now--five, 10, 20?

    The NEC may not be the best landing--independent status may be just as palatable--but it's worth some dialogue. The PL's use of 60 scholarships AND the Ivy Index chokes off any meaningful recruiting Georgetown can do to compete without grants. Sgarlata can attract the kids in Florida and Texas that wouldn't know Bucknell from Bushwood, but if these same recruits need a 1350 or a 1400 out of 1600 to get in per the league's Harvardian rules, they'll go elsewhere and probably get a free ride to do so.

    The NEC has no such artificial firewall on SAT scores, but there's no star power among the member schools, either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony215 View Post
    I agree fully that the Patriot League has to put its foot down on Georgetown with either upgrading their scholarships/competitiveness and facilities or boot them out. All of Georgetown other sports are in the Big East so the PL wouldn't be losing anything and it would help their other members SOS by not having a dead weight opponent yearly on the schedule.
    Georgetown's membership is renewed by the PL every three years. If it's no longer welcome, someone will say so.
    Last edited by DFW HOYA; February 17th, 2017 at 12:18 PM.
    Georgetown: "We play where we do not compete, and compete where we do not play."

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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by DFW HOYA View Post
    At some point the Patriot (and Georgetown) has to come to the reality that Georgetown is increasingly non-competitive with an NEC budget and an Ivy League admissions policy, either of which are incongruous with today's high-budget PL. Maybe the NEC would be interested in bringing them on, the Ivy less so.

    I really don't see Monmouth as interested in the PL. As Rev. John Brooks famously said, "We have set a course for others to follow. So far, no one has followed."
    I agree fully that the Patriot League has to put its foot down on Georgetown with either upgrading their scholarships/competitiveness and facilities or boot them out. All of Georgetown other sports are in the Big East so the PL wouldn't be losing anything and it would help their other members SOS by not having a dead weight opponent yearly on the schedule. If they don't successfully land Monmouth why not go after Marist if they are willing to up their scholarship money. Facilities wise they could upgrade their stadium a bit. But they have a good endowment so alumni opening their pockets shouldn't be a big problem

  9. #9
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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony215 View Post
    If they don't successfully land Monmouth why not go after Marist if they are willing to up their scholarship money. Facilities wise they could upgrade their stadium a bit.
    I would think they would have to upgrade their stadium A LOT. When I attended a game there in 2013, my "seat" on the visitors side was a large timber embedded into the slightly sloping ground behind the Visitors bench.



    Buildings on campus looked cool though and I certainly enjoyed tailgating on the banks of the Hudson River.
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    20.10.1 Commitments to the Division I Collegiate Model
    Bylaws proposed and enacted by member institutions governing the conduct of intercollegiate athletics shall be designed to foster competition in amateur athletics

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    Member institutions shall conduct their athletics programs…maintaining a line of demarcation between student-athletes who participate in the Collegiate Model and athletes competing in the professional model

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    Re: Big South football

    Quote Originally Posted by DFW HOYA View Post
    At some point the Patriot (and Georgetown) has to come to the reality that Georgetown is increasingly non-competitive with an NEC budget
    Not sure how relevant a budget comparison is...but what about scholarship equivalencies? Does Georgetown come close to matching the top NEC teams?

    It's time for Georgetown to accept that invitation to join Ivy League football. Three non-league games per year are clearly too many for them. They want the Hoyas NOW.

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