What should the preseason SoCon rankings look like headed into next year?

[GSU Eagle]

Here is how I see it:

1. Appalachian St. (They have won the conference for several years now and until someone takes it away they should stay #1)
2. GSU. We lose very little and should be a force next year.
3. Wofford. Ayers had his down year in 2009, was back in 2010 and should be a playoff team again. Ayers is one of the the best coaches in the league.
4. Chattanooga. Made a real push this year and clearly is moving up.
5. Furman. New coach-- hard to say what Furman will be like next year.
6. Elon. I see a big drop off with Riddle leaving next year.
7. Samford.
8. Citadel
9. Western Carolina.

[Reign of Terrier]

I believe that the preseason rankings will look like the above but I think in reality it will turn out like this
Wofford
App
GSU
Chatty
Furman
Elon
Samford
The Citadel
Western Carolina.

For all intents and purposes, App State has given us no reason to think that they are unable to reload after winning the Socon 6 years straight however this year I think they are more vulnerable to losses in the Socon more than ever before. They lose basically all their star power on defense, lots of offensive linemen, lots of receivers, and a lot of senior leadership. I just don't think they are going to be able to beat the upper ranks of the conference this year because every team is so good. They don't play Wofford at Gibbs nearly as well as they do at the Rock. I'd give them the edge against Chatty and GSU this year because of home field advantage, but it wouldn't surprised me in the least if App finished as low as 4th. If App wins conference this year Jerry probably deserves COTY.

Georgia Southern should win between 7-9 games this year. Call me crazy but their success is not because of the triple option. It's because of their defense. I wouldn't be surprised if they won conference or finished 4th.

Wofford I think has a chance to be really good this year (and yes I'm biased). They bring back 9 of 11 starters on one of the conference's (and country's) top defenses. Offensively they lose both tailbacks, and 3 offensive linemen but Wofford has replaced offensive linemen as well as anybody in the last few years (not to mention the replacements have gametime experience this year). We seem to be recruiting tailbacks rather well but if necessary it is felt by many fans that we could move one of our fullbacks or Quarterbacks to play the position well. We return our best receiver, lead rusher, and starting QB. If playcalling is more like it was against Jacksonville State and Chattanooga as opposed to playcalling against App State we will have a circa 2008 offense, provided that Mitch Allen's ability to pitch the ball continues to improve. If not we have 3 quarterbacks behind him that have the talent to be effective running the option. I would be disappointed if we finished lower than 2nd this year.

Chattanooga is an unknown for me, all I know is that they are capable of making the playoffs, even winning conference. Coleman is a great QB, probably going to be all conference, and Huesman is a great coach but I don't know how well they will reload this year. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if they won it this year, and it wouldn't surprise me if they have a little slump too.

Furman and Elon are an unknown to me. I think they could compete for a playoff spot but I doubt they win conference this year.

Samford loses a lot, they will be bottomfeeders on the same level as The Citadel (why is Higgins not fired?) and Western Carolina.

I predict 3 playoff teams this year. Possibly 4. slim possibility of 5.

[elonforrealz]

Here's how I see things

Elon
App
GSU
Wofford
Furman
Chatt
Samford
The Citadel
Western Carolina.

[elonforrealz]

I believe that the preseason rankings will look like the above but I think in reality it will turn out like this
Wofford
App
GSU
Chatty
Furman
Elon
Samford
The Citadel
Western Carolina.

For all intents and purposes, App State has given us no reason to think that they are unable to reload after winning the Socon 6 years straight however this year I think they are more vulnerable to losses in the Socon more than ever before. They lose basically all their star power on defense, lots of offensive linemen, lots of receivers, and a lot of senior leadership. I just don't think they are going to be able to beat the upper ranks of the conference this year because every team is so good. They don't play Wofford at Gibbs nearly as well as they do at the Rock. I'd give them the edge against Chatty and GSU this year because of home field advantage, but it wouldn't surprised me in the least if App finished as low as 4th. If App wins conference this year Jerry probably deserves COTY.

Georgia Southern should win between 7-9 games this year. Call me crazy but their success is not because of the triple option. It's because of their defense. I wouldn't be surprised if they won conference or finished 4th.

Wofford I think has a chance to be really good this year (and yes I'm biased). They bring back 9 of 11 starters on one of the conference's (and country's) top defenses. Offensively they lose both tailbacks, and 3 offensive linemen but Wofford has replaced offensive linemen as well as anybody in the last few years (not to mention the replacements have gametime experience this year). We seem to be recruiting tailbacks rather well but if necessary it is felt by many fans that we could move one of our fullbacks or Quarterbacks to play the position well. We return our best receiver, lead rusher, and starting QB. If playcalling is more like it was against Jacksonville State and Chattanooga as opposed to playcalling against App State we will have a circa 2008 offense, provided that Mitch Allen's ability to pitch the ball continues to improve. If not we have 3 quarterbacks behind him that have the talent to be effective running the option. I would be disappointed if we finished lower than 2nd this year.

Chattanooga is an unknown for me, all I know is that they are capable of making the playoffs, even winning conference. Coleman is a great QB, probably going to be all conference, and Huesman is a great coach but I don't know how well they will reload this year. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if they won it this year, and it wouldn't surprise me if they have a little slump too.

Furman and Elon are an unknown to me. I think they could compete for a playoff spot but I doubt they win conference this year.

Samford loses a lot, they will be bottomfeeders on the same level as The Citadel (why is Higgins not fired?) and Western Carolina.

I predict 3 playoff teams this year. Possibly 4. slim possibility of 5.


I wouldn't fire Higgins either.... Look at the high percentage of his players that graduate.... Pretty damn impressive.

[Reign of Terrier]

I wouldn't fire Higgins either.... Look at the high percentage of his players that graduate.... Pretty damn impressive.

I don't know the percentages, but from what I hear from people, they don't like him at all down there in Chuck town

[elonforrealz]

That shouldn't matter. They aren't going to win anyway. It's a military school. Do you know how hard it is to not only A) recruit to a military institution, but B) recruit good athletes that want to run an option offense. So, when I evaluate Citadel coaching I ignore the product on the field since it's pretty much a conclusion that they will never be able to win consistently anyway. But when you graduate all your players and nobody gets in trouble with the law, that's pretty good.

[Reign of Terrier]

That shouldn't matter. They aren't going to win anyway. It's a military school. Do you know how hard it is to not only A) recruit to a military institution, but B) recruit good athletes that want to run an option offense. So, when I evaluate Citadel coaching I ignore the product on the field since it's pretty much a conclusion that they will never be able to win consistently anyway. But when you graduate all your players and nobody gets in trouble with the law, that's pretty good.
well if Army/Navy/Air Force can get 6-9 wins every year in the FBS the citadel could win 5 or 6 every year too. The Citadel wants to win. They have in the past. See the year 1992. The alumni know this and that's why they don't like Higgins (among many other reasons). Every program aims to win every year and graduating players is a great thing and should be somewhat priority but you can still have a winning coach that graduates just as much

[elonforrealz]

Those programs also have an independent association. They can schedule whatever cupcakes they want to. And Army sucked before their bowl game this year.

Navy Schedule in 2010 (cupcake games only)
Georgia Southern
Louisiana Tech
Air Force
Duke
Central Michigan
Arkansas State
Army

7 cupcakes

Air Force 2010 schedule (cupcakes only)

NW State
Wyoming
Navy
Colorado State
Army

5 cupcakes


So it's not like they have to beat that many top-notch talents to make a bowl game. Maybe one or two non-cupcakes a year, max. Those schools being good is more of a deception than authentic production.

[Reign of Terrier]

Those programs also have an independent association. They can schedule whatever cupcakes they want to. And Army sucked before their bowl game this year.

Navy Schedule in 2010 (cupcake games only)
Georgia Southern
Louisiana Tech
Air Force
Duke
Central Michigan
Arkansas State
Army

7 cupcakes

Air Force 2010 schedule (cupcakes only)

NW State
Wyoming
Navy
Colorado State
Army

5 cupcakes


So it's not like they have to beat that many top-notch talents to make a bowl game. Maybe one or two non-cupcakes a year, max. Those schools being good is more of a deception than authentic production.

I'm not going to debate the merits of that Armed Forces teams' schedule but I will say that the Citadel can be competitive. In 2007 they were probably one win away from the playoffs and they gave Wisconsin a scare. In 1992 they beat Arkansas as well as Army and Navy, and won the socon if I'm not mistaken. Just because a team is a military college does not give it an excuse to be inadequate, because the Citadel can be successful

[elonforrealz]

Okay I'm a recruit.... Pitch Citadel for me.... I'm a guy from a poor background... I'm going to get a scholarship somewhere, and I'm smart despite my upbringing. Trick me into committing to military service. Just try. It's not easy. Oh, and to boot, I have to run the option, which nobody likes to watch. It might win for sometimes, but it's ugly. I'm a flashy guy. Sell me.

[Reign of Terrier]

Okay I'm a recruit.... Pitch Citadel for me.... I'm a guy from a poor background... I'm going to get a scholarship somewhere, and I'm smart despite my upbringing. Trick me into committing to military service. Just try. It's not easy. Oh, and to boot, I have to run the option, which nobody likes to watch. It might win for sometimes, but it's ugly. I'm a flashy guy. Sell me.

I can't because the player you described is not intelligent. You as a poster don't seem to be of an open mind. Remember last year when military colleges beat their bowl opposition by double digits? The option is great son. better than Elon's frilly nilly playbook

[elonforrealz]

I'm not going to get in a debate over which playbook is better, because if I do, I'll say something controversial and get in trouble. The point that I'm making is that offense makes it a) harder to get quality QBs and WRs to commit to your school (it's not impossible, but it's hard) and if you get behind early in a game or have to rely on a 2 minute offense using a QB who is known more for his feet than his water pistol arm.... How can you win that way? If you don't get ahead early it's hard to win.

[Reign of Terrier]

I'm not going to get in a debate over which playbook is better, because if I do, I'll say something controversial and get in trouble. The point that I'm making is that offense makes it a) harder to get quality QBs and WRs to commit to your school (it's not impossible, but it's hard) and if you get behind early in a game or have to rely on a 2 minute offense using a QB who is known more for his feet than his water pistol arm.... How can you win that way? If you don't get ahead early it's hard to win.

First of all you have to remember
A) the Citadel is a college in which enlistment into the military is not a requirement. This is helpful for recruiting
B) You're right, it's hard to come back but not impossible. Look at what Georgia Tech did to Georgia in 2008.
C) An option team that fires on all cylinders is awesome to watch, you should check out the highlights of when Wofford smacked Elon 55-20 in 2008.

[The Eagle's Cliff]

GSU had an unexpectedly good year. I'll agree that defense had a lot to do with it. We're still looking at 2012 before we get the speed in the TO we're accustomed to. What impresses me most about GSU is the return of the GATA mentality. GATA is an intangible that goes beyond offense and defense and the Eagles could have a let down without it's presence.

Wofford is starting to be like App used to be. That is, they're a tough game for everyone, but can't seem to get over the hump to become a real power. Maybe 2011 will be their year. Appy will continue it's recent success, but there won't be as big a gap between them and the rest of the SoCon as there has been. Chattanooga can be right there with GSU, Wofford, and App contending for the title.

The pre-season rankings should be:
App
Wofford (consistency and home vs App and GSU)
GSU
Chatty
Samford (because they'll be better than the other 4)

The bottom four all have big ????

Furman and Elon have new coaches and Elon hasn't been a winner without a QB named Riddle.

Citadel looked awful, but could do well if they improve execution with the option.

Western is a mess, but they, um, have a good band?

[Reign of Terrier]

Wofford is starting to be like App used to be. That is, they're a tough game for everyone, but can't seem to get over the hump to become a real power. Maybe 2011 will be their year.

I agree with you but at the same time we haven't been to the playoffs as many times as App did when they failed in the playoffs. Only time will tell. Hopefully we can get a ring this year

[eaglewraith]

Here's how I see things

Elon
App
GSU
Wofford
Furman
Chatt
Samford
The Citadel
Western Carolina.

Are you serious?

[Reign of Terrier]

Are you serious?

don't worry about it....

[elonforrealz]

Are you serious?

Why would I ever not put Elon at the top? Until I graduate, I don't have to think objectively about preseason rankings.

[I-16Bandit]

don't worry about it....

Ditto.


Why would I ever not put Elon at the top? Until I graduate, I don't have to think objectively about preseason rankings.

So a Western Carolina player wouldn't have to think objectively and put themselves at #1??

[seantaylor]

GSU
Chatty
Appy
Woffie
Eloan
Samford
Furman
WCU
El Chit

[blazrdog#1]

from Auburn to run the offense next year.So keep putting us at the bottom...because Pat Sullivan has been given a directive to win in 2011 or pack his bags!

[The Eagle's Cliff]

from Auburn to run the offense next year.So keep putting us at the bottom...because Pat Sullivan has been given a directive to win in 2011 or pack his bags!

One of our local media guys is a Samford Alumn and he says Samford doesn't really care that much about football, anyway. Maybe he's just comparing it to here.

[elon77]

Here's how I see things

Elon
App
GSU
Wofford
Furman
Chatt
Samford
The Citadel
Western Carolina.

Looks pretty good to me! Drop ASU to 4th and move GSU and Wofford up one each and then it will be right. Elon has plenty of talent on hand could surprise most folks. Hey, they have done it for 4 years .

[PaladinFan]

No one knows what to expect from Furman. They graduate only a small handful of players on either side of the ball off a team that played quite a few close games against playoff teams.

Defense was pretty good last season considering the offense couldn't sustain drives. Even slight improvement from the offense and Furman wins the games against Georgia Southern and Chattanooga (the defense simply cannot stay out there for an entire half). Paladins will return just about everyone, including a guy who should be the unanimous pick for defensive player of the year pre-season in Chris Steed.

Offensively, we finally get to see Chris Forcier as the outright starter most likely. He sat behind Jordan Sorrells and then was injured in the South Carolina game early in the season. Hopefully he gives Furman that great equalizer on offense. He hasn't played much in two years, but he's already put together some electrifying runs.

I imagine Furman is going to look a lot more like its old self in 2011. They bring in a former DC from an SEC school as head coach, so you know there will be a renewed focus on defense (what used to be FU's bread and butter). I'm interested to see what we do offensively, but I'd love to see more of the old power option out of the I formation. Still got good backs and a quick runner under center.

My guess is we will be middle of the pack again this season and start climbing back to our old spot next year.

[Saint3333]

Any takers that ASU doesn't finish 3rd or higher in the SoCon, name the bet? I'll also double down that Elon doesn't win the conference.

Has the rest of the SoCon been out recruiting ASU the last four years and I missed it? ASU may not win it for the 7th straight year, but predicting them 4th seems unreasonable.

[elonforrealz]

I can't bet against App. In order to be the best, you've got to beat the best. We narrowly failed to do so last year. I'm not going to put them fourth like some people because I truly believe until anybody beats them they deserve to be the best in the conference. If I was being objective I would pick them to win the conference.

[PaladinNation]

I gotta agree with Paladin Fan… better times are ahead for Furman.

Bruce Fowler played and coached at Furman a long time and I'll go out on a limb and say head to head against the best Paul Johnson had at GSU, Bruce knows how to plan a defense to slow down option football. I see Furman matching up a lot better against Wofy and GSU this season.

I see Furman taking third maybe second in the SoCon. APP, Woffy, Elon all have to come to Gville this season and at the worst I see Furman going 2-1.

[Apps03]

PaladinFan, Steed is a strong player but, I believe Brent Russell at GSU is going to have something to say about that unanimous pick. He may win but he will have some tough competition. Somebody we have never heard of will have a big season and get consideration for the post season award but those two will be the frontrunners for the preseason award.

[Eaglesrus]

PaladinFan, Steed is a strong player but, I believe Brent Russell at GSU is going to have something to say about that unanimous pick. He may win but he will have some tough competition. Somebody we have never heard of will have a big season and get consideration for the post season award but those two will be the frontrunners for the preseason award.

I agree with y'all about Steed and Russell being leading candidates, but didn't Ameet Pall tie for second in Buck Buchanan Award voting. Not that I personally think that he's better than the other two, but I would think that he'll be in the mix, not to mention possible unknowns, as you say, App 03.

[Eagle22]

I agree with y'all about Steed and Russell being leading candidates, but didn't Ameet Pall tie for second in Buck Buchanan Award voting. Not that I personally think that he's better than the other two, but I would think that he'll be in the mix, not to mention possible unknowns, as you say, App 03.

Agreed. I think Ameet Pall and Brent Russell have to be the leading two preaseason picks for defensive player of the year in the SoCon. That is not an indictment on Steed's abilities, but the other two have set themselves apart at a higher level, IMO.

[elon77]

Any takers that ASU doesn't finish 3rd or higher in the SoCon, name the bet? I'll also double down that Elon doesn't win the conference.

Has the rest of the SoCon been out recruiting ASU the last four years and I missed it? ASU may not win it for the 7th straight year, but predicting them 4th seems unreasonable.

Just wanted to see if I could ruffle some feathers, and it worked. The top part of the Socon should be strong, the bottom probably not so much. It will probably be wide open and a lot of fun. The sun doesn't shine on one dog all the time, it's time for you to finish 4th. BUT, if I was a betting man I would..................................xtwocentsx

[Reign of Terrier]

Honestly, I understand the criticism of Pall. I think Mike Niam may be the sleeper pick for DPOTY, he missed 5 games this year and finished as one of the top tacklers on defense (I can't remember the exact number).

