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Hate the CAA
December 14th, 2008, 03:31 PM
I am curious to Nova fans answers to the following questions:

Your program has a storied tradition at the 1AA level... So many great teams and playoff appearances etc...

Do you think that your program will ever win the National Champ?xconfusedx

The way I see it, you have an edge over so many 1AA teams b/c of your basketball program yet for whatever reason Andy Talley has not brought home a champ let alone a semi-final appearance... No your facilities are probably not on par with say a JMU but neither is Richmonds and they are a small school. And Colgate doesn't even offer scholarships so why has the crown alluded you?

Finally, at some point Talley retires... Who takes over... One of his long-tenured assistants or do you think your AD goes outside? And how long does Talley stay till he retires?

Shellin
December 14th, 2008, 03:37 PM
They would've lost by 50 to Montana this weekend xrolleyesx :D

In all seriousness though, 'Nova has been a good program and no matter how you slice it only 1 team wins the National Championship every season which means a lot of good teams are knocked out of there. They just haven't had the breaks go there way yet.

DFW HOYA
December 14th, 2008, 04:11 PM
The way I see it, you have an edge over so many 1AA teams b/c of your basketball program...

Hasn't exactly been the edge in Washington, either. xeyebrowx

Hate the CAA
December 14th, 2008, 04:17 PM
Hasn't exactly been the edge in Washington, either. xeyebrowx

It would help if you offered scholarships as well.:)

Hoyadestroya85
December 14th, 2008, 04:33 PM
I would actually argue that our big time basketball program gives us a disadvantage.. people overlook our football program and we don't put butts in the seats. We've been to the semi finals in 2002 when we were jobbed by possibly the most questionable officiating ever. Next year is our year.. we return 15 starters and all of our second string.
I think there is a possibility we win the NC and I hope that if we do our students will finally go to the games

DFW HOYA
December 14th, 2008, 04:39 PM
It would help if you offered scholarships as well.:)

Need some 1400+ SAT kids out there that can block!

http://uadmissions.georgetown.edu/applying_firstyear_sdprofile.cfm

WMTribe90
December 14th, 2008, 04:49 PM
Hoyadestroya, WM only looses seven starters and returns both kickers. Richmond, JMU and Villanova will all be in the hunt for a CAA title and if UD gets Delvin from PSU they should be back in business. So, I think the CAA South will have 5 playoff caliber teams. Best case is probably three make the playoffs, maybe four if the stars align perfectly. More than likely two or three very good, playoff caliber, teams won't make it out of the CAA South. Its gonna be brutal, worse than 2008.

dasteelers
December 14th, 2008, 04:51 PM
lets not kid ourself about the scholarships. the hoyas are giving money to there football players just like all the other teams in the patriot . look at there football budgets and they spend more than half of the teams in the villanova conference. they just call them memorial or alumni scholarships and they get considerably more than the average student with the same financial aid forms !!!

Native
December 14th, 2008, 05:11 PM
I would actually argue that our big time basketball program gives us a disadvantage.. people overlook our football program and we don't put butts in the seats. We've been to the semi finals in 2002 when we were jobbed by possibly the most questionable officiating ever. Next year is our year.. we return 15 starters and all of our second string.
I think there is a possibility we win the NC and I hope that if we do our students will finally go to the games

Weber returns half the defense, almost all of the offense, the kicker and punter and most of the second string as well. See you next year in the national championship game, but don't count on winning it quite yet! xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

DuckDuckGriz
December 14th, 2008, 05:13 PM
Nova seems to be the real deal this year and next. Early favorite to make it far next year.

wideright82
December 14th, 2008, 07:36 PM
Who the hell knows xsmhx. Why do you have to rub it in? xbawlingx


xthumbsupx


oh but we made the semis in 2002. Just to be clear, and prior to this year we lost to the winner each time. just need to get out of the way of those guys.

ngineer
December 14th, 2008, 07:39 PM
Great xrolleyesx ...Oh, well, another early 'barometer' on just how good my Mountain Hawks will be. Back to 'nova's stadium on September 12.

wideright82
December 14th, 2008, 07:41 PM
Great xrolleyesx ...Oh, well, another early 'barometer' on just how good my Mountain Hawks will be. Back to 'nova's stadium on September 12.


I've been wondering ngineer. How did we get you guys twice in a row at home (I was looking forward to partying at lehigh after we won this year :p), we have had a nice back and forth going since my sophomore year.

ngineer
December 14th, 2008, 07:49 PM
I've been wondering ngineer. How did we get you guys twice in a row at home (I was looking forward to partying at lehigh after we won this year :p), we have had a nice back and forth going since my sophomore year.

I was surprised, too, when I saw it. Possibly some aberration with VU needing another home game in '09, while Lehigh already will have 7 home games in '09. So far, we've been home twice and VU home twice since the series resumed. I hope we get you guys at home in 2010 (I think it is a six year contract), which would make it 3 apiece.

wideright82
December 14th, 2008, 07:51 PM
I was surprised, too, when I saw it. Possibly some aberration with VU needing another home game in '09, while Lehigh already will have 7 home games in '09. So far, we've been home twice and VU home twice since the series resumed. I hope we get you guys at home in 2010 (I think it is a six year contract), which would make it 3 apiece.



