Rate the Coaches in Your Conference

[carney2]

A previous post at this site has an interesting article that grades each of the coaches in the Southern Conference. This is a request/challenge to rate each of the coaches in your conference.

I'll start with the Patriot League (in alphabetic order):

BUCKNELL: Tim Landis lost every able bodied QB on his roster and still manged to be competitive at times. I am still expecting big things here. Even though it is, as yet, unearned: Grade: B

COLGATE: How can any coach entice talented footballers, who obviously have other options, to travel to upstate New York and don pads in the wind and ice and snow? I don't know, but Dick Biddle can. Grade: A+

FORDHAM: We're grading the departed Ed Foley here and not the new kid, Tom Masella. Fordham had some lofty expectations in 2005 and once again they were rammed (get it?) into the toilet. Grade: D

GEORGETOWN: Kevin Kelly is replacing Bob Benson, but we are grading history here, so it's Benson that's up for grabs. With Georgetown you really can't tell about the coach because the facilities, raw material and support are so bad. In any event, it all comes out the same: Grade: F

HOLY CROSS: It is beyond belief that the days of Gordie Lochbaum have deteriorated to this. Tom Gilmore showed some signs of moving to a higher level, but how much of this "progress" was due to the now departed Steve Silva? Hey, Tom, we're still waiting for a sign. Grade: C-

LAFAYETTE: Frank Tavani took over a program that was well beyond circling the bowl and made it into - well, made it into something that everyone except former President Arthur Rothkopf can be proud of. The jury is still out as to whether he merely had a team for two years or created a program. Still, a job well done. Grade: A

LEHIGH: Another new kid on the block scenario where we will look at the guy who has left for greener pastures. Pete Lembo was always short on charisma. Personally, I think that the kids just got tired of listening to him by November. Still, the proof is in the pudding (that's won - lost record for the culturally deprived), as they say, so... Grade: A-

Your turn.

[colgate13]

I'll follow with more PL (keep in mind, we abhor grade inflation here at Colgate!):

Bucknell (Landis): C. There's life there, but last year has me worried. We'll see if he can right the ship this year.

Colgate (Biddle): A+. You really can't say anything bad about Biddle. He took a loser of a program and made a consistent, nationally recognized winner.

Fordham (Foley): C-. Going on what I saw in Hamilton last fall, the Rams had some personnel issues, not necessarily coaching issues to deal with.

Georgetown (Benson): D. There are a lot of excuses we can ponder here, but ultimately Benson was never competitive in the PL. I don't give him the F because I think the transition from the MAAC was difficult, and the Hoyas still haven't committed the $ needed for PL success.

Holy Cross (Gilmore): B. He needs to continue the turn around, but he's done a fantastic job of making a bottom dweller into a respectable opponent in only 2 seasons.

Lafayette (Tavani): B+. I'm waiting for consistency before grading him higher. This year will be a big test.

Lehigh (Lembo): B+. Great winning percentage, but really couldn't bring home the bacon. If he wasn't handed a top program when he started and achieved the same winning percentage, I'd give him at least an 'A'. But the fact is he took over an impeccable Lehigh program and, hindsight being 20/20, managed not to damage it, but didn't really add to it either.

(BTW, anyone else think it's odd that the PL 'alphabet' ends at L?)

[JohnStOnge]

I'll grade Southland coaches of how well I think they've been doing lately given the resources and support at their disposal.

Jay Thomas, Nicholls State A+
David Baliff, Texas State A
Clint Conque, Central Arkansas A
Dennis Roland, Southeastern Louisiana B+
Scott Stoker, Northwestern State C+
Todd Whitten, Sam Houston State C
Tommy Tate, McNeese State C-
Robert McFarland, SFA F

[Pard4Life]

A previous post at this site has an interesting article that grades each of the coaches in the Southern Conference. This is a request/challenge to rate each of the coaches in your conference.

I'll start with the Patriot League (in alphabetic order):

BUCKNELL: Tim Landis lost every able bodied QB on his roster and still manged to be competitive at times. I am still expecting big things here. Even though it is, as yet, unearned: Grade: B

COLGATE: How can any coach entice talented footballers, who obviously have other options, to travel to upstate New York and don pads in the wind and ice and snow? I don't know, but Dick Biddle can. Grade: A+

FORDHAM: We're grading the departed Ed Foley here and not the new kid, Tom Masella. Fordham had some lofty expectations in 2005 and once again they were rammed (get it?) into the toilet. Grade: D

GEORGETOWN: Kevin Kelly is replacing Bob Benson, but we are grading history here, so it's Benson that's up for grabs. With Georgetown you really can't tell about the coach because the facilities, raw material and support are so bad. In any event, it all comes out the same: Grade: F

HOLY CROSS: It is beyond belief that the days of Gordie Lochbaum have deteriorated to this. Tom Gilmore showed some signs of moving to a higher level, but how much of this "progress" was due to the now departed Steve Silva? Hey, Tom, we're still waiting for a sign. Grade: C-

LAFAYETTE: Frank Tavani took over a program that was well beyond circling the bowl and made it into - well, made it into something that everyone except former President Arthur Rothkopf can be proud of. The jury is still out as to whether he merely had a team for two years or created a program. Still, a job well done. Grade: A

LEHIGH: Another new kid on the block scenario where we will look at the guy who has left for greener pastures. Pete Lembo was always short on charisma. Personally, I think that the kids just got tired of listening to him by November. Still, the proof is in the pudding (that's won - lost record for the culturally deprived), as they say, so... Grade: A-

Your turn.

As much as I love Tavani, Biddle rules the roost in this league.

1. Biddle A+
2. Tavani A (warrants A+ but can't beat Colgate)
3. Landis B+
4. Limbo Lembo B
5. Gilmore B-
6. Benson C-
7. Foley D-

Lafayette has a program like Colgate and Lehigh. Gilmore will come around, and I am totally unimpressed with Foley. I even had misgivings about him last year... no energy or motivation, at least what I saw in the press conference. I think it was evident this year from what the Fordham people have been saying.. the players had no emotion.

[blackfordpu]

I'll rate mine in order of how well I think they've been doing lately given the resources and support at their disposal.

Jay Thomas, Nicholls State A+
David Baliff, Texas State A
Clint Conque, Central Arkansas A
Dennis Roland, Southeastern Louisiana B+
Scott Stoker, Northwestern State C+
Tommy Tate, McNeese State C
Todd Whitten, Sam Houston State C
Robert McFarland, SFA F

Very generous in not listing Whitten last. I would give him a F after last season. He could not figure out how to motivate his players and talked down to them. I hope he figures things out before next season.

[ngineer]

My take on the current and departed in the PL:

Bucknell--Landis has had a lot of obstacles. Coming in following the death of a beloved coach, and then hit with a ton of injuries. Seems well respected and has kept his teams competitive. B

Colgate--Biddle has certainly proven himself over a long time. His record says it all. A (no "+"s...there's always room for improvement--i.e. games like CCSU loss)

Fordham--Foley was big disappointment. High expectations. Lost his players as seen in their dispationate play late in the season. D

Georgetown--Benson had an uphill battle all the way. Fighting against nuclear powers with spitballs (to borrow a Zell Miller phrase :rolleyes: ) C

Holy Cross--This year will tell how much of the Crusaders' return to life is Gilmore or the seniors just graduated. If the players have accepted Gilmore's intensity and he has stablized his staff, HC could once again become a force. While the jury is still out, I give him a B

Lafayette--Tavani is a great guy personally. Has to be admired for turning around a program that was headed for oblivion. However, I still question some of his play calling. B+

Lehigh--Lembo's legacy was that he wasn't Kevin Higgins. While extremely organized and a good recruiter, his personality as an overbearing accountant wore thin on some. At the same time, he kept a top 25 program consistently winning. A couple 'one point losses' (James Madison and Delaware) kept up the drum beat that he couldn't win a 'big one.' B+

[mainejeff]

Atlantic 10

McDonnell A-
Clawson A-
Laycock B+
Matthews B
Brown B
Keeler B-
Talley B-
Hager C-
Cosgrove D+
Stowers D+
Towson ?
Hofstra N/A

[jmuroller]

Atlantic 10

McDonnell A-
Clawson A-
Laycock B+
Matthews B
Brown B
Keeler B-
Talley B-
Hager C-
Cosgrove D+
Stowers D+
Towson ?
Hofstra N/A


I agree w/ that in general MJ. Laycock is not a B+ until he learns to play defense. I'm still waiting to see how good Clawson is without Tutt. Don't be so hard on Cosgrove. 4-5 years ago he was doing great, but has def. slid the past few years.

[golionsgo]

A previous post at this site has an interesting article that grades each of the coaches in the Southern Conference. This is a request/challenge to rate each of the coaches in your conference.

I'll start with the Patriot League (in alphabetic order):

BUCKNELL: Tim Landis lost every able bodied QB on his roster and still manged to be competitive at times. I am still expecting big things here. Even though it is, as yet, unearned: Grade: B

COLGATE: How can any coach entice talented footballers, who obviously have other options, to travel to upstate New York and don pads in the wind and ice and snow? I don't know, but Dick Biddle can. Grade: A+

FORDHAM: We're grading the departed Ed Foley here and not the new kid, Tom Masella. Fordham had some lofty expectations in 2005 and once again they were rammed (get it?) into the toilet. Grade: D

GEORGETOWN: Kevin Kelly is replacing Bob Benson, but we are grading history here, so it's Benson that's up for grabs. With Georgetown you really can't tell about the coach because the facilities, raw material and support are so bad. In any event, it all comes out the same: Grade: F

HOLY CROSS: It is beyond belief that the days of Gordie Lochbaum have deteriorated to this. Tom Gilmore showed some signs of moving to a higher level, but how much of this "progress" was due to the now departed Steve Silva? Hey, Tom, we're still waiting for a sign. Grade: C-

LAFAYETTE: Frank Tavani took over a program that was well beyond circling the bowl and made it into - well, made it into something that everyone except former President Arthur Rothkopf can be proud of. The jury is still out as to whether he merely had a team for two years or created a program. Still, a job well done. Grade: A

LEHIGH: Another new kid on the block scenario where we will look at the guy who has left for greener pastures. Pete Lembo was always short on charisma. Personally, I think that the kids just got tired of listening to him by November. Still, the proof is in the pudding (that's won - lost record for the culturally deprived), as they say, so... Grade: A-

Your turn.