[Smitty]

Appy
GSU
Woffie
Chatty
Elon
Samford
Furman
WCU
El Cid

Seems pretty resonable...

Hopefully this next year we can finally show some consistency somewhere.

[elonforrealz]

Cmitty, are you worried that Elon's in Cullowhee tonight and will probably get revenge for the Socon Tourney loss

[Saint3333]

Just wanted to see if I could ruffle some feathers, and it worked. The top part of the Socon should be strong, the bottom probably not so much. It will probably be wide open and a lot of fun. The sun doesn't shine on one dog all the time, it's time for you to finish 4th. BUT, if I was a betting man I would..................................xtwocentsx

When is the last time ASU finished 4th or lower in the Socon, the sun has been shining for a loooong time.

[Apps03]

Agreed. I think Ameet Pall and Brent Russell have to be the leading two preaseason picks for defensive player of the year in the SoCon. That is not an indictment on Steed's abilities, but the other two have set themselves apart at a higher level, IMO.

I guess that was more of my point. All three are great candidates, I just don't see anyone of them being a "unanimous" selection.

[cmaxwellgsu]

I'm not going to get in a debate over which playbook is better, because if I do, I'll say something controversial and get in trouble. The point that I'm making is that offense makes it a) harder to get quality QBs and WRs to commit to your school (it's not impossible, but it's hard) and if you get behind early in a game or have to rely on a 2 minute offense using a QB who is known more for his feet than his water pistol arm.... How can you win that way? If you don't get ahead early it's hard to win.

I'd take Jaybo over Riddle any day of the week and twice on Saturday. Has plenty of arm to get it done, and he also has an elusiveness and mental toughness that Riddle can't even sniff. Recruiting isn't difficult for the option because it uses a different type of personnel. I don't know what position you play, but it's an easy sell for running backs. Our offense uses a different kind of lineman that is sort of in no man's land in most other offenses. So all we need are a few 6'0-6'2 250 pounders that can run, and we're set there. We're out of the arms race for the giant statues. As for receivers, we can use a blue collar guy that maybe doesn't have quite the speed for the spread. If he'll block, he'll be facing one on one coverage when it comes his way. Again, you can use RB's with speed out there so there's no need to get too caught up in arms race for receivers. Recruiting for the option isn't very difficult in Statesboro, and our coaches are very at getting our talent ready to play.

[Smitty]

Cmitty, are you worried that Elon's in Cullowhee tonight and will probably get revenge for the Socon Tourney loss

If it was last year I wouldn't worry as much but losing our seniors have really hurt the team. I think the only thing that is going for us is that it is a home game and our team is strong in the Ramsey Center.



I basically believe that Basketball is the filler sport for the football offseason.

[PaladinFan]

Agreed. I think Ameet Pall and Brent Russell have to be the leading two preaseason picks for defensive player of the year in the SoCon. That is not an indictment on Steed's abilities, but the other two have set themselves apart at a higher level, IMO.

While I disagree they have set themselves apart, they will probably end up being more of a threat for the award given their positions. Defensive linemen and linebackers, I think, have a better shot at those type awards for the mere fact they are in on more plays. Steed is a cornerback and is locked into one side of the field, often 15-20 yards from the action.

I will say this, Steed may well be the best cornerback to come out of this conference in a long time. Not only big and physical, but if he puts his hands on the ball a defensive touchdown is a strong possibility. I imagine he will lead the conference in 2011 in interceptions, passes defended, and defensive touchdowns, but will be far down the list on tackles given his position. I'm anxious to see what he does with a defensive minded coach like Bruce Fowler running the show.

[md64179]

ASU
GSU
Wofford
UTC
Furman
Elon
Samford
Citadel
WCU

[PhoenixMan]

Looks pretty good to me! Drop ASU to 4th and move GSU and Wofford up one each and then it will be right. Elon has plenty of talent on hand could surprise most folks. Hey, they have done it for 4 years .

although I share your enthusiasm, and hope for a good 2011 season....they REALLY haven't done it for four years. This past season they definitely underachieved, and the surprise was that they didn't return to the playoffs. Just keepin it real.

[PhoenixMan]

I'd take Jaybo over Riddle any day of the week and twice on Saturday. Has plenty of arm to get it done, and he also has an elusiveness and mental toughness that Riddle can't even sniff.

I understand that you are a GSU fan, and therefore biased. But, if you would take Jaybo Shaw as your QB over Scott Riddle, or think Jaybo is more elusive or mentally tough than Riddle......then you are the one sniffing something. Come on Man.

[eaglewraith]

I understand that you are a GSU fan, and therefore biased. But, if you would take Jaybo Shaw as your QB over Scott Riddle, or think Jaybo is more elusive or mentally tough than Riddle......then you are the one sniffing something. Come on Man.

I haven't seen Jaybo start a fight at a baseball game and then run away like a little girl. (Different sport but speaks to character)

Or slap a defender in the head because he's too frustrated from getting put on the ground all night. (Being a little ***** in the face of adversity)

Riddle would not be able to stand up to the grind that Shaw goes through. It takes a special type to handle it, cause you've gotta have the drive inside of you to keep getting up, knowing you're probably going to get smacked hard again the next play....and the next play....and the next play. Especially with a hip problem and a nagging knee in every game, it takes digging down deep and gutting it out, which Shaw pretty much had to contend with after midseason.

Based on history with Riddle, he wouldn't be man enough to be our QB. He also had a temper problem. So yes....I'd take Jaybo any day as well.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

I think most will agree that all agree the top 4 will consist of GSU, Chatty, Wofford, and App.

Furman could improve but won't get into the top 4.
Without Riddle and a questionable hire Elon won't be a top 4 team.
El Cid will get better but still doesn't have a QB for the option.
Western will get better next year but still won't be very good.
Samford will probably finish last without Evans and key players on the defense.

App's defense will keep them from winning the SoCon. No more Fletcher, Smith, and Legree. Can they be replaced?

My take...
1. Wofford (give them the edge over GSU because this year's game is in S'burg)
2. GSU
3. App. State
4. Chatty
5. Furman
6. Elon
7. El Cid
8. Western
9. Samford

[Reign of Terrier]

I think most will agree that all agree the top 4 will consist of GSU, Chatty, Wofford, and App.

Furman could improve but won't get into the top 4.
Without Riddle and a questionable hire Elon won't be a top 4 team.
El Cid will get better but still doesn't have a QB for the option.
Western will get better next year but still won't be very good.
Samford will probably finish last without Evans and key players on the defense.

App's defense will keep them from winning the SoCon. No more Fletcher, Smith, and Legree. Can they be replaced?

My take...
1. Wofford (give them the edge over GSU because this year's game is in S'burg)
2. GSU
3. App. State
4. Chatty
5. Furman
6. Elon
7. El Cid
8. Western
9. Samford

I'll go ahead and point out that the home team hasn't won in a while between GSU and Wofford, however I still think Wofford will win this time around in Spartanburg, if we are "for real" this year at least.

[seantaylor]

I think most will agree that all agree the top 4 will consist of GSU, Chatty, Wofford, and App.

Furman could improve but won't get into the top 4.
Without Riddle and a questionable hire Elon won't be a top 4 team.
El Cid will get better but still doesn't have a QB for the option.
Western will get better next year but still won't be very good.
Samford will probably finish last without Evans and key players on the defense.

App's defense will keep them from winning the SoCon. No more Fletcher, Smith, and Legree. Can they be replaced?

My take...
1. Wofford (give them the edge over GSU because this year's game is in S'burg)
2. GSU
3. App. State
4. Chatty
5. Furman
6. Elon
7. El Cid
8. Western
9. Samford

GSU absolutely owns Woffie in Sparty. Woffie lost much more than GSU. Can't see Woffie finishing top 3.

[Reign of Terrier]

GSU absolutely owns Woffie in Sparty. Woffie lost much more than GSU. Can't see Woffie finishing top 3.

2010-good game, crowd made a difference
2009-you beat a 3-8 team
2007-outperformed us with all everything Jayson Foster.

^^^^that doesn't seem like "absolutely owning" us. Wofford owns GSU in Statesboro with not only 3 straight but 4 of the last 5; Wofford leads the series since 2002 6-4. those stats mean nothing when they put on the pads next year. And we really don't lose a lot either, especially on defense. Wofford's a power that's here to stay

[Saint3333]

No more insert name here. Can they be replaced?



This question has been asked since 2006 when ASU had to replace Williams, Hunter, etc. I think we all know the answer.

[Accelerati Incredibilus]

"Western is a mess, but they, um, have a good band?"

If you like electric guitars and stuff like that. First "marching band" I've ever seen that relied on generators. xlmaox

[Accelerati Incredibilus]

Defense will not be an issue. The Apps did lose some quality players, but return 2 of 4 2010 starters along the line and get Tanyi (3rd in SoCon in sacks '09) back at DE 6-2 260, will replace Bozzo with juco DT 6-4 290 and return 3 back ups, all LB's have starting experience, and return 3 of 4 DB's. The biggest question heading into 2011 will be offense and replacing 3 of 5 starting linemen, 4 WR's and 3 of the top 4 RB's.

[Smitty]

"Western is a mess, but they, um, have a good band?"

If you like electric guitars and stuff like that. First "marching band" I've ever seen that relied on generators. xlmaox

All part of the show. The band could be boring and do the "traditional" marching band show but honestly those are boring...

[PhoenixMan]

I haven't seen Jaybo start a fight at a baseball game and then run away like a little girl. (Different sport but speaks to character)

Or slap a defender in the head because he's too frustrated from getting put on the ground all night. (Being a little ***** in the face of adversity)

Riddle would not be able to stand up to the grind that Shaw goes through. It takes a special type to handle it, cause you've gotta have the drive inside of you to keep getting up, knowing you're probably going to get smacked hard again the next play....and the next play....and the next play. Especially with a hip problem and a nagging knee in every game, it takes digging down deep and gutting it out, which Shaw pretty much had to contend with after midseason.

Based on history with Riddle, he wouldn't be man enough to be our QB. He also had a temper problem. So yes....I'd take Jaybo any day as well.

This is way off the subject of this thread, so my last comment on this. If you would seriously rather have Jaybo, a good/mediocre QB, instead of the all time leader in passing yds, completions, TD passes, 200 and 300 yd. passing games, most attempts without a pick (just to name a few) in SoCon history...again I say, Come on Man. But that's cool, all fans should stand up for their QB.

[Reign of Terrier]

This is way off the subject of this thread, so my last comment on this. If you would seriously rather have Jaybo, a good/mediocre QB, instead of the all time leader in passing yds, completions, TD passes, 200 and 300 yd. passing games, most attempts without a pick (just to name a few) in SoCon history...again I say, Come on Man. But that's cool, all fans should stand up for their QB.

Jaybo is many things but mediocre is not one of them. Riddle is a product of his system so honestly his stats mean nothing to me. The Kool-Aid session must end

[Baldy]

This is way off the subject of this thread, so my last comment on this. If you would seriously rather have Jaybo, a good/mediocre QB, instead of the all time leader in passing yds, completions, TD passes, 200 and 300 yd. passing games, most attempts without a pick (just to name a few) in SoCon history...again I say, Come on Man. But that's cool, all fans should stand up for their QB.

I'll take a winner like Jaybo over a whiner like Riddle any day of the week. In one season, Jaybo took a 5-6 team from the bottom of the SoCon to a national semifinal. Do you really want to compare that to Riddle's one and done in his 4 years?

[OL FU]

I don't know the percentages, but from what I hear from people, they don't like him at all down there in Chuck town

The Citadel should have known better than to hire a yankee:D

I think people's comments above are pretty much on target. The top four teams are ASU, WC, GSU and Chatt and not really in any particular order although I am inclined ot put Chatt fourth.

Furman who knows. xeyebrowx We played decent against ASU, should have beaten Chatt and Georgia Southern (even though both teams played better games than we did and let us hang around with first half turn overs) and of course WC smashed our heads in.

From what I understand, Higgins has a long term contract and the Citadel isn't going to pay two coaches for an extended period of time. The switch the option gave him some breathing room last year because no Citadel person I talked to thought they would amount to much in year one of the new offense. Next year had better be better or they may find an alum willing to fork over the cash to get rid of him.

[eaglewraith]

This is way off the subject of this thread, so my last comment on this. If you would seriously rather have Jaybo, a good/mediocre QB, instead of the all time leader in passing yds, completions, TD passes, 200 and 300 yd. passing games, most attempts without a pick (just to name a few) in SoCon history...again I say, Come on Man. But that's cool, all fans should stand up for their QB.

I'll take "Results in Playoff Games" for $1000 Alex.

I can use stats too.

[elonforrealz]

You know, the same people that are saying Riddle isn't as good as Shaw because of the two's records in playoffs are probably the same idiots that didn't think Felix Hernandez deserve the Cy Young because he was only 13-12. Let's not forget that the Mariners had a HISTORICALLY bad offense and gave King Felix almost NO RUN SUPPORT. He CLEARLY was the best pitcher in the AL.

It's the same thing with Riddle. Now, Elon's defense was good all season. But that's not the point. The point is you cannot throw the game result on the quarterback unless he truly has an Aaron Rodgers or Jake Delhomme (obviously depending on the result) type of game, and Riddle's game against the Spiders resembled neither.

[OL FU]

As far as the Citadel's possibilities, YT is dead on correct. Do they have more limitations than the other schools? Absolutely! I think the ability to compete for a SoCon championship year and and year out is tough for the Citadel with their recruiting limitations. But do they have the ability to be good every year and compete for a championship every two, three or four years? With right coach, absolutely again.

[Accelerati Incredibilus]

All part of the show. The band could be boring and do the "traditional" marching band show but honestly those are boring...

You would be hard pressed to find many people that would describe non-electric bands at FSU, Georgia, Alabama, LSU, Auburn, Tennessee, Jack State, JMU, ASU, Troy, and others as "boring". Personally I hope ASU never goes down the path of electric instruments in the marching band.

[Accelerati Incredibilus]

Riddle was great. As long as things were going good and nobody was putting any pressure on him. When frustrated he fell apart. Saw it happen against App several times.

[cmaxwellgsu]

Riddle was great. As long as things were going good and nobody was putting any pressure on him. When frustrated he fell apart. Saw it happen against App several times.

That's exactly what I mean when I say Jaybo is mentally tougher than Riddle. The game in Statesboro was very telling. Jaybo got blindsided on a corner blitz where he got hit hard enough for his helmet to fly off. I figured he was done for a while (weeks.) He was back out next series, and his play showed no effects. Meanwhile, a pick and a lot of pressure had Riddle slapping defenders after the whistle, stomping around the sideline, and not even speaking with his offense. He has his strengths, but mental toughness isn't one of them.

[smallcollegefbfan]

I believe that the preseason rankings will look like the above but I think in reality it will turn out like this
Wofford
App
GSU
Chatty
Furman
Elon
Samford
The Citadel
Western Carolina.

For all intents and purposes, App State has given us no reason to think that they are unable to reload after winning the Socon 6 years straight however this year I think they are more vulnerable to losses in the Socon more than ever before. They lose basically all their star power on defense, lots of offensive linemen, lots of receivers, and a lot of senior leadership. I just don't think they are going to be able to beat the upper ranks of the conference this year because every team is so good. They don't play Wofford at Gibbs nearly as well as they do at the Rock. I'd give them the edge against Chatty and GSU this year because of home field advantage, but it wouldn't surprised me in the least if App finished as low as 4th. If App wins conference this year Jerry probably deserves COTY.

Georgia Southern should win between 7-9 games this year. Call me crazy but their success is not because of the triple option. It's because of their defense. I wouldn't be surprised if they won conference or finished 4th.

Wofford I think has a chance to be really good this year (and yes I'm biased). They bring back 9 of 11 starters on one of the conference's (and country's) top defenses. Offensively they lose both tailbacks, and 3 offensive linemen but Wofford has replaced offensive linemen as well as anybody in the last few years (not to mention the replacements have gametime experience this year). We seem to be recruiting tailbacks rather well but if necessary it is felt by many fans that we could move one of our fullbacks or Quarterbacks to play the position well. We return our best receiver, lead rusher, and starting QB. If playcalling is more like it was against Jacksonville State and Chattanooga as opposed to playcalling against App State we will have a circa 2008 offense, provided that Mitch Allen's ability to pitch the ball continues to improve. If not we have 3 quarterbacks behind him that have the talent to be effective running the option. I would be disappointed if we finished lower than 2nd this year.

Chattanooga is an unknown for me, all I know is that they are capable of making the playoffs, even winning conference. Coleman is a great QB, probably going to be all conference, and Huesman is a great coach but I don't know how well they will reload this year. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if they won it this year, and it wouldn't surprise me if they have a little slump too.

Furman and Elon are an unknown to me. I think they could compete for a playoff spot but I doubt they win conference this year.

Samford loses a lot, they will be bottomfeeders on the same level as The Citadel (why is Higgins not fired?) and Western Carolina.

I predict 3 playoff teams this year. Possibly 4. slim possibility of 5.

Mark my words on this. This past year was the start of an App State decline. I think Wofford and GSU both are catching up, GSU is catching back up very quickly. UTC is more improved and Furman will either improve in 2011 or 2012 to really clog up the top of the standings.