Yeah, that would make sense. Well I guess it'll be another day on the main line.

DFW HOYA
December 14th, 2008, 07:54 PM
lets not kid ourself about the scholarships. the hoyas are giving money to there football players just like all the other teams in the patriot . look at there football budgets and they spend more than half of the teams in the villanova conference. they just call them memorial or alumni scholarships and they get considerably more than the average student with the same financial aid forms !!!

Not so fast, my friend.

Most of the PL teams do spend at or above the CAA average and many include the merit based scholarships (Marquis, Dean's Scholars, etc.). By contrast, Georgetown is not one of these. Its budget is $1.1 million less than the lowest CAA team (Towson) and as a university it does not award any merit aid.

Add the vagaries of the PL's academic index, and schools like Georgetown and Colgate have a higher grade/SAT threshold to deal with than all but, oh, about eight other schools in I-AA. That having been said, I give Colgate tremendous credit to be nationally competitive under these constraints and to sign the top players Georgetown has been (to date) unable to do.

uofmman1122
December 14th, 2008, 07:58 PM
As for the first post, I think it doesn't work that way.

Look at Montana. We used to be a HUGE basketball school back in the day. Then we built a nice little football stadium, and our basketball program has taken a backseat to our football program. Success and fan support in one sport does not always mean the same fan support in other sports. xtwocentsx

Franks Tanks
December 14th, 2008, 08:01 PM
Not so fast, my friend.

Most of the PL teams do spend at or above the CAA and do include the merit based scholarships (Marquis, Dean's Scholars, etc.). By contrast, Georgetown's budget is less than half of the lowest PL budget (Bucknell) and Georgetown as a university does not award any merit aid.

Add the vagaries of the PL's academic index, and schools like Georgetown and Colgate have a higher grade/SAT threshold to deal with than all but, oh, about eight other schools in I-AA. That having been said, I give Colgate tremendous credit to be nationally competitive under these constraints and to sign the top players Georgetown has been (to date) unable to do.

Always blaming the AI. If that were the main reason then why were the Hoya teams of a decade or so ago more competitive vs. Patriot League teams then they are today (agruably). Did you not have strict criteria in the late 90's? Perhaps the problem is lack of proper funding, bad facilities and poor coaching, yet you just want to shift blame to AI instead of placing blame squarely on the Georgetown administration where it belongs.

wideright82
December 14th, 2008, 08:13 PM
Always blaming the AI. If that were the main reason then why were the Hoya teams of a decade or so ago more competitive vs. Patriot League teams then they are today (agruably). Did you not have strict criteria in the late 90's? Perhaps the problem is lack of proper funding, bad facilities and poor coaching, yet you just want to shift blame to AI instead of placing blame squarely on the Georgetown administration where it belongs.


I know they told me I wasn't good enough, academically, for them to get me in the front doors due to football.

DFW HOYA
December 14th, 2008, 08:16 PM
Always blaming the AI. If that were the main reason then why were the Hoya teams of a decade or so ago more competitive vs. Patriot League teams then they are today (agruably). Did you not have strict criteria in the late 90's? Perhaps the problem is lack of proper funding, bad facilities and poor coaching, yet you just want to shift blame to AI instead of placing blame squarely on the Georgetown administration where it belongs.

Ummm...no. The MAAC had no academic banding. If the floor was, for example's sake, an SAT of 1200, than all 30 could get in at 1200, not two or three.

Clearly, the AI is not the sole problem facing the Hoyas, but it simply loses too many kids every year which could make it a reasonably more competitive team--not a championship team per se, but a team which isn't down 21-0 after the first quarter.

For a program that is 1-16 in the league under Kevin Kelly and a combined 0-22 since 2001 against Lehigh, Holy Cross and Colgate, it's a talent issue first, then other issues follow. And to bring this back to Villanova, it's Villanova (and Richmond's) ability to recruit without artificial banding that maintains its success.

Franks Tanks
December 14th, 2008, 08:28 PM
Ummm...no. The MAAC had no academic banding. If the floor was, for example's sake, an SAT of 1200, than all 30 could get in at 1200, not two or three.

Clearly, the AI is not the sole problem facing the Hoyas, but it simply loses too many kids every year which could make it a reasonably more competitive team--not a championship team per se, but a team which isn't down 21-0 after the first quarter.

For a program that is 1-16 in the league under Kevin Kelly and a combined 0-22 since 2001 against Lehigh, Holy Cross and Colgate, it's a talent issue first, then other issues follow.

Perhaps but I doubt Georgetown was bending admission standards to let in MAAC FB players. Also the Ivy teams find talented FB players and manage to attract them to campus, why cant Georgetown do the same?