Obviously I'm biased but I honestly think we have the best coach and coaching staff in the Southland Conference. Give us another year or two and I think we're gonna make some noise nationally.

1. Dennis Roland, SE Louisiana
2. Jay Thomas, Nicholls State
3. David Bailiff, Texas State
4. Tommy Tate, McNeese
5. Todd Whitten, Sam Houston
6. Robert McFarland, SFA
7. Scott Stoker, Northwestern St.

Clint Conque of Central Arkansas is outstanding and will have UCA competing right away but I can't rank him until they play a conference game.

[TexasTerror]

I'm not going to rate the SLC, but I think Jay Thomas is one of the most under-rated coaches in the nation. I wish Ralph would get him on I-AA Waves. He should've been Coach of the Year nationally this year. Had a tough go with the hurricanes, has one of the worst budgets in all the SLC and still won the conference this year. Helluva story and one good coach, especially if he was able to get Nicholls with two points of beating Furman on the road in the playoffs, a game they probably could've won.

[blukeys]

For this year.
Clawson A
McDonnell A-
Brown B+
Laycock B
Gumbs B Towson
Keeler B-
Talley C+
Matthews C+
Hager C+
Gardi C
Cosgrove C-
Stowers D+

[wannabegaucho]

Bob Biggs (UC Davis) -- A-
Rich Ellerson (SLO) -- A-
Wes Meier (SUU) -- C+
Craig Bohl (NDSU) -- B+
John Stiegelmeier (SDSU) -- B-

UC Davis always has a heartbreaker or two (i.e. New Hampshire)
Cal Poly can't get anyone to play them at home.
Southern Utah is in a "do or die" year this year
I don't follow the Dakotas much, but they tend to beat us when they host games.

[SochorField]

Bob Biggs (UC Davis)-- A
(I think his winning precentage is over 80% for his 13 years at UCD)
Rich Ellerson (Cal Poly)-- A-
Craig Bohl (NDSU) -- B+/A-
John Stiegelmeier (SDSU) -- B
Wes Meier (SUU) -- C



I know...I'm a homer. Overall, this conference is well coached (now that UNC is gone ;)

[CatFan22]

Big Sky Conference

Eastern Washington, Paul Wulff: A
Idaho State, Larry Lewis: C
Montana, Bobby Hauck: B+
Montana State, Mike Kramer: A
Northern Arizona, Jerome Souers: C-
Portland State, Tim Walsh: B-
Sacramento State, Steve Mooshagian: D-
Weber State, Ron McBride: B+

[thirdgendin]

Southern Conference

Jerry Moore (Appalachian) A+
Bobby Lamb (Furman) A-
Mike Ayers (Wofford) B
Kent Briggs (Western Carolina) B-
Rodney Allison (Chattanooga) B-
Kevin Higgins (The Citadel) C?

Pete Lembo (Elon) - n/a
Brian VanGorder (GSU) - n/a

[Canyoncat]

Big Sky Conference

Eastern Washington, Paul Wulff: A
Idaho State, Larry Lewis: C
Montana, Bobby Hauck: B+
Montana State, Mike Kramer: A
Northern Arizona, Jerome Souers: C-
Portland State, Tim Walsh: B-
Sacramento State, Steve Mooshagian: D-
Weber State, Ron McBride: B+

I agree with all your grades except for Kramer. I would give Kramer a B+. He hasn't won more than 7 games yet and hasn't won in the playoffs. Still, he has taken Bobcat Football to heights we haven't seen for a long time!!!

GO CATS!!

[Fordham]

BUCKNELL: Given the defensive and ST returners he had this year I really expected ALOT more from Bucknell this year. I understand the QB losses but there's no way imo to give him better grade than a D ... and that's only because he's done well in the past and you could argue that this past season was more of an anomaly: Grade: D

COLGATE: Remarkable work here by Biddle. He lost some great talent and started off with a stunning loss and still pulled off a championship season. Colgate has what we at Fordham hope for ... an oustanding coach who is not looking for something better (I hope we've found it in Massella but who knows at this point?) ... again, remarkable. Grade: A+

FORDHAM: Ed Foley is a great, great guy who you can't help but root for. As much as someone may argue that we didn't have the talent to compete, it was too abysmal to see the combination of a lack of passion by the players (imo) as well as the number of times that we were up or close in the 1st half followed by a 2nd half blowout. Grade: F

GEORGETOWN: Benson beat us and Bucknell and that gives him a higher grade than both in my book. Throw in the all important fact that they are the only school way below the PL curve in terms of financial support of the program and I think he gets a middle of the road grade. Grade: C

HOLY CROSS: Regardless of whether or not he did it with departing seniors, I thought this was a great season for HC. Taking them from where they were and where everyone expected to be in the pre-season and knocking off Lehigh and being in the driver's seat for the PL championship in the middle of the year was nothing short of amazing. The loss to us and weak overall finish knocks him down from a higher grade, imo. Grade: B

LAFAYETTE: Tavani is the closest thing that any other PL school has to a Biddle. Tough to knock what he has produced the past 2 years for the Pards. As long as he can keep that staff together, they should be in very good shape for the foreseeable future. Grade: A

LEHIGH: I was more of a Lembo fan than most ngihawk fans seemed to be. With a coach that young & smart, who has also produced very good overall results for so long, I think they should have given him more time to mature and learn how to get over the hump in the big game (or games). Grade: A-

[OL FU]

Southern Conference

Jerry Moore (Appalachian) A+
Bobby Lamb (Furman) A-
Mike Ayers (Wofford) B
Kent Briggs (Western Carolina) B-
Rodney Allison (Chattanooga) B-
Kevin Higgins (The Citadel) C?

Pete Lembo (Elon) - n/a
Brian VanGorder (GSU) - n/a

I generally agree. I think if the grades are based on this year only, Ayers would have to fall some. probably in the C range. If the grades are for more than this season, I would only drop Moore slightly either A or A- (I have always been a fan of the way Moore coaches) Lamb probably drops to a B or Bplus. and Ayers slightly under Lamb. Only small differences.

[Ronbo]

Big Sky Conference

Eastern Washington, Paul Wulff: A
Idaho State, Larry Lewis: C
Montana, Bobby Hauck: B+
Montana State, Mike Kramer: A
Northern Arizona, Jerome Souers: C-
Portland State, Tim Walsh: B-
Sacramento State, Steve Mooshagian: D-
Weber State, Ron McBride: B+

Last three years.

1) Bobby Hauck - 29 wins, 11 losses, 3 playoff appearances, NC appearance.
2) Paul Wulff - 22 wins, 14 losses, 2 playoff appearances.
3) Mike Kramer - 19 wins, 16 losses, 2 playoff appearances.
4) Ron McBride - 6 wins, 5 losses (only 1 year at Weber). Nice turn around from 0-11 in 2004.
5) Tim Walsh - 17 wins, 16 losses. 13-9 last two years.
6) Larry Lewis - 16 wins, 18 losses.
7) Jerome Souers - 16 wins, 19 losses.
8) Steve Mooshagian - 7 wins, 26 losses. xidiotx

[CatFan22]

I agree with all your grades except for Kramer. I would give Kramer a B+. He hasn't won more than 7 games yet and hasn't won in the playoffs. Still, he has taken Bobcat Football to heights we haven't seen for a long time!!!

GO CATS!!

Although I disagree that Kramer should be a B+, I do understand where you are coming from. I gave him an A because of his playoff appearances and what he has done to resurrect this university. He could have gotten an A-, but for the sake of what he has done here, I thought that alone constituted an A.

[Canyoncat]

Although I disagree that Kramer should be a B+, I do understand where you are coming from. I gave him an A because of his playoff appearances and what he has done to resurrect this university. He could have gotten an A-, but for the sake of what he has done here, I thought that alone constituted an A.

Agree with your assessment of Kramer. What he has done for us is great, but we can be so much better!! And I think the Cats are going to be real good this year. With our running attack and O-Line, the new QB (Carpenter or Rolovich) should have time to develop chemistry with the new WR's.

GO CATS!!

[kats89]

I'll grade Southland coaches of how well I think they've been doing lately given the resources and support at their disposal.

Jay Thomas, Nicholls State A+
David Baliff, Texas State A
Clint Conque, Central Arkansas A
Dennis Roland, Southeastern Louisiana B+
Scott Stoker, Northwestern State C+
Todd Whitten, Sam Houston State C
Tommy Tate, McNeese State C-
Robert McFarland, SFA F

Man, you were generous in the C grade for Whitten. No higher than a D in my book his first year. The only reason he didn't get an F was because we beat SFA AGAIN!!!

[DFW HOYA]

GEORGETOWN: Kevin Kelly is replacing Bob Benson, but we are grading history here, so it's Benson that's up for grabs. With Georgetown you really can't tell about the coach because the facilities, raw material and support are so bad. In any event, it all comes out the same: Grade: F


The PL posters on this board have generally been tougher on Bob Benson than 90% of the Georgetown fans I know. I'm not sure why, but as to his place in the PL landscape, I'll say this: as a defensive coach, he is underrated. With very limited resources, Georgetown was the 25th ranked defense two years running, and Georgetown was actually #1 in total defense in 1995. Defensive coaching was not the issue.

By contrast, Benson did not coach the offense, instead entrusting 100% of the plays to a former I-A head coach (Elliott Uzelac) who was inflexible in running an offense where the talent did not match the tactics. Anyone who watched the predictability of the GU offense has to give some credit to the defense as to the fact that the Hoyas won four games this season.

Benson used to say that Georgetown was a "gold mine" of potential, because it had the academic weight and the national name to reach a lot of prospects. But a miner is only as good as the tools he has to work with, and Benson was visibly frustrated in recent years with the resources at his disposal. I hope Coach Kelly is given more of the tools needed to dig down and get the kind of resources that can make a difference for Hoya Football.

[HensRock]

So many things go into being a good/great head coach. I decided I would break it up for the A-10 and rate each head man in the following areas:

Recruiting - obviuosly how well they do at attracting and bringing in new HS talent
Base Strategy - how well do they know their X's and O's.
Game Plan/Prep - how well they prepare for the upcoming opponent - tailoring the game plan to leverage any advantages.
Game Day Adjustments - how willing they are to change game plans to adapt to what is going on during the game. Most often seen as half-time adjustments.
Public Relations - how well they deal with the media, get students and community involved, etc.
Team Discipline/Ethics - how willing are they to sit a kid for disciplinary reasons, even if they are a "star" player. Do the kids stay out of trouble?