Teams are improving and have begun to figure out the spread offense and we all know ASU isn't going to use weapons like Brian Quick as much as they should. They will be very young up front on the OL and lose Jabari Fletcher, DJ Smith, and Mark LeGree on defense leaving them for the first time without a star on the unit heading into the season. I think ASU should be picked number one in the preseason based on history but it wouldn't surprise me one bit to see ASU finish in a tie for first again or even second in the SoCon.

As far as nationally they simply weren't big enough for Villanova and looking at their current commitments this year the coaches obviously didn't learn their lesson signing some smaller linemen again. Other teams are going for bigger and stronger linemen and it is hurting ASU when they get into the playoffs. I haven't crunched the numbers for exact size averages but just glancing there is a big difference in the average OL size for the semi-final teams this year compared to ASU.

[Apps03]

Its nice when a decline is "finish in a tie for first again or even second in the SoCon."...

Having said that, I don't disagree with what you are saying at all. The debate begins with, why?

[Reign of Terrier]

Mark my words on this. This past year was the start of an App State decline. I think Wofford and GSU both are catching up, GSU is catching back up very quickly. UTC is more improved and Furman will either improve in 2011 or 2012 to really clog up the top of the standings.

Teams are improving and have begun to figure out the spread offense and we all know ASU isn't going to use weapons like Brian Quick as much as they should. They will be very young up front on the OL and lose Jabari Fletcher, DJ Smith, and Mark LeGree on defense leaving them for the first time without a star on the unit heading into the season. I think ASU should be picked number one in the preseason based on history but it wouldn't surprise me one bit to see ASU finish in a tie for first again or even second in the SoCon.

As far as nationally they simply weren't big enough for Villanova and looking at their current commitments this year the coaches obviously didn't learn their lesson signing some smaller linemen again. Other teams are going for bigger and stronger linemen and it is hurting ASU when they get into the playoffs. I haven't crunched the numbers for exact size averages but just glancing there is a big difference in the average OL size for the semi-final teams this year compared to ASU.
I remember in the past year when the App coaches neglected to sign that many linemen, App fans were concerned about the future and the future is now

[Saint3333]

Mark my words this will be the start of the decline of ASU they will tie for the SoCon championship or finish 2nd. That is one heck of a decline. I don't see it as much of a decline for ASU as much as GSU getting back to normal, Wofford being solid, and UTC replacing Furman as a contender.

ASU will get Tanyi (sp?) back at DE to replace Fletch, he and Rizor are a solid pair of DEs, ASU also has two redshirts from last year to help with DT depth. I think Sanders will continue to grow and may move to safety. Kimbrough will replace Smith (someone you have said all year is overrated) and do a good job and if Wray and Greir continue to improve the LB core will not be a problem. Plus there is always at least one freshman that comes out of no where to contribute.

As for ASU o-lineman they are young, but size shouldn't be a factor. The sophomores and redshirt freshman for 2011 were 6'6" - 275, 6'4" - 265, 6'6" - 280, and 6'2" - 275 when they came to school. I'm willing to bet those boys have gained mass, ASU will be bigger up front this year and these guys are also faster than some current lineman. They also have two 6'2" -275 commitments, one a Shrine bowl player, the other with offers from Army and Navy. Yeah those guys are going to be terrible.

[smallcollegefbfan]

Its nice when a decline is "finish in a tie for first again or even second in the SoCon."...

Having said that, I don't disagree with what you are saying at all. The debate begins with, why?


I remember in the past year when the App coaches neglected to sign that many linemen, App fans were concerned about the future and the future is now

Several reasons and youngterrier mentioned one of them.

1. OL is going to be young and I don't think it will be too deep because of low numbers in recruiting a few years.

2. ASU tries to spread the ball around too much not using weapons like Brian Quick like they should.

3. I think the ASU coaches are a little arrogant and have big egos because they are clearly sticking to what they were doing 5 years ago even though they aren't dominating like they were and aren't a guarantee to even win the SoCon anymore. Other teams are closing the gap and someone is going to pass them either this year or next year.

4. Teams are figuring out the spread offense.

5. Jerry Moore's replacements when he lost some key coaches haven't been that great. ASU has made mental mistakes on special teams and had some bad play calling which can be attributed to below average coaching.

With that stuff said it's like Apps03 said it is pretty impressive when a decline is finishing in a tie for first or finishing second.

Here is an interesting stat. If I made the statement that a team had eight legit NFL prospects in their senior and junior class with four of the eight likely to get drafted you would be impressed and assume that team would not only win their league outright but would at least be in the NC game. Well, ASU had that this year and they tied the league and didn't even make it to the semi-finals..

For those wondering who the prospects are the eight total are LeGree, Smith, Kilgore, Fletcher, Moore, Hillary, Cadet, and Quick; the four draftable players are Quick, LeGree, Smith, and Kilgore.

[smallcollegefbfan]

Mark my words this will be the start of the decline of ASU they will tie for the SoCon championship or finish 2nd. That is one heck of a decline. I don't see it as much of a decline for ASU as much as GSU getting back to normal, Wofford being solid, and UTC replacing Furman as a contender.

ASU will get Tanyi (sp?) back at DE to replace Fletch, he and Rizor are a solid pair of DEs, ASU also has two redshirts from last year to help with DT depth. I think Sanders will continue to grow and may move to safety. Kimbrough will replace Smith (someone you have said all year is overrated) and do a good job and if Wray and Greir continue to improve the LB core will not be a problem. Plus there is always at least one freshman that comes out of no where to contribute.

As for ASU o-lineman they are young, but size shouldn't be a factor. The sophomores and redshirt freshman for 2011 were 6'6" - 275, 6'4" - 265, 6'6" - 280, and 6'2" - 275 when they came to school. I'm willing to bet those boys have gained mass, ASU will be bigger up front this year and these guys are also faster than some current lineman. They also have two 6'2" -275 commitments, one a Shrine bowl player, the other with offers from Army and Navy. Yeah those guys are going to be terrible.

Nobody said ASU would be terrible but they are going to be younger in key spots. You do know that who a player had offers from or his star rating in FCS really means nothing right? If major offers or stars meant anything then Mark LeGree (only 1 offer and it was ASU) and Armanti Edwards (no FBS offers for QB) would not have panned out. Neither of them had any stars. I could point out so many more not just from ASU but other teams who fit that same mold. I just looked at ASU recruiting the last 5 years and Malcolm Bennett was the highest rated by Rivals and he wasn't even one of the top 10 players from those five classes. I'm not saying ASU will be bad but I'm saying because of the reasons above I think teams are getting better and closing the game. Maybe ASU declining isn't the best wording but it will appear so because other teams like GSU, Wofford, and UTC (Furman if not this year in two years) are getting better and are likely to completely tear down that gap the next couple years.

[Saint3333]

Did I mention "stars"? Boise St. the last 5 years has had the 75th best recruiting class according to the stars ratings.

Completely disagree with the FBS offers commits however. Edwards had offers from Clemson and Vandy I believe not for QB but BCS offers. Wray had CUSA offers and has turned out to be a stud LB. A couple of the younger lineman mentioned in the 2010 class did as well and they will be solid as well.

Thanks for restating my point about the remainder of the conference vs. saying you agree.

Lesson learned - don't start a post mark my words and predict doom and gloom for a program and expect not to be called out.

[smallcollegefbfan]

Did I mention "stars"? Boise St. the last 5 years has had the 75th best recruiting class according to the stars ratings.

Completely disagree with the FBS offers commits however. Edwards had offers from Clemson and Vandy I believe not for QB but BCS offers. Wray had CUSA offers and has turned out to be a stud LB. A couple of the younger lineman mentioned in the 2010 class did as well and they will be solid as well.

Thanks for restating my point about the remainder of the conference vs. saying you agree.

Lesson learned - don't start a post mark my words and predict doom and gloom for a program and expect not to be called out.

I stand by what I said. Teams are figuring out the spread. ASU has a huge bulls eye on their back and everyone is gunning for them. Teams are closing the gap. Others have passed ASU nationally and SoCon teams are working hard on that as well.

You didn't mention stars but most folks associate big offers with stars or great recruiting classes with stars. Heck one of ASU's best classes ever was the one with Kerry Brown, Corey Lynch, Marques Murrell, etc. and that group didn't have many stars at all and several of them like Murrell and Lynch didn't have any major FBS offers.

Having FBS offers doesn't matter. I point back to Mark LeGree. And my comment on Armanti Edwards those like Clemson and Vandy offered him as a DB and I said major FBS offers. Vandy is the worst team in the SEC and he had an offer from New Mexico State which is not exactly a big time FBS program. All of the FBS schools were wrong about AE. He was a great QB. And if FBS teams were always right in their offers then no FCS players would make it to the NFL and AE would not have been a great QB. Trust me by his senior year there were maybe only 3 or 4 teams in the ACC and SEC combined who would not have taken him as their starter.

We will see on the OL. My prediction is the ASU OL struggles early in the year but gets better. I think ASU loses at least 3 games this year, maybe 4, and one of those losses is going to be in the playoffs until ASU gets bigger and stronger on the OL.

[Saint3333]

Agree that having no FBS offers isn't important, ASU has made a living off those kind of guys, however I disagree that signing players having FBS offers doesn't matter. Offers are a much better gauge than stars. Every player with FBS offers tends to contribute when signed.

[smallcollegefbfan]

Agree that having no FBS offers isn't important, ASU has made a living off those kind of guys, however I disagree that signing players having FBS offers doesn't matter. Offers are a much better gauge than stars. Every player with FBS offers tends to contribute when signed.

You just made my point. What I'm saying is that ASU could sign a class of guys with no FBS offers and it can be just as good or better than a class with players who have a bunch of C-USA, Sun Belt, etc. offers. I just looked at some of your top names on Rivals and saw none of the following have any FBS offers, according to Rivals: DeAndre Presley, Brian Quick, Mark LeGree, Ben Jorden, and DJ Smith. Now I know Smith eventually had some offers but Rivals didn't update it.

Does having FBS offers mean anything? It means they are sought after but it does not mean the player will be good. It just means they are sought after. Offers from Navy, Army, North Texas, etc. doesn't mean the player will be any good at all but if a player has offers from North Carolina, Wake Forest, ECU, South Carolina, Clemson, etc. that is a different story. It would be like saying a player who has FCS offers from Duquesne, VMI, Tennessee Tech, and Idaho State is equal to having offers from App State, Delaware, GSU, Montana, etc. and it isn't. Not all FCS offers are equal and not all FBS offers are equal. Here is an example.

Player A is offered by the following groups: Delta State (D2), Grand Valley State (D2), App State (FCS), Richmond (FCS), Delaware (FCS), Clemson (FBS), Villanova (FCS), ECU (FBS), and Montana (FCS). Then Player B has offers from Army (FBS), VMI (FCS), Navy (FBS), North Texas (FBS), Eastern Michigan (FBS), Buffalo (FBS), and Mars Hill (D2). Player A has just one FBS offer but his entire list from top to bottom is more impressive than Player B's list who has more FBS offers. It just happens his FBS offers are from awful teams for the most part. That's all I'm saying look at how good the teams are not the Division they are from. Top 10 in FCS is better than the bottom 10 in FBS by far.

[Saint3333]

No, you aren't understanding what I'm saying. There are guys that don't have FBS offers that turn out to be all-americans, but there are more that don't last more than two years with the program and/or never start, the guys with FBS offers, as a percentage, are more likely to stay with the team and contribute.

And yes Smith had ACC offers.

[PaladinFan]

I'll take a winner like Jaybo over a whiner like Riddle any day of the week. In one season, Jaybo took a 5-6 team from the bottom of the SoCon to a national semifinal. Do you really want to compare that to Riddle's one and done in his 4 years?

I'm no Riddle fan, but you still have to recognize what the guy has done. We all remember just how pathetic Elon was when they entered the league. I imagine any reasonable Phoenix fan would agree that they were years behind the SoCon's upper echelon. Riddle is a guy that took over a glorified high school team and elevated them to a level most thought would never happen.

This argument is as old as the hills. As much as Riddle is a system QB, so is Shaw. In the same way that the system helped out Colt Brennan and Timmy Chang, it helped out Riddle. It also helps out Shaw. At the end of the day, you have to recognize that Riddle took over a struggling program and turned them into a national contender. He saw about every conceivable defense and got the kitchen sink thrown at him repeatedly. I don't hold it against the guy because he wasn't lights out in the playoffs. Sometimes you gotta put some of the blame on the supporting cast as well.

That's my two cents.

[smallcollegefbfan]

No, you aren't understanding what I'm saying. There are guys that don't have FBS offers that turn out to be all-americans, but there are more that don't last more than two years with the program and/or never start, the guys with FBS offers, as a percentage, are more likely to stay with the team and contribute.

And yes Smith had ACC offers.

Okay going by that look at SEC teams. Those are offers correct? Look at how many of those guys don't pan out. It is less than 50 percent for most teams.

This whole thing has too many variables to say that one thing or another is a lock to mean they will pan out. It just depends. You can't make a blanket statement. There are so many factors involved. Yes it looks good for a player to have FBS offers but I'm just saying it doesn't mean anything. The guy with offers from Navy and Army could be out of the program in two years or never touch the field just as easily as the kid with no offers at all is an All-American.

I know what your saying but I also know I can find several examples of kids ASU and others signed who did not pan out all. Like I said, there are so many factors involved.

[elonforrealz]

You know, the same people that are saying Riddle isn't as good as Shaw because of the two's records in playoffs are probably the same idiots that didn't think Felix Hernandez deserve the Cy Young because he was only 13-12. Let's not forget that the Mariners had a HISTORICALLY bad offense and gave King Felix almost NO RUN SUPPORT. He CLEARLY was the best pitcher in the AL.

It's the same thing with Riddle. Now, Elon's defense was good all season. But that's not the point. The point is you cannot throw the game result on the quarterback unless he truly has an Aaron Rodgers or Jake Delhomme (obviously depending on the result) type of game, and Riddle's game against the Spiders resembled neither.

[smallcollegefbfan]

Any takers that ASU doesn't finish 3rd or higher in the SoCon, name the bet? I'll also double down that Elon doesn't win the conference.

Has the rest of the SoCon been out recruiting ASU the last four years and I missed it? ASU may not win it for the 7th straight year, but predicting them 4th seems unreasonable.

Now that is insane. ASU won't drop off that much. Might finish second or tied for second but no way they finish 4th or lower this year. ASU returns Presley, Cadet, Quick, Tanyi, McCray, Kimbrough, Martin, etc., etc. Plenty of good players. I just said I don't think they will dominate like they have and I believe other teams are catching up a bit. The SoCon is going to be light years ahead of where it was in 2009 this coming season. You can see that so many teams are improving. I just don't see ASU skipping through like they have in some years. This year will be a battle to win it IMO.

[phoenixphanatic21]

GSU
App
Wofford
UTC
Elon
Furman
Samford
Citadel
WCU

[The Eagle's Cliff]

App has obviously done a phenomenal job on the field and with their fan base, facility improvements, game day, etc. since 2005. What can't be ignored when discussing Appy's "rise" in the SoCon is the decline of GSU and Furman. While Wofford and Elon provided some level of competition, it was never up to the level of the old "Big Three".

Georgia Southern had a good year with a special bunch of players, but we're still looking at 2012 for a return to the kind of dominance synonymous with Georgia Southern. If Chatty continues on the same path, I look for them to complete the new Triumvirate of the SoCon along with App and GSU. 2011 should be interesting in the SoCon.

One thing to watch out for is the Metro Atlanta recruiting game. App, Furman, Western, and Wofford pull players from that region. Ga State and Kennesaw St will enter the fray along with Chatty and may reduce the talent level Furman and Woffy are accustomed to.

[phoenixphanatic21]

I'm no Riddle fan, but you still have to recognize what the guy has done. We all remember just how pathetic Elon was when they entered the league. I imagine any reasonable Phoenix fan would agree that they were years behind the SoCon's upper echelon. Riddle is a guy that took over a glorified high school team and elevated them to a level most thought would never happen.

This argument is as old as the hills. As much as Riddle is a system QB, so is Shaw. In the same way that the system helped out Colt Brennan and Timmy Chang, it helped out Riddle. It also helps out Shaw. At the end of the day, you have to recognize that Riddle took over a struggling program and turned them into a national contender. He saw about every conceivable defense and got the kitchen sink thrown at him repeatedly. I don't hold it against the guy because he wasn't lights out in the playoffs. Sometimes you gotta put some of the blame on the supporting cast as well.

That's my two cents.

+1

[Saint3333]

Okay going by that look at SEC teams. Those are offers correct? Look at how many of those guys don't pan out. It is less than 50 percent for most teams.

This whole thing has too many variables to say that one thing or another is a lock to mean they will pan out. It just depends. You can't make a blanket statement. There are so many factors involved. Yes it looks good for a player to have FBS offers but I'm just saying it doesn't mean anything. The guy with offers from Navy and Army could be out of the program in two years or never touch the field just as easily as the kid with no offers at all is an All-American.

I know what your saying but I also know I can find several examples of kids ASU and others signed who did not pan out all. Like I said, there are so many factors involved.

I agree there are many factors.

The difference is the SEC offers you're speaking of are guys trying to play at the SEC level (IMO the highest level in college). If those guys had turned down the SEC offers and gone to CUSA or Sun Belt programs they would likely have had a better success rate. Guys that have FBS offers and go to FCS schools are more likely to be "tweeners" that would sit the bench for three years at the FBS level (especially BCS schools) that could get playing time by their sophomore years at FCS schools. None of these are absolute statements, just averages.

