I-AA vs. I-A Now Counts Once Every Year for the I-Aers Bowl Hopes

[*****]

http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=69623

NCAA Board of Directors Rejects 12-game Proposal for I-AA, Adopts I-AA vs. I-A Games Counting Towards I-A Bowl Hopefuls Once Each Year
NCAA News

"...adopt emergency legislation allowing Division I-A teams to count one win each year against a Division I-AA opponent for bowl eligibility beginning with the 2005 season. ..."

More to come...

[igo4uni]

Woo Hoo!!

This is good news. Now, the hapless Iowa State Cyclowns have no excuse for not playing the fabulous UNI Panthers!! :) :) :) :)

peace

igo4uni

[*****]

Woo Hoo!!
This is good news. Now, the hapless Iowa State Cyclowns have no excuse for not playing the fabulous UNI Panthers!!hahahaha Don't forget, it only counts if the I-A wins! :eek:

[Ronbo]

hahahaha Don't forget, it only counts if the I-A wins! :eek:

Which happens 95% of the time. I doubt the 1A's are shaking in their cleats. ;) They look at our games like we look at Div. II and III games.

[*****]

Which happens 95% of the time. I doubt the 1A's are shaking in their cleats. ;) They look at our games like we look at Div. II and III games.UNI has beaten Iowa State Ronbo... that was the point. :nod:

[Ronbo]

What's sad is that half the folks on the Oregon Message board are whining about the Ducks playing a Division II game. :mad: The other half that actually know we're I-AA are whining too as they think it's not much better. Geeze, I hope we play them close like we did 1994. Most of them have forgotten we only lost by a couple points the last time we played.

[igo4uni]

UNI has beaten Iowa State Ronbo... that was the point. :nod:

UNI can usually play with Iowa State. Iowa State has had a few good teams over the years, but as a general rule, Iowa State vs. UNI is a pretty good game.

I come in contact with quite a few Iowa State fans on my sales route. They have always relied on the "games vs. UNI don't count, so that's why we don't play the Panther". Ralph and I, of course, know the real reason: Iowa State doesn't like getting beat by the wonderful UNI Panthers!! :) :) :)

peace

igo4uni

[ISUMatt]

This yr its our turn to shock Iowa State!!!

[*****]

What's sad is that half the folks on the Oregon Message board are whining about the Ducks playing a Division II game. :mad: The other half that actually know we're I-AA are whining too as they think it's not much better. Geeze, I hope we play them close like we did 1994. Most of them have forgotten we only lost by a couple points the last time we played.Well at least now they'll know because it counts towards their bowl bid if they win... D-II doesn't.

[Tribe4SF]

I'm glad they decided not to go to 12 games for I-AA. 15 games will be enough for the Tribe! :smiley_wi

[youwouldno]

A lot of I-A/I-AA matchups are like Citadel vs. FSU. If Furman and GSU were playing Sun Belt teams, and UNI and SIU playing MAC teams, etc., I-As wouldn't win 95% of the time. But even with a 12th game the good I-AA teams will still struggle to get games against middle of the road I-A teams (and of course not crappy I-A teams).

[*****]

hahahaha Don't forget, it only counts if the I-A wins! :eek:
Which happens 95% of the time ...I-AA has won:
2004 11%
2003 16%
2002 12%
2001 14%
2000 31%

BTW, I-AA was 78% winning against non-D-I in 2004

I-AA vs. I-A ('00-'04) (http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=46828)

[Umass74]

What's sad is that half the folks on the Oregon Message board are whining about the Ducks playing a Division II game. The other half that actually know we're I-AA are whining too as they think it's not much better. Geeze, I hope we play them close like we did 1994. Most of them have forgotten we only lost by a couple points the last time we played.

Montana is playing the Ducks this year? I have relatives in oregon that are big Ducks fans. It would be great if I could razz them about a Montana win. Go Grizz!!! ;)

[colgate13]

No 12 games? Shame... I like the extra action. But we get 12 in 2008 anyway I think...

