View Full Version : DSU Stadium
04-18-2005, 02:13 PM
Proposed being the key word. That's at the end of Phase III which is decades away (Phase I may be 5-10 years away).
That's why it was done by "Creative Animation"... very creative!
04-18-2005, 02:36 PM
89Hen, I'm not at all familiar with the extended timeline you presented of various phases of the proposed DSU stadium/Dover civic center project. According to the study conducted by CH Johnson Consulting, the entire project is to be completed by Aug. 2009, just over 5 years away. (see http://www.newszap.com/articles/2004/06/22/dm/central_delaware/dsn02.txt
While 5 years may be incredibly ambitious for such a large project, I've not seen the completion date mentioned anywhere in terms of decades. It just may be that I'm not up to speed with the latest news. What's the source of your timeline?
04-18-2005, 02:49 PM
I don't think he meant that it would take longer, just that it may not come to pass at all - in the article you link to it even says that state funding is crucial and currently there is plenty of skepticism in Dover that would stand in the way of that funding.
04-18-2005, 02:55 PM
Just wanted to move this since that thread should really just be pictures (my fault for commenting there). :o
henfan, I was going off all the news clips that transpired over a year ago. They outlined three phases for the stadium I believe it was...
Phase I - Home lower deck plus the new facilities in end zone
Phase II - Visiting side (single deck)
Phase III - Upper Deck and luxury boxes on home side
They didn't have a timeframe, but judging from the fact that they thought it would be years for Phase I, I couldn only assume that Phase III would be a long time off. This is just from my fading memory so I could have it completely wrong.
With UD sitting on a 50+ year old stadium that they're filling, I can't imagine state officials OK'ing the stadium from that diagram in your post. I'd have to guess that DSU will end up looking at a 7,000 seat, mostly home side, single deck similar to Elon or Coastal. Imagine the outcry if DSU had a new huge state of the art stadium and UD didn't. If DSU were playing in a 10,000 seater, selling it out and competing for MEAC titles, I'd have no problem with it. This is not 'Field of Dreams' here. Are they hoping if you build it, they will come? Sure sounds like it from the article.
04-18-2005, 03:11 PM
Yup, Gannonfan, the word 'proposed' does indeed imply a degree of uncertainy, just not the decades referred to in the previous post. Wanted to clarify that for those not familiar with the DSU deal.
04-18-2005, 03:52 PM
henfan, I was going off all the news clips that transpired over a year ago.
Thanks for the clarification, but that's old news. Since the time of that presentation, DSU has partnered with the Dover Civic Center Corp in a joint effort to get both a football stadium for DSU and a civic center for the City of Dover. DSU has already scaled back plans for its football stadium from 30K to 14.5K. As I understand it, the new facility would be expandable.
Imagine the outcry if DSU had a new huge state of the art stadium and UD didn't.
Over the years, UD has gotten almost everything its ever wanted and more from the State, including a $12M grant to build its $20K basketball arena in the early '90's. Doubt there'd be anything resembling an outcry from UD if DSU is successful in its bid, but it could spurn UD to finally get off of their collective behinds and do something to improve its facilities. Let's hope.
If the DSU project ultimately is rejected, it could put UD in a precarious situation the next time they go to seek public funding for improvements to their athletic facilities. Don't imagine lawmakers in Dover and Wilmington are going to be head over heals about that sort of preferential treatment.
Regarding the size of the stadium, 7K is just too small. There is a certain amount of "build it and they will come" assumed, as well as an expectation that the DSU programs will improve as the school continues to invest more in athletics. Sessoms seems committed to doing just that. The other side of the coin is that DSU, unlike UD, will be committed to allowing the State to conduct its HS championships at their facility.
14.5K may not be necessary right now, but 7K clearly won't cut it and isn't even in the cards. In addition, we don't know how much DSU and the State would save by cutting the capacity back by 4K-5K. Speculation's pointless.
04-18-2005, 04:02 PM
True, once you start building, several thousand more seats isn't where the big costs are. Like a house where your biggest expenses are the kitchen and bathrooms, I'd have to believe a stadiums biggest expenses are the luxury boxes, team facilities and infrastructure. Still, 14,500 is perhaps a bit aggressive when it comes to seating. If they're talking about expandable stadiums, then start with 7-10 and expand from there. Supply (or lack there of) begets demand in many cases IMO. If you build 14,500 and TRIPLE DSU's attendance, you're still talking about 55% capacity. Let's be real.
04-18-2005, 04:24 PM
Still, 14,500 is perhaps a bit aggressive when it comes to seating. If they're talking about expandable stadiums, then start with 7-10 and expand from there.
Don't disagree with 14.5K being high for where DSU is right now. 7K's too low and 10K wouldn't be bad, but that's not the proposal. If it comes down to scaling back, we may learn the actual cost differential between 14.5K and 10K. It would be interesting to read what the CH Johnson study has to say about proposed capacity. Should have access to that through the FOI Act. I just don't have the time to chase it down.
04-18-2005, 05:09 PM
Op-ed piece on CH Johnson (http://www.pioneerinstitute.org/research/opeds/greed.cfm)
"authored by C.H. Johnson Consulting, Inc. of Chicago... Unfortunately, if this report were a book, you’d find it in the "New Fiction" section of your local bookstore."
04-19-2005, 09:12 AM
89Hen, would you expect an arch-conservative group like the Pioneer Institute to have a different opinion of a publicly-funded project? I appreciate the link, though it isn't even slightly relevant to the DSU/Civic Center proposal or CH Johnson study.
04-19-2005, 11:36 AM
I noted that it was op-ed. :D
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