[Saint3333]

Now that is insane. ASU won't drop off that much. Might finish second or tied for second but no way they finish 4th or lower this year. ASU returns Presley, Cadet, Quick, Tanyi, McCray, Kimbrough, Martin, etc., etc. Plenty of good players. I just said I don't think they will dominate like they have and I believe other teams are catching up a bit. The SoCon is going to be light years ahead of where it was in 2009 this coming season. You can see that so many teams are improving. I just don't see ASU skipping through like they have in some years. This year will be a battle to win it IMO.

This was in response to Elon fans picking ASU 4th.

[ElonPride]

This was in response to Elon fans picking ASU 4th.

A questionable Elon fan orginially posted that prediction......I'm not sure the elonforrealz is a "for realz" an Elon fan. The guy claimed to be a player, but that is highly doubtful.

[Reign of Terrier]

Now that is insane. ASU won't drop off that much. Might finish second or tied for second but no way they finish 4th or lower this year. ASU returns Presley, Cadet, Quick, Tanyi, McCray, Kimbrough, Martin, etc., etc. Plenty of good players. I just said I don't think they will dominate like they have and I believe other teams are catching up a bit. The SoCon is going to be light years ahead of where it was in 2009 this coming season. You can see that so many teams are improving. I just don't see ASU skipping through like they have in some years. This year will be a battle to win it IMO.
I wouldn't be surprised if App finished 4th, that's not a knock on App but rather a compliment on how the socon will be much improved this year; remember in '08 GSU finished 6-5 but lost to the top 3 Socon teams by a grand total of 4 points, I see App finishing that low as extremely unlikely but a possibility nevertheless

App has obviously done a phenomenal job on the field and with their fan base, facility improvements, game day, etc. since 2005. What can't be ignored when discussing Appy's "rise" in the SoCon is the decline of GSU and Furman. While Wofford and Elon provided some level of competition, it was never up to the level of the old "Big Three".

Georgia Southern had a good year with a special bunch of players, but we're still looking at 2012 for a return to the kind of dominance synonymous with Georgia Southern. If Chatty continues on the same path, I look for them to complete the new Triumvirate of the SoCon along with App and GSU. 2011 should be interesting in the SoCon.

One thing to watch out for is the Metro Atlanta recruiting game. App, Furman, Western, and Wofford pull players from that region. Ga State and Kennesaw St will enter the fray along with Chatty and may reduce the talent level Furman and Woffy are accustomed to.
interesting assertion. I will admit that Wofford and Elon didn't play to the level of GSU and Furman in the old days, but Wofford was definitely the closest to playing at that level as we sustained more success for a longer period of time. Take away that abysmal 2009 year and no one outside of GSU and App have beaten us in conference since 2006, heck since 2002 the only team that has a winning record against Wofford is App State.

as for the recruiting standpoint we will have to wait and see, Wofford has gotten players from all over the place and in the past we went to Ohio, but the last few years we've gone the southern route

[GSU Eagle]

1 thing working against GSU is that the Wofford and App games are on the road this year, although the Eagles tend to play better vs. Wofford in Spartanburg than in Statesboro. In my memory serves, wehave not had a great deal of success in Boone over the last 10 years. I think we have won once in our last 5 trips to Boone.

Where is the Wofford/App. game in 2011?

[Reign of Terrier]

1 thing working against GSU is that the Wofford and App games are on the road this year, although the Eagles tend to play better vs. Wofford in Spartanburg than in Statesboro. In my memory serves, wehave not had a great deal of success in Boone over the last 10 years. I think we have won once in our last 5 trips to Boone.

Where is the Wofford/App. game in 2011?

it's @ Gibbs, and usually Wofford plays better against them at Gibbs(2009 we were 3-8 but led for most the game, 2007 we won, 2005 they beat us bad but we weren't that good again either, and 2003 we won)

to your point about the GSU/Wofford rivalry, I don't think location of the game is as important as circumstances surrounding the game, let's review to say 2002
2010 playoffs: GSU was on a roll in the playoffs, and it's always hard to beat a team twice
2010: Wofford played well against a GSU team that hadn't quite hit its stride yet
2009: a wofford team that finished 3-8 that was devastated by injuries loses to GSU team that finished 5-6
2008: good Wofford team almost chokes but beats a GSU team that was better than their 6-5 record
2007: Jayson Foster. decent but not great Wofford defense nothing more needs to be said
2006: a bubble 7-4 Wofford team (in retrospect probably could have made the playoffs in the current format) beats the worst GSU team of all time
2005: the only upset, a 6-5 wofford team beat a GSU team that made the playoffs
2004: nevermind, GSU stomping the-then defending conference champs into the ground by 40 would have been an upset
2003 and 2002: boths games came down to a last minute scoring drive by wofford.

So really, I thinks it's only chance that the visiting team has won the last 6, the games are just so close

[The Eagle's Cliff]

1 thing working against GSU is that the Wofford and App games are on the road this year, although the Eagles tend to play better vs. Wofford in Spartanburg than in Statesboro. In my memory serves, wehave not had a great deal of success in Boone over the last 10 years. I think we have won once in our last 5 trips to Boone.

Where is the Wofford/App. game in 2011?

We've never had success in Boone. Interesting Stat: In the Modern Era (1987) GSU and App are Both 7-3 at home against each other.


it's @ Gibbs, and usually Wofford plays better against them at Gibbs(2009 we were 3-8 but led for most the game, 2007 we won, 2005 they beat us bad but we weren't that good again either, and 2003 we won)

to your point about the GSU/Wofford rivalry, I don't think location of the game is as important as circumstances surrounding the game, let's review to say 2002
2010 playoffs: GSU was on a roll in the playoffs, and it's always hard to beat a team twice
2010: Wofford played well against a GSU team that hadn't quite hit its stride yet
2009: a wofford team that finished 3-8 that was devastated by injuries loses to GSU team that finished 5-6
2008: good Wofford team almost chokes but beats a GSU team that was better than their 6-5 record
2007: Jayson Foster. decent but not great Wofford defense nothing more needs to be said
2006: a bubble 7-4 Wofford team (in retrospect probably could have made the playoffs in the current format) beats the worst GSU team of all time
2005: the only upset, a 6-5 wofford team beat a GSU team that made the playoffs
2004: nevermind, GSU stomping the-then defending conference champs into the ground by 40 would have been an upset
2003 and 2002: boths games came down to a last minute scoring drive by wofford.

So really, I thinks it's only chance that the visiting team has won the last 6, the games are just so close

I agree with this. 2002 and 2003 were the "surprise" years. Ayers basically out-coached Mike Sewak, which isn't hard to do. I think most Eagle Fans see 2006-2009 as a self-imposed Death Penalty.

[1andDone]

I am going with App State or Georgia Southern to win it all.

[SideLine Shooter]

Why would I ever not put Elon at the top? Until I graduate, I don't have to think objectively about preseason rankings.

With reasoning like that, I really don't think you have to worry about graduating too much.

[ElonPride]

I am going with App State or Georgia Southern to win it all.

At this time I would pick either Wofford or GSU.

1/2: GSU/Wofford
3: App
4-6: UTC/Furman/Elon (in no particular order)
7-9: Samford/El Cid/WCU (in no particular order)

[GATA]

I'm not going to get in a debate over which playbook is better, because if I do, I'll say something controversial and get in trouble. The point that I'm making is that offense makes it a) harder to get quality QBs and WRs to commit to your school (it's not impossible, but it's hard) and if you get behind early in a game or have to rely on a 2 minute offense using a QB who is known more for his feet than his water pistol arm.... How can you win that way? If you don't get ahead early it's hard to win.

Is this even a real question? It's the main reason why the service academies are even competitive.

Also, GSU won all 6 of their national titles running an offense that you seem to think is fundamentally broken. Football is football...the object is to score points...not look flashy. I remember in 2004 GSU scored about 48 points per game...

It doesn't matter how you do it...just score points.

...and the idea that if you fall behind you can't catch back up is silly. No team wants to fall behind by double digit points. It's hard for ANYBODY to catch back up...not just option teams.

[elonforrealz]

You guys get so mad when people disrespect ASU, but look at all the constant disrespect of Elon, being ranked 4-6. Will losing Riddle hurt? Perhaps. But in our spread offense I think Thomas Wilson or Mike Quinn, whoever wins the job out of training camp, can do a damn good job at the position and have us in contention for a national title.

[insideout08]

You guys get so mad when people disrespect ASU, but look at all the constant disrespect of Elon, being ranked 4-6. Will losing Riddle hurt? Perhaps. But in our spread offense I think Thomas Wilson or Mike Quinn, whoever wins the job out of training camp, can do a damn good job at the position and have us in contention for a national title.

You finished in a 3-way tie for third last year, went 6-5, lost the best QB in school history, and are changing coaches. I don't think it's a stretch for anyone outside of your program to predict a 4-6 finish for Elon in 2011.

[elonforrealz]

Remember back in the day when the niners lost Joe Montana... It didn't seem to me they lost much of a beat with the new guy.

[ElonAlum]

Didnt GSU have a season somewhat like ours two years ago? They had record like ours, lots of close losses and didnt they have a new coach? (just playing Devils advocate here)

I personally think that the SoCon will be a toss up next year. ASU is always strong, GSU will be strong, Wofford will be strong, UTC and Furman are on the upswing, and Elon has alot of unknowns but could shock some teams and finish around the top.

[PhoenixMan]

Remember back in the day when the niners lost Joe Montana... It didn't seem to me they lost much of a beat with the new guy.
I like your line of thinking...especially if Wilson or Quinn is as good Steve Young:-)

[Saint3333]

Remember back in the day when the niners lost Joe Montana... It didn't seem to me they lost much of a beat with the new guy.

The 49ers?

1. pro vs. college, they isn't a draft in college
2. The 49ers won championships and had championship talent around Montana

Picking Elon 4-6th is logical based upon last year's results and the players they loss vs. other program prior year success and players lost. Elon just lost their coach, which will likely have an impact on recruiting this year. Please remind me why Elon should be picked above the following programs: ASU, GSU, Wofford, and UTC.

[biggie]

I would also go with:

GSU
Chatty
App
Woff
Samford
Elon
Furman
WCU
El Cit

App is losing too much on OL, WR and D to build confidence to me. Though I would expect coaches/Media Will have App 1 or 2. Chatty may not continue their improvemnt streak but we'll see.

[JROCK98]

I think the top three are ASU, GSU and Wofford in no particular order as I see any one of them coming in first. ASU gets GSU in Boone and will be looking for pay back from last year. ASU travels to Wofford and rarely plays their best ball there. Chatty can factor into that also but their last game against Wofford in 2010 really surprised me and keeps me from putting them in the title hunt right now.
Out of positions where ASU lost key players the OL concerns me the most. I think the talent is definitely there and very well could be better than what was lost but how long will it take the new group to gel together is the big question mark. I actually think the WR position will not miss and beat and the talent will be better. On defense replacing Smith is huge but the guy replacing him started last year and is a heck of a talent so I see this position as a push and I think the secondary improves this year with the guys having a year under their belt in a new system etc.

[Accelerati Incredibilus]

Mountaineers have a stockpile of young talent waiting in the wings nobody knows about. Perhaps the best back to back recruiting classes in SoCon history has produced names like Lott, Washington, Walker, Peacock, Sawyer, Bailey, McDonald, McDermott, Bostic, Jones, Fisher, Lamm, and Barnes. All redshirt freshmen or sophmores. Some will think I'm insane, but expect Kalik Barnes to push DeAndre this spring and fall. Ya'll keep on thinking the Apps are slipping. The only thing that can screw this bunch up are the coaches. Unfortunately they've been known to do that from time to time.

[Reign of Terrier]

Didnt GSU have a season somewhat like ours two years ago? They had record like ours, lots of close losses and didnt they have a new coach? (just playing Devils advocate here)



Um, let's see here, Elon didn't win a playoff game that year. GSU won not one, not two, but three this year

[Reign of Terrier]

If Wofford can get the monkey off our back and beat App, stay consistent in conference, as well as beat GSU at home, I think we'll win conference. We haven't been able to do all three of the listed since 2003 in an unfortunately down southern conference (however that Wofford team was still "for real" and the best team Wofford team in history imo at least defensively). The biggest deal to me is if we can beat App. The last 2 playoff years we've been a darn good team, then we head into Boone, get scared in the lights, and get flattened in result. Then the next couple weeks of the season we use as a "rally the troops" kind of games. In short we got exposed at App. If we can beat them or stay within a score of them, I don't just like our chances at a conference title but at a national title as well

[The Eagle's Cliff]

Ok, going way out just to make it interesting. App beats GSU; Woffy beats App; GSU beats Woffy. How does the rest play out? Does Chatty get revenge against Woffy at Findley? Does Elon surprise everyone and get App at Rhodes? GSU is home against Furman, Chatty, Western, Citadel. App is home against Chatty, Samford, Western, and GSU. Woffy is home against App, GSU, Elon, and Samford.

I'd say Woffy has the tougher home schedule, App has the tougher road schedule, and GSU is in between.

Just like everyone was justified in picking GSU to finish 7th in 2010, we're justified in putting question marks on Samford and Citadel based on past performance and Elon and Furman have coaching and personnel unknowns. However, it wouldn't surprise me to see Furman and Elon do well and Citadel will be trouble if/when they get a handle on the offense.

[elonforrealz]

Okay, I don't see the love affair with UTC. Elon beat them last year pretty handily, yet everybody has them above Elon in the conference. Elon lost close games to Richmond and App and Wofford. GSU was a blowout. Duke was just abysmal and I'm still mad that we lost to them. But with a few bounces our way, we would have gone 9-2 last year. And remember the Joe Montana-Steve Young analogy I made previously still holds water.

[Reign of Terrier]

Okay, I don't see the love affair with UTC. Elon beat them last year pretty handily, yet everybody has them above Elon in the conference. Elon lost close games to Richmond and App and Wofford. GSU was a blowout. Duke was just abysmal and I'm still mad that we lost to them. But with a few bounces our way, we would have gone 9-2 last year. And remember the Joe Montana-Steve Young analogy I made previously still holds water.

we're talking preseason here. There is absolutely no reason to think, based of what proven players return next year, that Elon will be better than Chatty. Could they be better? sure, heck even Western has a chance of winning the conference next year because right now everyone is 0-0. But as of now there is no reason to think that Elon will be better than 5th at this point because of the personnel they have to replace in comparison to Wofford, GSU, Chatty, and App

[Reign of Terrier]

Ok, going way out just to make it interesting. App beats GSU; Woffy beats App; GSU beats Woffy. How does the rest play out? Does Chatty get revenge against Woffy at Findley? Does Elon surprise everyone and get App at Rhodes? GSU is home against Furman, Chatty, Western, Citadel. App is home against Chatty, Samford, Western, and GSU. Woffy is home against App, GSU, Elon, and Samford.

I'd say Woffy has the tougher home schedule, App has the tougher road schedule, and GSU is in between.

Just like everyone was justified in picking GSU to finish 7th in 2010, we're justified in putting question marks on Samford and Citadel based on past performance and Elon and Furman have coaching and personnel unknowns. However, it wouldn't surprise me to see Furman and Elon do well and Citadel will be trouble if/when they get a handle on the offense.

As for predicting who will win what game next year, I really can't say because there are a lot of factors that come into play before then. Right now, I think Wofford is the best team in the conference going in (though my eyes may be blinded by homerism). That's not to say that GSU, who beat Wofford more recently, won't be at the top. I just don't think they'll win 9 games next year (in the regular season at least), they still don't have the personnel to run the option effectively. If a team scores 30 on them and manages to not turn the ball over, I don't like their chances (but that is a hard feat to accomplish because the defense is so darn good). App is always good, and they are Wofford's kryptonite so the game at Gibbs next year should be a good one to watch, and they really play well in Boone so GSU will have a hard time playing them next year. Chatty scares me, they can't be taken lightly by anybody because they have the guns to score 30 or 40 or 50 on anybody.

[PaladinFan]

Mountaineers have a stockpile of young talent waiting in the wings nobody knows about. Perhaps the best back to back recruiting classes in SoCon history has produced names like Lott, Washington, Walker, Peacock, Sawyer, Bailey, McDonald, McDermott, Bostic, Jones, Fisher, Lamm, and Barnes. All redshirt freshmen or sophmores. Some will think I'm insane, but expect Kalik Barnes to push DeAndre this spring and fall. Ya'll keep on thinking the Apps are slipping. The only thing that can screw this bunch up are the coaches. Unfortunately they've been known to do that from time to time.

I think the cut against App is there were two years back to back maybe three years ago when they recruited virtually no offensive linemen. They lost out on many of their top targets to other SoCon schools. They have made their money on recruiting backs and receivers. Most folks, I think, believe that the lack of attention to the offfensive line will come back and bite them at some point.