Keep in mind, I am not real familiar with a lot of the coaches, but here's my take FWIW. I do think we have some excellent coaches in the A-10.

Delaware: K.C. Keeler
REC: A+
BS: B+
GPP: B
GDA: C
PR: A+
TDE: A
Overall: A-

James Madison: Micky Matthews
REC: A+
BS: B+
GPP: B-
GDA: B
PR: B
TDE: A
Overall: B+

Hofstra: Joe Gardi
REC: A-
BS: Offense A+, Defense C- (overall B)
GPP: B
GDA: B
PR: A
TDE: B
Overall: B

Maine: Jack Cosgrove
REC: B
BS: A
GPP: B+
GDA: A
PR: B
TDE: D
Overall: B-

Massachusetts: Don Brown
REC: A
BS: A
GPP: A+
GDA: B+
PR: B-
TDE: C (the way he left NU was kind of slimy, IMO)
Overall: B+

New Hampshire: Sean McDonnell
REC: A-
BS: A+
GPP: A+
GDA: A+
PR: B
TDE: B+
Overall: A+

Northeastern: Rocky Hager (2 seasons at NU)
REC: B
BS: A
GPP: B
GDA: B+
PR: A-
TDE: A
Overall: B+

Rhode Island: Tim Stowers
REC: C-
BS: B+
GPP: C+
GDA: B
PR: B-
TDE: A
Overall: C+

Richmond: Dave Clawson (1 season at UR)
REC: B
BS: A-
GPP: B+
GDA: A
PR: B
TDE: A
Overall: B+

Towson: Gordy Combs
REC: A-
BS: B
GPP: A
GDA: B
PR: A
TDE: B
Overall A-

Villanova: Andy Talley
REC: B-
BS: A+
GPP: A
GDA: B
PR: A
TDE: C+
Overall: B

William & Mary: Jimmye Laycock
REC: B
BS: A
GPP: B
GDA: A
PR: B
TDE: A
Overall: A-

[WMTribe90]

So many things go into being a good/great head coach. I decided I would break it up for the A-10 and rate each head man in the following areas:

Recruiting - obviuosly how well they do at attracting and bringing in new HS talent
Base Strategy - how well do they know their X's and O's.
Game Plan/Prep - how well they prepare for the upcoming opponent - tailoring the game plan to leverage any advantages.
Game Day Adjustments - how willing they are to change game plans to adapt to what is going on during the game. Most often seen as half-time adjustments.
Public Relations - how well they deal with the media, get students and community involved, etc.
Team Discipline/Ethics - how willing are they to sit a kid for disciplinary reasons, even if they are a "star" player. Do the kids stay out of trouble?

Keep in mind, I am not real familiar with a lot of the coaches, but here's my take FWIW. I do think we have some excellent coaches in the A-10.

I like and agree with your criteria. I would probably add a couple: 1) Graduates Players, 2) Player Development (turns HS duds into studs).

I won't attempt to rate each coach by each criteria, but will give an overall grade considering all the criteria as best I can. There are certainly alot of good coaches in the A10. I will also consider whether the coaches have overachieved with limited resources or administractive/academic hurdles.

Top Tier
1) Sean McDonnel (UNH), clean program, good recruiter, success despite bad facilities, graduates players, innovative offense
2) Dave Clawson (UR), only two years at UR, but he turned the Spiders and Rams around in a hurry, good recruiter, clean programs
3) Jimmye Laycock (WM), record of consistent success, great developer or talent, good recruiter despite academic barriers, good offensive schemes
4) Keeler (UD), great recruiter, good PR, won a NC, not a great game-day coach, little innovation on offense, has the most to work with in the conf.
5) Matthews (JMU), great recruiter, team could be more disciplined, won a NC, puts his foot in his mouth from time to time, generally good PR

Second Tier
6) Joe Gardi (Hofstra), ended a rough stretch this season, but has several productive seasons and playoff appearences on his resume
7) Don Brown (UMass), did good things at NU, not the most ethical coach IMO, underachieved at UMass this year given the talent
8) Gordy Combs (TU), stock on the rise after last year, overachieved with young team and fewer schollies than A10 opponents, good offense
9) Andy Talley (Villanova), stock has fallen sharply in recent years after successful run in the 90s, good recruiter, clean program
T10) Tim Stowers (URI) does pretty well with the worst supported and funded program in the A10.
T10) Rocky Hager (NU) has the huskies competitive, but can't get over the hump, facilites and attendance working against him, team plays hard
T10) Jack cosgrove (Maine) has had some very successful campaigns, team has been inconsistent in effort for two years, poor graduation rate and some discipline/ethics problems, good recruiter

[jmuroller]

Hensrock,

Looking at your rankings is why I think the A10 is such a strong conference from top to bottom. The coaching in the A10 is top notch. We don't have just 2-4 teams that dominate year in and year out, yet every year someone pops up and takes the top shot.

[Stang Fever]

Big Sky Conference

Eastern Washington, Paul Wulff: A
Idaho State, Larry Lewis: C
Montana, Bobby Hauck: B+
Montana State, Mike Kramer: A
Northern Arizona, Jerome Souers: C-
Portland State, Tim Walsh: B-
Sacramento State, Steve Mooshagian: D-
Weber State, Ron McBride: B+


I might not be in teh Big Sky conf. but two teams that i believe you graded way to high is EWU and MSU


EWU- Terrible team......and i will say it over and over again because even though they had one of the best offense in the nation hands down...as a team they sucked....no one had a problem putting up points on that defense.....teams scored at will they just could not keep scoring was the problems...special teams..was a joke C+ at best for special teams.....Defense D+...and the offense is an A


which should come out to be some where around a B to B-


MSU......same boat...played well late in teh season....but whatelse is new...until he can keep them winning in the first half of the season you would have to give im a B to B+ at best



and how you give the weber state coach a B+ is one of the bigges problems i have.....i mean this man took a team that had no chance in hell to win....yes they didnt win the conf. but for a first year coach to turn a team around and have them in just about every game except NDSU....deserves an A for coaching cause thats all that can be is coaching...none of those players are his players

[MR. CHICKEN]

KEELER...................A+.....GOTTA RING LADS!
MATTHEWS.............A+.....GOTTA RING LADS!
STOWERS...............A+.....GOTTA RING LADS!.......DIFFERENT SCHOOL DOUGH!
MCDONNELL............A-......NO RING....BUT CLOSE!
TALLEY...................A.......GOOD ENOUGH TA FRY DUH CHICKENS ALOT!
LAYCOCK.................A.......SEE TALLEY!
GARDI.....................B+.....SEE LAYCOCK!
CLAWSON................B+.....UP & COMIN' YOUNG GUN!
COSGROVE...............B.......ATTRACTS DUH TALENT TA DUH FROZEN TUNDRA!
HAGER.....................B......SEE COSGROVE....'CEPT.....BOSTON SCHOOLYARD!
COMBS....................B......PUT GROWL IN DUH TIGERS..WHIFF FEWER SCHOLIES!
BROWN....................C+....SORRY DONNIE....CAN'T HOLD DUH UMA$$ ATTENTION FO' ELEVEN GAMES!

LADS.........NOBODYAH..BELOW C+.....DIS IS WHAT MAKES A-10....DIFFICULT!

BUK!...BUK!...BUK!...BRRAAAWWWWKKKKKQ!..:rotateh:

[CatFan22]

I might not be in teh Big Sky conf. but two teams that i believe you graded way to high is EWU and MSU


EWU- Terrible team......and i will say it over and over again because even though they had one of the best offense in the nation hands down...as a team they sucked....no one had a problem putting up points on that defense.....teams scored at will they just could not keep scoring was the problems...special teams..was a joke C+ at best for special teams.....Defense D+...and the offense is an A


which should come out to be some where around a B to B-


MSU......same boat...played well late in teh season....but whatelse is new...until he can keep them winning in the first half of the season you would have to give im a B to B+ at best



and how you give the weber state coach a B+ is one of the bigges problems i have.....i mean this man took a team that had no chance in hell to win....yes they didnt win the conf. but for a first year coach to turn a team around and have them in just about every game except NDSU....deserves an A for coaching cause thats all that can be is coaching...none of those players are his players

This is not about the teams individually. It is is about the coaches and their performances throughout their stay at each school. It is about COACHING. Take a look at the topic. And EWU didn't suck. They were a good team who did make the playoffs. I gave Weber State's coach what I did because of how he COACHED the team and turned them around from an 0-11 season. Take a look at what you are suppose to be talking about and argue that.

[bcrawf]

Gateway Football Conference:

Mark Farley (UNI)- B+ will eventually win the big one
Jerry Kill (SIU)- B+ Must take his program to the next level in the Playoffs
Terry Allen (MSU)- B+ Great in the Regular Season Terrible in the Playoffs
Denver Johnson (Il St)- B Up and comer will do great things in Normal
Dave Elson (WKU)- B- really lost his team down the stretch this year
Jim Heacock (YSU)- B- Does a nice job nothing special
Don Patterson (WIU)- C Game has past him by just like mentor Hayden Fry
Lou West (IN ST)- F- Guy is lost and shows it off on a weekly basis

[Cap'n Cat]

Gateway Football Conference:

Terry Allen (MSU)- B+ Great in the Regular Season Terrible in the Playoffs



:confused:



:eyebrow:

[umassfan]

KEELER...................A+.....GOTTA RING LADS!
MATTHEWS.............A+.....GOTTA RING LADS!
STOWERS...............A+.....GOTTA RING LADS!.......DIFFERENT SCHOOL DOUGH!
MCDONNELL............A-......NO RING....BUT CLOSE!
TALLEY...................A.......GOOD ENOUGH TA FRY DUH CHICKENS ALOT!
LAYCOCK.................A.......SEE TALLEY!
GARDI.....................B+.....SEE LAYCOCK!
CLAWSON................B+.....UP & COMIN' YOUNG GUN!
COSGROVE...............B.......ATTRACTS DUH TALENT TA DUH FROZEN TUNDRA!
HAGER.....................B......SEE COSGROVE....'CEPT.....BOSTON SCHOOLYARD!
COMBS....................B......PUT GROWL IN DUH TIGERS..WHIFF FEWER SCHOLIES!
BROWN....................C+....SORRY DONNIE....CAN'T HOLD DUH UMA$$ ATTENTION FO' ELEVEN GAMES!

LADS.........NOBODYAH..BELOW C+.....DIS IS WHAT MAKES A-10....DIFFICULT!

