LEHIGH VS LAFAYETTE, THE 141ST MEETING

[ngineer]

It's only 8 pm on Saturday night, but the planning for next weekend's battle at Goodman is already underway. This will should be a classic. It's been sold out for weeks. Long range forecast seems to indicate a good day for football. No precepitation, chilly but decent.
Lehigh and Lafayette both put on solid shows today. Threatt had his best all-round day rushing for 81 and throwing for 258 in tad over three quarters. Defense continued it's excellent shut down of the run holding Prydatko to 33 yards. half a dozen sacks from the front four,too.
From reports, the Leopards had all pistons running today, too, though reports also say the Crusaders made a lot of mistakes with penalties that stalled out drives.
So, for those that have played against both, what's your take? In my view, Lehigh's offense has too many weapons to be covered and averaging 38 points/game and four straight of 40 or more. The defense against the run has been strong all year, and now the pass rush has picked up the past couple weeks. Both qbs will be similar--dangerous due to ability to run and throw. Lehigh's receiving corps is very deep with 7 or 8 receivers typically on the receiving end during a game, so no one can be doubled up without being exposed elsewhere.
On defense, Lafayette seems to have had the stronger reputation this year, but I don't think Lehigh's is far behind at this point in the season. Special teams could be key. Freshman Jason Leo has been solid punting with excellent placements inside the 20. The remaining question is the placekicking. Musiek has been much better this year--but only from 35 on in. It seems that whenever he attempt anything longer he loses the 'lift' subjecting his kicks to blocks--several which have occured. Lembo went to Leo for long-range against Georgetown and it worked. I expect he would go to Leo for anything beyond 35.
Kickoff and punt returns--Lehigh very dangerous with Gerran Walker and Petrosky. KO coverage has had some lapses this year and LC has an excellent returner, too.
Home field--advantage Lehigh. Leopards may have to undertake an exorcism--a lot of ghosts from years past at Goodman. Plus the bitter taste of last year is in the Mountain Hawks mouth. No one, other than one who as worn brown or maroon, knows what I mean. This date has been circled since last November.
So it's early, but my preliminary juices say Lehigh 34-24 that sends the Mountain Hawks into the playoffs and a home game on November 26. I thingk the game will have a bit of everything: some great offense, great defensive plays, great hitting and a lot of noise.:D

[Tim James]

From a neutral perspective I hope Lehigh wins so the Patriot League can send a strong 9-2 team to the playoffs.

[Pard94]

In my view, Lehigh's offense has too many weapons to be covered and averaging 38 points/game and four straight of 40 or more. The defense against the run has been strong all year, and now the pass rush has picked up the past couple weeks. Both qbs will be similar--dangerous due to ability to run and throw.

This all sounds very familiar. Seems like I've heard similar analysis for the last two years. Except it all seems to go right out the window on game day. I would dare say the disparity between the two teams on paper was much greater the last two years than it is this year. Therefore, I am choosing not to listen to all of the perople who are talikng about the juggernaut that is Lehigh Football. What I can tell you is that I watched LC dismantle Holy Cross yesterday. Now you can chalk it up to HC mistakes and stalled drives (as if the Leopards had nothing to do with those mistakes and stalled drives). And the week before they lost a very close, somewhat controversial game to a very strong Colgate team. Seems to me, Lafayette may just be peaking at the right time. I like our chances very much. If all goes well Lafayette wins 21-17. If that happens I will say the Lafayette Leopards happily reside in the head of Lembo and the Mountain Hawks...oh happy day.

By the way...is it too early to pick the Lafayette Leopards as the prohibitive favorites for next years PL Champ?

[hawkineer]

By the way...is it too early to pick the Lafayette Leopards as the prohibitive favorites for next years PL Champ?
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH, Yes!
Win the LU game, maybe.
Lose the LU game, LU or CU will be the league preseason favorite again!