Hoyadestroya85
December 14th, 2008, 08:54 PM
Perhaps but I doubt Georgetown was bending admission standards to let in MAAC FB players. Also the Ivy teams find talented FB players and manage to attract them to campus, why cant Georgetown do the same?
Because they play in a stadium that would be a middle of the road high school stadium

Reign of Terrier
December 14th, 2008, 09:02 PM
Need some 1400+ SAT kids out there that can block!

http://uadmissions.georgetown.edu/applying_firstyear_sdprofile.cfm

Well Wofford's average SAT is 1350 and we block pretty wellxwhistlex

wideright82
December 14th, 2008, 09:03 PM
Because they play in a stadium that would be a middle of the road high school stadium


was that about us or gtown? xlolx





save everyone else the time

Franks Tanks
December 14th, 2008, 09:20 PM
Because they play in a stadium that would be a middle of the road high school stadium

True, but again that is something that G-town did to themselves and it is up to them to change. It has nothing to do with league affiliation.

Go Lehigh TU owl
December 14th, 2008, 09:34 PM
True, but again that is something that G-town did to themselves and it is up to them to change. It has nothing to do with league affiliation.

Georgetown has no one to blame but themselves when it comes to their poor performance. They simply don't support their program and the AI excuse is very weak.

I can't wait for the Lehigh-'Nova game next year. 'Nova should be loaded but i fully expect Lehigh to give them a great fight for 60 minutes.

foghorn
December 14th, 2008, 09:51 PM
Add the vagaries of the PL's academic index, and schools like Georgetown and Colgate have a higher grade/SAT threshold to deal with than all but, oh, about eight other schools in I-AA
Does Georgtown have different academic requirements for basketball vs. football players? I don't think Patrick Ewing or Allen Iverson were exactly Academic All-Stars. :D

Go Lehigh TU owl
December 14th, 2008, 09:51 PM
Does Georgtown have different academic requirements for basketball vs. football players? I don't think Patrick Ewing or Allen Iverson were exactly Academic All-Stars. :D

Or Victor Page...

ngineer
December 14th, 2008, 11:11 PM
Does Georgtown have different academic requirements for basketball vs. football players? I don't think Patrick Ewing or Allen Iverson were exactly Academic All-Stars. :D

I remember some big poohbah at Georgetown defending the admission of Iverson as an 'allowable aberration' because of the recognized need to have a successful big-time basketball program. It was acknowledged it was purely a 'business decision' because of the money the basketball program generates. A few cases where the heads of those in 'admissions' are turned was viewed as justified.

Hoyadestroya85
December 14th, 2008, 11:25 PM
Or Victor Page...

I've been waiting forever to bring up Victor Page..
you stole my thunder
he looks like a pirate now

Redwyn
December 15th, 2008, 05:34 AM
lets not kid ourself about the scholarships. the hoyas are giving money to there football players just like all the other teams in the patriot . look at there football budgets and they spend more than half of the teams in the villanova conference. they just call them memorial or alumni scholarships and they get considerably more than the average student with the same financial aid forms !!!

Mmmmm, the Ivy League "scholarship" system. Good times!

dasteelers
December 15th, 2008, 05:24 PM
Does Georgtown have different academic requirements for basketball vs. football players? I don't think Patrick Ewing or Allen Iverson were exactly Academic All-Stars. :D

YOU HIT THE NAIL RIGHT ON THE HEAD FOGHORN. LETS NOT FORGET THAT ALL THE OTHER SCHOOLS IN THE CONFERENCE CAN STACK UP ACADEMICALLY AGAINST EACH OTHER !!! IF WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE LAW SCHOOL OR INTERNATIONAL BUSINESS MAJOR THEY ALL GIVE THEM A RUN FOR THERE MONEY. EVEN TINY LITTLE CATHOLIC UNIVERSITY IN DC 3 MI DOWN THE ROAD IS HIGHER RATED IN ARCHITECTURE, ENGINEERING AND NURSING SO SAVE THE BULL**** !!! I CAN RATTLE OFF RECRUITS THAT WERE SUPERSTARS THIS YEAR IN THE PATRIOT THAT THEY NEVER CALLED IN FOR A VISIT. STARTING WITH THE COLGATE RB WHO GREW UP IN DC. ITS LIKE THEY NEVER READ THE PAPER DOWN THERE. THEY HAVE 4 OR 5 CATHOLIC CONFERENCES THAT THEY NEVER PICK ANYBODY OUT OF. SOME OF THESE SCHOOLS ARE OLDER PREP SCHOOL KIDS AND ARE OVER 30K TO GET IN TO. THE REST OF THE PATRIOT ROSTERS ARE FULL OF THESE KIDS. I KNOW. I HAVE BEEN TO SEE ALL THE TEAMS. ALSO HAVE ALL THERE ROSTERS IN THE PROGRAMS .

UNH Fanboi
December 15th, 2008, 06:22 PM
I would actually argue that our big time basketball program gives us a disadvantage.. people overlook our football program and we don't put butts in the seats.

It's a shame. A couple of weeks ago I mentioned to a female co-worker of mine, who is a Villanova alum, that they had a really good team this year, and her response was total indifference. And I know that she doesn't hate football in general.

I guess it's tough to be just a casual FCS fan. There is essentially no media coverage of it unless you actively seek it out.