[Saint3333]

ASU returns
Frye 6'2" - 270
Ruff 6'3" - 270
Thomas 6'2" - 270
Duford 6'5" - 285
Curtis Marshall 6'4" - 300

plus 2010 recruits:

2010
Ian Barnard 6'4" - 255lbs.
Dylan Bostick 6'6" - 280lbs. (Marshall, Memphis, UCF offers)
Graham Fisher 6'2" - 275lbs. (shrine bowl player)
Kalan Jones 6'4" - 275lbs. (Wake offer)
Kendall Lamm 6'6" - 265lbs. (GSU and Marshall offers played at NCHS powerhouse Butler)

Given their height I'm sure they've put on weight

2011
Shaquille Counts 6'2" - 275lbs. (shrine bowl)
Derek Evans 6'2" - 275lbs. (Navy and Army offers)

Likely Depth Chart
LEFT TACKLE
Dylan Bostick (6-6 / 280 / SO)
Regan Dufort (6-5 / 285 / SO)
LEFT GUARD
Xan Thomas (6-2 / 270 / JR)
Kalan Jones 6'4" - 275lbs. R-FR
CENTER
Graham Fisher 6'2" - 275lbs / R-FR
Sherman Holt (5-11 / 235 / SR)
RIGHT GUARD
70 MATT RUFF (6-3 / 270 / SR)
67 Ian Barnard (6-4 / 255 / SO)
RIGHT TACKLE
ORRY FRYE (6-2 / 270 / SR)
Kendall Lamm 6'6" - 265lbs. R-FR

The guys in the 2010 cilass were highly recruited, ASU's offensive line could actually be better this year.

[BlackNGoldR3v0lut10n]

After reviewing this thread, here are my thoughts. I think the SoCon has the potential to get four teams in the playoffs next year, but three would be most likely.

Playoff teams
1. Appalachian State - King of the mountain until someone else proves otherwise.
2. Georgia Southern - Will they fly all the way to their first title in years? We'll find out next season.
3a. Chattanooga - Can this train make its way to the top of the mountain?
3b. Wofford - Will these dogs fight their way to the top?

Non-playoff teams
5. Furman - New coach gets to work with plenty of good horses in his stable.
6. Elon - Can this team rise from the ashes that were last year's season?
7. The Citadel - These dogs have the potential to make something of next season.
8. Samford - Has this team lost its bite?
9. Western Carolina - Played like kittens last season, expect the same.

[PaladinFan]

I don't think, if Furman struggles, it will be because of the new coach. Furman brings on a staff with a great deal of experience that inherits a team with a lot of talent on roster.

I'm not suggesting Furman will be good, but that there's as much a chance that Fowler elevates the team as much as endures 'rebuilding'

[The Eagle's Cliff]

I don't think, if Furman struggles, it will be because of the new coach. Furman brings on a staff with a great deal of experience that inherits a team with a lot of talent on roster.

I'm not suggesting Furman will be good, but that there's as much a chance that Fowler elevates the team as much as endures 'rebuilding'

I don't disagree with this. The SoCon is going to fun to watch in '11:

App - Can they hold on to the top?
Wofford - Proven winner with a great coach, but can they get over the "good team" hump and become a true "power"?
GSU - The ball bounced their way more than a few times in '10. Will they be improved enough to take the next step or will 2012 be the year it all comes together?
Chatty - Good coach, better recruiting, better fan base/game day experience...can they go 8-3?
Furman and Elon - Solid players, new coaches, how fast can they get it together?
Samford - Solid team with a good coach who can beat you if you're not prepared.
Citadel - The option can look brilliant or horrible. Horrible was '10. How much have they improved?
Western - Can the band play football too?

[T-Dog]

I think the cut against App is there were two years back to back maybe three years ago when they recruited virtually no offensive linemen. They lost out on many of their top targets to other SoCon schools. They have made their money on recruiting backs and receivers. Most folks, I think, believe that the lack of attention to the offfensive line will come back and bite them at some point.

True but that started being rectified last year when we realized our entire starting o-line would grauduate after 2010. Plus losing the o-line coach was a big blow.

After 2009 when a lot of folks thought we would drop with the loss of Armanti, I knew we'd be fine as most everyone else returned. It was 2011 I was concerened about. I'm not as concered as I was with my team, but I am concerned with the rapid improvement of UTC, Wofford and GSU.

App has the advantage among those four in that GSU and UTC come to Boone and no offense to Wofford, but out of these three teams, I'd rather play at Spantanburg rather than Nooga or Statesboro.

[seantaylor]

As for predicting who will win what game next year, I really can't say because there are a lot of factors that come into play before then. Right now, I think Wofford is the best team in the conference going in (though my eyes may be blinded by homerism). That's not to say that GSU, who beat Wofford more recently, won't be at the top. I just don't think they'll win 9 games next year (in the regular season at least), they still don't have the personnel to run the option effectively. If a team scores 30 on them and manages to not turn the ball over, I don't like their chances (but that is a hard feat to accomplish because the defense is so darn good). App is always good, and they are Wofford's kryptonite so the game at Gibbs next year should be a good one to watch, and they really play well in Boone so GSU will have a hard time playing them next year. Chatty scares me, they can't be taken lightly by anybody because they have the guns to score 30 or 40 or 50 on anybody.

I don't know. GSU had the best defense in the Socon this year, and lose basically nobody. This year our D could be the best in the country. Our D line will be absolutley unblockable in another year in Tom Melton's strength program. This is an underrated aspect of GSU ascent. Hatcher had nobody lifting weights and conditioning. The gains across the boards in one seaons under Melton were astounding. Look out in year 2. Josh Gebhardt and Lavelle Westbrooks become superstars this season.

[elonforrealz]

The hatred and vitriol being spread about elon on this thread is just ridiculous. it's like people forget Elon is on a 4-game winning strerak

[phan]

The hatred and vitriol being spread about elon on this thread is just ridiculous. it's like people forget Elon is on a 4-game winning strerak
please shut up already!

[ElonPride]

please shut up already!

+1

[appvette]

The hatred and vitriol being spread about elon on this thread is just ridiculous. it's like people forget Elon is on a 4-game winning strerak

Where did anybody hate on elon?

[biggie]

How low do you have to get to where other Elon fans tell you to shut up?

[SpeedkingATL]

Should be the strongest and best balanced SoCon in a long time. IMO there are 4 teams that have a real shot at the title and 2 others that will make some real noise. As for this argument that option teams are done when they fall behind I would like to know the number of scoring plays of greater that 50 yards during GSU and Wofford's strong seasons compared to a more traditional offense. I know both teams have scored A LOT of long TDs against ASU over the last decade and 50 yard runs don't use much clock. All it takes is one missed assignment....think of the GaTech victory over UGA a couple of years ago when they were down by 3 touchdowns and won going away using Paul Johnson's "high school" offense.

[Reign of Terrier]

App has the advantage among those four in that GSU and UTC come to Boone and no offense to Wofford, but out of these three teams, I'd rather play at Spantanburg rather than Nooga or Statesboro.

Same here, we play better against App at Gibbs

[GSU Eagle]

It used to be the SoCon was hoping for 3 playoff teams. I see the situation now as the SoCon will get 3 teams in most years and occasionally 4 teams now with the 20 team tourney. I think it is a matter of time before the tourney goes to 24 teams and that would make it even more likely to get 4 SoCon teams in. Basically if a SoCon team goes 7-4 with 7 D1 wins they are in it seems to me.

Over the last 5 years App and Wofford have been the best 2 teams. Ga. Southern is now back in the discussion and Chattanooga seems ready to make a bid to get in the top 3-4. I am not quite as sold on Chattanooga as some others right now, but they are clearly much improved over just a couple of years ago.

Provided the SoCon teams take care of the out-of-conference FCS opponents, the day of 4 SoCon teams in the tourney is coming.

[SoCon48]

First of all you have to remember
A) the Citadel is a college in which enlistment into the military is not a requirement. This is helpful for recruiting
B) You're right, it's hard to come back but not impossible. Look at what Georgia Tech did to Georgia in 2008.
C) An option team that fires on all cylinders is awesome to watch, you should check out the highlights of when Wofford smacked Elon 55-20 in 2008.

OUCH!

[elonforrealz]

an option is NEVER fun to watch

[AppIAA]

an option is NEVER fun to watch

You must not know football.. do you enjoy watching teams like Auburn and Oregon?

They also run an option.. its a different kind of option - a spread option - but it is an option nonetheless...

[ElonPride]

an option is NEVER fun to watch

Whatever man! It was pretty darn fun to watch when Elon was winning while running the wishbone in '99 and '00.

[blazrdog#1]

One of our local media guys is a Samford Alumn and he says Samford doesn't really care that much about football, anyway. Maybe he's just comparing it to here.

Yeah riiiight...comparing SU to GSU...there is NO comparison...we beat you twice in your place and once in ours for the last THREE years!xsmileyclapx

[blueballs]

Wofford (9-2) should be the favorite next year because they have App and GSU at their place... although if GSU fans outnumber Wofford fans again at Gibbs they're going to change the name of the stadium to Paulson II.

App (9-2) should be ranked second because GSU has to travel to App and to Wofford.

GSU (8-3) third because of the road schedule which includes Wofford, App, and Alabama.

Chatty (7-4) fourth because they travel to App and to GSU.

Furman (6-5) has the talent to be fifth but who knows what kind of team they'll have?

Sammy (5-6) just being Sammy,

Elon (5-6) has some talent returning but is a huge unknown at the HC and QB spots

WCU (2-9) and Citadel (2-9) are what they are...

Wofford makes the playoffs and is a seed... App and GSU qualify for the playoffs and are both capable of making deep runs-especially GSU who returns 21 out of 22 starters off a national semifinal team. Chatty is on the bubble...

[blueballs]

Yeah riiiight...comparing SU to GSU...there is NO comparison...we beat you twice in your place and once in ours for the last THREE years!xsmileyclapx

When was the last time Sammy won a playoff game? Because GSU did it about six weeks ago...

[Baldy]

Yeah riiiight...comparing SU to GSU...there is NO comparison...we beat you twice in your place and once in ours for the last THREE years!xsmileyclapx

Congrats, Miss Congeniality. xlolx

[AppMan]

Wofford (9-2) should be the favorite next year because they have App and GSU at their place... although if GSU fans outnumber Wofford fans again at Gibbs they're going to change the name of the stadium to Paulson II.

App (9-2) should be ranked second because GSU has to travel to App and to Wofford.

GSU (8-3) third because of the road schedule which includes Wofford, App, and Alabama.

Chatty (7-4) fourth because they travel to App and to GSU.

Furman (6-5) has the talent to be fifth but who knows what kind of team they'll have?

Sammy (5-6) just being Sammy,

Elon (5-6) has some talent returning but is a huge unknown at the HC and QB spots

WCU (2-9) and Citadel (2-9) are what they are...

Wofford makes the playoffs and is a seed... App and GSU qualify for the playoffs and are both capable of making deep runs-especially GSU who returns 21 out of 22 starters off a national semifinal team. Chatty is on the bubble...

Didn't know road games were automatically counted a loss.

[AppMan]

Yeah riiiight...comparing SU to GSU...there is NO comparison...we beat you twice in your place and once in ours for the last THREE years!xsmileyclapx

And that got you what?

[eaglewraith]

Yeah riiiight...comparing SU to GSU...there is NO comparison...we beat you twice in your place and once in ours for the last THREE years!xsmileyclapx

Get ready to have your stadium torn down by your fans escaping the annilhation of your football team on Sept 3. It's going to be so awful that Sullivan won't even get the rest of the year to recover, he'll be fired the next day.

You've benefited from being the week before App the last 3 years and we've played some of our worst games against you.

Although I guess I should thank you for the game this year....losing to you is what was the turning point of our season and refocused our team for their tremendously successful playoff run.....while you sat at home and watched us.

[chattanoogamocs]

Wofford (9-2) should be the favorite next year because they have App and GSU at their place... although if GSU fans outnumber Wofford fans again at Gibbs they're going to change the name of the stadium to Paulson II.

App (9-2) should be ranked second because GSU has to travel to App and to Wofford.

GSU (8-3) third because of the road schedule which includes Wofford, App, and Alabama.

Chatty (7-4) fourth because they travel to App and to GSU.

Furman (6-5) has the talent to be fifth but who knows what kind of team they'll have?

Sammy (5-6) just being Sammy,

Elon (5-6) has some talent returning but is a huge unknown at the HC and QB spots

WCU (2-9) and Citadel (2-9) are what they are...

Wofford makes the playoffs and is a seed... App and GSU qualify for the playoffs and are both capable of making deep runs-especially GSU who returns 21 out of 22 starters off a national semifinal team. Chatty is on the bubble...

I don't disagree with the top 4...but I think Chattanooga will win two of their three OOC games (EKU/JSU) and go 8-3...giving the SoCon 4 playoff teams.

[The Eagle's Cliff]

Yeah riiiight...comparing SU to GSU...there is NO comparison...we beat you twice in your place and once in ours for the last THREE years!xsmileyclapx

Congrats. Lots of people have beaten Ga Southern the last several years, but you're still Samford. You've got a 400 year old retread coach and a campus that doesn't allow beer, dancing, or girls showing their cankles. September in Birmingham is going to be fun to watch. Hopefully, after the Eagles beat the piss out of some Bulldogs, I'll be in Atlanta in time to watch some Broncos do the same to another set of Bulldogs with about as many championships as Samford.

[Aho_Old_Guy]

(1) GSU
The Dynasty Returns: Why bother playing the games?

(2) Furman
Vermin University Has Life and a lot of talent.

(3) Chattanooga
Friday Practice Does Matter

(4) Samford
Do It For Pat! for no reason as they fire him, anyway

(5) Wofford
Maybe Year After Next Year?

(6) Elon
See Wofford Above

(7) Appalachian
Apocalyptic End of Known World xbawlingx

(8) The Citadel
Winning Streak Ends At One

(9) Western Carolina
LOL What?

[Reign of Terrier]

(1) GSU
The Dynasty Returns: Why bother playing the games?

(2) Furman
Vermin University Has Life and a lot of talent.

(3) Chattanooga
Friday Practice Does Matter

(4) Samford
Do It For Pat! for no reason as they fire him, anyway

(5) Wofford
Maybe Year After Next Year?

(6) Elon
See Wofford Above

(7) Appalachian
Apocalyptic End of Known World xbawlingx

(8) The Citadel
Winning Streak Ends At One

(9) Western Carolina
LOL What?

Wofford has 15 returning starters

[PaladinFan]

(1) GSU
The Dynasty Returns: Why bother playing the games?

(2) Furman
Vermin University Has Life and a lot of talent.

(3) Chattanooga
Friday Practice Does Matter

(4) Samford
Do It For Pat! for no reason as they fire him, anyway

(5) Wofford
Maybe Year After Next Year?

(6) Elon
See Wofford Above

(7) Appalachian
Apocalyptic End of Known World xbawlingx

(8) The Citadel
Winning Streak Ends At One

(9) Western Carolina
LOL What?

People forget, I think, that Furman had a very young team in 2010. Furman played App tough and dropped winnable games against UTC and Georgia Southern. Sure, the Paladins were 5-6 and have a new coaching staff, but they graduated only 10 or so players off a team that wasn't that far away from being a 7 or 8 win team.

[elonforrealz]

dude I'ma be a senior next year. Elon's winning the Socon

[seantaylor]

dude I'ma be a senior next year. Elon's winning the Socon

Elon's never winning the Socon. Ever.

[blazrdog#1]

that was then...this is now...GSU will NOT win against Samford...couldn't do it the last three years and you WON'T do it in 2011...your championship run is over...so man up and get over it!xnodxxthumbsupx

[SpiritCymbal]

dude I'ma be a senior next year. Elon's winning the Socon

Name the cost of the bet...I'll even give you odds.

[SpiritCymbal]

Pre-season Rankings
1. App St. - They've got to do a whole lot more losing for them not to be pre-season #1.
2. Wofford
3. Ga. Southern - Had we not lost our DC this past week, I think there was a real shot at GSU being pre-season #1 or at least #2. But this will be just enough of a question mark to drop our pre-season ranking a little.
4. Chattanooga - I wouldn't be surprised if they were in the preseason top 3.
5. Samford
6. Furman
7. Elon - I guess I'm the only one that thinks that Lembo leaving is just as big if not bigger than losing Riddle. Combine both and this could get down right ugly for Elon this year.
8. Citadel
9. W. Carolina

Final Stadings
1. Wofford
2. App. St.
3. Ga. Southern
4. Chattanooga
5. Furman
6. Samford
7. Elon
8. W. Carolina
9. Citadel

[SpiritCymbal]

that was then...this is now...GSU will NOT win against Samford...couldn't do it the last three years and you WON'T do it in 2011...your championship run is over...so man up and get over it!xnodxxthumbsupx

Name your price. I'll even give you odds.

[OL FU]

I love football prediction threads in Januaryxwhistlex

[Aho_Old_Guy]

I love football prediction threads in Januaryxwhistlex

The New Year is 3 weeks old and the Furmudgeons are already whining . . .

xlolx

2011 Fun Fact #1

The Appalachian football team Graduate APR shall surpass that of Vermin University xthumbsupx

[GSU Eagle]

Isn't it nice again to have Ga. Southern relevant. We have emerged from several years of being a joke to now being back to where we belong.

[elcid83]

That shouldn't matter. They aren't going to win anyway. It's a military school. Do you know how hard it is to not only A) recruit to a military institution, but B) recruit good athletes that want to run an option offense. So, when I evaluate Citadel coaching I ignore the product on the field since it's pretty much a conclusion that they will never be able to win consistently anyway. But when you graduate all your players and nobody gets in trouble with the law, that's pretty good.

Apparently the Elon folks don't read the Charleston Post and Courrier. I'm afraid Coach Higgins has not been all that successful keeping players out of trouble with the law.

http://www.postandcourier.com/blogs/bulldog_bites/?plckController=Blog&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&UID=d576f03b-78df-47af-8602-6c828c91cead&plckPostId=Blog%3ad576f03b-78df-47af-8602-6c828c91ceadPost%3ac0b2175b-b8e1-48fb-bcb5-ae6a2af4213a&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest

[seantaylor]

Isn't it nice again to have Ga. Southern relevant. We have emerged from several years of being a joke to now being back to where we belong.