[hawkineer]

Seems to me, Lafayette may just be peaking at the right time. I like our chances very much.
What would you say about Lehigh's play right now? Perhaps peaking at the right time? :rolleyes:
10/22/2005 at Bucknell (Lewisburg, Pa.) W 42 - 10
10/29/2005 at Colgate (Hamilton, N.Y.) W 50 - 34
11/05/2005 Georgetown (Goodman Stadium) W 46 - 14
11/12/2005 at Fordham (Bronx, N.Y.) W 40 - 3

[ngineer]

I think BOTH teams are peaking at the right time. Lafayette's offense has sputtered all year. Appears llike it got on track this week. One week aberration or the real deal? We'll see Saturday. I agree that if Lafayette can win it will be in a "low" scoring affair--like the score you suggest. I don't see lafayette being able to win a track meet.
As for next year. I see an even stronger Lehigh squad. Although we will lose a bunch of wr's there are some excellent frosh and sophs waiting in the wings who I saw in the spring game. With Threatt back for two more years (plus the backfield is back, too), as well as both TE's and most of the o-line, the juggaurnaut should continue. Defense should be stellar, again, I think almost the entire def. lline returns. Plus alot of players got time due to injuries. The secondary will have a lot returning, though losing Cardwell hurts. Leo doing the punting AND placekicking will be a plus. So the 'same old song' will continue ;)

[Lehigh Lover]

Is Rath eligible next year? I know he left Lehigh and came back, but does he still have an extra year of eligibility?

[RichH]

Yes, he is a junior both academically and for football

[lugo02]

I think BOTH teams are peaking at the right time. Lafayette's offense has sputtered all year. Appears llike it got on track this week. One week aberration or the real deal? We'll see Saturday. I agree that if Lafayette can win it will be in a "low" scoring affair--like the score you suggest. I don't see lafayette being able to win a track meet.
As for next year. I see an even stronger Lehigh squad. Although we will lose a bunch of wr's there are some excellent frosh and sophs waiting in the wings who I saw in the spring game. With Threatt back for two more years (plus the backfield is back, too), as well as both TE's and most of the o-line, the juggaurnaut should continue. Defense should be stellar, again, I think almost the entire def. lline returns. Plus alot of players got time due to injuries. The secondary will have a lot returning, though losing Cardwell hurts. Leo doing the punting AND placekicking will be a plus. So the 'same old song' will continue ;)

I don't think there will be any more Low scoring games for Lehigh until we beat an A-12 team in playoffs. I think Lehigh will put 40 or more points on the board for the 5th consecutive game.

[hawkineer]

Yes, he is a junior both academically and for football
Are you sure? The 2005 media guide shows Rath as a Senior. I thought that he lost a year of eligibilty by transferring out and then back.

[LEHIGH61]

UNFORTUNATELY, he has indicated that he wil not back next year. Someone should talk him into going to graduate school.

[LEHIGH61]

I HATE to make typographical errors!

[ngineer]

Yes, that was my understanding, that Rath could have one more year if he chose. He is listed as a senior. He sat out a year after going through his year of confusion on what he wanted to do. I think it is somewhat similar to Colgate's back a few years back who sat out a year to get his head straightened out, then came back with a vengeance.

[hawkineer]

Yes, that was my understanding, that Rath could have one more year if he chose. He is listed as a senior. He sat out a year after going through his year of confusion on what he wanted to do. I think it is somewhat similar to Colgate's back a few years back who sat out a year to get his head straightened out, then came back with a vengeance.
I think the problem is that he transferred out of Lehigh. I think to East Stroudsburg for a semester because LU didn't offer the major he wanted (criminal justice?). I thought that this cost him a year of eligibility. Jamaal Branch never transferred to another school. Somehow, if he had another year of eligibility, he'd be back.

[colgate13]

By the way...is it too early to pick the Lafayette Leopards as the prohibitive favorites for next years PL Champ?

That's going to be Colgate's honor IMO. ;)

[colgate13]

I think it is somewhat similar to Colgate's back a few years back who sat out a year to get his head straightened out, then came back with a vengeance.

Probably not. He kind of sat out unvoluntarily if you get my drift.