Hoyadestroya85
December 15th, 2008, 06:46 PM
It's a shame. A couple of weeks ago I mentioned to a female co-worker of mine, who is a Villanova alum, that they had a really good team this year, and her response was total indifference. And I know that she doesn't hate football in general.

I guess it's tough to be just a casual FCS fan. There is essentially no media coverage of it unless you actively seek it out.

Some kids on campus don't know what the team is doing

GannonFan
December 15th, 2008, 09:02 PM
My wife is a nova grad and we didn't meet until 4 years after she had graduated. Only when accompanying me to a Blue Hens game did she become aware that nova actually played football. Such is the fanbase at nova.

With that said, I was on record at the end of last year that Richmond was the team to beat in the CAA this year - granted, it took them until now to prove it, but they were certainly the best team coming into this year based on who they had coming back. This year, although I despise them, there is no denying that nova is the CAA team to beat for 2009. I'm not sold on Whitney as a complete QB as his passing is not impressive and he's not the runner that a Landers was, but he's got a complete team around him and they return almost everyone. Regardless of who wins the championship game this year, I'll be putting nova as my #1 team in next year's pre-season poll.

Hoyadestroya85
December 15th, 2008, 09:46 PM
I think Whitney will develop this spring because he'll get starter snaps for the first time in his career.. I may gift a team (it might even be delaware) the #1 rank just so that I don't feel like a homer but I feel like We'll be one of the Best if not the best team in the country. And put me on record on this: in that situation, with that ankle injury.. Whitney would have come back in the 2nd half.

MplsBison
December 16th, 2008, 08:55 AM
Need some 1400+ SAT kids out there that can block!

http://uadmissions.georgetown.edu/applying_firstyear_sdprofile.cfm


But if they're 6'10" and can dunk, no problem if they have a 700 SAT?


What a joke.

Just another school that hates football and loves bball.

Hoyadestroya85
December 16th, 2008, 09:05 AM
But if they're 6'10" and can dunk, no problem if they have a 700 SAT?


What a joke.

Just another school that hates football and loves bball.
Basketball is easier to make money off of If you aren't in the BCS

wideright82
December 16th, 2008, 10:04 AM
My wife is a nova grad and we didn't meet until 4 years after she had graduated. Only when accompanying me to a Blue Hens game did she become aware that nova actually played football. Such is the fanbase at nova.

With that said, I was on record at the end of last year that Richmond was the team to beat in the CAA this year - granted, it took them until now to prove it, but they were certainly the best team coming into this year based on who they had coming back. This year, although I despise them, there is no denying that nova is the CAA team to beat for 2009. I'm not sold on Whitney as a complete QB as his passing is not impressive and he's not the runner that a Landers was, but he's got a complete team around him and they return almost everyone. Regardless of who wins the championship game this year, I'll be putting nova as my #1 team in next year's pre-season poll.


GF, it actually goes past the point of not recognizing us. There was an article in the paper by some dbag who wanted us (the football team) gone so badly that he needed to publish it in our paper. People at the school, not only don't know about us, but actually do not like us. It is disgraceful, but we are all lumped into a sterotype of being meatheads at a school that worships basketball, because they think they are cool. Cliques are the thing at Nova, and I hope this year, the football team starts to get more recognition. It appears they may.

DFW HOYA
December 16th, 2008, 10:06 AM
But if they're 6'10" and can dunk, no problem if they have a 700 SAT?

What a joke.

Just another school that hates football and loves bball.

Next time, criticize things you know a little more about. And for the good of the Villanova fans who don't want to argue all things Georgetown and PL, we can discuss it in another topic.

MplsBison
December 16th, 2008, 10:13 AM
Basketball is easier to make money off of If you aren't in the BCS

Oh I know it's justifiable as a business decision.


It just pains me to see these "DI" football schools who basically are basketball only schools but for some reason they still want to say that they have a varsity football team, so they have a team and don't fund it.

PFL, some NEC and Georgetown come to mind.


And FCS lets them get away with it.

Hoyadestroya85
December 16th, 2008, 11:03 AM
Oh I know it's justifiable as a business decision.


It just pains me to see these "DI" football schools who basically are basketball only schools but for some reason they still want to say that they have a varsity football team, so they have a team and don't fund it.

PFL, some NEC and Georgetown come to mind.


And FCS lets them get away with it.

That's very true.. we may not have the biggest nicest stadium.. but our home locker room is great, the press box is one of the best in the country and the team is competitive. Villanova will always be a basketball school, but hopefully football won't be as much of a doormat as it is now.

MplsBison
December 16th, 2008, 03:24 PM
That's very true.. we may not have the biggest nicest stadium.. but our home locker room is great, the press box is one of the best in the country and the team is competitive. Villanova will always be a basketball school, but hopefully football won't be as much of a doormat as it is now.


It's no more of a stretch to see Villanova playing football at the Linc in the Big East than it was for UConn to play in the Big East.

But for Georgetown, they won't ever get scholarships for sports other than basketball.

GannonFan
December 16th, 2008, 03:42 PM
It's no more of a stretch to see Villanova playing football at the Linc in the Big East than it was for UConn to play in the Big East.