[Delaware Ghostrider II]

So does it count against them if a I-A team loses to a I-AA school? If they count the win then they should consider the loss too. I mean they are the ALL MIGHT I-A....if they lose to a chump school in I-AA then be all means it should count against thier hopes to be in a bowl game. Because of how they feel about I-AA, and pick on them...lol....so if they lose to a lil ole I-AA school then they shouldn't be worthy of a bowl appearance.

[Ronbo]

So does it count against them if a I-A team loses to a I-AA school? If they count the win then they should consider the loss too. I mean they are the ALL MIGHT I-A....if they lose to a chump school in I-AA then be all means it should count against thier hopes to be in a bowl game. Because of how they feel about I-AA, and pick on them...lol....so if they lose to a lil ole I-AA school then they shouldn't be worthy of a bowl appearance.

Just playing a I-AA will hurt them. Their BCS ranking will go down on the strength of schedule.

[arkstfan]

At the start of the year there aren't but about 20 schools that could get in the BCS title game even if everything went perfect and another 25 or 30 that could make one of the other BCS games, and most of those are just in theory.

Realistically there are probably only 20 to 25 schools that should worry about strength of schedule.

Of course I-AA losses count, all losses count in I-A no matter the opponent. The issue is having enough qualifying wins.

[Libertine]

Typical NCAA. They open up the door to a 12-game schedule for I-A supposedly to allow teams to increase home-gate revenue and then slam the door in the faces of the I-AA teams that the I-A's probably would have scheduled.

[Tribe4SF]

So does it count against them if a I-A team loses to a I-AA school? If they count the win then they should consider the loss too. I mean they are the ALL MIGHT I-A....if they lose to a chump school in I-AA then be all means it should count against thier hopes to be in a bowl game. Because of how they feel about I-AA, and pick on them...lol....so if they lose to a lil ole I-AA school then they shouldn't be worthy of a bowl appearance.

I-As who lose to a I-AA are not likely to be bowl eligible because they're not likely to win enough games. Rare exceptions are possible. I believe UD beat a bowl eligible Navy in 2003, did they not? If W&M had held onto lead against UNC last year, that would have been another. Maine and UNH wins last year were evidence of how bad Miss. St. and Rutgers were.

[Wmbgskip]

Libertine-- All three of the I-AA representatives voted against it, which is why I-AA won't get the 12th game. It wasn't the NCAA slamming the door on us, it was our own representatives saying "Our National Champ has to play 15 games already. Enough is enough"

--Skip

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Libertine-- All three of the I-AA representatives voted against it, which is why I-AA won't get the 12th game. It wasn't the NCAA slamming the door on us, it was our own representatives saying "Our National Champ has to play 15 games already. Enough is enough"

--Skip

-- or they could be looking at it as:

- more demand for I-AA matchups
- limit the supply of I-AA regular-season games
- increase in the size of guarantees

This is what I believe to be the case.

[*****]

http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=69623

NCAA Board of Directors Rejects 12-game Proposal for I-AA, Adopts I-AA vs. I-A Games Counting Towards I-A Bowl Hopefuls Once Each Year
NCAA News

"...adopt emergency legislation allowing Division I-A teams to count one win each year against a Division I-AA opponent for bowl eligibility beginning with the 2005 season. ..."

More to come...The NCAA D-I Board of Directors also addressed the enhancement of the I-AA playoffs initiative and the nomenclature change. They gave approving statements and will address them in their August 4, 2005 meeting.

[ngineer]

Isn't there also some kind of regulation that requires the I-AA school to have 63 scholarships or equivalencies in order for the games to count. Lehigh, as of this year only has 53-55, which may be one of the reasons we've had trouble getting a I-A game.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

It's not 63 schollies, but I think you have to average 56.5 or something like that (and I believe it is possible to have half an equivalency). Is it really 53-55? I thought that Lehigh, Colgate, Lafayette and the upper echelon of PL schools had enough to qualify.

[ngineer]

It's not 63 schollies, but I think you have to average 56.5 or something like that (and I believe it is possible to have half an equivalency). Is it really 53-55? I thought that Lehigh, Colgate, Lafayette and the upper echelon of PL schools had enough to qualify.