But, we still have a joke AD employed, so any day we can revert back to being a joke just due to sheer bad karma. This guy needs to be fired ASAP.

[OL FU]

The New Year is 3 weeks old and the Furmudgeons are already whining . . .

xlolx

2011 Fun Fact #1

The Appalachian football team Graduate APR shall surpass that of Vermin University xthumbsupx

First that would be "wining" not whining.:D

Secondly, I was just enjoying the smack.

Third, APR? Appalachian Pot Ratingxeyebrowx

[Mountaineer]

Third, APR? Appalachian Pot Ratingxeyebrowx

xlolx

The rest of the conference doesn't stand a chance in that metric. xsmiley_wix

[ElonPride]

2011 Fun Fact #1

The Appalachian football team Graduate APR shall surpass that of Vermin University xthumbsupx

When you don't boot criminals from the program, it sure helps out!

[SideLine Shooter]

Name the cost of the bet...I'll even give you odds.

I want some of that action too.

[chattownmocs]

I like the mocs chances. Huesman is recruiting at an elite level. I think 2011 is the year we learn to put 4 quarters together.

[gophoenix]

Pre-season Rankings
1. App St. - They've got to do a whole lot more losing for them not to be pre-season #1.
2. Wofford
3. Ga. Southern - Had we not lost our DC this past week, I think there was a real shot at GSU being pre-season #1 or at least #2. But this will be just enough of a question mark to drop our pre-season ranking a little.
4. Chattanooga - I wouldn't be surprised if they were in the preseason top 3.
5. Samford
6. Furman
7. Elon - I guess I'm the only one that thinks that Lembo leaving is just as big if not bigger than losing Riddle. Combine both and this could get down right ugly for Elon this year.
8. Citadel
9. W. Carolina

Final Stadings
1. Wofford
2. App. St.
3. Ga. Southern
4. Chattanooga
5. Furman
6. Samford
7. Elon
8. W. Carolina
9. Citadel

I think it is putting Elon too high. Losing Riddle hurts. Losing Lembo hurts. Losing the OC and DC hurt. Hiring what seems to be an unorganized and inexperienced coach is going to hurt. And hiring a loser from Rhode Island to be OC seems to me like it is going to hurt. And the fact that we'ce been without Lembo for over 6 weeks and we still don't have a full football coaching staff is going to hurt. I've heard a number of players have already annouced that they are transferring, and a number of our top recruits have left for Ball State.

Next season is going to kill what was built the past 5 years.

[Saint3333]

GP - I give you Elon guys a lot of crap, but I hope it isn't that bad. If what you're saying is accurate, Elon will be in trouble as you say next year but maybe back to 2006 levels.

I knew Lembo was picking off Elon's top recruits, but was unaware of potential transfers. Not having a full staff during the heart of the recruiting season may hurt for many years.

[SoCon48]

Riddle was great. As long as things were going good and nobody was putting any pressure on him. When frustrated he fell apart. Saw it happen against App several times.

Like when he threw 3 interceptions and had 4 sacks. The Greensboro paper's color picture of him on his knees spiking the ball was classic.

[ElonAlum]

Good God gophoenix! Give Swepson a damn chance! From what I heard our new OC has a proven track record with the spread offense like what we have had. We have many great players NOT named Riddle who are still on the team. Of course some players will threaten to leave since they have a new coach but thats with almost every team that has a new coach.

I think overall it was already going to be a rebuilding year for Elon but now more than ever. I think middle of the conference is where we will end up and seeing what Swepson can do in his second year will be very telling.

We will be Western, Sammy, El Cid and either Furman or Chatty to end up middle of the pack. Remember we were on a pretty impressive winning streak at the end of last year.

[elon77]

I think it is putting Elon too high. Losing Riddle hurts. Losing Lembo hurts. Losing the OC and DC hurt. Hiring what seems to be an unorganized and inexperienced coach is going to hurt. And hiring a loser from Rhode Island to be OC seems to me like it is going to hurt. And the fact that we'ce been without Lembo for over 6 weeks and we still don't have a full football coaching staff is going to hurt. I've heard a number of players have already annouced that they are transferring, and a number of our top recruits have left for Ball State.

Next season is going to kill what was built the past 5 years.

Maybe the ones that are suppose to be leaving need to leave, did you think about that. When Lembo replaced Hamilton I believe there were some players that left. I'm sure that when the new coaches came on board at GSU and UTC some players left. That just happens.

[Saint3333]

Looking at rivals, Elon has lost three recruiting battles with Ball State, not sure if they previously were verbal commits to Elon or not though.

[gophoenix]

Yes they were all verbals. And there is another article of an Eastern Alamance guy switching to Ball State today:
http://www.thetimesnews.com/articles/miles-40703-course-ball.html

Sure, maybe some of the players need to go, but right now. We have a new head coach that has put the fans and the media in a black cloud as far as information goes. it is week 6.5 without Lembo and we do not have a full staff announced. Swepson has named a "friend" as OC and one of his ex-players as a defensive coach. In fact, he made defensive coach hires without hiring the defensive coordinator. Not only that, he has only really hired two guys as all the other coaches he has gotten so far are the Lembo leftovers. We've lost a number of guys to Ball State. This isn't spelling success at all. This isn't even spelling middle of the pack.

I'd give Swepson a chance if he was making Elon look organized. So far, this entire process and his first 3 weeks look like a complete joke.

[ElonAlum]

Do you think that its easy to hire a bunch of coaches for a first time head coach?? Im sure that its a very difficult process and Im glad that he is taking his time. I want him to not make any rash decisions and pick the very best options for our team. So he hired a friend to be the OC.....so what?? Im glad that he hired a friend who has a proven track record and not some guy that he doesnt know from the next guy. From what I have heard Swepson has already assembled his staff and Elon is waiting to announce them. Of course Lembo was going to steal away our commits....its the name of the game! We all need to support Swepson 100% and see what he can do.

This is new territory for Elon because the coaches before Lembo were terrible and didnt leave for other schools. This is a process that takes time to develop.

[gophoenix]

Do you think that its easy to hire a bunch of coaches for a first time head coach?? Im sure that its a very difficult process and Im glad that he is taking his time. I want him to not make any rash decisions and pick the very best options for our team. So he hired a friend to be the OC.....so what?? Im glad that he hired a friend who has a proven track record and not some guy that he doesnt know from the next guy. From what I have heard Swepson has already assembled his staff and Elon is waiting to announce them. Of course Lembo was going to steal away our commits....its the name of the game! We all need to support Swepson 100% and see what he can do.

This is new territory for Elon because the coaches before Lembo were terrible and didnt leave for other schools. This is a process that takes time to develop.

I'll hold out the rest of my judgement until they announce the recruits. But, if they are a lit of recruits like the list of coaches.... then I'll just be posting this same stuff on Thursday.

[Saint3333]

Yes they were all verbals. And there is another article of an Eastern Alamance guy switching to Ball State today:
http://www.thetimesnews.com/articles/miles-40703-course-ball.html

That is good for me, had he gone to Elon I couldn't pull against a fellow Eastern Eagle.

[elon77]

Yes they were all verbals. And there is another article of an Eastern Alamance guy switching to Ball State today:
http://www.thetimesnews.com/articles/miles-40703-course-ball.html

Sure, maybe some of the players need to go, but right now. We have a new head coach that has put the fans and the media in a black cloud as far as information goes. it is week 6.5 without Lembo and we do not have a full staff announced. Swepson has named a "friend" as OC and one of his ex-players as a defensive coach. In fact, he made defensive coach hires without hiring the defensive coordinator. Not only that, he has only really hired two guys as all the other coaches he has gotten so far are the Lembo leftovers. We've lost a number of guys to Ball State. This isn't spelling success at all. This isn't even spelling middle of the pack.

I'd give Swepson a chance if he was making Elon look organized. So far, this entire process and his first 3 weeks look like a complete joke.

Let's see gophoenix, in 3 longgggggggggggggggggg weeks he's been to Florida at least once, put together a staff, moved into the new field house, probably found a new residence, made contact with the verbals, had I believe 3 weekend player visits, met with some alum's, contacted new recruits, met with the current team, met with many individual current players, had a few interviews, met with some local high school coaches, sent out an E mail that I received, and probably found a litle time to eat and sleep. Dang, sounds like to me he has been sitting on his a$$ those longgggggggggggggggg 3 weeks.xchinscratchx

[gophoenix]

Let's see gophoenix, in 3 longgggggggggggggggggg weeks he's been to Florida at least once, put together a staff, moved into the new field house, probably found a new residence, made contact with the verbals, had I believe 3 weekend player visits, met with some alum's, contacted new recruits, met with the current team, met with many individual current players, had a few interviews, met with some local high school coaches, sent out an E mail that I received, and probably found a litle time to eat and sleep. Dang, sounds like to me he has been sitting on his a$$ those longgggggggggggggggg 3 weeks.xchinscratchx

Did I say he's been doing nothing? I said, we lost people, he sent out a newsletter that said nothing and had a conference at the gym that said nothing. He's barely put together a staff. He has lost recruits. He has a job to do, and the facts are, the newspapers are dieing for a story to which he either doesn't ahve one or is neglecting to give one. The image to me, other fans and recruits is the same. What the heck is going on there? Right now, no one knows. All you can see are the recruits we thought we had that are going elsewhere.

[PaladinFan]

Not to shift the topic from all this lovely bickering, but I thought I'd mention another point.

Furman is rumored to have hired Ricky Logo, Vanderbilt's defensive line coach, to take the same position with the Paladins. While this is not earthshattering, its does make an interesting point. Furman is cherry-picking defensive coaches that put together a very respectable Vanderbilt defense.

While Furman is going through coaching changes, you are now adding very good defensive coaches with successful track records to a team that was already among the best defenses in the SoCon and returns virtually everybody. It looks like Furman is putting a renewed focus on defense, where they used to excel but have recently lost a step.

[pleahy1]

[QUOTE=OL FU;1609512]First that would be "wining" not whining.:D

no, no its not

[OL FU]

QUOTE=pleahy1;1610053]
First that would be "wining" not whining.:D

no, no its not

Oh yes it is

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/06/30/article-1030652-0122671A000004B0-773_468x556.jpg

[phoenix3]

...I think overall it was already going to be a rebuilding year for Elon but now more than ever. I think middle of the conference is where we will end up and seeing what Swepson can do in his second year will be very telling...

Elon was destined to be in the middle of the pack in 2011 even with Lembo. O-line and D-line losses alone would have done that. If we finish in the middle of the conference, I will be VERY happy with the job Swepson will have done.

Personally, I believe how well the team does will be a direct reflection of how well the players are motivated to play for the incoming coaching regime. We still have reasonably good talent. I have heard from people who should know that the players are pretty happy with Swepson so far. He seems to be a players' coach, which Lembo was not. I also like the Pincince hire. The guy had success at Holy Cross & unfortunately for him, moving to a scholarship program was a good idea, the place he chose wasn't. I am a little disappointed that we don't have a DC as of yet, but the rumor is the DC we're most interested in is coming from Alabama, & did not want to leave until after UA's verbals were inked. Again, this is rumor, but if it turns out to be true waiting for him can't be all bad.

I will say that I'm not nearly as enthusiastic with Swepson as I was with Lembo, but a lot of this has to do with his level of communication with the fans & Elon community, not with what I think he can do with the players. Only time will tell with that...

[seantaylor]

MONSTER class from GSU.

[PaladinFan]

MONSTER class from GSU.

We hear that every year.

[straightshooter]

We hear that every year.

You better pay attention this time...six three stars and a transfer three star with three years to play. Granted, stars given are on paper, but the class looks very athletic, fast and talented.

[AppTrex77]

You better pay attention this time...six three stars and a transfer three star with three years to play. Granted, stars given are on paper, but the class looks very athletic, fast and talented.

I agree with you, straightshooter, we had better be paying attention. The gap in competition levels is closing in from several teams. We can't rest on past laurels.... we have to be on top of our game in every aspect.

Your incoming class looks top-notch; however, I think we picked up some aces ourselves. We'll just have to wait to see how they pan out.

[The Eagle's Cliff]

I agree with you, straightshooter, we had better be paying attention. The gap in competition levels is closing in from several teams. We can't rest on past laurels.... we have to be on top of our game in every aspect.

Your incoming class looks top-notch; however, I think we picked up some aces ourselves. We'll just have to wait to see how they pan out.

We lost all of our speed over the down years. We still don't have it back, but the last two classes indicate it's coming. We may make some noise in 2011, but 2012 and 2013 are looking like '99 and '00.

[straightshooter]

SoCon will be fun to watch this season. GSU, Wofford and AppSt should be very good, but there are others who could surprise. I don't know that there are many impact freshman players in anyone's signing class, but I'm sure there are a few that will stand out.

[PaladinFan]

You better pay attention this time...six three stars and a transfer three star with three years to play. Granted, stars given are on paper, but the class looks very athletic, fast and talented.

I'm not doubting you got a class of great athletes. There is absolutely no reason why GSU and App State shouldn't have the lion's share of success recruiting every year. They have the largest schools, the most money, and aren't hamstrung with the type of limitations many of the other SoCon schools are.

That said, every year we hear the same thing. It wasn't a couple of years ago that some Valentine kid out of South Carolina was going to be the greatest receiver to put on cleats in the SoCon. He was there, what, two years and transferred?

That's not a problem relegated to GSU either. Furman had a three star QB from Mississippi who had rejected a scholarship from Miss. State to play for Furman. Most of us pictured him as the next great Paladin quarterback. He just now transferred to Faulkner in Montgomery who, until recently, I didn't even realized had a football team.

My point is that recruiting is overhyped. Sure, some of the players may be good ones. Others with a lot of fanfare will be absolute duds. I've never heard a soul say "man, our recruiting class sucks." No, everyone thinks that this year's class will put them over the top.

[Smitty]

SoCon will be fun to watch this season. GSU, Wofford and AppSt should be very good, but there are others who could surprise. I don't know that there are many impact freshman players in anyone's signing class, but I'm sure there are a few that will stand out.

We picked up 6 Juniors to help our dismal OL, DL, and QB.


"The junior college players bring instant size and experience on both the offensive and defensive lines, while we were able to sure up some depth on the perimeter with the young and talented high school student-athletes."

[Eaglesrus]

I'm not doubting you got a class of great athletes. There is absolutely no reason why GSU and App State shouldn't have the lion's share of success recruiting every year. They have the largest schools, the most money, and aren't hamstrung with the type of limitations many of the other SoCon schools are.

That said, every year we hear the same thing. It wasn't a couple of years ago that some Valentine kid out of South Carolina was going to be the greatest receiver to put on cleats in the SoCon. He was there, what, two years and transferred?

That's not a problem relegated to GSU either. Furman had a three star QB from Mississippi who had rejected a scholarship from Miss. State to play for Furman. Most of us pictured him as the next great Paladin quarterback. He just now transferred to Faulkner in Montgomery who, until recently, I didn't even realized had a football team.

My point is that recruiting is overhyped. Sure, some of the players may be good ones. Others with a lot of fanfare will be absolute duds. I've never heard a soul say "man, our recruiting class sucks." No, everyone thinks that this year's class will put them over the top.

Ours does look like a really good group but I have to agree with you about recruiting, PaladinFan. So many adverse things can happen with these kids that I just can't get too excited about the signing day hype. On the other hand, a number of our really good players have started out as walk-ons. I hope that they all pan out, of course (actually, I'd be happy if just a majority do), but time will tell, as they say.

[Yank]

[QUOTE=PaladinFan;1610389]I'm not doubting you got a class of great athletes. There is absolutely no reason why GSU and App State shouldn't have the lion's share of success recruiting every year. They have the largest schools, the most money, and aren't hamstrung with the type of limitations many of the other SoCon schools are.

From an article ranking FCS athletic budgets (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/285979-will-athletic-budgets-be-used-to-classify-schools-as-di-after-2010):

National Rank
32. Furman
42. Elon
48. Wofford
52. The Citadel -10M
55. Appalachian State
57. Chattanooga
59. Samford
61. College of Charleston
68. Davidson
83. North Carolina-Greensboro
86. Western Carolina
99. Georgia Southern - 6M

Public institutions typically have more restrictions on budgetary processes than do private institutions. Georgia Southern cannot use any Education & General Fund money (the allocation of state funds to the institution) in the athletic budget.

[PaladinFan]

[QUOTE=PaladinFan;1610389]I'm not doubting you got a class of great athletes. There is absolutely no reason why GSU and App State shouldn't have the lion's share of success recruiting every year. They have the largest schools, the most money, and aren't hamstrung with the type of limitations many of the other SoCon schools are.

From an article ranking FCS athletic budgets (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/285979-will-athletic-budgets-be-used-to-classify-schools-as-di-after-2010):

National Rank
32. Furman
42. Elon
48. Wofford
52. The Citadel -10M
55. Appalachian State
57. Chattanooga
59. Samford
61. College of Charleston
68. Davidson
83. North Carolina-Greensboro
86. Western Carolina
99. Georgia Southern - 6M

Public institutions typically have more restrictions on budgetary processes than do private institutions. Georgia Southern cannot use any Education & General Fund money (the allocation of state funds to the institution) in the athletic budget.