But for Georgetown, they won't ever get scholarships for sports other than basketball.


Another thread of Mpls not knowing anything about the local issues that completely rebutt his argument. xsmhx

nova would never be able to play at the Linc. The Eagles had to be essentially threatened with legal action to allow a city school, Temple, to play there, and the Eagles still charge them so much money that Temple is drowning in the cost to play there. And that was arranged right as the stadium was being built when the Eagles most needed the city to pony up their part of the bill to build it.

Now, we're a half decade away from that, nova is not even a city school so they won't have the city going to bat for them, and the Eagles are dying to kick even Temple out of their building. Comparing nova to UConn is baseless as the two situations couldn't be any more different.

Hoyadestroya85
December 16th, 2008, 06:47 PM
The Original (temporary) plan was to play in Franklin field until we could convince the NIMBY people around here to let us build a stadium. We'd still have to put butt's in the seats though. That is the sole reason we didn't move up when we did the feasibility study (which actually recommended that we do move up because we'd make back the losses as soon as we got the tv share) it's unfortunate that we didn't foresee the creation of the BCS because i think we would have done it if that had happened.

eaglesrthe1
December 16th, 2008, 06:52 PM
I am curious to Nova fans answers to the following questions:

Your program has a storied tradition at the 1AA level... So many great teams and playoff appearances etc...

Do you think that your program will ever win the National Champ?xconfusedx

The way I see it, you have an edge over so many 1AA teams b/c of your basketball program yet for whatever reason Andy Talley has not brought home a champ let alone a semi-final appearance... No your facilities are probably not on par with say a JMU but neither is Richmonds and they are a small school. And Colgate doesn't even offer scholarships so why has the crown alluded you?

Finally, at some point Talley retires... Who takes over... One of his long-tenured assistants or do you think your AD goes outside? And how long does Talley stay till he retires?

Another wasted thread...(to which I am now participating). Shouldn't this be directed to UNI?

Franks Tanks
December 16th, 2008, 07:02 PM
The Original (temporary) plan was to play in Franklin field until we could convince the NIMBY people around here to let us build a stadium. We'd still have to put butt's in the seats though. That is the sole reason we didn't move up when we did the feasibility study (which actually recommended that we do move up because we'd make back the losses as soon as we got the tv share) it's unfortunate that we didn't foresee the creation of the BCS because i think we would have done it if that had happened.

Where did Nova play in the 60's and 70's when you were D-I. (before you dropped)

Hoyadestroya85
December 16th, 2008, 08:29 PM
On Campus.. that was before there was an attendance requirement

Franks Tanks
December 16th, 2008, 08:34 PM
On Campus.. that was before there was an attendance requirement

In the same stadium? I know you guys played some attractive opponents at that time, I guess many were on the road.

DFW HOYA
December 16th, 2008, 09:02 PM
But for Georgetown, they won't ever get scholarships for sports other than basketball.

Another statement from nowhere in particular--the Big East mandates certain scholarship aid in every sport it sponsors. That includes Georgetown, Villanova and as many as 14 other schools.


The Original (temporary) plan was to play in Franklin field until we could convince the NIMBY people around here to let us build a stadium. We'd still have to put butt's in the seats though. That is the sole reason we didn't move up when we did the feasibility study (which actually recommended that we do move up because we'd make back the losses as soon as we got the tv share) it's unfortunate that we didn't foresee the creation of the BCS because i think we would have done it if that had happened.

The major problem with Franklin Field was that the Big East mandated primary control of stadiums on Saturdays for scheduling purposes, something FF couldn't offer.

MplsBison
December 21st, 2008, 02:47 PM
Another statement from nowhere in particular--the Big East mandates certain scholarship aid in every sport it sponsors. That includes Georgetown, Villanova and as many as 14 other schools.



The major problem with Franklin Field was that the Big East mandated primary control of stadiums on Saturdays for scheduling purposes, something FF couldn't offer.

It just proves the hypocracy of the Georgetown leadership.

For sports that make GU big money, sure they will give scholarships to any moron who can dunk a bball.


But for football? No aid and you have to be a genius on top to even try to get into the school.



It's a joke and school with superior academics like Stanford, Northwestern, Rice, Duke, etc. have shown that you can be a big time academic school with big time scholarship football.

DFW HOYA
December 21st, 2008, 06:59 PM
What part of this equation are you missing?

1. Georgetown and Villanova play (excepting football) in the Big East.

2. The Big East mandates minimum scholarship amounts in all of these 23 sports. Not all have to be fullly funded, but there are minimums and plenty of kids in non-revenue sports receive scholarships from their schools (prob. 75-85% of each school's total are outside of basketball).

3. Georgetown and Villanova must meet these minimum totals before they spend money on football, or rowing, or sailing, or any other non-BE sport.

MplsBison
December 22nd, 2008, 08:46 AM
What part of this equation are you missing?

1. Georgetown and Villanova play (excepting football) in the Big East.

2. The Big East mandates minimum scholarship amounts in all of these 23 sports. Not all have to be fullly funded, but there are minimums and plenty of kids in non-revenue sports receive scholarships from their schools (prob. 75-85% of each school's total are outside of basketball).