BUK!...BUK!...BUK!...BRRAAAWWWWKKKKKQ!..:rotateh:
Do you forget that Don Brown was the first on that list to get a I-AA Champ ring? Guess you seemed to forget that....

[umassfan]

I like and agree with your criteria. I would probably add a couple: 1) Graduates Players, 2) Player Development (turns HS duds into studs).

I won't attempt to rate each coach by each criteria, but will give an overall grade considering all the criteria as best I can. There are certainly alot of good coaches in the A10. I will also consider whether the coaches have overachieved with limited resources or administractive/academic hurdles.

Top Tier
1) Sean McDonnel (UNH), clean program, good recruiter, success despite bad facilities, graduates players, innovative offense
2) Dave Clawson (UR), only two years at UR, but he turned the Spiders and Rams around in a hurry, good recruiter, clean programs
3) Jimmye Laycock (WM), record of consistent success, great developer or talent, good recruiter despite academic barriers, good offensive schemes
4) Keeler (UD), great recruiter, good PR, won a NC, not a great game-day coach, little innovation on offense, has the most to work with in the conf.
5) Matthews (JMU), great recruiter, team could be more disciplined, won a NC, puts his foot in his mouth from time to time, generally good PR

Second Tier
6) Joe Gardi (Hofstra), ended a rough stretch this season, but has several productive seasons and playoff appearences on his resume
7) Don Brown (UMass), did good things at NU, not the most ethical coach IMO, underachieved at UMass this year given the talent
8) Gordy Combs (TU), stock on the rise after last year, overachieved with young team and fewer schollies than A10 opponents, good offense
9) Andy Talley (Villanova), stock has fallen sharply in recent years after successful run in the 90s, good recruiter, clean program
T10) Tim Stowers (URI) does pretty well with the worst supported and funded program in the A10.
T10) Rocky Hager (NU) has the huskies competitive, but can't get over the hump, facilites and attendance working against him, team plays hard
T10) Jack cosgrove (Maine) has had some very successful campaigns, team has been inconsistent in effort for two years, poor graduation rate and some discipline/ethics problems, good recruiter
Lets put it this way... Brown has done something no one else has ever at Northeastern.... bring them to the playoffs. Also he too has a NC ring... it may be as an assistant coach it still is a NC ring. BTW until recently what has McDonnel ever done at UNH? You have Clawson second but what has he ever done in his career? I still think people knock Brown for his decision to leave NU for UMass. Can you blame a guy for wanting to stay in the best conference and leave the worst team in the best conference? Think about it before you look more a fool.

[Stang Fever]

This is not about the teams individually. It is is about the coaches and their performances throughout their stay at each school. It is about COACHING. Take a look at the topic. And EWU didn't suck. They were a good team who did make the playoffs. I gave Weber State's coach what I did because of how he COACHED the team and turned them around from an 0-11 season. Take a look at what you are suppose to be talking about and argue that.


well for one...i said exactly what this topic is all about...maybe you should have payed more attention to EWU coaching......great coaching on offense....terrible coaching on Defense...if you think that defensive coordinator is so great...why dont you try to have him lead MSU..doubt u would...special teams coaching...i believe they were bototm of the league in KR or PR..cant rememer which one...an overall grade should not be an A- thats what i am saying....

[mainejeff]

I like and agree with your criteria. I would probably add a couple: 1) Graduates Players, 2) Player Development (turns HS duds into studs).

I won't attempt to rate each coach by each criteria, but will give an overall grade considering all the criteria as best I can. There are certainly alot of good coaches in the A10. I will also consider whether the coaches have overachieved with limited resources or administractive/academic hurdles.

Top Tier
1) Sean McDonnel (UNH), clean program, good recruiter, success despite bad facilities, graduates players, innovative offense
2) Dave Clawson (UR), only two years at UR, but he turned the Spiders and Rams around in a hurry, good recruiter, clean programs
3) Jimmye Laycock (WM), record of consistent success, great developer or talent, good recruiter despite academic barriers, good offensive schemes
4) Keeler (UD), great recruiter, good PR, won a NC, not a great game-day coach, little innovation on offense, has the most to work with in the conf.
5) Matthews (JMU), great recruiter, team could be more disciplined, won a NC, puts his foot in his mouth from time to time, generally good PR

Second Tier
6) Joe Gardi (Hofstra), ended a rough stretch this season, but has several productive seasons and playoff appearences on his resume
7) Don Brown (UMass), did good things at NU, not the most ethical coach IMO, underachieved at UMass this year given the talent
8) Gordy Combs (TU), stock on the rise after last year, overachieved with young team and fewer schollies than A10 opponents, good offense
9) Andy Talley (Villanova), stock has fallen sharply in recent years after successful run in the 90s, good recruiter, clean program
T10) Tim Stowers (URI) does pretty well with the worst supported and funded program in the A10.
T10) Rocky Hager (NU) has the huskies competitive, but can't get over the hump, facilites and attendance working against him, team plays hard
T10) Jack cosgrove (Maine) has had some very successful campaigns, team has been inconsistent in effort for two years, poor graduation rate and some discipline/ethics problems, good recruiter

Really? That's news to me.

[Spider]

1AA.ORG NATIONAL COACH OF THE YEAR, VA SID COACH OF THE YEAR....says it all......

[bluehenbillk]

Everyone's view of Andy Talley is inflated. He has done a lot of things well at 'Nova but hasn't paid attention since Westbrook & Gordon left. They'll be a last-place team in the A-10 South this year.

[WMTribe90]

Lets put it this way... Brown has done something no one else has ever at Northeastern.... bring them to the playoffs. Also he too has a NC ring... it may be as an assistant coach it still is a NC ring. BTW until recently what has McDonnel ever done at UNH? You have Clawson second but what has he ever done in his career? I still think people knock Brown for his decision to leave NU for UMass. Can you blame a guy for wanting to stay in the best conference and leave the worst team in the best conference? Think about it before you look more a fool.

Just my opinion. Odd you love to critique others posts but rarely offer anything of substance yourself. Why not post your own rankings if you beleive mine are so flawed?

[WMTribe90]

Really? That's news to me.

Maine has the lowest grad rate in the A10 according to the NCAA most recent data. See the recent AGS thread on IA v IAA grad rates. Perhaps it was a bad year for Maine and not the norm, but the listed grad rate for Maine was below 60%.

[GannonFan]

Just my opinion. Odd you love to critique others posts but rarely offer anything of substance yourself. Why not post your own rankings if you beleive mine are so flawed?

Interesting that he does that, isn't it? As for Brown's success at Northeastern, Barry Gallup did prove you could win at Northeastern before Brown got there. Granted, no playoff bid, but he did come close and had a few winning years. Maybe Brown just knew better than Gallup and got out while he was on top rather than staying too long?

[mainejeff]

Maine has the lowest grad rate in the A10 according to the NCAA most recent data. See the recent AGS thread on IA v IAA grad rates. Perhaps it was a bad year for Maine and not the norm, but the listed grad rate for Maine was below 60%.

So because Maine has a 50-something % grad rate, Cosgrove doesn't "graduate his players"? That's a higher average than the school's general population, so I don't see what the big deal is. Why don't you post the grad rates for all A-10 programs. I have a feeling that very little seperates Maine from a few of the other schools (you know, the ones that you didn't attack for not graduating their players :rolleyes: )

By the way, I did post my list.

[saint0917]

KEELER...................A+.....GOTTA RING LADS!

A+ for a 6-5 season :eyebrow: :eyebrow:. And Brown 7-4 beat Delaware and he gets a C+, And he got his ring before Keller. :D You must have one heck of a rating curve :rolleyes: You must be smoking some good stuff. :p ;)

[WMTribe90]

So because Maine has a 50-something % grad rate, Cosgrove doesn't "graduate his players"? That's a higher average than the school's general population, so I don't see what the big deal is. Why don't you post the grad rates for all A-10 programs. I have a feeling that very little seperates Maine from a few of the other schools (you know, the ones that you didn't attack for not graduating their players )

By the way, I did post my list.

MJ,

I requested MassFan post his list, that post was not directed at you.

As for the grad rates here you go...


A10...

Richmond 97
W&M 95
Villanova 95
UNH 90
UD 89
N'eastern 88
UMass 84
JMU 84
URI 81
Towson 78
Hofstra 76
Maine 59

Maine is 17% below the next closest Hofstra.
The University's graduation rate is 68% (students graduating within 6 years, average rate for years 93-99)

So, I stand by my claim. Cosgrove, at least for the most recent year on record with the NCAA, graduated the fewest players of any team in the A10 by 17%. Maine football players graduated at a rate below that of the student body by 9%.

Considering the graduation rate for football only applies to scholarship players, I would expect the rate for FB players to be higher than the student population. "Regular" students sometimes fail to graduate because they can't afford the tuition or because they have to enter the workforce to support themselves or their familes before graduating. Neither of these would be a likely reason for a scholarship player to not graduate.

I've got nothing personal against Cosgrove or Maine, but the facts are the facts.

[ChickenMan]

A+ for a 6-5 season :eyebrow: :eyebrow:. And Brown 7-4 beat Delaware and he gets a C+, And he got his ring before Keller. :D You must have one heck of a rating curve :rolleyes: You must be smoking some good stuff. :p ;)


I'd give Keeler (6-5) a 'C' for last year... but Brown (7-4) was no better and probably worse... as UMass was expected to do a lot better than 7-4 and no playoffs.

[MR. CHICKEN]

A+ for a 6-5 season :eyebrow: :eyebrow:. And Brown 7-4 beat Delaware and he gets a C+, And he got his ring before Keller. :D You must have one heck of a rating curve :rolleyes: You must be smoking some good stuff. :p ;)

KEELER IS UH A+ COACH..WHO HAD DUH MISFORTUNE O' 'BOUT 40 INJURIES!

DON BROWN WAS AN ASSISTANT....GOPHER..TYPE.......WHEN GEORGIA SOUTHERN.....SERVED UP DAT GRAMMY...ON UH PLATTER...TA DUH PILGRIMS!...................OL' DONNIE....STARTS OUT EVERAH SEASON WHIFF PIE-N-DA-SKY...PROMISE........DEN WE HOLD DUH I-AA DANCE.......AN' GUESS WHAT PILGRIM?........NO MINUTEMEN IN SIGHT!......:nod:xlolx:nod:.......BRAWK!.......... ............HOW'S DAT FOR UH CURVE?? xazzx

ps.......COACH "K"........HAD QUALITY WINS OVERAH..LEHIGH....HOLY CROSS...'04 NATIONAL CHUMPS..JMU.....BIG WIN OVERAH BILL & MARE...AN' 'NOVA...(DESPITE DUH WALKIN' WOUNDED).....LEHIGH..JMU..WM & MARY... RANKED IN DUH POLLS AT DUH TIME!....A+.....;)

[mainejeff]

MJ,

I requested MassFan post his list, that post was not directed at you.