That's a fair enough point. It probably comes out in the wash. Most FCS programs are underfunded regardless of where they fall in the ranking. I suppose the point I'm trying to make is that it is generally easier for GSU, Western, App and UTC to go out and get a guy than the likes of Furman, Wofford, Samford, Elon, and the Citadel. This isn't to get into an argument over schools, but only to say that the latter group just has a lot smaller pool from which to pick. There's no reason they shouldn't have good recruiting.

[PaladinNation]

[QUOTE=PaladinFan;1610389]I'm not doubting you got a class of great athletes. There is absolutely no reason why GSU and App State shouldn't have the lion's share of success recruiting every year. They have the largest schools, the most money, and aren't hamstrung with the type of limitations many of the other SoCon schools are.

From an article ranking FCS athletic budgets (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/285979-will-athletic-budgets-be-used-to-classify-schools-as-di-after-2010):

National Rank
32. Furman
42. Elon
48. Wofford
52. The Citadel -10M
55. Appalachian State
57. Chattanooga
59. Samford
61. College of Charleston
68. Davidson
83. North Carolina-Greensboro
86. Western Carolina
99. Georgia Southern - 6M

Public institutions typically have more restrictions on budgetary processes than do private institutions. Georgia Southern cannot use any Education & General Fund money (the allocation of state funds to the institution) in the athletic budget.

Is this ranking taking into account… scholarship costs? With Furman around 50K per scholarship… that drives the budget up quickly. Plus Furman, puts a ton of resources in men's and women's golf.

One of Furman's biggest disadvantage over the last 4-5 years has been increase in admission requirements. Frankly this has benefited Wofford, Elon, and Samford. But with new Furman leadership and a commitment to winning. Furman has a lot to sell. And the current recruiting class, though small, proves it.

When Furman challenged GSU in their bad *** days we did it with few players that had a star beside their name. The had a big ole chip on their shoulder, and a bunch of character.

[PaladinFan]

[QUOTE=Yank;1610396]

Is this ranking taking into account… scholarship costs? With Furman around 50K per scholarship… that drives the budget up quickly. Plus Furman, puts a ton of resources in men's and women's golf.

One of Furman's biggest disadvantage over the last 4-5 years has been increase in admission requirements. Frankly this has benefited Wofford, Elon, and Samford. But with new Furman leadership and a commitment to winning. Furman has a lot to sell. And the current recruiting class, though small, proves it.

When Furman challenged GSU in their bad *** days we did it with few players that had a star beside their name. The had a big ole chip on their shoulder, and a bunch of character.

Further goes to the point. I saw nothing last season to suggest that Furman was falling behind in recruiting.

[Saint3333]

$50K a year, you guys can't be serious? If someone is paying that, they need a refund.

[straightshooter]

I'm not doubting you got a class of great athletes. There is absolutely no reason why GSU and App State shouldn't have the lion's share of success recruiting every year. They have the largest schools, the most money, and aren't hamstrung with the type of limitations many of the other SoCon schools are.

That said, every year we hear the same thing. It wasn't a couple of years ago that some Valentine kid out of South Carolina was going to be the greatest receiver to put on cleats in the SoCon. He was there, what, two years and transferred?

That's not a problem relegated to GSU either. Furman had a three star QB from Mississippi who had rejected a scholarship from Miss. State to play for Furman. Most of us pictured him as the next great Paladin quarterback. He just now transferred to Faulkner in Montgomery who, until recently, I didn't even realized had a football team.

My point is that recruiting is overhyped. Sure, some of the players may be good ones. Others with a lot of fanfare will be absolute duds. I've never heard a soul say "man, our recruiting class sucks." No, everyone thinks that this year's class will put them over the top.

No. Valentine was at GSU to play in Hatcher's spread offense. Lead the team in catches as a freshman. Made the All-Freshman team in the SoCon. Transferred to a JUCO in California when the option came back. Played one year in CA and just signed with Memphis on Wednesday. Had the Hatch Attack stayed at GSU, Valentine probably would have set all of the receiving records there.

[SpeedkingATL]

No. Valentine was at GSU to play in Hatcher's spread offense. Lead the team in catches as a freshman. Made the All-Freshman team in the SoCon. Transferred to a JUCO in California when the option came back. Played one year in CA and just signed with Memphis on Wednesday. Had the Hatch Attack stayed at GSU, Valentine probably would have set all of the receiving records there.

I remember App tried to recruit Valentine as well and he chose GSU. Would love to see him in an App uniform today.

[PaladinFan]

$50K a year, you guys can't be serious? If someone is paying that, they need a refund.

I don't think that is tuition. If it is, then its gone up about 20k a year. Not sure where he got that number from. Point being, it costs more to fund a scholarship at a private school than a state school resulting in necessarily higher budgets for athletics.

Regardless, if someone wants to pay that to go to Furman, that's their call. Some might say whatever the tuition is to attend App should be refunded. Something is worth whatever someone wants to pay for it.

[Skjellyfetti]

I don't think that is tuition. If it is, then its gone up about 20k a year. Not sure where he got that number from. Point being, it costs more to fund a scholarship at a private school than a state school resulting in necessarily higher budgets for athletics.

Tuition at Furman for the 2010-2011 year is $47,840 a year for a student living on campus.
http://www2.furman.edu/admission/EngageFurman/FinancialInfo/Pages/Tuition.aspx

Not only does that make your scholarships extremely costly... it makes it much more difficult to build a solid walk-on program. Quality walk-ons are essential to add depth since we're limited to 63 scholarships at our division. App's walk-ons have fueled our success this decade. We have several all conference and even all americans who came to App as walk-ons. Asking a kid to pay $50,000 a year to come to Furman and try to make the team is a hard sell.

[OL FU]

Tuition at Furman for the 2010-2011 year is $47,840 a year for a student living on campus.
http://www2.furman.edu/admission/EngageFurman/FinancialInfo/Pages/Tuition.aspx

Not only does that make your scholarships extremely costly... it makes it much more difficult to build a solid walk-on program. Quality walk-ons are essential to add depth since we're limited to 63 scholarships at our division. App's walk-ons have fueled our success this decade. We have several all conference and even all americans who came to App as walk-ons. Asking a kid to pay $50,000 a year to come to Furman and try to make the team is a hard sell.


Only rich kids from the north are paying that fee because they think it is a steal at that price.:D Tuition like most things is negotiable. Haven't heard the statistic lately but five years ago about 65% of all FU students were receiving scholarships or grants.

I freak at the $50K number everytime I hear it and there are some that are paying it, but not most.

The scary part, 30-35 years ago the tuition was a whoping $2500.

[BucBisonAtLarge]

It has been interesting following you through this Furman discussion, as it echoes with the teeth-gnashing being done in the scholarship epic elsewhere on this board by the Patriot League schools, whose tuition falls in the same range as Furman. Those schools all expect to assist up to 80% or more of all students with some sort of aid, including your 'walk-ons'. The disparity in the sheer number of dollars it takes for a single tuition between state and private schools also the cost of the Title IX adjustments being made. It is the accounting that gets creative between merit and need. As someone returning after living abroad a few years my presumptive explanation for Davidson not playing in the Southern in fb was the inability to work the numbers the way Furman has managed to this point.

[Reign of Terrier]

Wofford has the somewhat problem of tuition, as ours is 40k, however something like 84% of students recieve financial aid of some kind. The average financial aid package is 27k, just to put things in perspective. It's well worth it IMO

[OL FU]

Don't know if it is correct but this site says 84% of FU students get aid.
Read more: http://collegeprowler.com/furman-university/statistics/#ixzz1D2khjMIO

[PaladinNation]

Dang… PaladinFan I wouldn't say 50K if I didn't know that it was close to the cost of a full ride xlolx

[Saint3333]

Those prices are insane. No wonder the public school SAT averages continue to increase. People may actually be realizing the value of the dollar and the quality education they can receive at places like ASU.

Seriously guys a kid can go to ASU for undergrad and potentially get a masters for the price of one year at Furman or Wofford. Yeah I know there is financial aid/scholarships at the privates. But if those schools really are more difficult to get into wouldn't those students be in the top third of a public school and receive academic scholarships of some sort further reducing the costs.

I sincerely hope no kid in taking out loans to pay for schools, talk about starting out in a hole. Like someone said I guess some people think it's worth it.

[straightshooter]

Got to make sure those liberal professors get those big pay checks.

[parr90]

I'm not doubting you got a class of great athletes. There is absolutely no reason why GSU and App State shouldn't have the lion's share of success recruiting every year. They have the largest schools, the most money, and aren't hamstrung with the type of limitations many of the other SoCon schools are.

That said, every year we hear the same thing. It wasn't a couple of years ago that some Valentine kid out of South Carolina was going to be the greatest receiver to put on cleats in the SoCon. He was there, what, two years and transferred?

That's not a problem relegated to GSU either. Furman had a three star QB from Mississippi who had rejected a scholarship from Miss. State to play for Furman. Most of us pictured him as the next great Paladin quarterback. He just now transferred to Faulkner in Montgomery who, until recently, I didn't even realized had a football team.

My point is that recruiting is overhyped. Sure, some of the players may be good ones. Others with a lot of fanfare will be absolute duds. I've never heard a soul say "man, our recruiting class sucks." No, everyone thinks that this year's class will put them over the top.

Your only wrong about 1 thing......Georgia Southern does not have alot of money. Some how people think that but we dont. You can go back to when we were Ga teachers college. Most of our 60, 70, 80 year old alumnis are retired teachers. Its starting to catch up and the size and growth surely help but we dont have the money.

[Reign of Terrier]

Those prices are insane. No wonder the public school SAT averages continue to increase. People may actually be realizing the value of the dollar and the quality education they can receive at places like ASU.

Seriously guys a kid can go to ASU for undergrad and potentially get a masters for the price of one year at Furman or Wofford. Yeah I know there is financial aid/scholarships at the privates. But if those schools really are more difficult to get into wouldn't those students be in the top third of a public school and receive academic scholarships of some sort further reducing the costs.

I sincerely hope no kid in taking out loans to pay for schools, talk about starting out in a hole. Like someone said I guess some people think it's worth it.

I'd have to say that the reason people go to Wofford/Furman despite financial reasons is because of prestige and family ties. I personally am of the philosophy that one can get a great education anywhere, however if you go to a school like Furman or Wofford you'd probably have closer connections to more powerful people for life, and yes I know that's somewhat of a blanket statement that can't be proven by stats or anything, but it's just the theme of a private school. It has prestige. Employers when searching for employees think of places like Wofford and Furman as great academic institutions who create smart, well prepared, scholars whereas a place like, say Coastal Carolina is known for being a party school. If I'm an employer I'd pick the Wofford guy over the Coastal guy anyday. I don't mean to call out coastal, I just know (as a high school junior) that they are the party school of south carolina.

[The Eagle's Cliff]

When it comes to winning, especially championships, I believe the "intangibles" are what make the difference. The expectations of the supporters and coaches become the expectations of the players. Erk Russell described these "intangibles" with phrases like "a bad case of the wants" and "runts try harder".

All coaches know X's and O's and all teams have good players. The "intangibles" decide championships. My example of this rule has always been UGA. UGA has 1st dibbs on some of the most fertile recruiting ground in the country and always have a Top 10 recruiting class. UGA football profits are 2nd in the nation at $52 million. Counting Conference and National Championships, UGA has only 15 championship seasons in their nearly 120 years of football.

Most of the kids who signed with any team Wednesday have the potential to be good college football players. The "intangibles" will decide which of them will be champions.

[bleedblue]

I know this is off topic but I did not want to start an entire thread for one question. Hey GSU fans. I was really impressed with your team when I saw them first hand in the playoffs. But was wondering if you have another QB that could push Jaybo for playing time. I'm not sure if he just had a bad day or if it was our Def but he looked like the weak link on that team. Just wondering if there's a chance anyone else plays QB this year. I am hopeing you guys take down App this year! Good luck!

[Eaglesrus]

I know this is off topic but I did not want to start an entire thread for one question. Hey GSU fans. I was really impressed with your team when I saw them first hand in the playoffs. But was wondering if you have another QB that could push Jaybo for playing time. I'm not sure if he just had a bad day or if it was our Def but he looked like the weak link on that team. Just wondering if there's a chance anyone else plays QB this year. I am hopeing you guys take down App this year! Good luck!

There are other posters that could speak more intelligently on this, but since I'm up and on the board.......as to his game against Delaware, I don't want to get into a debate about why, i.e. he was just off / it was because of Delaware's defense, but I thought it was by far his worst game of the season. I will say that it was very out of character for him to make some of the decisions that he did.

Regarding the question of having anyone who will challenge him, we have a couple, including our 1 QB recruit this year, who I have very high hopes for, but no one who is proven. Personally I don't think that his backup in 2010, who was a true freshman, is our QB of the future. I'm thinking (and hoping) that he will end up being a standout A-back. Bottom line is that due to the mix of skills, experience and leadership Jaybo will again be the guy in 2011, and I think with more depth and experience around him he has the potential to take us further than we got this year.

Final note; I think that Jaybo should and will hold a special place in the hearts of Eagle fans for having come to us at exactly the time we needed his abilities. I also think that he will become a terrific coach, which was one of his stated reasons for transferring from GA Tech.

[OL FU]

Those prices are insane. No wonder the public school SAT averages continue to increase. People may actually be realizing the value of the dollar and the quality education they can receive at places like ASU.

Seriously guys a kid can go to ASU for undergrad and potentially get a masters for the price of one year at Furman or Wofford. Yeah I know there is financial aid/scholarships at the privates. But if those schools really are more difficult to get into wouldn't those students be in the top third of a public school and receive academic scholarships of some sort further reducing the costs.

I sincerely hope no kid in taking out loans to pay for schools, talk about starting out in a hole. Like someone said I guess some people think it's worth it.

I am not disagreeing with because I think the cost of private school education has gotten ridiculous. But remember pricing is psychological. You can say our price is $50,000 and everybody goes ooohhhhh without realizing the average student is paying $25,000.

It is kinda like this. When you go to a Kia dealer everbody thinks you paid $10,000 when you really paid $12,000. IF you buy a BMW everybody thinks you paid $60,000 when you really paid $40,000. Perspective is everything.

The other thing to remember is it depends on what you want afterwards. If you want to go to a top notch graduate school, something like 98% of FU grads are accepted. So if you pay $25,000 versus $15K and the $25 doubles your chance of getting into grad school, then maybe it is worth it.

On the other hand, I can guaranty. If was 18 today, as much as I love my alma mater, I probably would be attending a lesser school.xnodx























Like Woffordxlolx

just kidding guys:D

[OL FU]

Final note; I think that Jaybo should and will hold a special place in the hearts of Eagle fans for having come to us at exactly the time we needed his abilities. I also think that he will become a terrific coach, which was one of his stated reasons for transferring from GA Tech.

That is a very good point. Very few (imho) outside of the Eagle nation thought you had a chance of changing offenses and in one year having the kinda season you had. Jaybo gets a lot of the credit.

[The Eagle's Cliff]

"Izzy" Youyoute was the #2 QB coming out of fall camp in '10, but had an injury (turf toe) that kept him out and he was red-shirted. I look for Izzy and Prince McJunkins (Ok) to be #2 and #3 with Prince possibly getting a red-shirt. Jaybo takes a lot of hits full force...he's a tough kid, but he'll probably need some back-up at times. McKinnon is still a possibility, but Izzy and Prince have great arms to go with their legs.

I haven't heard much about it lately, but there was a strong rumor about another FBS transfer from a triple-option team. That would buy time for the young guys to develop.

[Saint3333]

I'd have to say that the reason people go to Wofford/Furman despite financial reasons is because of prestige and family ties. I personally am of the philosophy that one can get a great education anywhere, however if you go to a school like Furman or Wofford you'd probably have closer connections to more powerful people for life, and yes I know that's somewhat of a blanket statement that can't be proven by stats or anything, but it's just the theme of a private school. It has prestige. Employers when searching for employees think of places like Wofford and Furman as great academic institutions who create smart, well prepared, scholars whereas a place like, say Coastal Carolina is known for being a party school. If I'm an employer I'd pick the Wofford guy over the Coastal guy anyday. I don't mean to call out coastal, I just know (as a high school junior) that they are the party school of south carolina.

You can find people of influence and power at any school, the percentage is just lower at public schools. Take a look at ASU's FBS study committee for exhibit A.

[Reign of Terrier]

You can find people of influence and power at any school, the percentage is just lower at public schools. Take a look at ASU's FBS study committee for exhibit A.

sure they can, but when your total alumnus is 16k as opposed to 80k, the connections are a lot closer

[cmaxwellgsu]

I know this is off topic but I did not want to start an entire thread for one question. Hey GSU fans. I was really impressed with your team when I saw them first hand in the playoffs. But was wondering if you have another QB that could push Jaybo for playing time. I'm not sure if he just had a bad day or if it was our Def but he looked like the weak link on that team. Just wondering if there's a chance anyone else plays QB this year. I am hopeing you guys take down App this year! Good luck!

It was definitely Jaybo's worst game, and I would argue it was our worst offensive game plan. We had a great opening drive, and then we seemed to want to use alot of formations and things we haven't done all year. Youyoute and McJunkin will be good, but it should be Jaybo for his senior year. It's going to be great when the speed kicks in.

[Skjellyfetti]

sure they can, but when your total alumnus is 16k as opposed to 80k, the connections are a lot closer

Our 100,000th living alum graduated this past December. No point, really. Just thought it was cool. xlolx

http://www.news.appstate.edu/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/craigalum.jpg

Carry on.