[ngineer]

Will Lehigh bring in extra seats for an overflow crowd? My recollection is that the University does not allow people to sit on the grass horseshoe for this game due to crowd control concerns. Several times in the past extra bleachers were erected on the ends of the grandstands. I recall that in 1989 and '91 when the top two crowds in Goodman history were 18,623 and 19,110 respectively. 16,906 for Bucknell in 2000 was done without extra seats due to the horseshoe. IMO they could easily sell 20,000 tickets to this one, but don't know if they'll try to squeeze more into the venue. Anyone with 'connections' to the U have any inkling on this?

[Lafalumni29]

This all sounds very familiar. Seems like I've heard similar analysis for the last two years. Except it all seems to go right out the window on game day. I would dare say the disparity between the two teams on paper was much greater the last two years than it is this year. Therefore, I am choosing not to listen to all of the perople who are talikng about the juggernaut that is Lehigh Football. What I can tell you is that I watched LC dismantle Holy Cross yesterday. Now you can chalk it up to HC mistakes and stalled drives (as if the Leopards had nothing to do with those mistakes and stalled drives). And the week before they lost a very close, somewhat controversial game to a very strong Colgate team. Seems to me, Lafayette may just be peaking at the right time. I like our chances very much. If all goes well Lafayette wins 21-17. If that happens I will say the Lafayette Leopards happily reside in the head of Lembo and the Mountain Hawks...oh happy day.

By the way...is it too early to pick the Lafayette Leopards as the prohibitive favorites for next years PL Champ?
Don't you love it 94? The "mightier than thou" attitude ceases to amaze me. This contest ought to be interesting though. Lehigh does have some fire power so it will great to see who wins the battle: their offense or clearly the best defense in the league. If we can muster another 200+ rushing day ala HC, we can chalk another up for the Leopards.

[Pards Rule]

Waiting for Saturday! I saw write-ups on Sedale and I couldn't believe it! I remember his Dad playing for the Sixers in the early 80s...Dave Zinkoff (remember him, died Xmas Day 20 years ago, 1985) LOVED to say "Threatttttttttttttttttt" - especially if he did a 3 pointer so he could add " for threeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee"

[Pard94]

Don't you love it 94? The "mightier than thou" attitude ceases to amaze me. This contest ought to be interesting though. Lehigh does have some fire power so it will great to see who wins the battle: their offense or clearly the best defense in the league. If we can muster another 200+ rushing day ala HC, we can chalk another up for the Leopards.


That's fine. Seems to me, once again, conditions are perfect. Nobody gives Lafayette any credit at all. 14, 21, 17 point margin of victory for the Mountain Hawks...great...keep the predictions coming. Come to think of it, isn't it about time for Lembo or one of his merry men to make their annual idiotic remark about how UD is the real Lehigh rival (or some such nonsense). Not that we need it but it would be nice to have some bulletin board material before The Game. When Lafayette beats Lehigh for the third straight year, will Pete's job be in jeopardy?

[Lehigh Lover]

Lehigh beat Lafayette in 2003. This would be the second in a row if they won (which they won't), not the third.

[ngineer]

What will the difference for either a Lehigh or Lafayette win? I'm talking about picking only one aspect of a football game that will be a turning point. IMO a Lehigh win hinges most on Threatt protecting the ball through good decisions. A Lafayette win hinges most on Maurer getting 300 yards (~100 yards rush/200 pass). I know many think Hurt is the key to the Pards, but Lehigh has shut down or controlled each big back they faced this year. Stopping Maurer is the key to me.
Both teams have had shakey special teams this year, so they may balance out.

[LUHawker]

I've seen Lehigh several times this year in person and on TV and Lafayette several times on TV and Lehigh looks to be the stronger team this year. The LC folks on the boards seem to take offense to any prediction of an LU win, simply because Lafayette won LAST year. LC is good this year, but Lehigh is more determined this year. I also think Lembo finally understands the importance of this game and will be playing to win, much like Tavani did last year, although without the gimmicky black jerseys. LC played their first solid offensive game last week, so they appear to be peaking at the right time; Lehigh is as well, however. Lafayette's resurgence the last couple of years has made the rivalry exciting again as evidenced by the sell-out crowd. Go Lehigh!