As for the grad rates here you go...



Maine is 17% below the next closest Hofstra.
The University's graduation rate is 68% (students graduating within 6 years, average rate for years 93-99)

So, I stand by my claim. Cosgrove, at least for the most recent year on record with the NCAA, graduated the fewest players of any team in the A10 by 17%. Maine football players graduated at a rate below that of the student body by 9%.

Considering the graduation rate for football only applies to scholarship players, I would expect the rate for FB players to be higher than the student population. "Regular" students sometimes fail to graduate because they can't afford the tuition or because they have to enter the workforce to support themselves or their familes before graduating. Neither of these would be a likely reason for a scholarship player to not graduate.

I've got nothing personal against Cosgrove or Maine, but the facts are the facts.

I think that you better check YOUR facts. Are we talking football here, because if we are I see some different numbers. Check it out.....and get back to me with the FACTS...... :rolleyes:

[umassfan]

KEELER IS UH A+ COACH..WHO HAD DUH MISFORTUNE O' 'BOUT 40 INJURIES!

DON BROWN WAS AN ASSISTANT....GOPHER..TYPE.......WHEN GEORGIA SOUTHERN.....SERVED UP DAT GRAMMY...ON UH PLATTER...TA DUH PILGRIMS!...................OL' DONNIE....STARTS OUT EVERAH SEASON WHIFF PIE-N-DA-SKY...PROMISE........DEN WE HOLD DUH I-AA DANCE.......AN' GUESS WHAT PILGRIM?........NO MINUTEMEN IN SIGHT!......:nod:xlolx:nod:.......BRAWK!.......... ............HOW'S DAT FOR UH CURVE?? xazzx

ps.......COACH "K"........HAD QUALITY WINS OVERAH..LEHIGH....HOLY CROSS...'04 NATIONAL CHUMPS..JMU.....BIG WIN OVERAH BILL & MARE...AN' 'NOVA...(DESPITE DUH WALKIN' WOUNDED).....LEHIGH..JMU..WM & MARY... RANKED IN DUH POLLS AT DUH TIME!....A+.....;)
Injuries are apart of the game there chickenman... you cant give an A+ when the coach had just above a .500 record due to injuries. Every team has them. We played last year without two starting olineman, a rb, wr for half the year, and two LBers but yet still finished one game out of the playoffs.

[umassfan]

I'd give Keeler (6-5) a 'C' for last year... but Brown (7-4) was no better and probably worse... as UMass was expected to do a lot better than 7-4 and no playoffs.
Where was Delaware picked to finish last year? I believe they were picked to finish at the top of the A10 South. Where did Delaware finish? Thats right at the bottom of the A10 South. Where was UMass picked to finish the A10 North? Tied for 1st and they finished second behind UNH so I wouldnt quite say we did worse then expected. It was quite disapointing for not getting in the playoffs but we return enough pieces this year to be on top yet again. It doesnt hurt to play an easier A10 schedule as well. :)

[HensRock]

I really think Brown is a good couch. What he did at NU with so little resources is amazing. No, I don't blame him for moving to a program with more resources in UMass. It was the WAY he did it that didn't sit well with me. I really respect coach Brown alot for what he did at NU.

[ChickenMan]

Where was Delaware picked to finish last year? I believe they were picked to finish at the top of the A10 South. Where did Delaware finish? Thats right at the bottom of the A10 South. Where was UMass picked to finish the A10 North? Tied for 1st and they finished second behind UNH so I wouldnt quite say we did worse then expected. It was quite disapointing for not getting in the playoffs but we return enough pieces this year to be on top yet again. It doesnt hurt to play an easier A10 schedule as well. :)

UD has their youngest team... maybe ever and goes 6-5... UMass goes one whole game better... at 7-4... UMass was expected win the A10... they don't... UMass was expected to make the playoffs... they don't.

You spin like a Massachusetts Democrat... :p

[MR. CHICKEN]

KEELER...WOULDA OWNED D-III...IFIN' DERE WAS NO MT. UNION...........HE SKIPPED UH LEVEL...AN' BECAME UH INSTANT WINNER..IN I-AA...............AH'D SAY DAT IS DUH MARK O' AN A+ HEAD COACH!.....:rotateh::bow::nod::bow::rotateh:...... .BAWQ!

HE WON DUH RING....WHIFF PLAYERS DAT WERE NOT HIS OWN..WHO WERE RECRUITED FO' DUH W-T.........WITHIN DUH TOUGHEST CONFERENCE IN DUH UNIVERSE!....A+....A+....A+.........xsmoochx...... .BRAWQ!

[Go...gate]

Keeler has the pelt on the wall, as Bill Parcells would say, with his 2003 NCAA Championship. I also remember him at Rowan and he was a fine coach with that program.

[MR. CHICKEN]

THANKY...FO' WATCHIN' DUH BIG BIRD'S BACK.......GATE-MAN!......xsmoochx......AWQ!

[Tom W]

I might not be in teh Big Sky conf. but two teams that i believe you graded way to high is EWU and MSU


EWU- Terrible team......and i will say it over and over again because even though they had one of the best offense in the nation hands down...as a team they sucked....no one had a problem putting up points on that defense.....teams scored at will they just could not keep scoring was the problems...special teams..was a joke C+ at best for special teams.....Defense D+...and the offense is an A


which should come out to be some where around a B to B-


MSU......same boat...played well late in teh season....but whatelse is new...until he can keep them winning in the first half of the season you would have to give im a B to B+ at best



and how you give the weber state coach a B+ is one of the bigges problems i have.....i mean this man took a team that had no chance in hell to win....yes they didnt win the conf. but for a first year coach to turn a team around and have them in just about every game except NDSU....deserves an A for coaching cause thats all that can be is coaching...none of those players are his players
You know nothing about what you are talking about! EWU had little trouble keeping your mustangs from scoring in last seasons meeting and as for this year EWU had sixteen starters out (mostly on defense) by the time they played Cal Poly this year. They were starting four freshman on the D-line against Cal Poly 2 true freshmen and 2 red shirt freshmen and many others who were second and third team by the time they played in SLO. Also, they have had winning seasons for all of Coach Wulff's seven seasons and have done so with by far the smallest budget in the big sky. Maybe before you spout off you should learn some facts!!

[SochorField]

UC Davis' offense had trouble scoring on EWU...7 points. Although it was a "fog bowl" up there that day.

[slostang]

You know nothing about what you are talking about! EWU had little trouble keeping your mustangs from scoring in last seasons meeting and as for this year EWU had sixteen starters out (mostly on defense) by the time they played Cal Poly this year. They were starting four freshman on the D-line against Cal Poly 2 true freshmen and 2 red shirt freshmen and many others who were second and third team by the time they played in SLO. Also, they have had winning seasons for all of Coach Wulff's seven seasons and have done so with by far the smallest budget in the big sky. Maybe before you spout off you should learn some facts!!
Coach Wulff is a great coach and EWU is a great program. Injuries killed what should have been a great season. Even with the injuries EWU still managed to make the playoffs and almost pulled off a win against UNI on the road in the first round. That is the same UNI team that made it all the way to Chatty.

Wulff is also a great recruiter and I expect EWU to be a top team in the Big Sky and in I-AA. I only wish EWU was still on Poly's schedule. Good luck Febuary 1rst and with spring ball.

[saint0917]

KEELER IS UH A+ COACH..WHO HAD DUH MISFORTUNE O' 'BOUT 40 INJURIES!

A+ for injuries :confused: :bang: And Keller got his ring from all the Transfer U. Players. :nod:


ps.......COACH "K"........HAD QUALITY WINS OVERAH..LEHIGH....HOLY CROSS...'04 NATIONAL CHUMPS..JMU.....BIG WIN OVERAH BILL & MARE...AN' 'NOVA...

Quality wins?? xlolx :eyebrow:

Nova- 4-7 "Quality Win" over a bottom feeder :confused: xlolx
William & Mary 5-6 "BIG WIN" if you say so. :rotateh:

I think you might want to go and see your doctor, I think you might have the Bird Flu and it's affecting the way you think :nod:

[UNH 40]

KEELER IS UH A+ COACH..WHO HAD DUH MISFORTUNE O' 'BOUT 40 INJURIES!

DON BROWN WAS AN ASSISTANT....GOPHER..TYPE.......WHEN GEORGIA SOUTHERN.....SERVED UP DAT GRAMMY...ON UH PLATTER...TA DUH PILGRIMS!...................OL' DONNIE....STARTS OUT EVERAH SEASON WHIFF PIE-N-DA-SKY...PROMISE........DEN WE HOLD DUH I-AA DANCE.......AN' GUESS WHAT PILGRIM?........NO MINUTEMEN IN SIGHT!......:nod:xlolx:nod:.......BRAWK!.......... ............HOW'S DAT FOR UH CURVE?? xazzx

ps.......COACH "K"........HAD QUALITY WINS OVERAH..LEHIGH....HOLY CROSS...'04 NATIONAL CHUMPS..JMU.....BIG WIN OVERAH BILL & MARE...AN' 'NOVA...(DESPITE DUH WALKIN' WOUNDED).....LEHIGH..JMU..WM & MARY... RANKED IN DUH POLLS AT DUH TIME!....A+.....;)

Keeler is a marginal coach at best. He won a national championship with pretty much all of Tubby Taymonds players. Now his recruiting classes are starting to come of age and prove that he is a very average coach. And one more note, he has to get rid of those stupid sun glasses. When we played Delaware two years ago in a night game and i look over and see him with sun glasses on i thought to myself this guy is a real tool. Keeler takes himself way to seriously.

[ChickenMan]

Keeler is a marginal coach at best. He won a national championship with pretty much all of Tubby Taymonds players.

funny... but 'Tubby' couldn't win a I-AA championship with his 'own players' in 22 seasons... xidiotx

[ChickenMan]

And Keller got his ring from all the Transfer U. Players. :nod:


A UMass fan complaining about TRANSFERS....