3. Georgetown and Villanova must meet these minimum totals before they spend money on football, or rowing, or sailing, or any other non-BE sport.

And Nova also funds 63 scholarships for its football team.


No way Nova has more cash than GU. Nice try.

Anovafan
December 22nd, 2008, 07:50 PM
And Nova also funds 63 scholarships for its football team.


No way Nova has more cash than GU. Nice try.

We only fund 59 scholarships in football to try to save money.

To answer the original poster, I suggest reading Tony Moss's book, A Season In Purgatory, which chronicled a recent Villanova season and the plight of I-AA football at a big time basketball school.

MplsBison
December 23rd, 2008, 09:47 AM
Yeah but Georgetown not only has no scholarships, they provide no aid to football players. This is billed as an ethical decision (we only admit top notch student/athetes! blah blah blah, can't afford it, blah blah blah, Patrick Ewing, blah).

But for basketball? Oh wait wait wait, it's all the Big East's fault. That MAKE us have scholarships in basketball, because as you all know, if it were up to us we wouldn't let in a single athlete that doesn't have a 1600 SAT and 40 hours a week of community service logged.


Crock of @$&

ChickenMan
December 23rd, 2008, 10:01 AM
Yeah but Georgetown not only has no scholarships, they provide no aid to football players. This is billed as an ethical decision (we only admit top notch student/athetes! blah blah blah, can't afford it, blah blah blah, Patrick Ewing, blah).

But for basketball? Oh wait wait wait, it's all the Big East's fault. That MAKE us have scholarships in basketball, because as you all know, if it were up to us we wouldn't let in a single athlete that doesn't have a 1600 SAT and 40 hours a week of community service logged.


Crock of @$&



Hey don't forget this famous Georgetown scholar...

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/t-mac_1_andy/Allen20Iverson-11.jpg


:p

HoyaMetanoia
December 23rd, 2008, 11:11 AM
Yeah but Georgetown not only has no scholarships, they provide no aid to football players. This is billed as an ethical decision (we only admit top notch student/athetes! blah blah blah, can't afford it, blah blah blah, Patrick Ewing, blah).

But for basketball? Oh wait wait wait, it's all the Big East's fault. That MAKE us have scholarships in basketball, because as you all know, if it were up to us we wouldn't let in a single athlete that doesn't have a 1600 SAT and 40 hours a week of community service logged.


Crock of @$&

It's a weird, almost obsessive anger you have towards Georgetown.

MplsBison
December 23rd, 2008, 01:07 PM
It's a weird, almost obsessive anger you have towards Georgetown.

GU by far pisses me off the most with it's bulls&%# attitude towards funding its "DI" college football team.

It has the money and the fan base to support scholarship FCS football at least, but FBS if they wanted it.

And it funds big time college basketball with not even a blink of the eye while giving nothing to its football team.


It's hypocracy to the highest level and it's one of the main reasons that I want DI football to have minimum scholarships: to force a financial commitment out of these types of schools for football or force them to drop the sport (because you know DAMN well they will not give up their DI basketball teams to drop to DII or DIII).

GannonFan
December 23rd, 2008, 01:29 PM
GU by far pisses me off the most with it's bulls&%# attitude towards funding its "DI" college football team.

It has the money and the fan base to support scholarship FCS football at least, but FBS if they wanted it.

And it funds big time college basketball with not even a blink of the eye while giving nothing to its football team.


It's hypocracy to the highest level and it's one of the main reasons that I want DI football to have minimum scholarships: to force a financial commitment out of these types of schools for football or force them to drop the sport (because you know DAMN well they will not give up their DI basketball teams to drop to DII or DIII).

And this is all a problem why again????? xconfusedx xconfusedx xrotatehx

HoyaMetanoia
December 23rd, 2008, 01:47 PM
GU by far pisses me off the most with it's bulls&%# attitude towards funding its "DI" college football team.

It has the money and the fan base to support scholarship FCS football at least, but FBS if they wanted it.

And it funds big time college basketball with not even a blink of the eye while giving nothing to its football team.


It's hypocracy to the highest level and it's one of the main reasons that I want DI football to have minimum scholarships: to force a financial commitment out of these types of schools for football or force them to drop the sport (because you know DAMN well they will not give up their DI basketball teams to drop to DII or DIII).


Georgetown by no means has the fanbase, facilities or the money to support FBS football. Not even close.

MplsBison
December 23rd, 2008, 01:47 PM
There is no way that GU could not do what Nova does.

MplsBison
December 23rd, 2008, 01:47 PM
And this is all a problem why again????? xconfusedx xconfusedx xrotatehx

I don't like it.

wideright82
December 23rd, 2008, 05:31 PM
I don't like it.
xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

DFW HOYA
December 23rd, 2008, 09:39 PM
I guess I would take your posts more seriously if they had any research to them. Within this thread, you've said:


It just pains me to see these "DI" football schools who basically are basketball only schools but for some reason they still want to say that they have a varsity football team, so they have a team and don't fund it.