[colgate13]

I will say this (and not to try and jinx Lehigh like my previoius post):

This WHOLE scenario sounds an awful lot like last year: Lehigh's clearly the better team, Lafayette really doesn't have much shot except because of the rivalry and Lehigh is 'determined' or Lembo 'understands the importance of this game', etc. I joined in the LC put down last year based on watching both teams in person. Boy, was I wrong last year. So I won't do that again. IMO LC has just as much chance to win this game as LU. Slight nod to LU for homefield advantage and the winning streak there. BUT, streaks were made to be broken... Good luck to both teams!

[Lafalumni29]

I will say this (and not to try and jinx Lehigh like my previoius post):

This WHOLE scenario sounds an awful lot like last year: Lehigh's clearly the better team, Lafayette really doesn't have much shot except because of the rivalry and Lehigh is 'determined' or Lembo 'understands the importance of this game', etc. I joined in the LC put down last year based on watching both teams in person. Boy, was I wrong last year. So I won't do that again. IMO LC has just as much chance to win this game as LU. Slight nod to LU for homefield advantage and the winning streak there. BUT, streaks were made to be broken... Good luck to both teams!
I'm with you 13. All very familiar sounding. We were thinking at the beginning of the season that we would have this big bullseye on our back, but I'll take the underdog position everyone thinks we're in. The offensive "juggernaut" that is averaging 38 ppg this year was averaging 32 ppg in 2004 until they met up with the SAME defensive team they will meet on Saturday. Love it.

[ngineer]

I'm with you 13. All very familiar sounding. We were thinking at the beginning of the season that we would have this big bullseye on our back, but I'll take the underdog position everyone thinks we're in. The offensive "juggernaut" that is averaging 38 ppg this year was averaging 32 ppg in 2004 until they met up with the SAME defensive team they will meet on Saturday. Love it.

The equation is 'slightly' changed this year with a vastly improved receiving corps and a 'run 'n gun' QB...If LC shuts us down, then they certainly deserve move on--though, Pards' season will be 'on the Rocks' with the Hoyas. For Lehigh, the 'out of town scores' won't matter. Lafayette's faithful, and I dare say, the players, could be effected by repeated scores of Colgate finishing off the Hoyas.

[LUHawker]

I'm with you 13. All very familiar sounding. We were thinking at the beginning of the season that we would have this big bullseye on our back, but I'll take the underdog position everyone thinks we're in. The offensive "juggernaut" that is averaging 38 ppg this year was averaging 32 ppg in 2004 until they met up with the SAME defensive team they will meet on Saturday. Love it.

So, let me get this straight. Just because the situation was similar last year and the outcome was not as predicted, that means we should abandon the thought process entirely? Lafayette hasn't done anything this year to prove that it is the contender they were last year, and please, don't cite the Richmond game as an example. LC lost to Harvard, Princeton and Colgate and showed poorly against G'town, Marist and Bucknell. The Holy Cross game was LC's best of the year. This doesn't mean that LU/LC won't be competitive or that LC can't win, but just because LC won last year and the scenario is similar this year, that the outcome should be the same.

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

The problem last year was Lembo tried to beat Lafayette at it's own game and it failed misserably. How many pass attempts did Lehigh have in the first half last year? Wasn't it 2 or 3?!?! That's not Lehigh football. He never gave his players a chance to win the game. Lafayette beat the crap outta Lehigh last year in the second half i'll give them that. However, even the 'Pard fans last year had to wonder what the heck Lehigh was doing. Lehigh also wasn't playing as well offensively heading into the game and was inonsistent all year. They struggled mightly the week before against Fordham, against Colgate, 'Nova, Stony Brook, even the first half against Yale. Tavani has played to win the last 2 times in Easton but hasnt had much success in Bethlehem. If both teams bring their A+ game and both coaches play to win Lehigh should win because i think they have the better team plus homefield advantage.

[LEHIGH61]

2003 - LEHIGH 30 Lafayette 10 AT GOODMAN!!!! Where were you?