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

[saint0917]

A UMass fan complaining about TRANSFERS....


Who's complaining?, I'm just pointing out the facts. :nod: xazzx

[Go...gate]

Keeler went 15-1 with his team and won the championship. NCAA regulations don't give demerits for transfer students, how many years a coach has had his job, or if he wears sunglasses at night. Before Keeler went back to UD, when he was at Rowan, he was a highly sought-after coach but wanted to succeed Raymond.

[UNH 40]

funny... but 'Tubby' couldn't win a I-AA championship with his 'own players' in 22 seasons... xidiotx

Give any coach in the conference the talent that he fell ass backwards into and that team would have gone 15-0 and won a national Championship. Look at what he has done with his own recruiting classes and you will see that each year they have declined. He should grow a pair and sit Riccio, that kid will lead them nowhere but down.

[Go...gate]

It ain't easy to go 15-1 and win a championship on any level; good coaching is necessary. A bad coach can sabotage the most talented of teams. Roger Hughes of Princeton is a good example, as is Pete Lembo, formerly of Lehigh.

[UNH 40]

Keeler went 15-1 with his team and won the championship. NCAA regulations don't give demerits for transfer students, how many years a coach has had his job, or if he wears sunglasses at night. Before Keeler went back to UD, when he was at Rowan, he was a highly sought-after coach but wanted to succeed Raymond.

True but the fact that he was highly sought-after doesn't make him a good coach. The facilities he has allows him to get players so that he will compete no matter what. Give McDonnell, Clawson, or brown that situation and you would see much better football coming out of Delaware.

[ChickenMan]

Give any coach in the conference the talent that he fell ass backwards into and that team would have gone 15-0 and won a national Championship. Look at what he has done with his own recruiting classes and you will see that each year they have declined. He should grow a pair and sit Riccio, that kid will lead them nowhere but down.

All that 'talent' that UD had in '03... went 6-6 in '02... guess they all got a whole lot better in just one season under KC.

As for the recent crop of UD recruits... you may be very unpleasently surprised by what UNH sees on their 9/30 visit to the Tub.

PS... Riccio was a Senior... UD will have a new QB in '06.

[GannonFan]

Keeler is a marginal coach at best. He won a national championship with pretty much all of Tubby Taymonds players. Now his recruiting classes are starting to come of age and prove that he is a very average coach. And one more note, he has to get rid of those stupid sun glasses. When we played Delaware two years ago in a night game and i look over and see him with sun glasses on i thought to myself this guy is a real tool. Keeler takes himself way to seriously.

Come on, where's all the hate coming from? As Chicken Man said, Tubby couldn't win a IAA NC with his own players so KC gets some credit for that. And it wasn't all Tubby's players - Andy Hall, Shawn Johnson, David Boler, Brad Shushman, Joey Bleymeir, Keindre Hepburn, and Rashaad Woodard all played roles, and some significantly, on that title team and all were brought in by KC after Tubby - we don't win that year without most of those guys. Hardly like he fell into these guys - every one of them had to be recruited in.

As for the classes coming in, I think the evidence is on the contrary - the 2004 recruiting class is looking very good and last year's wasn't bad either - with his classes coming in I'd say no playoffs in 2006 would be a huge disappointment and not contending for the national title in 2007 would be a downer as well. Not sure where this idea that these guys are average is coming from.

And as for the sunglasses, KC does have a medical condition with his eyes that makes it very painful for him to go without eye correction in bright light. I'm not sure if the brightness of lights at night games is too much or if he's just so use to wearing glasses that it's more comfortable or he feels lucky wearing them, but the use of sunglasses is far from an ego thing as you suggest. You gotta know more before you start smacking a guy like this.

[UNH 40]

All that 'talent' that UD had in '03... went 6-6 in '02... guess they all got a whole lot better in just one season under KC.

As for the recent crop of UD recruits... you may be very unpleasently surprised by what UNH sees on their 9/30 visit to the Tub.

PS... Riccio was a Senior... UD will have a new QB in '06.

one name Andy Hall without him they are just another team. UNH always plays well at Delaware, they won't be able to cover Ball or stop Santos.

[SunCoastBlueHen]

one name Andy Hall without him they are just another team. UNH always plays well at Delaware, they won't be able to cover Ball or stop Santos.


:confused: Hall was the starting QB on the 6-6 '02 team also. :confused:

[GannonFan]

:confused: Hall was the starting QB on the 6-6 '02 team also. :confused:

Hey, it's getting clearer and clearer this guy doesn't have control of his facts on this issue. Shawn Johnson was just another defensive lineman according to this guy.

[FlyBoy8]

one name Andy Hall without him they are just another team.

lol

Maybe you missed where Delaware set all kinds of DEFENSIVE records in the playoffs that year. Maybe you missed where MIKE ADAMS is starting in the NFL and MONDOE DAVIS, SHAWN JOHNSON, JAY NERYS and TRIP DELCAMPO are also playing professional football. Maybe you didn't realize that CHRIS MOONEY also signed a pro contract and TOM PARKS will in a couple months.

lol

[UNH 40]

:confused: Hall was the starting QB on the 6-6 '02 team also. :confused:

He was learning the offense as was the whole team. They just move out of the Delaware Wing T. Georgia Southern will be in the same situation this year. :confused:

[UNH 40]

lol

Maybe you missed where Delaware set all kinds of DEFENSIVE records in the playoffs that year. Maybe you missed where MIKE ADAMS is starting in the NFL and MONDOE DAVIS, SHAWN JOHNSON, JAY NERYS and TRIP DELCAMPO are also playing professional football. Maybe you didn't realize that CHRIS MOONEY also signed a pro contract and TOM PARKS will in a couple months.

lol


With a QB like Sunny Riccio that team would have been 7-5 or 8-4. With out a good QB any team will struggle.

[FlyBoy8]

Seeing as the Sonny Riccio-led 2004 team went NINE and four, and was not nearly as good, I think you should just move on to something else.

[GannonFan]

With a QB like Sunny Riccio that team would have been 7-5 or 8-4. With out a good QB any team will struggle.

Hey, without Shawn Johnson UD probably loses the Navy and UMass games and maybe misses the playoffs too. I don't even know what point you are trying to make anymore. Andy Hall played hurt throughout the playoffs (separated shoulder in the last game of the year against nova) and as a result UD had to lean heavily on the offensive line to run the ball and the defense, and their playoff run is a testament to that. If you honestly think UD won a title solely on the exploits of one player then you are clearly out on your own on this one.

[UNH 40]

Hey, without Shawn Johnson UD probably loses the Navy and UMass games and maybe misses the playoffs too. I don't even know what point you are trying to make anymore. Andy Hall played hurt throughout the playoffs (separated shoulder in the last game of the year against nova) and as a result UD had to lean heavily on the offensive line to run the ball and the defense, and their playoff run is a testament to that. If you honestly think UD won a title solely on the exploits of one player then you are clearly out on your own on this one.

The point i am trying to make is that Keeler just because he won a national championship is not the greatest coach in the world. Andy Hall was a great player and so was Shawn Johnson. UNH will come down to you place next year and Delware will be out coached and out played by UNH. Enough said :hurray: :hurray: :hurray:

[GannonFan]

The point i am trying to make is that Keeler just because he won a national championship is not the greatest coach in the world. Andy Hall was a great player and so was Shawn Johnson. UNH will come down to you place next year and Delware will be out coached and out played by UNH. Enough said :hurray: :hurray: :hurray:

Using your rationale how can you say he'll be outcoached? Wouldn't McDonnell have a decided edge having two of the best players in the country in Santos and Ball? If UNH wins, was it the coaching or the good fortune to have these guys on the team? I mean, he has great players, who can't win with that? And does McDonnell get credit for having Santos or does he get a knock because in Santos's breakout year he was buried at 4th on the depth chart when the season began and only got the shot he did against UD (and then Rutgers) because of injuries and departures of the guys on the chart ahead of him?

I'm not sure who said Keeler is the best coach in the world - I'm pretty sure no one made that claim. On the contrary, you seem to be making the claim that he is a bad coach, prehaps the worst coach in the conference. I'm pretty sure his true ranking is somewhere in between. :nod:

[Stang Fever]

You know nothing about what you are talking about! EWU had little trouble keeping your mustangs from scoring in last seasons meeting and as for this year EWU had sixteen starters out (mostly on defense) by the time they played Cal Poly this year. They were starting four freshman on the D-line against Cal Poly 2 true freshmen and 2 red shirt freshmen and many others who were second and third team by the time they played in SLO. Also, they have had winning seasons for all of Coach Wulff's seven seasons and have done so with by far the smallest budget in the big sky. Maybe before you spout off you should learn some facts!!



you keep missing what i am saying........i was talking about the grade itself......i dont care about injuries.......why cause thats part of the game.....everyone has someone hurt on there team......and for you to bring up 04 season...when we are talking about 05 season just proves it even more that you are not hearing me......EWU was highly ranked....all season...but could never be the great team they were suppose to be.....yes injuries played a part in that......but it still comes down to a coach getting his team in the best possible situations to win.......and i didnt see that from him.......from the begining of the year to the end.......no one ever talked about EWU defense......why cause its not good...simple as that


for someone to give a coach an A....they have to have

an A offense.....B+ defense/special teams........if they were highly ranked to start the season......


but when you are team like Weber state who nobody had picked to win more then 3 games last season....that comes down to coaching.......who deserves a high grade B+/A-........thats called good coaching

[ChickenMan]

UNH will come down to you place next year and Delware will be out coached and out played by UNH. Enough said :hurray: :hurray: :hurray:

After that playoff choke at HOME vs UNI... New Hampshire fans should be a little more restrained in tooting the UNH horn... ;)

[UNH 40]

After that playoff choke at HOME vs UNI... New Hampshire fans should be a little more restrained in tooting the UNH horn... ;)

No restraint here. UD pounded. :hurray: :hurray: :hurray:

[ChickenMan]

No restraint here. UD pounded.

When UD had a championship quality team... KC closed the deal and the Hens pounded their playoff competition in route to a I-AA title... when UNH had a similar opportunity... well we all know what happened... waa waa


:D :p ;)

[GannonFan]

No restraint here. UD pounded. :hurray: :hurray: :hurray:

Man, I never thought it was true, but maybe those UNI fans complaining about these newfound UNH fans were right? Facts all messed up, ranting and raving without much to support what he's saying. Oh well, I'm sure if Delaware ends up beating UNH in Newark this fall this guy will be long gone from posting on the board.