Haven't seen it documented, but a number of those 'in the know' at the Brown and White game were in agreement that we did not have enough equivalencies to overcome that hurdle that makes I-A schools avoid us, during a discussion about trying to get more frequent I-A games.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Wonder then what it would take to get up to 56.5? Would it require a lot of spending? Since they say we're not there, that would put pressure on the AD to add more scholly-equivalents to get at the "big money" I-A games.

For 2005, it's no big deal since we're not scheduling I-As. The question comes during recruiting season of 2006.

This was precisely what I was worried about with PL schools. This means PL schools will have pressure to hit up against that arbitrary 56.5 limit in order to get the big money games.

[Tribe4SF]

Wonder then what it would take to get up to 56.5? Would it require a lot of spending? Since they say we're not there, that would put pressure on the AD to add more scholly-equivalents to get at the "big money" I-A games.

For 2005, it's no big deal since we're not scheduling I-As. The question comes during recruiting season of 2006.

This was precisely what I was worried about with PL schools. This means PL schools will have pressure to hit up against that arbitrary 56.5 limit in order to get the big money games.

You can always do what Towson did. Pony up and become a real I-AA conference.

[McTailGator]

Just playing a I-AA will hurt them. Their BCS ranking will go down on the strength of schedule.

Not necessarily, The top 16 of I-AA typically has higher computer rankings than the bottom 25 to 30 of I-A.

I actually look for the tradition top 10 I-AA's to become more sought after over many SunBelt and some MAC teams by some BCS schools.

Especially those of us that have better traveling fans than the I-A bottom feeders.

[ngineer]

Wonder then what it would take to get up to 56.5? Would it require a lot of spending? Since they say we're not there, that would put pressure on the AD to add more scholly-equivalents to get at the "big money" I-A games.

For 2005, it's no big deal since we're not scheduling I-As. The question comes during recruiting season of 2006.

This was precisely what I was worried about with PL schools. This means PL schools will have pressure to hit up against that arbitrary 56.5 limit in order to get the big money games.

Guess we just have to dig in and contribute to the Partnership--add to those Asa Packer Society memberships. :D

[bisonguy]

Isn't there also some kind of regulation that requires the I-AA school to have 63 scholarships or equivalencies in order for the games to count. Lehigh, as of this year only has 53-55, which may be one of the reasons we've had trouble getting a I-A game.

It's an average of 60 grants over the three preceeding years for the game to be bowl eligible-

From the handy, dandy, NCAA DI Manual: (Section 30.9)


30.9.2.2 Exception—Division I-AA Opponent. [I-A] Once every four years, a Division I-A institution
may count one victory against a Division I-AA opponent toward the six-win minimum, provided
the Division I-AA opponent has averaged 60 financial aid equivalencies in football during the
three preceding academic years. (Adopted: 10/28/97 effective 8/1/98)

[UAalum72]

It's an average of 60 grants over the three preceeding years for the game to be bowl eligible-

From the handy, dandy, NCAA DI Manual (http://ncaa%20di%20manual/): (Section 30.9)
However, proposal 2005-18 would amend that to: (italics to be deleted, bold to be added)



30.9.2.1 Exception -- Division I-AA Opponent. Once every four years Each year, a Division I-A institution may count one victory against a Division I-AA opponent toward the six-win minimum, provided the Division I-AA opponent has averaged 60 financial aid equivalencies 90 percent of the permissible maximum number of grants-in-aid per year in Division I-AA football during the three preceding academic years over a rolling two-year period.
"30.9.2.1.1 Waiver. The Football Issues Committee may approve a waiver of the 60-equivalency 90 percent requirement to permit a Division I-A institution, once every four years, to count a victory against a Division I-AA opponent in the sport of football toward meeting the six-victory requirement when a unique or catastrophic situation affects the Division I-AA institution's ability to average 60 equivalencies during the three preceding academic years 90 percent of the permissible maximum number of grants-in-aid per year in Division I-AA football over a rolling two-year period."