[ngineer]

Matt Dougherty at TSN has issued his analysis of this week's games and picks Lehigh 27 Lafayette 13. Lehigh is on a consistent offensive roll now and has had four weeks to get comfortable with Threatt at the controls.
Yes, Lehigh came out and ran the ball last year at Lafayette--and actually move it well. The turnovers, if anything, was the difference. Rath's fumble at the goal line was huge.
Lehigh is much better this year with so many weapons. Last year, defenses focused on Bergen and the wr's were not up to the task. This year is totally different. All four wide outs and both TE's have been involved--and don't forget the rb's catching and running. Key--the O-line has performed better than expectations and Threatt has had plenty of time to find the open man and holes have opened, too.
If both teams play the way they have played in the previous ten games, Lehigh wins by two scores. I think a little more scoring, though, with Lehigh winning 34-20.

[colgate13]

Sounds like a familiar write up. Kind of like this one (edited for length):


In college’s most-played rivalry, the Mountain Hawks and the Leopards meet...the Brown and White defense should be able to shut down the Leopards’ attack. ...The quarterback has proven very capable this year, and I think he’ll be the difference in the game. ...Lehigh has the best winning percentage in I-AA in the past six seasons, so the coaching staff and the players know something about how to win games.... If Lehigh wins, the Mountain Hawks are in and Lafayette is out. If the Leopards win, Lehigh adds its name to a crowded at-large pool fighting for precious few spots. Lehigh is the more complete team, and has the defense to shut down the Leopards. Lehigh will win... Prediction: Lehigh 27, Lafayette 17

Here's hoping for deja vu all over again. :nod:

["Ho" Dweller]

Good discussion....Colgate 13's rooting interests are starting to show through ;) Can't blame you.

I think the difference this year will be the difference from last year, only reversed. I don't think there was one player who felt worse after that loss last year than #2 Eric Rath. The turnovers did Lehigh in last year. I am pretty sure that this is going to be Eric's last shot at Lafayette and I think you are going to see an effort on the level of his performance at Colgate.

If the coaching staff keeps the same formula with Threatt, he will be fine. They haven't asked him to go out and throw 40 times and win the game. They have mixed in alot QB draws, roll outs and misdirection from the running game. The key to this game for Lehigh will be to get out in front early and let Threatt settle into a rythm. The last thing Lehigh can afford is to fall behind early and ask him to use his arm to get them back into the game. I just don't think he is ready for that yet.

That being said, I see this one going to the good guys this year and the score is going to be about 35 - 14. I will also take Eric Rath as the game's MVP.

I agree with most of the posts on this thread that if Lehigh loses the turnover battle again, Lafayette will win this game. If Lehigh wins the turnover battle, Lehigh wins this game. :nod:

[BigPapi]

Lafayette wins outright. Lehigh will choke on their own vomit as this becomes increasingly a tighter and tougher game as time goes on instead of the burial some think it will be.

[ngineer]

Lafayette wins outright. Lehigh will choke on their own vomit as this becomes increasingly a tighter and tougher game as time goes on instead of the burial some think it will be.

:confused: I must say this is one of the classiest posts I've seen in a long time :rolleyes:

[Go Lehigh TU owl]

As i get ready to head from Philly up to Goodman all i can say is i hope Lehigh wants the game more then Lafayette this year. If they match the 'Pards intensity for 60 minutes of football they'll live to play another day. Lehigh 31 Spotted Rugs 17, Go Lehigh!!!

[ngineer]

Off to Goodman in about an hour--gotta go get suited up. After reading all the hype in the local press it's really going to come down to execution for both teams. My pick remains the same. If both teams play like they have the second half of the season, Lehigh wins 34-20. The ultimate battle will probably be in the trenches on both protection for the qbs and stopping or allowing either team a running game. I think Lehigh's O and D lines have the edge. I give the edge to LC at linebacker and a slight edge to LU in secondary. Backfield edge goes to LU--though very slight. LU has a few more weapons to preventing the LC defense from keying on any one receiver or back. The big unknown will be how Threatt handles his first BIG game--although every game he has played was big in its own way due to LU not being able to afford any missteps down the stretch.
Here's to a spirited well-played battle. I really hope both teams bring their "A" games and everything gets left out on the turf. Everybody up for 141st!!! :D