[UNH 40]

Man, I never thought it was true, but maybe those UNI fans complaining about these newfound UNH fans were right? Facts all messed up, ranting and raving without much to support what he's saying. Oh well, I'm sure if Delaware ends up beating UNH in Newark this fall this guy will be long gone from posting on the board.

UNI was a far better team than any of the teams that Delaware played that year. Hell UNH was better that year than any of the teams they faced in the playoff and we were 5-6. I will be at that ball game in Newark and we will see what happens. And one more note UD fans are much more obnoxious fans in College football, that don't know a thing about the game. xazzx

[henfan]

Just for the record, UNH40-

KC Keeler vs. A-10 competition (23-13, .638); vs. all I-AA teams (36-16, .692); vs. Sean McDonnell (1-1, .500)

Sean McDonnell vs. A-10 competition (28-32, .466); vs. all I-AA teams (44-38, .537); vs. KC Keeler (1-1, .500)

Both seem like pretty darn good coaches to me, especially considering Sean's recent success.

Thank heavens there are some really good UNH posters out there who more than counter this kind of nonsense.

[UNH 40]

Just for the record, UNH40-

KC Keeler vs. A-10 competition (23-13, .638); vs. all I-AA teams (36-16, .692); vs. Sean McDonnell (1-1, .500)

Sean McDonnell vs. A-10 competition (28-32, .466); vs. all I-AA teams (44-38, .537); vs. KC Keeler (1-1, .500)

Both seem like pretty darn good coaches to me, especially considering Sean's recent success.

Thank heavens there are some really good UNH posters out there who more than counter this kind of nonsense.

I am not saying Keeler is a bad Coach Just not the best in the conference.

[GannonFan]

UNI was a far better team than any of the teams that Delaware played that year. Hell UNH was better that year than any of the teams they faced in the playoff and we were 5-6. I will be at that ball game in Newark and we will see what happens. And one more note UD fans are much more obnoxious fans in College football, that don't know a thing about the game. xazzx

Now you're just getting silly, if not also confusing with your stunted grammar. UD in 2003 played both UNI and SIU, co-champs of the Gateway, they played a great Wofford team who was the champ of the Southern Conference, before playing an admittedly overmatched Colgate team. There's no way the 2003 UNH team (which finished 5-7 btw that year - although I'm sure you don't remember as apparently the bandwagon you jumped on was somewhere around the middle of 2004) was better than UNI, SIU, and Wofford that year. That kind of a statement kinda underscores why your credibility is just dropping with every post. I'd ask you to post more but it won't affect the credibility any further as that's just about hit rock bottom. :asswhip:

[ChickenMan]

UNI was a far better team than any of the teams that Delaware played that year.

The teams that UD played during their '03 playoff run were a combined... 47-4

as for UNI... a team UD beat... 37-7 in the '03 playoffs... they were 9-2 during the '03 regular season and only 8-3 last year...

Keep digging... your hole is only getting deeper... ;)

[henfan]

Actually, you didn't come right out and call Keeler "bad" but you did say he was "a marginal coach at best." No one claimed he was the best coach in the conference, though the stats prove KC's far better than marginal and, during his short tenure, even more successful than Sean McDonnell. It's hard to argue the numbers.

Now, most people would agree that Sean's a pretty terrific coach. That said, the numbers say Keeler's done a little bit better on the field. Obviously the facts aren't going to change your opinion, which is fine so long as you recognize your opinion is colored more by your dislike for Keeler's personality than his ability to win football games.

[GannonFan]

I am not saying Keeler is a bad Coach Just not the best in the conference.

Yup, as my fellow poster has pointed out, here's what you are saying about Keeler:


Keeler is a marginal coach at best. He won a national championship with pretty much all of Tubby Taymonds players. Now his recruiting classes are starting to come of age and prove that he is a very average coach.

Hardly the way to say that you just don't think he's the best in the conference. :cool: :cool:

[UNH 40]

Now you're just getting silly, if not also confusing with your stunted grammar. UD in 2003 played both UNI and SIU, co-champs of the Gateway, they played a great Wofford team who was the champ of the Southern Conference, before playing an admittedly overmatched Colgate team. There's no way the 2003 UNH team (which finished 5-7 btw that year - although I'm sure you don't remember as apparently the bandwagon you jumped on was somewhere around the middle of 2004) was better than UNI, SIU, and Wofford that year. That kind of a statement kinda underscores why your credibility is just dropping with every post. I'd ask you to post more but it won't affect the credibility any further as that's just about hit rock bottom. :asswhip:

If you remember the UNH vs UD game UNH lost that game on a missed 35 yd field goal with 3 seconds left 20-21, a much closer game than any of the Delaware playoff games. I am not a bandwagon jumper 2004, I was a player for UNH when we came down and ruined your little celebration for winning a national championship. Do you remember me now, because i sure remember your sad faces as i walked of the field all smiles after we beat up on your Blue Hens. :hurray: :hurray: xazzx

[Go...gate]

Didn't realize that about KC's eyes. Makes a hell of a lot of sense, actually, as I know people who wear visors at night baseball games to reduce the glare for the same reason of light sensitivity.

[ChickenMan]

Do you remember me now, because i sure remember your sad faces as i walked of the field all smiles after we beat up on your Blue Hens.

Hopefully you played more competently on the field... than you do on AGS... :D

[UNH 40]

Actually, you didn't come right out and call Keeler "bad" but you did say he was "a marginal coach at best." No one claimed he was the best coach in the conference, though the stats prove KC's far better than marginal and, during his short tenure, even more successful than Sean McDonnell. It's hard to argue the numbers.

Now, most people would agree that Sean's a pretty terrific coach. That said, the numbers say Keeler's done a little bit better on the field. Obviously the facts aren't going to change your opinion, which is fine so long as you recognize your opinion is colored more by your dislike for Keeler's personality than his ability to win football games.

you are right he is better than marginal i got a little carried away. He puts a good team on the field, and they play hard, i just don't think you makes great changes in his offense or defense when they struggle in games. As for the numbers coach Mac, in the past to years is just starting to see the fruits of his recruiting classes, so the # will change.

[UNH 40]

Hopefully you played more competently on the field... than you do on AGS... :D

All- American :)

[HensRock]

I think Sean McDonnell is the best coach in the A-10. I've felt that way for years. Happy now, UNH40?
I really like him as a coach. Maybe he could do a better job at UD if given the same resources at KC's disposal. But to say KC is "marginal at best", is in fact calling him bad, isn't it? I think you're out of line there '40. KC is a darn good recruiter and a very good steward for the program, getting students and surrounding community involved. I'll even agree with you that he's not the best game-day coach, but there's more to coaching than that.


As for UNH's visit to Newark in September, we still haven't forgotten 2004. Last year we exacted revenge on JMU and W&M although we were the underdogs in both contests - just like I knew we would. UD may be outcoached in that game, but outplayed? I seriously doubt it.

[MR. CHICKEN]

I-AA LADS............DUH GRADES DAT AH AWARDED OUR A-10 COACHES.....WERE NOT FOR '05 SEASON.....BUT FO' CAREERS!......THE THREAD...DOESN'T SPECIFY ONE WAY OR DUH OTHERAH!......AH'M STANDIN' BY MY INITIAL GRADIN'....KEELER IS A+....END O' STORY!............:deadhorse...........BRAWK!

[MR. CHICKEN]

If you remember the UNH vs UD game UNH lost that game on a missed 35 yd field goal with 3 seconds left 20-21, a much closer game than any of the Delaware playoff games. I am not a bandwagon jumper 2004, I was a player for UNH when we came down and ruined your little celebration for winning a national championship. Do you remember me now, because i sure remember your sad faces as i walked of the field all smiles after we beat up on your Blue Hens. :hurray: :hurray: xazzx

IFIN' YA'LL REMEMBER....DAT WAS UH NON-CONFERENCE AFFAIR...WE DIDN'T HAVE TA PLAY YA'LL AT ALL............SOME OTHERAH GUTLESS SCHOOLS....WOULDN'T UH PLAYED YA AT ALL .......UD...CHOSE TA TAKE ON UH VERAH GOOD UNH...WE DIDN'T HAVE TA DO IT........AN' YA BARELY BEAT US...AN' OL' SEAN..WAS ON DUH FIELD MO' DAN YOUR TEAM...BEGGIN' FO' EVERAH CALL........EVEN DUH ONES DAT WENT HIS WAY!......xsmoochx.....AWK!

[GannonFan]

Didn't realize that about KC's eyes. Makes a hell of a lot of sense, actually, as I know people who wear visors at night baseball games to reduce the glare for the same reason of light sensitivity.

Most people don't realize that even though there have been many a story about the problem with KC's eyes. Most people, like UNH 40 here, find it easier to assume he's a prick and go from there. But hey, whatever makes them happy I guess.

[umassfan]

UD has their youngest team... maybe ever and goes 6-5... UMass goes one whole game better... at 7-4... UMass was expected win the A10... they don't... UMass was expected to make the playoffs... they don't.

You spin like a Massachusetts Democrat... :p

The year before last UMass had a very young team as well and went 6-5. Enjoy your 7-4 season. :smiley_wi

[Tribe4SF]

UNI was a far better team than any of the teams that Delaware played that year. Hell UNH was better that year than any of the teams they faced in the playoff and we were 5-6. I will be at that ball game in Newark and we will see what happens. And one more note UD fans are much more obnoxious fans in College football, that don't know a thing about the game. xazzx

Looks like you aspire to help UNH challenge for that "most obnoxious" title.

By the way, how'd you fare against the Tribe during your career? :smiley_wi

[catamount man]

Based on each team's EXPECTATIONS FOR 2005 in the SoCon, my voting went like this.

1) Jerry Moore - App.State
2) Bobby Lamb - Furman
3) Kent Briggs - W.Carolina
4) Rodney Allison - Chattanooga
5) Mike Sewak - Georgia Southern
6) Mike Ayers - Wofford
7) Kevin Higgins - The Citadel
8) Paul Hamilton - Elon

GO CATAMOUNTS!!!

[blukeys]

And one more note UD fans are much more obnoxious fans in College football, that don't know a thing about the game. xazzx


I'm not sure what you mean by this.

Are you talking about Delaware fans at the game?? There are those at the stadium who consciously harass the opposition in the hopes of getting them off their game. I have seen this work. I don't agree with the tactics. But usually they are young and overly enthusiastic fans who eventually grow up.