[Smitty]

2011 WCU Football Schedule:
Sept. 1 - at Georgia Tech - Atlanta, Ga.
Sept. 10 - Mars Hill - Cullowhee
Sept. 17 - OPEN
Sept. 24 - at Georgia Southern - Statesboro, Ga.
Oct. 1 - Furman - Cullowhee
Oct. 8 - Elon - Cullowhee
Oct. 15 - at Chattanooga - Chattanooga, Tenn.
Oct. 22 - The Citadel - Cullowhee
Oct. 29 - at Samford - Birmingham, Ala.
Nov. 5 - Wofford - Cullowhee
Nov. 12 - at Appalachian State - Boone, N.C.
Nov. 19 - OPEN
Nov. 26 - 1st Round of NCAA Playoffs - TBA

Ouch 8 games in a row without a break...

[Saint3333]

sure they can, but when your total alumnus is 16k as opposed to 80k, the connections are a lot closer

I'd actually look at it the other way, there is power in numbers.

[parr90]

I know this is off topic but I did not want to start an entire thread for one question. Hey GSU fans. I was really impressed with your team when I saw them first hand in the playoffs. But was wondering if you have another QB that could push Jaybo for playing time. I'm not sure if he just had a bad day or if it was our Def but he looked like the weak link on that team. Just wondering if there's a chance anyone else plays QB this year. I am hopeing you guys take down App this year! Good luck!

We have a couple of QB's one that was redshirted and one coming in. The guy redshirted got hurt and if not would have probably pushed Shaw for the job. The back up QB's we have are very similar to the QB's we had in the past, more speed. Shaw was really the only QB we had with experience and it was in the ACC. Hes not the typical GSU QB but he had the experience and made minimum mistakes and with a brand new offense we had to have a guy with this experience and leadership. This year will be interesting because young talent is going to push him for the job.

[Reign of Terrier]

I'd actually look at it the other way, there is power in numbers.

yes but we're having an argument over intangibles now xlolx since we will both probably make blanket statements to make ourselves feel better about our schools I will say that there is probably more concentrated power in Wofford than Appxcoolx

App smells like fish

[Saint3333]

I think both schools are great, one just costs 1/5 a year ;-).

[SideLine Shooter]

2011 WCU Football Schedule:
Sept. 1 - at Georgia Tech - Atlanta, Ga.
Sept. 10 - Mars Hill - Cullowhee
Sept. 17 - OPEN
Sept. 24 - at Georgia Southern - Statesboro, Ga.
Oct. 1 - Furman - Cullowhee
Oct. 8 - Elon - Cullowhee
Oct. 15 - at Chattanooga - Chattanooga, Tenn.
Oct. 22 - The Citadel - Cullowhee
Oct. 29 - at Samford - Birmingham, Ala.
Nov. 5 - Wofford - Cullowhee
Nov. 12 - at Appalachian State - Boone, N.C.
Nov. 19 - OPEN
Nov. 26 - 1st Round of NCAA Playoffs - TBA

Ouch 8 games in a row without a break...



WCU in the PLAYOFFS? I really would like to see that.

[Smitty]

Hey it can happen... just not likely

[SideLine Shooter]

Hey it can happen... just not likely

Agreed.

[BlackNGoldR3v0lut10n]

2011 WCU Football Schedule:
Sept. 1 - at Georgia Tech - Atlanta, Ga. - SOLID Georgia Tech
Sept. 10 - Mars Hill - Cullowhee - LEAN WCU
Sept. 17 - OPEN
Sept. 24 - at Georgia Southern - Statesboro, Ga. - SOLID Georgia Southern
Oct. 1 - Furman - Cullowhee - SOLID Furman
Oct. 8 - Elon - Cullowhee - SOLID Elon
Oct. 15 - at Chattanooga - Chattanooga, Tenn. - SOLID Chattanooga
Oct. 22 - The Citadel - Cullowhee - LEAN The Citadel
Oct. 29 - at Samford - Birmingham, Ala. - LEAN Samford
Nov. 5 - Wofford - Cullowhee - SOLID Wofford
Nov. 12 - at Appalachian State - Boone, N.C. - SOLID Appalachian State
Nov. 19 - OPEN
Nov. 26 - 1st Round of NCAA Playoffs - TBA - Playoffs? Are you kidding me?

Best case scenario: 3-7 (2-6 SoCon with wins over The Citadel and Samford)
Worst case scenario: 0-10 (WCU loses to a SAC team for the second time in many years, prompting Wagner to either resign or get fired.)
Most Likely: one, maybe two wins (Mars Hill and maybe either The Citadel or Samford), probably not enough for Wagner to save his job.

[Smitty]

The only other game I would give us a small chance is the Elon game. But of course it is still way to early to tell.

[PhoenixMan]

The only other game I would give us a small chance is the Elon game. But of course it is still way to early to tell.
Curious as to why you would pick that game out of the bunch. After a 45-14 score last year with Riddle sitting out the 4th quarter because of the lopsided score.

[Smitty]

Curious as to why you would pick that game out of the bunch. After a 45-14 score last year with Riddle sitting out the 4th quarter because of the lopsided score.

Probably because of the new coach and Riddle leaving. Riddle was a beast with 452 passing yards and 5 TDs in that game, I just don't know how easily he will be replaced.


Also don't forget though I did say small chance, not that we were going to win outright.

[PaladinFan]

Probably because of the new coach and Riddle leaving. Riddle was a beast with 452 passing yards and 5 TDs in that game, I just don't know how easily he will be replaced.


Also don't forget though I did say small chance, not that we were going to win outright.

I sat in the stands and watched an inferior WCU team run Furman out of the stadium in 2005. Learned the hard way that strange things can happen in Cullowhee.

[eaglewraith]

2011 WCU Football Schedule:
Sept. 1 - at Georgia Tech - Atlanta, Ga.
Sept. 10 - Mars Hill - Cullowhee
Sept. 17 - OPEN
Sept. 24 - at Georgia Southern - Statesboro, Ga.
Oct. 1 - Furman - Cullowhee
Oct. 8 - Elon - Cullowhee
Oct. 15 - at Chattanooga - Chattanooga, Tenn.
Oct. 22 - The Citadel - Cullowhee
Oct. 29 - at Samford - Birmingham, Ala.
Nov. 5 - Wofford - Cullowhee
Nov. 12 - at Appalachian State - Boone, N.C.
Nov. 19 - OPEN
Nov. 26 - 1st Round of NCAA Playoffs - TBA

Ouch 8 games in a row without a break...

Why only 10 games?

[Smitty]

"We greatly appreciate the cooperation of the four Southern Conference programs that rearranged their 2011 football schedules at our request," said SoCon Commissioner John Iamarino. "We realized that this would inconvenience our programs, but it was important to the league to assist the SEC in its objectives and I'm grateful to our coaches and administrators for working this out with us."

Because of the restructuring of the schedule, the second game of a two-year contract with Tusculum College would have had to be moved to a date the Pioneers' schedule could not accommodate.

"It is unfortunate that we have lost the home date with Tusculum, which would have given us six home games for the 2011 season," said Director of Athletics, Chip Smith. "We had hoped to find an alternative date that was suitable for both teams, but with their schedule already set, it could not be worked out to allow the game to be played. We will continue to look for an additional opponent to visit Cullowhee this coming fall."

WCU's schedule currently has two open dates on Sept. 17 and Nov. 19 which WCU will continue to try and fill. Smith said he is looking for an additional game with hopes of securing a sixth home date for 2011 on one of the open dates.

So apparently there was a conflict with the SEC with one of the other SoCoN teams and everything had to be rearranged. Which caused us to lose a game with Tusculum.

[straightshooter]

2011 WCU Football Schedule:
Sept. 1 - at Georgia Tech - Atlanta, Ga. - SOLID Georgia Tech
Sept. 10 - Mars Hill - Cullowhee - LEAN WCU
Sept. 17 - OPEN
Sept. 24 - at Georgia Southern - Statesboro, Ga. - SOLID Georgia Southern
Oct. 1 - Furman - Cullowhee - SOLID Furman
Oct. 8 - Elon - Cullowhee - SOLID Elon
Oct. 15 - at Chattanooga - Chattanooga, Tenn. - SOLID Chattanooga
Oct. 22 - The Citadel - Cullowhee - LEAN The Citadel
Oct. 29 - at Samford - Birmingham, Ala. - LEAN Samford
Nov. 5 - Wofford - Cullowhee - SOLID Wofford
Nov. 12 - at Appalachian State - Boone, N.C. - SOLID Appalachian State
Nov. 19 - OPEN
Nov. 26 - 1st Round of NCAA Playoffs - TBA - Playoffs? Are you kidding me?

Best case scenario: 3-7 (2-6 SoCon with wins over The Citadel and Samford)
Worst case scenario: 0-10 (WCU loses to a SAC team for the second time in many years, prompting Wagner to either resign or get fired.)
Most Likely: one, maybe two wins (Mars Hill and maybe either The Citadel or Samford), probably not enough for Wagner to save his job.

Smooth move Cats. Scheduled Georgia Tech to help prepare the team for the GSU option attack.

[chattownmocs]

1. Chattanooga
2. Appy State
3. Ga Souther
4. Wofford

[Horseshoe App]

1. Chattanooga
2. Appy State
3. Ga Souther
4. Wofford

What would the world be without blind bias? Your team is improving, but you really think you will be better than the other three teams you mention?

[chattownmocs]

What would the world be without blind bias? Your team is improving, but you really think you will be better than the other three teams you mention?

We were right on the same level as them last year. Got beat down by Wofford, Couldnt hold a huge lead against Appy but beat Southern. Not sure why its such a stretch in your mind. Its a process just need to learn how to finish games.

[eaglemachine]

We were right on the same level as them last year. Got beat down by Wofford, Couldnt hold a huge lead against Appy but beat Southern. Not sure why its such a stretch in your mind. Its a process just need to learn how to finish games.

GSU is a much different team than when we played Chatty.

[chattownmocs]

Chattanooga would have done the same damage in the playoffs as Georgia Southern. As a matter of fact why was Georgia Souther even in the playoffs while chatty was at home? Same Conference record, chattanooga won head-to-head, the difference is chattanooga played auburn and jax state in the Non conference while GSU only played navy. Hence the eagles 1 game better overall record. Georgia Southern was only there because they are Georgia Southern. Not because they were a better team or had a better resume.

[Reign of Terrier]

Chattanooga would have done the same damage in the playoffs as Georgia Southern. As a matter of fact why was Georgia Souther even in the playoffs while chatty was at home? Same Conference record, chattanooga won head-to-head, the difference is chattanooga played auburn and jax state in the Non conference while GSU only played navy. Hence the eagles 1 game better overall record. Georgia Southern was only there because they are Georgia Southern. Not because they were a better team or had a better resume.GSU had a better defense than Chatty. GSU's defense carried them through the playoffs really; Chatty didn't get in because they only had, what? 5 D1 wins? If Chatty wins one more game, against maybe Elon or someone they're in, and GSU is probably on the bubble. Chatty could win the conference this year, but I just don't think it will happen. They'll have 6-8 wins this year, 9 tops

[chattownmocs]

GSU had a better defense than Chatty. GSU's defense carried them through the playoffs really; Chatty didn't get in because they only had, what? 5 D1 wins? If Chatty wins one more game, against maybe Elon or someone they're in, and GSU is probably on the bubble. Chatty could win the conference this year, but I just don't think it will happen. They'll have 6-8 wins this year, 9 tops

Chattanooga's non conference games were Eastern Kentucky, Jacksonville State and Auburn. They were penalized for playing a tough nonconference schedule. They didnt play a non D1 team.

[Saint3333]

I could see UTC beating anybody in the SoCon next year. They have a great coach. He has upgraded the talent of the starters thus far and likely added depth to that talent this recruiting season. They will be dangerous.

[GSUhooligan]

Chattanooga would have done the same damage in the playoffs as Georgia Southern. if you think you would have beaten W&M, you're mistaken. They see pass-happy attacks all year long in the CAA and would have shut yours down. Also, Wofford man-handled you during the year when you were playing for your playoff lives and they were already in the playoffs.

[PaladinFan]

Chattanooga would have done the same damage in the playoffs as Georgia Southern. As a matter of fact why was Georgia Souther even in the playoffs while chatty was at home? Same Conference record, chattanooga won head-to-head, the difference is chattanooga played auburn and jax state in the Non conference while GSU only played navy. Hence the eagles 1 game better overall record. Georgia Southern was only there because they are Georgia Southern. Not because they were a better team or had a better resume.

And neither thanked us for giving you a win! :)

[gsugt1]

Chattanooga would have done the same damage in the playoffs as Georgia Southern. As a matter of fact why was Georgia Souther even in the playoffs while chatty was at home? Same Conference record, chattanooga won head-to-head, the difference is chattanooga played auburn and jax state in the Non conference while GSU only played navy. Hence the eagles 1 game better overall record. Georgia Southern was only there because they are Georgia Southern. Not because they were a better team or had a better resume.

We won 3 in a row to enter playoffs. Ya'll got drilled by Wofford the last game of the season to finish 6-5.

[SpiritCymbal]

Chattanooga would have done the same damage in the playoffs as Georgia Southern. As a matter of fact why was Georgia Souther even in the playoffs while chatty was at home? Same Conference record, chattanooga won head-to-head, the difference is chattanooga played auburn and jax state in the Non conference while GSU only played navy. Hence the eagles 1 game better overall record. Georgia Southern was only there because they are Georgia Southern. Not because they were a better team or had a better resume.

UTC only had 6 DI wins last year. The "unofficial" rule of thumb is that you need to have at least 7 DI wins if you're not an AQ.

UTC/GSU should be a fun game this year.

[eaglewraith]

Chattanooga would have done the same damage in the playoffs as Georgia Southern. As a matter of fact why was Georgia Souther even in the playoffs while chatty was at home? Same Conference record, chattanooga won head-to-head, the difference is chattanooga played auburn and jax state in the Non conference while GSU only played navy. Hence the eagles 1 game better overall record. Georgia Southern was only there because they are Georgia Southern. Not because they were a better team or had a better resume.

You didn't make it for the same reason we didn't make it in back in 2007. You need to have 7 D1 wins. Honestly there's really no reason to schedule tough OOC in our conference. Do well in the conference and win your OOC games and you're in the playoffs. Follow the UNH school of thought when it comes to scheduling.

[Reign of Terrier]

Chattanooga's non conference games were Eastern Kentucky, Jacksonville State and Auburn. They were penalized for playing a tough nonconference schedule. They didnt play a non D1 team.

win one of those games and you're in. Very rarely do you see a team from a conference like the Socon lose all of their OOC games and make the playoffs.

[beanburrito]

win one of those games and you're in. Very rarely do you see a team from a conference like the Socon lose all of their OOC games and make the playoffs.

UTC beat Eastern Kentucky. Mocs blew late leads to App and Jax State, fell apart late vs. Elon and no-showed at Wofford. Win one of those and they were in and probably hosting a playoff game.

[Wofford/Montana Dude]

So has Wofford replaced Furman in the "Big Three?"

[ThompsonThe]

That would have been the game to lose in the lineup. The one with Tusculum. For several reasons.
Good luck this year. Reading your recruits bios you would think they could beat Georgia Tech, but I don't really think your problem is just recruits.

[Reign of Terrier]

Wofford signed a recruit late today. This one is huge. Tarak Odom is his name and he's a defensive linemen who has been compared to Gerald McCoy (the former Oklahoma defensive tackle a couple years back). There are high expectations of him

[cmaxwellgsu]

Chattanooga would have done the same damage in the playoffs as Georgia Southern. As a matter of fact why was Georgia Souther even in the playoffs while chatty was at home? Same Conference record, chattanooga won head-to-head, the difference is chattanooga played auburn and jax state in the Non conference while GSU only played navy. Hence the eagles 1 game better overall record. Georgia Southern was only there because they are Georgia Southern. Not because they were a better team or had a better resume.

You did an excellent job of answering your own question. You were one D1 victory short. We also knocked off #1,so what victory would you say equals that? Y'all are definitely the most improved team in the SoCon, but you didn't win quite enough last year with that murderer's row schedule. I expect Chatty to be there this year.

[Aho_Old_Guy]

I updated my sig (Marked.) ---- and brought this over from the 'other' preseason SoCon thread:


(1) GSU
The Dynasty Returns: Why bother playing the games?

(2) Furman
Vermin University Has Life and a lot of talent

(3) Chattanooga
Friday Practice Does Matter

(4) Samford
Do It For Pat! for no reason as they fire him, anyway

(5) Wofford
Maybe Year After Next Year?

(6) Elon
See Wofford Above

(7) Appalachian xbawlingx
Apocalyptic End of Known World ? xeyebrowx

(8) The Citadel
Winning Streak Ends At One

(9) Western Carolina
LOL What?

[ThompsonThe]

You sir ..... are an idiot.

Baloney. App State is going to wreck you a new hole.....so wide your mama could drive through it.

Pathetic bull sh$t.

[Reign of Terrier]

You sir ..... are an idiot.

Baloney. App State is going to wreck you a new hole.....so wide your mama could drive through it.

Pathetic bull sh$t.

Considering he had Wofford as 5th when no one realistically has them lower than 2nd or 3rd or maybe 4th, and describes us as a rebuilding year....I'm going to say it's a bad prediction