And yet, Georgetown's budget for football is close to that of Brown or Albany. Are you pained by their commitments, too?

Or this quote:


But for Georgetown, they won't ever get scholarships for sports other than basketball.

Did you know there are scholarships at Georgetown in baseball, in men's and women's cross country, field hockey, men's and women's golf, men's and women's lacrosse, men's and women's soccer, men's and women's indoor and outdoor track, and women's volleyball, with softball grants around the corner. Did you know Georgetown provides twice as much athletic aid for its teams as does NDSU? I guess not.

Or this quote:


But for football? No aid and you have to be a genius on top to even try to get into the school.

Did you know Georgetown offers almost $1 million in aid to football players? Or did you know the Patriot League limits the number of players Georgetown can even recruit based, in part, on SAT scores?

Or this quote:


They make us have scholarships in basketball, because as you all know, if it were up to us we wouldn't let in a single athlete that doesn't have a 1600 SAT and 40 hours a week of community service logged.

Thre aren't a lot of athletes at 1600 nationwide, but Georgetown makes no apologies for being a admissions-competitive school. This fall's early admissions numbers shows an SAT range between 1420-1500 (math and critical reading) and a class rank in the top 3.2% of their high school. The acceptance rate is 18 percent. Does that limit the football pool? Absolutely. But the Pl ties admissions to admits, and that's the environment the coaches must work under.

Or this quote:


It has the money and the fan base to support scholarship FCS football at least, but FBS if they wanted it.

Georgetown's fan base is smaller than you think, along the lines of Villanova or other private schools. With 6,000 students and only 3% of those students from the DC area, a lot of fans are simply in places other than DC (myself included).

Georgetown has the largest budget in I-AA. But that budget goes across 29 sports, more than any I-AA school outside the Ivy League. I suppose if Georgetown wanted to drop, say, 15 sports, and play at the NCAA bare minimum, it could fund a I-A program, stadium issues notwithstanding. But when one in every nine undergraduates are on an intercollegiate team, that's neither wise nor practical.

grayghost06
December 23rd, 2008, 10:17 PM
GU by far pisses me off the most with it's bulls&%# attitude towards funding its "DI" college football team.

It has the money and the fan base to support scholarship FCS football at least, but FBS if they wanted it.

And it funds big time college basketball with not even a blink of the eye while giving nothing to its football team.


It's hypocracy to the highest level and it's one of the main reasons that I want DI football to have minimum scholarships: to force a financial commitment out of these types of schools for football or force them to drop the sport (because you know DAMN well they will not give up their DI basketball teams to drop to DII or DIII).

I agree 100%...You've got minimun scholly requirements for FBS participation and should have similar requirements for FCS. Cloak it any way you want to with academic schollys, grants or whatever like the Ivies do.

HoyaMetanoia
December 23rd, 2008, 11:20 PM
I agree 100%...You've got minimun scholly requirements for FBS participation and should have similar requirements for FCS. Cloak it any way you want to with academic schollys, grants or whatever like the Ivies do.

Georgetown simply doesn't have the money to do that.

And as a response to the laughable suggestion by MplsBison that Georgetown might even have the slightest capability of funding FBS football if it wanted to, even if they had the money (which they don't), Georgetown wouldn't be able to meet the facility requirements of FBS football without millions and millions of dollars being flooded into the athletic department and the elimination of half the academic buildings. There isn't the money or the room for FBS football and there never will be.

HoyaMetanoia
December 23rd, 2008, 11:24 PM
Thre aren't a lot of athletes at 1600 nationwide, but Georgetown makes no apologies for being a admissions-competitive school. This fall's early admissions numbers shows an SAT range between 1420-1500 (math and critical reading) and a class rank in the top 3.2% of their high school. The acceptance rate is 18 percent. Does that limit the football pool? Absolutely. But the Pl ties admissions to admits, and that's the environment the coaches must work under.


While it does limit the football pool, some who aren't familiar with the Patriot League AI system need to understand that it only does so because it raises the bar for each AI level due to the school averages.

However, I would venture a guess to say that not one player on the current Georgetown roster received above a 1500 on their SATs. So for those very unfamiliar with the process, these kids still would very rarely be admitted into school without the aid of football.

wideright82
December 23rd, 2008, 11:28 PM
Nova football? Weird i must have clicked on the wrong thread, this looks like a "Georgetown should be funding scholarships thread." I'll keep looking.

HoyaMetanoia
December 24th, 2008, 03:08 PM
Nova football? Weird i must have clicked on the wrong thread, this looks like a "Georgetown should be funding scholarships thread." I'll keep looking.

It's actually a "Irrational, rambling display of misplaced anger by MplsBison" thread.

NovaWildcat
December 24th, 2008, 04:40 PM
Back to NOVA FOOTBALL...

Next year we SHOULD be one of the top teams...first off (and maybe most importantly), we begin the year with a WINNABLE FBS game. We play Temple at the Linc next year, which is by no means a road game...better than starting the year at WVU or Maryland...we could very easily win this game and give ourselves some breathing room for the rest of the year instead of our usual 0-1 record to start the year.