90% of 63 = 56.5 (actually 56.7)

[bisonguy]

However, proposal 2005-18 would amend that to: (italics to be deleted, bold to be added)



30.9.2.1 Exception -- Division I-AA Opponent. Once every four years Each year, a Division I-A institution may count one victory against a Division I-AA opponent toward the six-win minimum, provided the Division I-AA opponent has averaged 60 financial aid equivalencies 90 percent of the permissible maximum number of grants-in-aid per year in Division I-AA football during the three preceding academic years over a rolling two-year period.
"30.9.2.1.1 Waiver. The Football Issues Committee may approve a waiver of the 60-equivalency 90 percent requirement to permit a Division I-A institution, once every four years, to count a victory against a Division I-AA opponent in the sport of football toward meeting the six-victory requirement when a unique or catastrophic situation affects the Division I-AA institution's ability to average 60 equivalencies during the three preceding academic years 90 percent of the permissible maximum number of grants-in-aid per year in Division I-AA football over a rolling two-year period."

90% of 63 = 56.5 (actually 56.7)



Thanks for that update. I was wondering if there was legislation to change that.

[bonarae]

Good for I-AA. At least we still have the playoffs... I-A's season is way too long.

[blackfordpu]

I wonder how Houston and Texas Tech are looking at the SHSU game now?
It could either be a blessing or a nightmare now.
EAT'EM UP KATS!! kill their bowl hopes. :)

[youwouldno]

I was thinking about the changes a bit, so far as how I-A teams will approach scheduling I-AA opponents. Clearly the rate at which that happens will increase because the 12th game is an opportunity for another home date and, even against a I-AA team, can count towards bowl eligibility.

The incentive structure is still mostly to play the weakest I-AA team possible as to make a victory more likely. However, bigger teams have more money and can offer a bigger payday to a potential I-AA team for visiting. That means the lesser I-A teams might sometimes have to play tough I-AA teams if they want a home game, rather than travelling to a bigger I-A program.

Does anyone know roughly what portion of I-AA teams meet the equivalency requirements? It has to be less than the number of I-A teams, because the mid-major I-AAs certainly don't, and at least a fair number of others don't either.

It will be interesting to see how this winds up playing out. Ideally my Paladins will benefit by having an easier time scheduling I-As, even of the non-top 25 variety.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I was thinking about the changes a bit, so far as how I-A teams will approach scheduling I-AA opponents. Clearly the rate at which that happens will increase because the 12th game is an opportunity for another home date and, even against a I-AA team, can count towards bowl eligibility.

The incentive structure is still mostly to play the weakest I-AA team possible as to make a victory more likely. However, bigger teams have more money and can offer a bigger payday to a potential I-AA team for visiting. That means the lesser I-A teams might sometimes have to play tough I-AA teams if they want a home game, rather than travelling to a bigger I-A program.

Does anyone know roughly what portion of I-AA teams meet the equivalency requirements? It has to be less than the number of I-A teams, because the mid-major I-AAs certainly don't, and at least a fair number of others don't either.

It will be interesting to see how this winds up playing out. Ideally my Paladins will benefit by having an easier time scheduling I-As, even of the non-top 25 variety.

We shall see. The key will be the overall perception of I-AA (or whatever it will be called) in the future compared to the lower and middle echelon "I-A mid-major" school, like Toledo and schools like that. All that's being done now is removing the penalty for playing I-AAs.

In general, though, I would think:

more games + no I-AA penalty = more demand for I-AA games

So I would think the Paldins should have their phone ring more ofter for guarantee games. Furhtermore, theoretically that should also raise the price of the guarantees they would be offered as well, since there's more competition for I-A games versus the Paladins.

As to what proportion of I-AA fits the bill - all the mid-majors do not have the right amount of schollies. The Ivies do not offer equivalencies, so the "ancient 8" are out. After that, with the possible exception of Georgetown (which is getting there), I think all other I-AA schools are eligible. The only ones I'm not sure about are HBCUs (like Grambling St.), but I think they are eligible.

[colgate13]

I'm not sure about other schools, but Colgate should be fine. We're averaging above 56 equivalencies by giving 15-17 a year.

[colgate13]

You can always do what Towson did. Pony up and become a real I-AA conference.

http://www.geocities.co.jp/Hollywood-Screen/3194/kepoint/keg/indy.jpg

Ha Ha, Very Funny Dr. Jones!

:rolleyes: