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SU DOG
June 9th, 2015, 11:02 AM
Informative article by SoCon John. UTC seems to be loaded with FBS xfer talent.

https://medium.com/@SoConJohn22/socon-football-2015-chattanooga-embraces-high-profile-transfers-44d4e71b34ef

PaladinFan
June 9th, 2015, 01:25 PM
This again is the time when I note that I can count on one hand the number of transfers to SoCon teams that have truly elevated their programs.

Many transfers were buried on a depth chart for one reason or another.

Catsfan90
June 10th, 2015, 05:04 PM
This again is the time when I note that I can count on one hand the number of transfers to SoCon teams that have truly elevated their programs.

Many transfers were buried on a depth chart for one reason or another.
I'm not always entirely sold on transfers. Of course there are plenty who make huge impacts, but its also important to look at why people are transferring in the first place.

KPSUL
June 10th, 2015, 08:39 PM
With 80% of their 2014 starters returning, and quality 2014 playoff experience, the MOCs look like one of the serious contenders to make it to the FCS finals this season. I suspect they are looking at these FBS transfers to provide more depth to their line-up and not replace experienced veteran players.

chattownmocs
June 10th, 2015, 09:03 PM
With 80% of their 2014 starters returning, and quality 2014 playoff experience, the MOCs look like one of the serious contenders to make it to the FCS finals this season. I suspect they are looking at these FBS transfers to provide more depth to their line-up and not replace experienced veteran players.

And of course you see the obvious which these socon boys cannot. 3 of these players didn't make it into the rotation at major programs and 2 are from UABs defunct now revived program. None are here to be program elevators or program saviors. We don't need them to be. They are here to provide depth and/or possibly compete for starting spots.

PaladinFan
June 11th, 2015, 06:44 AM
With 80% of their 2014 starters returning, and quality 2014 playoff experience, the MOCs look like one of the serious contenders to make it to the FCS finals this season. I suspect they are looking at these FBS transfers to provide more depth to their line-up and not replace experienced veteran players.

They will be contenders. They will face a top 10 JSU team they have struggled to beat in week 1. I also think they will face a much tougher SoCon schedule this season.

FUBeAR
June 11th, 2015, 07:14 PM
And of course you see the obvious which these socon boys cannot. 3 of these players didn't make it into the rotation at major programs and 2 are from UABs defunct now revived program. None are here to be program elevators or program saviors. We don't need them to be. They are here to provide depth and/or possibly compete for starting spots.

Every now and again Chatttown comes out with a well-thought-out, completely sane post. This is one of those.

Another positive comment on the UTC transfers, I don't think any of them had any publicly known behavior or academic issues at their prior schools. Correct?

On transfers in general, obviously some of them can be game-changers and some can be solid contributors....but I've always wondered, is there a number that can be too many? I think GaSt could be an example of a program that took/takes so many transfers that they have really hurt themselves regardless of those players' abilities. They don't build any program continuity or tradition. The constant influx of 'new guys' is extremely demoralizing to the players who have worked their way up from the scout team to a spot on the depth chart or to be a starter and then the Coach gets a 'shiny new toy' who HAS to get some reps...so he can learn the schemes and they can see what he can do...thus, taking practice (and game) reps from the long-term guys. And, maybe promises were made to get them to come there.

Anyway, I wonder if Samford and Chatt have maybe now gotten close to that 'too many' number that I think may exist - others, SHSU folks maybe, may disagree with the whole premise that there is a 'too many' number and I could be completely wrong/off-base (would not be the 1st time and won't be the last).

But if it does exist and the Mocs and SammyDogs are getting close, how it might affect their programs over the longer term. I honestly don't think they have reached that point yet...but they might be getting close. The UAB situation was an anomaly, so that may have a bit of a different (decreased) internal impact than 'normal' transfers. I have to admit I was a bit worried that Mercer was going to go VERY HEAVY on transfers as a start-up ala GaSt and UNCC, but they have not. They have brought in about 12-15 or so over the 4 years, but most of theirs (not all) are AF guys, who were from GA originally, or kickers....so that's a little different...and most of those were AF Prep guys and have 4 or 5 years of eligibility, so not really any of the issues that I mentioned above with those guys.

And...I'm not intending this as a 'knock' on Sammy or Chatt (or SHSU)...just thinking some folks might have some interesting thoughts on the topic and would like to see what those thoughts are.

kperk014
June 11th, 2015, 08:23 PM
Remember these guys for the University of North Alabama?

Defensive end Brandon Fanney came into his own as a junior and flourished as the Crimson Tide's starting jack linebacker ... enters the 2009 campaign as one of six returning starters in the defensive front seven ... an athletic linebacker that is a dangerous pass rusher, can stop the run and even dropped into pass coverage ... the senior has played in 25 games over three seasons at the Capstone with 73 total tackles, nine tackles for loss and six quarterback hurries ... won the team's Up-Front Award, which goes to the outstanding lineman from both sides of the ball following the 2008 season. Rod Woodson- brings a physical style of play in the secondary to Tuscaloosa ... a SuperPrep All-American that is listed as the magazine's No. 21 defensive back nationally and the No. 2 player out of the state of Mississippi ... a four-star recruit ... a Rival250 player and ranked as the No. 8 safety nationally and the No. 4 player in Mississippi by Rivals.com ... also rated as the hardest-hitting safety in the country by Rivals.com ... Scout.com lists Woodson as the nation's No. 14 safety ... ESPNU rates him as the No. 34 outside linebacker ... listed as the nation's No. 69 overall player in Tom Lemming's Prep Football Report.
Donald Bowens-3 star receiver was one of the leading receivers for NC State for three years.

Quinton Andrews, the Opa Locka, Fla., resident signed with West Virginia University instead of such in-state schools like Florida, Miami or Florida State. Andrews, a rock-solid 5-foot-11-inch, 205-pound freshman safety, is giving those close to the Mountaineer program cause to rejoice.
Andrews was easily the most impressive newcomer last spring, his bone-crushing hits reverberating throughout Milan Puskar Stadium. People are still talking about a one-on-one encounter with Owen Schmitt when Andrews actually got the better of the burly 250-pound fullback.
Harrison Beck, rated as the third-best pro-style QB recruit (http://collegefootball.rivals.com/viewrank.asp?ra_key=869)in the nation (behind Mark Sanchez and Jonathan Crompton; 12 spots ahead of Colt McCoy), he chose Nebraska over offers from Florida, Florida State, Miami, Michigan, Ole Miss and North Carolina State, among others.
Mico McSwain, named honorable mention Freshman All-American by The Sporting News. Played in nine games for the Rebels in 2005 before missing the last two with injuries. He led the team in rushing yards and set an Ole Miss freshman rushing record with 124 carries for 612 yards. Averaged 4.9 yards per carry, scored three touchdowns, who set a freshman rushing record at Ole Miss in 2005. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiprLbbbi0Q
Mammoth Calvin Wilson 6-6 353, ran 40 in 5.1. Picked as a preseason first-team pick on the offensive line by Phil Steele's Magazine ... 2007 (r-So.): Played in all 13 games for Southern Miss ... Started the last nine games ... Participated in 643 snaps ... Recorded 10 pancakes and 46 knockdowns ...

Courtney Harris-4 star defensive end at Miami. Played 20 games as part time starter his freshman and sophomore years before being injured.
Steven Wesley 3 star starting defensive end on the other side for the Canes as a soph. Also played 9 games as a freshman.
TJ Porter 3 star receiver from Miami transferred from the real Pittsburgh. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epiweeRKSNo
The All American Chef, 3 star massive Kyle Thornton played two years with Texas including a trip to the Rose Bow. http://www.ncaa.com/news/football/ar...-american-chef (http://www.ncaa.com/news/football/article/2011-10-14/all-american-chef)

Janoris Jenkins 4 star DB. 40 games at Florida. 121 tackles, 8 ints.
Bryan Thomas-4 star DB. At 6-2, and 192 pounds, Thomas is a hard hitting electrifying safety prospect who can dazzle with the hit or with the ball in his hand. His play on the field made him a top priority for urban Meyer and the Gators, and they were able to land his oral commitment in late November.
Marcus Dowtin 4 star LB from Georgia. Dowtin played in 35 games during his career, starting six and totaling 131 tackles and 3.5 sacks. His 57 tackles in 2010 tied Justin Houston for third-best on team.
Nick Williams 4 star of Bainbridge, Georgia (Bainbridge High School) has committed to the Georgia Bulldogs. Williams is rated as the 13th best safety by Rivals.com.
Williams (6-3, 206, 4.5) committed to the Dawgs over offers from Clemson, Georgia Tech, Louisville, South Carolina and UAB.

Nate Frazier and Wes Holland from Navy. Frazier dominating DT at Navy and Holland a versatile, quick running back.
James Brooks 6-6 260 pound defensive end. Brooks had 25 tackles, 7.5 tackles for a loss and four sacks last year. He was expected to team with Jamaar Jarrett and Junior Onyeali to give the Sun Devils, the preseason favorites in the Pac-12 South, one of the best threesomes at defensive end in the conference.

Preston Parker, 33 games at FSU. 104 catches, 1189 yards, 370 yards rushing, 7 TDs.
Will Furlong Member of the Rivals.com Florida Top 100 and a three-star prospect....the 31st-best offensive tackle in 2007 according to Rivals and one of the top 50 players overall in the state of Florida...PrepStar All-Region...has the ability to play anywhere on the line according to Scout.com.
Jarmon Fortson, 4 star receiver. Third leading receiver for the Noles as a soph.
Brandon Paul-4 star DB, rated 14th best nationally with 4.4 speed. FSU envisioned him as their Reggie Bush and switched him to RB where it never happened for him.
Jamall Edwards 4 star RB. 210 pounds with 4.4 speed rated 7th best nationally. Second on the depth chart entering the fall...a physical runner who will see playing time behind starter Antone Smith...named the most dependable running back by the offensive staff and the offense's Iron Nole Award winner following spring practice. Nagging injuries buried him in the FSU talent bin.
Antwan Greenlee (6-5.5, 300, 5.2) 4 star offensive lineman nicknamed the Pancake Man. Saw a lot of playing time before missing the entire 2009 season due to injury.
Daron Rose-4 star offensive lineman. Started 11 games as a sophomore at FSU. One of the top three run blockers in seven of his last eight starts...registered 28 knockdowns in 764 plays...had his best game of the season grading out at 76% versus BC.

There were so many I can't recall them all. Should have been three straight National Championships when you look at all that talent. These guys weren't riding the plank at D1. They were starters and in some cases, stars. So before you get TOO excited about your D1 transfers, there is something just as important as talent. It's called chemistry and you can't transfer that in. We found that out the disappointing way. Bowden never got UNA past the second round in D2.

chattanoogamocs
June 12th, 2015, 01:25 AM
Huesman has stated since day one that he wanted to build his program with freshmen, the majority of which will be redshirted. Transfers are still considered to be special cases (this year has more because of the UAB debacle and we seem to have a pipeline at UGA/Navy for lineman who are stuck on the depth chart). And in the instance that a transfer is taken, they rigorously check the player out to make sure they are good character kids. You aren't going to see a transfer who is on their 2nd or 3rd chance. You will also notice that the majority of the time, transfers have 3 (sometimes 4) years of eligibility. There are few two year only kids (going back to the ethos that a kid is never going to be a great team players unless they really get to spend years in the program). Good news is, when you redshirt most of your freshmen, you aren't having to get many "quick fix" kids. Most of the one's Huesman are taking are "too good to pass on."

Of course, some transfers ending up being a bust...but the rate isn't really any higher than with any group that comes in...every class, no matter how great, is going to have natural attrition and busts.

chattanoogamocs
June 12th, 2015, 01:30 AM
Cardiello is a great example of a typical UTC transfer...good student, good kid...got a recommendation from the UGA coaching staff (who hated to see him go, but understood that he wanted to get to play more). Solid player, but with 14 scholarship lineman, was buried on the depth chart at Georgia. The kid just wants to go somewhere and not watch the games from the sidelines. Last kid to do this from UGA was Derrick Lott (who was stuck in a nearly identical situation), who is now in a Tennessee Titans mini camp.

underdawg
June 12th, 2015, 02:05 PM
Matt McIntosh a 6'1" 218 pound dual threat QB transferring in from Northern Illinois University--will play his last year of eligibility as a Grad Student. His Brother Paul played for the Salukis 4 years ago and Matt was offered by SIU out of high school, but he signed with NIU--was Gaterade Indiana football player of year his senior year

kperk014
June 12th, 2015, 02:10 PM
Huesman has stated since day one that he wanted to build his program with freshmen, the majority of which will be redshirted. Transfers are still considered to be special cases (this year has more because of the UAB debacle and we seem to have a pipeline at UGA/Navy for lineman who are stuck on the depth chart). And in the instance that a transfer is taken, they rigorously check the player out to make sure they are good character kids. You aren't going to see a transfer who is on their 2nd or 3rd chance. You will also notice that the majority of the time, transfers have 3 (sometimes 4) years of eligibility. There are few two year only kids (going back to the ethos that a kid is never going to be a great team players unless they really get to spend years in the program). Good news is, when you redshirt most of your freshmen, you aren't having to get many "quick fix" kids. Most of the one's Huesman are taking are "too good to pass on."

Of course, some transfers ending up being a bust...but the rate isn't really any higher than with any group that comes in...every class, no matter how great, is going to have natural attrition and busts.

That's how it was for the almost all of UNA's transfers, contrary to popular (and false) belief. Either got injured and then buried in the depth chart or got got caught in the numbers game caused by oversigning. Only three were actually kicked off the team. I believe if you want to sign FBS transfers, it's best to sign those from schools who aren't used to playing in front of 90,000 screaming fans or were never on the field. Dropping down to crowds in the low teens or lower is quite a letdown and they just don't appear to give an all-out effort. When they do, they put up 62 points on a quality opponent and when they don't, they lose to a team who shouldn't even be on the field with them. A lot of these big plays were made my non-transfers. I'm still shocked Michael Johnson, a 6-4 250 LB with 4.5 speed never stuck in the NFL. It was said he didn't have fluid hips. Maybe so but when you can knock the hips off the opponent, maybe that's an equalizer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06XKR6Olmqc

longtimemocfan
June 12th, 2015, 10:05 PM
Informative article by SoCon John. UTC seems to be loaded with FBS xfer talent.

https://medium.com/@SoConJohn22/socon-football-2015-chattanooga-embraces-high-profile-transfers-44d4e71b34ef


Agree with both chattown and c-mocs on their assessments on the transfers we have gotten. The article missed on the better Navy transfer Danny Ring who started and played very well at DT for 2 years.

chattownmocs
June 13th, 2015, 12:00 AM
That's how it was for the almost all of UNA's transfers, contrary to popular (and false) belief. Either got injured and then buried in the depth chart or got got caught in the numbers game caused by oversigning. Only three were actually kicked off the team. I believe if you want to sign FBS transfers, it's best to sign those from schools who aren't used to playing in front of 90,000 screaming fans or were never on the field. Dropping down to crowds in the low teens or lower is quite a letdown and they just don't appear to give an all-out effort. When they do, they put up 62 points on a quality opponent and when they don't, they lose to a team who shouldn't even be on the field with them. A lot of these big plays were made my non-transfers. I'm still shocked Michael Johnson, a 6-4 250 LB with 4.5 speed never stuck in the NFL. It was said he didn't have fluid hips. Maybe so but when you can knock the hips off the opponent, maybe that's an equalizer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06XKR6Olmqc

Read the article dude. UTC has a proven track record with transfers. It matters not what UNA has done.

SU DOG
June 13th, 2015, 09:31 AM
I think FUBeAR does make some good points and brings up an interesting question. As for too many xfers, I believe that you certainly can overdo it. That questionable number must be decided on a case-by-case situation for each school, however. JSU has had relatively good luck with many kids that were problems at their P5 schools. Samford, on the other hand, would never take these players because of our academic requirements, and other policies. I'm not judging right/wrong here, just saying the situation is totally different. The B'ham area provides an incredible number of D-1 players that Samford recruits, but are lured away by the "FBS" title to mid-majors such as Southern Miss, Memphis, AR State, Middle TN, and various others. These players then sometimes, have a possibility to "come home" by transferring to Samford. Of course this is not the scenario for all cases, but it happens a lot. The UAB situation has been mentioned, and I think we will field 4 xfers from there this season, though I'm not certain. A good mix of xfers can definitely strengthen a program, if they are the right kind, and if they are handled properly by the coaching staff.

smallcollegefbfan
June 13th, 2015, 10:16 AM
Informative article by SoCon John. UTC seems to be loaded with FBS xfer talent.

https://medium.com/@SoConJohn22/socon-football-2015-chattanooga-embraces-high-profile-transfers-44d4e71b34ef

It is still early. I always check rosters late in August because there will be some good ones who pop up during fall camp.

kperk014
June 13th, 2015, 03:32 PM
Read the article dude. UTC has a proven track record with transfers. It matters not what UNA has done.

:D So does UNA with the exception of the Bowden years. Like I give a rip about a middling branch school, dude.

chattownmocs
June 13th, 2015, 03:46 PM
:D So does UNA with the exception of the Bowden years. Like I give a rip about a middling branch school, dude.

Well you posted some nonsense on this thread but I can assure you that absolutely no one here cares about a D2 school.

Cocky
June 14th, 2015, 05:29 AM
I keep up with DII. Good football and TUNA has good football.

kperk014
June 14th, 2015, 12:40 PM
Well you posted some nonsense on this thread but I can assure you that absolutely no one here cares about a D2 school.


Just for the record: A DOMINANT D2 program. As Joe Friday used to say: Just the facts, mam. I know there is a lot of fear among SOME that someday they'll have to eat a lot of crow. But don't look at it that way. Take it is as a positive step in vital task of replacing so many of the great FCS football programs who've moved up recentlWhen UNA moves up, they will automatically rank in the Top 20 among attendance. UNA already averages around 10,000 even though 70% of the Shoals' 150,000 residents could care less about the current schools we play. That's not a "bad thing" is it?

KPSUL
June 14th, 2015, 11:20 PM
Just for the record: A DOMINANT D2 program. As Joe Friday used to say: Just the facts, mam. I know there is a lot of fear among SOME that someday they'll have to eat a lot of crow. But don't look at it that way. Take it is as a positive step in vital task of replacing so many of the great FCS football programs who've moved up recentlWhen UNA moves up, they will automatically rank in the Top 20 among attendance. UNA already averages around 10,000 even though 70% of the Shoals' 150,000 residents could care less about the current schools we play. That's not a "bad thing" is it?

What's UNA? I know it's a city in India.

chattanoogamocs
June 15th, 2015, 12:24 PM
Ironically, of the 92 players list (scholarship + walkon) on last years roster, only 9 of them were transfers (or Juco). There really aren't a lot of them, but many of them have made a significant impact, so it makes it seem like more I guess.

I count 8 on the abbreviated (scholarship) roster for this year.

There is one Juco on the roster, Jeremiah Hay, who was definitely brought to help shore up what was a very young backfield last year. But the young players did so well, he struggled to get on the field. I believe he is the only Juco Huesman has ever recruited at UTC.

PaladinFan
June 15th, 2015, 01:00 PM
Ironically, of the 92 players list (scholarship + walkon) on last years roster, only 9 of them were transfers (or Juco). There really aren't a lot of them, but many of them have made a significant impact, so it makes it seem like more I guess.

I count 8 on the abbreviated (scholarship) roster for this year.

There is one Juco on the roster, Jeremiah Hay, who was definitely brought to help shore up what was a very young backfield last year. But the young players did so well, he struggled to get on the field. I believe he is the only Juco Huesman has ever recruited at UTC.

Not sure what the storyline is here. UTC has accepted transfers for years. Previously, no one paid a lot of attention because UTC was never very good.

Most transfers are just roster depth. Some turn into pretty good players. I'm not sure any of this moves the needle for me.

kperk014
June 15th, 2015, 09:14 PM
What's UNA? I know it's a city in India.

They've started football in New Hampshire? Is that recent?

KPSUL
June 15th, 2015, 09:47 PM
They've started football in New Hampshire? Is that recent?

No, the Granite State can't claim credit for that. College football started in New Jersey in 1869, college football was not played in NH until 1881.

chattanoogamocs
June 16th, 2015, 10:15 PM
Not sure what the storyline is here. UTC has accepted transfers for years. Previously, no one paid a lot of attention because UTC was never very good.

Most transfers are just roster depth. Some turn into pretty good players. I'm not sure any of this moves the needle for me.

Come on now PaladinFan, you have been around long enough to understand the difference between what they were doing back then and what they are doing now.

There is a major difference.

When UTC sucked they were constantly bringing in 1 and 2 year wonders to try and win (now they typically only take players with 3 or 4 years remaining).

There were non-stop Juco's too (as opposed to 1 in the last 6 years).

Grades were poor because quality standards were low correlating in a terrible APR and multiple years of penalties (for the last two years, the Mocs have had an Academic All-American, their first of the DI era and the APR is strong).

Character off the field was not a concern as long as they showed some sort of talent on the field (now character off the field is a major point of emphasis).

No one was getting redshirted (now, unless you can start as a freshman, you're going to sit your first year and focus on academics).


There is also a major difference in numbers.

As mentioned above, under Huesman, there are typically 8-10 transfers (and 1 Juco in 6 years).

For an example of past years, in 2007 under Rodney Allison, there were 18 transfers, a 1/3 of which were Juco.

Quality over quantity.

utcfan
June 19th, 2015, 03:46 PM
CMocs sometimes facts just aren't important.....Some folks just like to throw feces, or at least talk some feces. Huesman has managed the transfers well and they have helped the program. Academics under RH have improved nearly every year as well. He wants his players to have a good playing experience, compete for and some day win a National Championship, stay out of trouble and graduate. I think he has UTC moving in that direction. I am looking forward to watching the 2015 edition of UTC Mocs football.

Old Gregg
June 20th, 2015, 12:42 PM
Old Gregg loves FBS transfers.

kperk014
June 30th, 2015, 02:23 PM
No, the Granite State can't claim credit for that. College football started in New Jersey in 1869, college football was not played in NH until 1881.

Well, don't worry. Someday you will have both football and electricity! It must be bundled that way.

KPSUL
June 30th, 2015, 07:05 PM
Well, don't worry. Someday you will have both football and electricity! It must be bundled that way.

Split wood, not atoms! Actually until 2014 UNH didn't need electricity to play football. We had no lights on our game field until last season.