Our offense next year will be very good. Whitney gets an offseason of prep as the starter. Aaron Ball (running back) will only be a junior...he put up almost 1,000 yards this year. Only issue is finding a new tight end because our starter graduates.

Defense loses All-American Greg Miller and Captain Dave Dalessandro - besides that we return everyone and will have the same old fast Nova defense.

Basketball has positive and negative effects on football recruiting. Positive: basketball makes us a big name school and certainly more recognizable nationally than a lot of our competition. Negative: athletes here will always be second-rate to basketball - and if you don't think opposing coaches tell our recruits that you need to think twice. Most of our competition (JMU, UDel, Richmond), football is boss.

As for the student body...support will be there if the team is good. It was EXTREMELY unfortunate that it was terrible, terrible weather for our biggest home games this year (JMU notably on homecoming and UNH). Despite that, the students came out. Nova is a very spirited school - it's the rest of the "fan base" (whether or not it even exists...) that needs to pick up the slack. Home playoff game being over break is a KILLER.

As for the reputation on campus of the team - they don't have a great rep. That happens when you walk around thinking you're top dog. How about the FOOTBALL vs. BASKETBALL FIGHT in the sophomore quad last year?? (fists threw and police came...) People aren't amused when you walk around like you run the campus...when you don't.

Despite all of that, Villanova Football is very strong, has great recruiting despite it's academic restrictions (similar to Richmond, W&M) and can potentially gather support if it plays its cards right. As for a National Championship, we have as good a shot as any next year.

MplsBison
December 25th, 2008, 01:58 PM
I guess I would take your posts more seriously if they had any research to them. Within this thread, you've said:



And yet, Georgetown's budget for football is close to that of Brown or Albany. Are you pained by their commitments, too?

Or this quote:



Did you know there are scholarships at Georgetown in baseball, in men's and women's cross country, field hockey, men's and women's golf, men's and women's lacrosse, men's and women's soccer, men's and women's indoor and outdoor track, and women's volleyball, with softball grants around the corner. Did you know Georgetown provides twice as much athletic aid for its teams as does NDSU? I guess not.

Or this quote:



Did you know Georgetown offers almost $1 million in aid to football players? Or did you know the Patriot League limits the number of players Georgetown can even recruit based, in part, on SAT scores?

Or this quote:



Thre aren't a lot of athletes at 1600 nationwide, but Georgetown makes no apologies for being a admissions-competitive school. This fall's early admissions numbers shows an SAT range between 1420-1500 (math and critical reading) and a class rank in the top 3.2% of their high school. The acceptance rate is 18 percent. Does that limit the football pool? Absolutely. But the Pl ties admissions to admits, and that's the environment the coaches must work under.

Or this quote:



Georgetown's fan base is smaller than you think, along the lines of Villanova or other private schools. With 6,000 students and only 3% of those students from the DC area, a lot of fans are simply in places other than DC (myself included).

Georgetown has the largest budget in I-AA. But that budget goes across 29 sports, more than any I-AA school outside the Ivy League. I suppose if Georgetown wanted to drop, say, 15 sports, and play at the NCAA bare minimum, it could fund a I-A program, stadium issues notwithstanding. But when one in every nine undergraduates are on an intercollegiate team, that's neither wise nor practical.


The hypocrisy comes from the fact that you recruit only on athletic merit for all Big East sports and you fund those sports so that they have the chance to be competitive, but for football you recruit based on academic ability and do not fund the sport so that it could be competitive.



Wake Forest has ~7000k total enrollment, better academics than GU and has I-A football.

Nice try though.

HoyaMetanoia
December 25th, 2008, 04:05 PM
Wake Forest has ~7000k total enrollment, better academics than GU and has I-A football.

Nice try though.

When will the uninformed statements stop?

US News and World Report Rankings: Georgetown #23 (and Georgetown would be higher if it weren't for the endowment numbers and the peer review bias that hurts Catholic schools in the rankings), Wake Forest #28.

Furthermore, Georgetown is the 16th most preferred college in the US (http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/papers/1287.pdf), while Wake Forest checks in at #50.

Georgetown's acceptance standards are MUCH higher and acceptance rates are MUCH lower than those at Wake Forest (42.4% vs. 18% (http://www.thehoya.com/node/15924)).

MplsBison
December 25th, 2008, 04:24 PM
When will the uninformed statements stop?

US News and World Report Rankings: Georgetown #23 (and Georgetown would be higher if it weren't for the endowment numbers and the peer review bias that hurts Catholic schools in the rankings), Wake Forest #28.

Furthermore, Georgetown is the 16th most preferred college in the US (http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/papers/1287.pdf), while Wake Forest checks in at #50.

Georgetown's acceptance standards are MUCH higher and acceptance rates are MUCH lower than those at Wake Forest (42.4% vs. 18% (http://www.thehoya.com/node/15924)).


23rd vs. 28th. Wow. Huge difference. And they fund 85 scholarships in football where as GU funds zero.



OK, how Rice, where do they rank? Enrollment ~5k. They also have 85 scholarships in football.


The point is simple: GU can maintain high academics while funding football so that it is a competitive sport.