Are you talking about UD fans on this board? If so would you provide some documentation of how some of us have been obnoxious towards UNH and some samples of how we know nothing about the game?

I haven't seen it regarding UNH on this board, If you have would you point it out?

[SoCon Din]

BLamb: A- ...in his credit, won some big, CLOSE games this year. Last year was the loaded team for the Paladins, and to have them one game away from the Biggie was a great year

Moore:A+ ....good family friend, great man, won the Big One. 'nuff said.

Sewak:B+.... still thought he had a good year, beat the Dins, and tough playoff loss. Woulda been an A without the Wofford blemish. Offense was top notch, defense another story.

Briggs: A+.... big win vs. the Dins, and roller coaster from there. With his personal illness, to conquer that and have a decent year...got my respect

Ayers: B-.... down year for the Terriers, who are out-"athleted" at almost every position. Gets alot out of his players, and he's still a heck of a coach

Allison: B+... looks like some recruiting classes are starting to add up. Won some big games, at JSU and some other conference games. Still had old forms, such as their lack of muster in ending blowout to Paladins

Higgans: B? don't know too much, I think a better assessment can come next year

Elon?

[FargoBison]

Great West

Bob Biggs(UC Davis) A-
Craig Bohl(NDSU) A-
Rich Ellerson(Cal Poly) A-
John Stiegelmeier(SDSU) B
Wes Meier(SUU) C

Cal Poly, UC Davis, and NDSU all have great coaches and I don't think I can rate one above the other.

[UNH 40]

I'm not sure what you mean by this.

Are you talking about Delaware fans at the game?? There are those at the stadium who consciously harass the opposition in the hopes of getting them off their game. I have seen this work. I don't agree with the tactics. But usually they are young and overly enthusiastic fans who eventually grow up.

Are you talking about UD fans on this board? If so would you provide some documentation of how some of us have been obnoxious towards UNH and some samples of how we know nothing about the game?

I haven't seen it regarding UNH on this board, If you have would you point it out?

Just fans at the games. You guys are great fans, and know a lot about the game. I was way out of line with my comments at the end of last week. Keeler is a good coach, I just got a little carried away because of the ever growing rivalry between UNH and Delaware. Playing Delaware always got me excited and just talking about you guys got me going. Little competative. Can't wait to attend the game this September at your place, gonna be a good one.

[bluehenbillk]

ever-growing rivalry? We don't even play every year, don't get me wrong, UD fans already have 9/30 circled as a benchmark game to see where we stand versus the team that was the A-10's best in '05, but it's not a big rivalry game.

[UNH 40]

ever-growing rivalry? We don't even play every year, don't get me wrong, UD fans already have 9/30 circled as a benchmark game to see where we stand versus the team that was the A-10's best in '05, but it's not a big rivalry game.

Well I considered it one when i played. I got more excited to play Delaware than anyone, because they were the measuring stick in the league. If you played well against Delaware or beat them you feel better about your chances to make a run at the A-10 title.

[ChickenMan]

New Hampshire may not be Nova when it comes to rivalries... but there's no doubt that UNH is almost always a very tough game for the Hens.

[blukeys]

Well I considered it one when i played. I got more excited to play Delaware than anyone, because they were the measuring stick in the league. If you played well against Delaware or beat them you feel better about your chances to make a run at the A-10 title.


I've always thought UNH games were hard fought tough affairs. I remember seeing Jerry Azumah touch the ball and holding my breath until we put 3 helmets on him. I think there is a lot of mutual respect between the 2 programs and that is why both teams look forward to the game.

For UD the term rivalry game is reserved for Villanova or another local team that UD fans love to hate (Temple comes to mind and we haven't played them since the 80's) This is no knock on UNH, W&M, JMU etc., who everyone looks forward to seeing because they are tough competitive teams.

[UNH 40]

New Hampshire may not be Nova when it comes to rivalries... but there's no doubt that UNH is almost always a very tough game for the Hens.

We usually play our best against UD especially when we play at your place. something about playing in that hostile atmosphere, we always look forward to it.

[UNH_Alum_In_CT]

I know where all of you are coming from. As long as Coach McDonnell is at UNH there are three games that will always be at the top of the list -- UMass, Maine and Dartmouth. Those are the long standing, local rivalries for UNH, each with their own flavor. Much like UD looks at Villanova and hasn't forgotten a couple of old time rivals.

At the same time, of all the A-10 South schools, UD has been an opponent of UNH for the longest time and IMO the one that UNH has the most in common with. It is unfortunate that the scheduling since UD joined the Yankee Conference has had so many gaps with no UNH-UD game. If the number of years in the same all sports conference had been longer along with annual football games, maybe a bonafide rivalry would have blossomed. And if UD ever stepped up to D-I Ice Hockey, then who knows where the rivalry would have gone?

But the UD game will always be a special game for UNH. Starting with the reasons that UNH40 has listed. Add in that Newark is close to so many UNH player's hometowns who get to attend the game (more so than Towson, JMU, Richmond and W&M). And no matter what, beating UD is still viewed as a primo accomplishment. Part of that is while UD was a D-II power, UNH was also in D-II and getting spanked by the Hens whenever they met. Look at the games between UD and UNH, very one-sided pre-1986! UNH had just started to be a competitive D-II program during the mid and late 70's. So for many of us old timers at UNH, there is a certain level of accomplishment that goes with beating UD. The other A-10 South schools were just in different worlds back in those days so the history is just that much longer and richer with UD.

[blukeys]

And no matter what, beating UD is still viewed as a primo accomplishment. Part of that is while UD was a D-II power, UNH was also in D-II and getting spanked by the Hens whenever they met. Look at the games between UD and UNH, very one-sided pre-1986! UNH had just started to be a competitive D-II program during the mid and late 70's.


Not to mention the legendary Coach Jim Root incident after the 1971 Game. ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)

[UNH 40]

Not to mention the legendary Coach Jim Root incident after the 1971 Game. ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)

What happened then?

[Tribe4SF]

Not to mention the legendary Coach Jim Root incident after the 1971 Game. ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)

What was that incident? I'm interested because Jim was at W&M until Laycock took over, and lived out his life in Williamsburg.

[blukeys]

What was that incident? I'm interested because Jim was at W&M until Laycock took over, and lived out his life in Williamsburg.

Delaware's 1971 team was one of the best ever and won the D-2 National Championship. Delaware pounded UNH that year and Root was the coach. Root told the press when he got back to New Hampshire that Delaware should be scheduling Michigan and Ohio State instead of teams like New Hampshire. He went on and said that if UNH scheduled Delaware in the future he would quit as coach. Sports Illustrated did a story about Delaware in '72 and referenced the Root Quote.

When Root took over at W&M Delaware was on the schedule and the irony was noted that Root would be matching up again with Delaware.

[Ivytalk]

The Ivies have several good ones: Murphy of Harvard, Bagnoli of Penn, Estes of Brown and up-and-comer Knowles of Cornell.

[UNH_Alum_In_CT]

Delaware's 1971 team was one of the best ever and won the D-2 National Championship. Delaware pounded UNH that year and Root was the coach. Root told the press when he got back to New Hampshire that Delaware should be scheduling Michigan and Ohio State instead of teams like New Hampshire. He went on and said that if UNH scheduled Delaware in the future he would quit as coach. Sports Illustrated did a story about Delaware in '72 and referenced the Root Quote.

When Root took over at W&M Delaware was on the schedule and the irony was noted that Root would be matching up again with Delaware.

Blu remembers all the details better than I do, but the part about quitting is pretty much what I recall. Thankfully, Bill Bowes had a different outlook!

[henfan]

The A-10/YankCon's all-time leader in wins did pretty well vs. the Hens. Bill Bowes' lifetime record vs. Delaware: 5-6.

Root, OTOH:
Jim Root's lifetime record vs. Delaware: 0-4.

[Ivytalk]

The A-10/YankCon's all-time leader in wins did pretty well vs. the Hens. Bill Bowes' lifetime record vs. Delaware: 5-6.

Root, OTOH:
Jim Root's lifetime record vs. Delaware: 0-4.

Guess you could say that Jim's record "bit the root"! ;)

[Go...gate]

How come Temple and Delaware no longer play? Temple has played Bill & Mary, Villanova and a couple other 1-AA's. You guys are a natural rivalry, and I bet you could get get 35-40,000 at the Linc for that game, which makes it financially attractive.

[bluehenbillk]

2 reasons:

The main one is UD started beating Temple on a regular basis in the 80's, & TU started complaining in the local media that it was a "no-win" game for them that they had everything to lose. So, TU dropped UD & scheduled a few MEAC teams that they knew they'd beat.

The 2nd reason is, one I can't confirm but has been long-rumored that the 2 schools have talked but been unable to agree on a playing site. UD doesn't want to enter into a series with TU that plays all the games in Philly.

[blukeys]

How come Temple and Delaware no longer play? Temple has played Bill & Mary, Villanova and a couple other 1-AA's. You guys are a natural rivalry, and I bet you could get get 35-40,000 at the Linc for that game, which makes it financially attractive.


When the games were at the Old Veterans Stadium the attendance was in the 35,000 + range. It was like a home game for the Hens. Some of the Bus rides up to the Vet were some of the best parties I had been to. :) :) :)

[Ivytalk]

When the games were at the Old Veterans Stadium the attendance was in the 35,000 + range. It was like a home game for the Hens. Some of the Bus rides up to the Vet were some of the best parties I had been to. :) :) :)

Since Temple now draws something like 5000 "fans" to the Linc, I can guarantee you that Delaware fans would vastly outnumber Owl supporters if the series were renewed.

[blukeys]

Since Temple now draws something like 5000 "fans" to the Linc, I can guarantee you that Delaware fans would vastly outnumber Owl supporters if the series were renewed.


We always did outnumber them wherever we played. :nod: :nod: :nod:

[GannonFan]

Since Temple now draws something like 5000 "fans" to the Linc, I can guarantee you that Delaware fans would vastly outnumber Owl supporters if the series were renewed.


I actually went to many of those UD/Temple games at the Vet back in the days (and of course was there when Temple would come to Newark every other year) and I can actually say that I've been to Temple games that didn't include Delaware (there are very few people who can claim that) and really there isn't any Temple game where the opposing fans outnumber the Owl supporters. I've seen Temple play both Oregon St and California, two schools that are about 3,000 some miles away from Philly, and even in those games there were vastly more Beaver and Golden Bear fans than Owl fans.